The MAGA movement is a Cult of Personality following, no other individual can repeat it.

[fightforfreedom]

For some strange reason some evil people have a personality that people are drawn to and will fanatically follow.

If Manson had died early on, no one could have replaced him.

If Jim Jones had died early on, no one could have replaced him.

If Hitler had died early on in the war, no one could have replaced him. The Nazi movement would have come apart. These were all Cult of Personality followings.

If Trump died tomorrow we would see the MAGA movement come apart. People like DeSantis would try and replace him. He could act like Trump, try to do the same things Trump has done and it would not work because he does not have the same personality as Trump. He would not get the same fanatical following.

I am hopeful the moment Trump is indicted and convicted the MAGA movement will come apart and fade away.

[Wounded Bear]

1. Would love to believe that, but...

They said the same thing about Hitler and there are still Nazis in the world.

[Zambero]

2. Potential followers in search of a charismatic leader

They eventually found one, and he continues to exert his influence on them.

[fightforfreedom]

3. There have been fascists in America for many decades.

They could not find a leader until Trump came along. After Trump is gone they will not be able to find someone to replace him. The fascists will still be here but they will crawl back under the rocks where they came from.

[Jade Fox]

4. I agree......

When I see charisma-free people like Cruz, Jordan, and DeSantis thinking they can be the next Trump, I laugh.

Like it or not, Trump has charisma galore to his followers. He is, fortunately, one of a kind.

[fightforfreedom]

5. You get it.

[unblock]

6. This is false and dangerously so. Foxnews and hate radio created the conditions for Donnie

Donnie couldn't have done what he did without the previous decades of right-wing propaganda creating a subculture of people who see loyalty to the Republican Party and its leaders as more of a religious/tribal commitment than a reasoned political decision.

That part of the media created and fanned the white resentment and taught the Republican base to blame minorities and immigrants for everything, instead of billionaires not paying reasonable taxes or paying wages that at least kept up with inflation.

Donnie may go away, be discredited and abandoned, and in any event one day he will die. But the conditions that made his "cult of personality" possible will remain.

And someone else will capitalize on that. Possibly in a different form, but this whole fascist movement will not go away simply due to a scandal or even the death of one particular fascist leader.

Republicans are simply not going to move on from Donnie and become more reasonable people and behave like they did in the 1970s.

[Jade Fox]

10. I don't disagree with you but...

there is a strong cultish element in the Trump phenomenon that the foolish GOP decided to try and use to their advantage. Trump's inevitable downfall will leave them (at least temporarily) without a unifying figure, and left only with their foolishness.

The GOP has seriously overstepped their bounds by ending Roe and threatening other rights. I believe this will be their downfall. The hands of time cannot be turned back.

[unblock]

16. i agree that there would be a *temporary* setback while they switch from donnie to someone else

unless a new "alpha" moves in to depose the old "alpha". in theory this is certainly possible, but in practice i don't see a clear replacement. on the other hand, the weaker donnie gets, the more others will vie for the position. we've already seen quite a number of right-wing politicians trying to out-crazy each other, and nature abhors a vacuum, so someone will fill the void in due course.

whatever time we get during an interregnum won't be long enough to really fix the underlying problems that enable the whole fascist movement. not that there's any real will to do so anyway. if donnie dies or flees the country or actually managed to get himself imprisoned, most of us will cheer, claim victory, and quickly become complacent. and foxnews will continue to drag their base rightward.

i do agree that overturning roe *and* the underlying foundation for a constitutional right to privacy was an overstep that will hurt them politically, but that may only mean the midterms will be less of a victory for them than it otherwise would have been. it means the odds of us keeping both houses have improved, but if they capture either house, this "setback" won't amount to much.

[griffi94]

11. You are correct

The catastrophe that was Dubya didn't make a dent. They abandon him and embraced Trump without missing a beat.
Right-wing media even convinced the GOP rank & file that Dubya was a librul. He was a failure because he wasn't conservative enough.
Right-wingers have also revised history to align with their current populist stance by stating that they never supported the Iraq war.
Fox News is already starting to phase out Trump. When Trump is sufficiently diminished in the RW media, DeSantis or some other nutter will rise.

[Elessar Zappa]

12. It won't go away but it will be weakened, I guarantee it.

[unblock]

17. weakened, yes. but how much and for how long? remains to be seen....

[Cosmocat]

19. Spot on

45 did not even remotely start MAGA, he plugged into it and coopted it by taking it where others too meek to take it.

And, worse, having spent 4 years at POTUS he drove the movement MUCH, M U C H further away from the basic norms of civil democratic debate and even worse has completely destroyed the unstated norms of our political system.

You didn't see all these asshole republican state legislators actively working to deny actual votes like they are now, and there are countless other examples of that - county elections boards not putting their votes forward.

These assholes won't stop this if 45 faces justice.

AND, there are PLENTY of loathsome higher level pols DYING to replace him and it is an easy gig - scream liberals and be a complete asshole. They saw that 45 did and tripping overthemselves to say and do more ridiculous things- witness a candidate for governor openly referencing Big Dick Energy ...

45 or not, the next time we lose POTUS, our democracy will end, and it may even if that does not occur.

[uponit7771]

25. "These assholes won't stop this if 45 faces justice." ... yep, the infection in Germany did *NOT* ..

... stop with Hitler it stopped with NAZI error children in the 60s asking questions and demanding answers as to why their parents supported Hitler.

[Cosmocat]

26. There is that, but end of the day it stopped because

Russians trampled into Berlin with the US and other allies behind them ... They lost the war and the country itself, and were forced by the weight of military occupation to reform their government.

No one is hoping on boats and coming over her to stop this movement ...

[uponit7771]

28. +1, we're going to have to deMAGA America. MAGA doesn't want democracy

[Irish_Dem]

7. There will always be charismatic ruthless sociopaths in search of followers.

And weak, gullible, impaired people who will follow.

[kentuck]

8. I think that is true.

Not just anybody can replace a cult leader.

[ecstatic]

9. desantis could become cult-like based on his cruelty,

but the problem he would have is the inability to play clueless if and when committing crimes. Tfg is a visible clown and most of his insulation comes from people making excuses about how he didn't know this or didn't know that. desantis would not have the same luxury. Justice would be swift and immediate, assuming a fully functioning and non-compromised government.

[Jade Fox]

14. Exactly!

DeSantis has all the charisma of a hissing snake.

[moonscape]

27. But they don't seem to care about crimes

if they get the ruthless part.

[brooklynite]

15. Not true...

Other people may not be able to tap into it as well, but the "don't trust the Government/hate the "other"/Democrats are the enemy" thought process has been around for decades.

[dameatball]

18. It is important to remember that Trump was a so-called celebrity businessman, not a politician.

Limiting the field of "next Trumps" to just politicians such as Cruz, Desantis, etc is short sighted. If the cult wants charisma, the cult will find charisma, or at least their idea of charisma. The next Trump could just as easily come from the entertainment industry, sports, military, you name it. Dismissing the current crop of GOP blowhards is easy. There may be others more worrisome. Who really thought Trump would be president prior to 2010 or so? Things can happen fast when someone grabs the imagination of the mobs.
Hitler could easily have been someone else (imo), as the conditions for his rise already existed.

I venture to say that Putin was backing many possible candidates and causes that might be disruptive to our country. Once "Trumpism" caught fire the ready made propaganda machine threw gas on the flames. It can happen again. There can be another Trump. The important thing is to negate and deal with the one we have now. Then work on dismantling the means that he ever existed.

[Cosmocat]

23. And the reason that Nazi's were taken down was they lost a war

The US getting into it and them being stupid enough to start up with Russia.

Had the Japanese not attacked PH and/or Hitler not started up with Russia before he got the British Isle's sorted out, they would STILL be in power.

[Jade Fox]

20. We are all right about this.....

Trump is both the product of decades of right wing movement towards Fascism, AND a uniquely charismatic cult figure who will be difficult to replace.

And I still think the impact of Roe is being underestimated.

[fightforfreedom]

21. You are correct about Roe.

That was a major mistake and the Democrats must run on it. If they do the elections could have surprising results. You cannot take away rights from the American people. It is political suicide.

[Rob H.]

22. Have you seen the KHive on Twitter?

They're not right-wing, but they're unbelievably toxic.

[JHB]

24. Don't be so sure of that. Trump absorbed two pre-existing cults...

...those of Rush Limbaugh and of Glenn Beck, and probably a few others that don't spring as readily to mind.

My guess is that their post-Trump support will follow the clown-car pattern it exhibited in the 2012 primaries, but it's always possible that one guy will be able to get it to gel behind him.

[Thtwudbeme]

29. Don't forget the Palin Teabaggers

You are correct.

[sakabatou]

30. I've called it that for years.

[Thtwudbeme]

31. No, if Trump is just locked up, his offspring- particularly Don Jr. will visit

and tweet whatever he is told to. Don Jr. does not have the personality to keep it going by himself- he has to parasite off his father, and he will. That is all he has- he is a black hole of needing his Daddy. (on a side note, it might free Eric the Lesser to go get his degree in archetectural history....he's young enough to still make a life independent of his nasty brother and horrid father)

But, my point was- when leaders like Trump are imprisoned- it will just make his followers MORE rabid. He will become a martyr to the "government they hate." And that includes the MTG lunatics, the Boeberts- that weird woman out in Cheney's territory. And people will go out in droves to vote for those loons and "prove their love and loyalty."

Charles Manson still had followers while he was in prison. The only thing that almost exstinguished that cult was jailing the family.

If Trump goes to prison, it gets worse. It's part of the reason I lean towards Biden just lamely and quietly pardoning him.