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fightforfreedom

(4,913 posts)
Wed Jul 27, 2022, 10:31 AM Jul 2022

It was a miracle more Trump voters were not shot on Jan 6th.

I did notice when the one Trump voter was shot to death all the Trump voters who were smashing in the door ran like hell.

The police showed great restraint, maybe they shouldn't have. I am not saying they should have opened fire and killed scores of Trump voters. I am saying in a few situations deadly force would have been justified.

I imagine if Trump voters got any closer to Pence and the members of congress there would be more dead Trump voters.

35 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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It was a miracle more Trump voters were not shot on Jan 6th. (Original Post) fightforfreedom Jul 2022 OP
You might not be saying that, but I will. NutmegYankee Jul 2022 #1
+100 nt MarineCombatEngineer Jul 2022 #3
This was not expected...sure people were warned but it is like 9-11 no believed it could happen. Demsrule86 Jul 2022 #4
That's why I called it a miracle. fightforfreedom Jul 2022 #6
I called for it.. thomski64 Jul 2022 #14
Sounds like a good plan. usonian Jul 2022 #24
That is my take too. Hubs and I talked about if it came to civil war, what would we do... Demsrule86 Jul 2022 #2
+100 MarineCombatEngineer Jul 2022 #5
I am also a veteran. fightforfreedom Jul 2022 #8
Agreed. MarineCombatEngineer Jul 2022 #10
Thank you. fightforfreedom Jul 2022 #18
i have guns and ammo and a pistol with a laser sight so i dont miss.... samnsara Jul 2022 #35
Someone pointed out I think on tv that if it had been a lone person attacking. LiberalFighter Jul 2022 #7
Yes. I remember commenting that day that the Capitol police MineralMan Jul 2022 #9
True. Cracklin Charlie Jul 2022 #11
It was not really a Miracle, it was based on policy and orders. bottomofthehill Jul 2022 #12
I understand that. fightforfreedom Jul 2022 #22
I imagine if they had been any color other than white Higherarky Jul 2022 #13
I was thinking the same thing. The mostly white crowd was saved by their race. LonePirate Jul 2022 #19
Bingo! geardaddy Jul 2022 #27
But African Americans aren't brainwashed Maga idiots. emulatorloo Jul 2022 #29
Had that been an Antifa or BLM group SCantiGOP Jul 2022 #15
Why repeat MAGA talking points? Neither BLM or Antifa had any interest in overturning a legitimate emulatorloo Jul 2022 #30
One of the great disappointments of my life HAB911 Jul 2022 #16
Maybe I'm way off the mark KentuckyWoman Jul 2022 #17
You are correct electric_blue68 Jul 2022 #25
In what city did the police shoot and kill a bunch of BLM protesters? MichMan Jul 2022 #33
The fact that the police did not use deadly force saved Trump from declaring martial law. kentuck Jul 2022 #20
I've thought the same thing. Merlot Jul 2022 #21
Right, there's that electric_blue68 Jul 2022 #28
Right after the shot, the first time I saw the video louis-t Jul 2022 #23
Amazing restraint. gibraltar72 Jul 2022 #26
Nobody has mentioned this, but ... Novara Jul 2022 #31
A miracle or a tragedy? Aristus Jul 2022 #32
The Secret Service and the Capitol Police showed a great deal of restraint LetMyPeopleVote Jul 2022 #34

NutmegYankee

(16,201 posts)
1. You might not be saying that, but I will.
Wed Jul 27, 2022, 10:33 AM
Jul 2022

If police had implemented "Castle Doctrine" at it's oldest and most basic, barricaded themselves inside the castle walls, and defended those windows and doors with lethal force, the Capitol would not have been over-run.

usonian

(9,885 posts)
24. Sounds like a good plan.
Wed Jul 27, 2022, 11:47 AM
Jul 2022

The USCP were set up to fail, and I suspect, by some in their own ranks.

A f---ing miracle that democracy survived, including traitors among the legislators.

I think that DOJ is investigating things that the 1/6 committee is keeping its hands away from, because it might harm the cases to be tried.

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=16957864



"What about":

• Congresspeople leading the coup on the ground.
• The pipe bomber
• Breaking every known records retention and handling of classified information law (including sending it off to Russia, which is espionage and treason)
• Coordinating the fake elector scheme.
• Coordinating the camouflaged assault with intent to commit mayhem on public officials, using idiots as cover.

More ....

These are extremely serious and we heard basically ZERO about them, so that must be the coordination with DOJ. You can't work up these cases in a public hearing. Prejudicial to a case? They are criminal charges.

Demsrule86

(68,689 posts)
2. That is my take too. Hubs and I talked about if it came to civil war, what would we do...
Wed Jul 27, 2022, 10:34 AM
Jul 2022

we both agreed even though we are not youngins...we would fight to the death for our country. Fuck them, they can't take our Republic...I would see them in hell first.

MarineCombatEngineer

(12,449 posts)
5. +100
Wed Jul 27, 2022, 10:36 AM
Jul 2022

This old Marine still has a lot of fight in him and I would take as many of these traitorous POS with me as I could.

Most of these POS's have never seen a shot fired in anger, nor experienced actual combat, unless you count the video games they play and think are real, they would flee at the first round fired at them.

 

fightforfreedom

(4,913 posts)
8. I am also a veteran.
Wed Jul 27, 2022, 10:44 AM
Jul 2022

If I was a police officer that day I don't know if I could have held back from opening fire on those traitors, especially if I saw fellow police being beaten to death.

samnsara

(17,636 posts)
35. i have guns and ammo and a pistol with a laser sight so i dont miss....
Wed Jul 27, 2022, 12:39 PM
Jul 2022

..and I've participated in Glock competitions.






They think we are marshmallows...

LiberalFighter

(51,094 posts)
7. Someone pointed out I think on tv that if it had been a lone person attacking.
Wed Jul 27, 2022, 10:38 AM
Jul 2022

They would have used lethal force.

MineralMan

(146,331 posts)
9. Yes. I remember commenting that day that the Capitol police
Wed Jul 27, 2022, 10:49 AM
Jul 2022

were being too reserved in their use of force. A few dead insurrectionists who were trying to break into the Capitol might well have ended things much earlier.

I did observe, though, that things slowed down considerably when that one woman was shot and killed. That seemed to take the wind right out of some of the insurrectionists' sails.

For me, the entire riot seemed to be a deadly threat to Congress members and staffers. I believe it warranted the use of deadly force in some cases. That's especially true because the LEOs were stretched far too thin. In hindsight, there should have been a much larger defensive force at the Capitol. Had there been, things would not have gone the way they did. But, the Trump administration worked very hard to keep the defenders at a minimum, and refused to reinforce them for a very long time.

Many mistakes were made, probably on the orders of superiors.

bottomofthehill

(8,347 posts)
12. It was not really a Miracle, it was based on policy and orders.
Wed Jul 27, 2022, 10:58 AM
Jul 2022

The USCP were not authorized to use lethal force unless there is/was a danger to human life. It sounds odd in that situation, but it is a best practice. When Ashley Babbitt was shot, the Lt who discharged his weapon saw her as a direct threat to the safety of the Members of Congress who were still in the House Chamber and thus he was not charged for the shooting. He was investigated by his department, metropolitan police and the justice department and all found it a clean shoot. Police officers are held to a much higher standard than the castle doctrine or stand your ground. Most of the asshole insurrectionists that have been arrested to date have been charged with misdemeanors. They were fucking assholes, but it is hard to execute people for that.

In hind sight, I wish that the USCP had greater access to non-lethal weapons outside the building. Better bulk distribution of CS and Pepper Spray, fire hoses, and more men and women ready for the insane battle that took place.

The use of lethal force has to be a last resort at all times. The Lt fired 1 round, he hit what he shot at. He did not shoot into the crowd, he did not empty his weapon. He followed his general orders and his training and took the protective action that was necessary to keep further loss of life from occurring.

 

fightforfreedom

(4,913 posts)
22. I understand that.
Wed Jul 27, 2022, 11:43 AM
Jul 2022

There were a few situations where police officers were being beaten to near death. That justified lethal force. It shocking more police did not open fire like the officer who shot Babbit did. I think a lot of them were ready to. They held back.

SCantiGOP

(13,873 posts)
15. Had that been an Antifa or BLM group
Wed Jul 27, 2022, 11:26 AM
Jul 2022

They would have never gotten past those first flimsy barriers. As soon as they threatened to go past them a dozen or more would have been shot. The Capitol would have never been touched by the first protestor.
And we would have heard 24 hours a day from FOX about how you are just asking for it if you disobey a command from a police officer.

emulatorloo

(44,186 posts)
30. Why repeat MAGA talking points? Neither BLM or Antifa had any interest in overturning a legitimate
Wed Jul 27, 2022, 11:54 AM
Jul 2022

Last edited Wed Jul 27, 2022, 01:02 PM - Edit history (1)

election.

KentuckyWoman

(6,694 posts)
17. Maybe I'm way off the mark
Wed Jul 27, 2022, 11:29 AM
Jul 2022

But given the way BLM protesters were treated, I believe skin color of the insurrectionist had a lot to do with them ending up in jail instead of coffins.

kentuck

(111,110 posts)
20. The fact that the police did not use deadly force saved Trump from declaring martial law.
Wed Jul 27, 2022, 11:37 AM
Jul 2022

He had already informed his people not to interfere with the "mob of protesters".

I think it may have been much worse if they had opened fire on the mob.

louis-t

(23,297 posts)
23. Right after the shot, the first time I saw the video
Wed Jul 27, 2022, 11:44 AM
Jul 2022

I heard a guy say "That was just a flash/bang." I haven't heard the audio from that video since. I have never seen a video of the rioters running from the scene after the shot.

Novara

(5,851 posts)
31. Nobody has mentioned this, but ...
Wed Jul 27, 2022, 11:58 AM
Jul 2022

... in addition to following orders, if they were monitoring radio traffic from other agencies like the SS they knew the traitors were armed. And they knew they were vastly outnumbered. I am sure they did not want a bloodbath on the Capitol floors. If the mob "won" the firefight, everyone in that building - especially the people they protect - would have been in immediate mortal danger.

I really do wonder why the mob didn't fire on the police. We knew many of them were armed.

Aristus

(66,462 posts)
32. A miracle or a tragedy?
Wed Jul 27, 2022, 12:01 PM
Jul 2022

We’ve gotten to where we are as a country because it’s the Trumpsters who are doing all the shooting, and the rest of us who are doing all the dying.

I think it’s high time we reverse that particular algorithm…

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