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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsBREAKING: GOP stealing ballots with "Victory Vans"
Sun Nov 04, 2012 at 11:53 PM PST
BREAKING: GOP stealing ballots with "Victory Vans"
by BeerNotWar
Here in King County Washington Democrats are raising a red flag calling attention to shady Replican efforts to intercept our ballots by luring voters to drop their ballots in "Victory Vans" touring the county. Washington is 100% vote-by-mail so voters fill out their ballots at home then deliver them to state dropoffs or send them in by mail. But the GOP has created special "Victory Vans" to collect ballots before they can ever reach these official delivery sites.
If you think you can trust the GOP with your ballot, I assure you, you cannot. Nobody in King County should hand their ballot to someone in a Republican "Victory Van," but should only drop off their ballot at an official state ballot collection site. This is critical for close state races such as the one for Governor where both Jay Inslee and Rob McKenna need voters in King County. Republican McKenna needs just enough Democrats in King County to vote for him, or not vote, to defeat Inslee. This, I suspect, is the Replublican game. Once they have the ballots they could be disposed of or even altered. I wish this were a completely irrational belief, but Republicans have demonstrated their unwillingeness to allow democracy to function if it won't result in a victory for their candidate. If you think I'm crazy then please explain why the hell they have vans running around in a massively Democratic county collecting ballots. Why would they spend the money to do that?
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/11/05/1155743/-BREAKING-GOP-stealing-ballots-with-Victory-Vans
flamingdem
(39,332 posts)really underhanded!
trueblue2007
(17,242 posts)FarPoint
(12,466 posts)It is obnoxious! GOP looters.......they need to be arrested now.
brewens
(13,631 posts)If they didn't intend on destroying ballots, they would just be hoping people got lazy and never got them in on time.
SheilaT
(23,156 posts)simply be stopped and impounded? Surely there are federal and state laws against tampering with votes.
Maybe the simplest solution is for someone to start following those vans and make sure that people who attempt to turn in their ballots there understand that these are not official ballot collection sites.
questionseverything
(9,663 posts)where the vans "deposit" the ballots
geardaddy
(24,931 posts)ellie
(6,929 posts)But I bet nobody gets punished for it.
valerief
(53,235 posts)lumberjack_jeff
(33,224 posts)It is naive to assume good intent.
Anyone who has given their ballot to these assholes should immediately call the cops to verify that the ballot was delivered.
democrat_patriot
(2,774 posts)If I found out the Dems cheated to win - I would neither be happy nor proud.
barbtries
(28,815 posts)to see how low they will go.
WilliamPitt
(58,179 posts)Lone_Star_Dem
(28,158 posts)Lone_Star_Dem
(28,158 posts)Democrats complain about new King County GOPs ballot drop-off tactic
Posted by Brian M. Rosenthal
Update:
King County officials on Sunday urged voters not to hand their ballots over to strangers.
The only way to guarantee a ballot will be counted is to mail it or drop it off at an offical King County elections site, said Democratic King County Executive Dow Constantine, joined by Sherill Huff, the countys elections director.
We are strongly advising citizens if they want to be sure their ballot is counted, dont hand your ballot over to someone you dont know, Constantine said.
Huff said she had received complaints from residents, concerned about people going door-to-door collecting ballots. The effort is part of a Republican get-out-vote push. King County Republicans have also set up 10 collection vans in suburban parts of the county.
Its not illegal to collect ballots for delivery, Huff said. Nor is there anything wrong with giving your ballot to someone else. Church and community groups commonly collect and deliver ballots, Constantine said. The danger lies is dealing with someone you dont know, he said.
Secretary of State Sam Reed issued a statement Sunday saying We strongly discourage such activity, but its not illegal.
Democrats mounted similar efforts in previous elections.
http://blogs.seattletimes.com/politicsnorthwest/2012/11/04/democrats-complain-about-new-king-county-gop-get-out-the-vote-tactic/
JohnnyRingo
(18,665 posts)There's a bizarre statement.
I don't care what party someone supports, there is definately something wrong with trusting your ballot to someone in a van. Is this the same advice Republicans give to their children? "If you need a ride home, just jump in someone's van."
alp227
(32,065 posts)to handle a ballot.
It is sick and unethical to run those "Victory Van" scams but also poor judgement on the voter's part to trust some random strangers on the street to deliver the ballots for convenience.
xxqqqzme
(14,887 posts)by someone other than the voter, has to print their name then sign the envelope, as well as indicate their relationship w/ the voter.
SaveAmerica
(5,342 posts)Hutzpa
(11,461 posts)need to check it.
sally5050
(151 posts)McKenna was Attorney General, he knows better.
But there is no level too low for losing republicans to stoop to steal an election.
I shook Jay's hand yesterday.. and I do believe he will squeak by as a winner..
If I were not a democrat, if I were not a pacifist, I would sure want to find that bus and accidentally leave a few nails behind the tire, but alas, I believe as happened when Obama was confronted with Crazy Romney lies, we win by being 'unwilling to stoop' to their thuggery.
bottom line, these rethugs are out for blood in the next 2 days,
McKenna can take that losing bus and go home.. game over... WA will stay a progressive Clean Energy state with jobs for all! with Jay inslee at the mantle...
freshwest
(53,661 posts)Got three pieces that claim Inslee was stealing the pensions of firefighters and police. And some weird crap from MT that had no party affiliation, name or mailing address, just a town in MT. All GOP, Teahadist candidates, but you couldn't tell it by the mailers. And their signs are out there in the roads. Inslee is a good and honest man, and so is Kathleen Drew running for the office of elections. If they lose, we lose progressive WA.
sally5050
(151 posts)and have you noticed that the Teahadist running against Maria Cantwell won't even call himself a Republican and mentions 'independent' in his ads but these thugs are so clear that American don't like republicans anymore they won't put it on their flyers or signs.
that's an amazing indictment of the entire GOP Party that Bush was nowhere to be found and they won't even put (R) after their name.
it's a sad state of affairs when we have elections run by anonymous people pushing violent literature costing billions we could be using to fix our schools, fix our road, upgrade our infrastructure to state of the art.
if china kicks our ass economically, its because we let the teapartiers and a very few koch brother like CEO's drive us down a path of ignominy and
I am hoping strongly that Kathleen Drew and Inslee win big and no recounts..
CrispyQ
(36,540 posts)My husband is unaffiliated so he gets political flyers from both sides. The repubs do not put Republican Party on their ads. Every dem candidate has Democratic Party on their ads.
freshwest
(53,661 posts)Would elude many voters. I looked through the entire spread on each candidate. They frame them as rational or mainstream, then you have to look at who has endorsed them. You also have to know their dogwhistles, couched in such terms as responsible, liberty, etc. Many people are so busy in their lives and unfamiliar with the memes, names and groups that are bad actors, so they don't know what's going on.
They also don't grasp the philosophy of governance behind the initiatives, and what the long-term effects will be on social cohesion, and the local school or services. Many wil be fooled, or think they are doing the right thing voting for these. They are usually Tim Eyeman = Grover Nordquist = ALEC organized petitions to sell off the commons and defund the state government so that it will be vulnerable to privateers.
I kept getting mail from the GOP governors' association in D.C., against Inslee. The charges were not backed up, but they made the emotional appeal with the photographs on them. Such as a young man in a firefighter suit looking desperately hurt as if his puppy had just died, an outraged woman dressed as an EMT. These appeals influence a good hearted person, but they don't know the larger picture.
One would have to look at the GOP and know their positions to see how dishonest appeal is. The GOP, 'concerned' about firemen's pensions? This from the party that wants to do away with their jobs, pensions, agencies, unions, public workers, fire, police and FEMA as a mater of public policy?
After this election we need a sweep to clean out these crooks who distort everything, say exactly the opposite of what they do to people, and get the public educated again. We're tired, but we need the young people who are lining the streets to vote for Obama, to get into the process and stay in it. We need to faciliate their involvement, their education. We can't afford to let things go the way the GOP is intending.
Venting over.
sally5050
(151 posts)and I think you're on to something
can we outlaw alec?
i guess we should put limits on how much money you can spend on elections and that will help enormously but how do you outlaw the aggregious lobbying that organizations like ALEC who hand pre written legislation to lazy GOP candidates to pass?
how do we you make sure the laws are written by the people?
i also don't like ballot initiatives.. it gets around mob rule that the founding fathers were so clear to prevent.. they knew the masses were unable to govern themselves because (as you point out people not paying attention might believe the GOP ads with firefighters in them).
i think a ballot initiative merely gets a law to be written a certain way and prioritized for vote by the legislators.. i don't think ballot initiatives (other than extremely local city ordinances) should be allowed to rest as law... especially ones like Ref. 74 where as a gay woman I have to beg for the right the legislature already granted me in gay marriage in WA state..
this is insane...
No Vested Interest
(5,167 posts)In seems to me (not a lawyer) that a third party, intervening between the voter and the BOE, is 1. misrepresenting their intention (fraud); 2. interfering with the casting of federal ballots and 3. someone help me here - there must be other ways of naming the illegality of private citizens intervening in elections.
How about an emergency injunction to stop this effort? Followed up by visits by the sheriff?
socialindependocrat
(1,372 posts)The ballot is meant to be a piece of mail to be sent to the
appropriate address.
By misrepresenting one's self as an agent to transfer mail without authority you are perpetrating a fraud and a felony (also, not a lawyer)
The vans should be easy to spot and they whould be arrested.
With all these tricks rMoney should just forefit the election.
This is really Mickey Mouse (apologies to the mouse)
i have no interest in ever interfacing with anyone who is stupid enough to say they are a Republican - These people are truely nuts!
AtheistCrusader
(33,982 posts)wherein no mail is involved (county elections runs the drop-offs, not the fucking Republican Party) so while you might get a brief injunction or something with that tack, you won't get a permanent solution.
I can't believe they think they can open these ballots and alter or review them, but you could 'hedge your bets' by looking up the voter's political donations history. If they gave to a Democrat, they could shitbarn the ballot.
I don't remember if my name is visible on the outside, but my signature certainly is. I wouldn't be surprised if they had some way to look up who the outer security envelope belonged to.
HooptieWagon
(17,064 posts)EmeraldCityGrl
(4,310 posts)I knew they were going door to door. This is reprehensible.
I Hate Republicans! They haven't a clue what it means to be an American. They are treasonous
criminals.
Phlem
(6,323 posts)And it seemed highly suspicious, also it was an SUV and not a van. This the first time in 17 years that I've seen them. The Republicans that live around my area are especially ignorant and vile. I can tell by the shithead comments they make in the local paper and some face to face.
Lie, cheat, and steal, that is pure GOP.
-p
JPZenger
(6,819 posts)In PA, if you have someone return your absentee ballot for you, you need to fill out and sign a form authorizing it. It is a bit of a hassle, but I can understand the risk otherwise.
DonCoquixote
(13,616 posts)I dislike voting by mail.
silvershadow
(10,336 posts)If you vote by mail, why in the world would you hand it over to some guy in a van?
easychoice
(1,043 posts)If anyone knocks on my door to collect my ballot they will be lying here on my porch when the cops get here.
Tigress DEM
(7,887 posts)ProudToBeBlueInRhody
(16,399 posts)Drop it in a fucking mailbox. Pretty simple.
Divine Discontent
(21,056 posts)they can't be taking people's election ballots. that's just absurd.
outsideworld
(601 posts)these folks want to just kill me before the elections are over
Junkdrawer
(27,993 posts)I can see it in Google's cache, but not on Kos. Did a search on poster "BeerNotWar" and this entry did not appear.
Jack Rabbit
(45,984 posts)Shame, shame. We shouldn't give the corporate fascists any (more) ideas.
Junkdrawer
(27,993 posts)See:
King County officials on Sunday urged voters not to hand their ballots over to strangers.
The only way to guarantee a ballot will be counted is to mail it or drop it off at an offical King County elections site, said Democratic King County Executive Dow Constantine, joined by Sherill Huff, the countys elections director.
...
Its not illegal to collect ballots for delivery, Huff said. Nor is there anything wrong with giving your ballot to someone else. Church and community groups commonly collect and deliver ballots, Constantine said. The danger lies is dealing with someone you dont know, he said.
Secretary of State Sam Reed issued a statement Sunday saying We strongly discourage such activity, but its not illegal.
Democrats mounted similar efforts in previous elections.
http://blogs.seattletimes.com/politicsnorthwest/2012/11/04/democrats-complain-about-new-king-county-gop-get-out-the-vote-tactic/
Jack Rabbit
(45,984 posts)Enumerated here are reason why a Romney "victory" should not be recognized by the general public. I guess we can add one more.
Who said the Republicans don't believe in transparency. They are showing, as they did during the dark years of the usurper Bush, a very transparent contempt for democracy.
midnight
(26,624 posts)ERROR!
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AgingAmerican
(12,958 posts)with signs warning people that their ballots will go down the sewer drain if they drop them off with these people.
They also need to be informed about the washington state ballot tracker
http://info.kingcounty.gov/elections/ballottracker.aspx
They park these vans in parking lots around the county.
http://www.kcgop.org/get-involved/gop-victory-van-locations/
SCVDem
(5,103 posts)People died for the right to vote.
Take it away under penalty of execution.
Still want to mess with voting?
DFW
(54,448 posts)It wouldn't break my heart to see the local populace react as if they were being attacked by the Taliban.
Because...they are.
Bernardo de La Paz
(49,047 posts)Find out where they go. See if any bags of shredded documents are taken out of the building. Might get taken out Tuesday or Wednesday.
Chakaconcarne
(2,466 posts)To those heavily GOP populated areas....
Fucking bastard ass, God Damn Republicans!
Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin
(108,304 posts)There needs to be a serious Justice Department investigation of voter supression tactics.
mlevans
(843 posts)Northwest Public Radio reports that the vans are specifically labeled "GOP Victory Vans" and that they are out gathering Republican ballots, not Democratic ones.
Republicans Chase Ballots With Minivans, Smart Phones
Seems to me any Democrat who would hand his or her ballot in to something marked "GOP Victory Van" would have to fall into the not-terribly-bright category. Just saying.
liberal_at_heart
(12,081 posts)whether democrat or republican to drop their ballot off at an official drop box or put it in the mail box. This should not be happening. People don't offer to go inside a polling site and vote for people.
yellowcanine
(35,702 posts)there is no such thing as a Republican or a Democratic ballot.
liberal_at_heart
(12,081 posts)I didn't know what it was at the time. I wish I had or I would have reported it to King county elections. Those bastards!
cui bono
(19,926 posts)Spitfire of ATJ
(32,723 posts)Found that local TV news is ALL OVER THIS:
http://www.kirotv.com/news/news/ballot-collecting-gop-victory-vans-causing-controv/nSxfG/
Here's the video:
http://www.kirotv.com/videos/news/controversy-brews-over-gop-victory-van/vg229/
lpbk2713
(42,769 posts)I hope when Romney and Lyin go down they take the whole rethuglican potty with them.
libguyob_19556dd
(10 posts)How typical..
cui bono
(19,926 posts)I mean, that's kind of a clue right there, isn't it? If it were just about voting in and of itself why would "victory" be involved? That's also pretty stupid, which leads me to believe the pubs did name them.
ETA: I just saw the pic in the post above. Wow. Just wow. In this day and age I hope everyone knows enough to not trust the GOP with anything election related.
liberal_at_heart
(12,081 posts)so hopefully no democrats handed any of their ballots over.
Nika
(546 posts)I saw the local media doing interviews of people voting today and urged them to keep checking on this story.
They said (KVAL) that they had heard of this story.
Cha
(297,812 posts)colsohlibgal
(5,275 posts)Religion was never rammed down my throat as a child, so I guess I'm agnostic, I do know there has to be more behind the curtain because nothing changed to something makes no sense. However if there is a Hell I hope righties like this get a special place down there, their lack of a moral compass is shocking.
Takket
(21,644 posts)Pakid
(478 posts)and put an end to the GOP dishonesty and election shenanigan. It is time for us decent people to say no more. We need to sue the Republican party until it is flat broke. Any lawyers out there looking to make a name for themselves here is your chance, to do something that will help this once great nation regain it self esteem. Help us to put an end to the Republican election dishonesty.
yellowcanine
(35,702 posts)ballots. Any collection sites should be staffed by bipartisan election judges just as polling sites are.
Window
(7,265 posts)put under the jail. These people will stoop to any low to disenfranchise voters. Just think about those stories not receiving any press.
VPStoltz
(1,295 posts)AsahinaKimi
(20,776 posts)Where fore art thou?
SammyWinstonJack
(44,130 posts)DonRedwood
(4,359 posts)fortyfeetunder
(8,894 posts)Monitor their every move...