Covid can survive on groceries for days according to new study

[wnylib]

Article in Fortune Magazine reports that the covid virus can remain viable on grocery items for days or hours depending on the type of food, packaging, and storage. It gives examples of cans, plastic wrapped foods, and fresh vegetables and fruits.

https://fortune.com/2022/12/02/covid-can-live-on-groceries-for-days-scientists-say-study/

[brush]

1. Early on in the covid pandemic videos online showed us how...

to wipe down groceries with covid killing sprays. I did it for weeks until reports came out that the virus didn't survive for long at all in the atmosphere, especially in sunlight.

Now this. Who knows what to believe. I've stopped wiping down groceries long ago and haven't gotten covid. I'm vaxxed and boosted four times. Maybe that's why I naven't gotten it, but again, who knows what to believe?

[Hortensis]

2. I believed Dr. Fauci's explanation that he personally left purchases

outside for a couple days before bringing them in. This was before research showed surface transmission of Covid was significantly less dangerous than feared and before the vaccines. He did it because he "didn't know what to believe." The data weren't in.

In leaving them out while any viruses died, he was being more careful than the other top epidemiologists asked what personal practices they were following, but he also was the only one heading fast for his 80s and waited for studies to provide information.

[LisaM]

29. Well, that lets out apartment dwellers.

Let me tell you (again!) how crappy it is to live in an apartment during a pandemic. No yard, no balcony, and having to constantly mask in the elevator. And obviously no garage where we can leave our groceries (leaving them in the car is not an option, due to break-ins).

I wonder if part of the persistence of the pandemic is connected to the dense housing model everyone is so anxious to put us in.

[jimfields33]

3. Thank God I did not do any of that.

Bad enough to take the groceries from the car in the garage to the house. Putting them away takes enough time. there was no way I was gonna wash the fruit and wash all the other garbage. No way! thankfully I didn’t waste my time. I won’t now either. I’ve had Covid once and it was like a nuisance flu. as long as you’re vaccinated, you can do what you want pretty much.

[BlackSkimmer]

15. I never did that either.

It’s an airborne virus.

Silliness.

[pnwmom]

26. The research now is saying that the risks of Long Covid and possible damage to the heart

and vascular system is much higher with the second infection than the first.

So no one should relax about this. Just because you got through the first infection doesn't mean you'd be fine with a second.

[yellowdogintexas]

30. we did all that for 2 years and finally slacked off after vaccine #3

I hope we don't go back to doing that it was making me a bit crazy

[Ms. Toad]

46. Pancreatitis can be deadly -

And COVID, even mild cases in vaccinated individuals, can cause pancreatitis. It's not a nuisance flu.

I was vaccinated (second booster - I've now had a third) between 2 and 3 weeks before I contracted COVID. Approximately a month later I was hospitalized with pancreatitis for 3+ days. I was also diagnosed with some sort of gall bladder crud (precisely what is not clear, since the diagnosis associated with the test is something only people on death's door get), and several immune deficiencies. The specialist I followed up with said he is seeing a lot of pancreatitis caused by COVID, and diagnosed both the pancreatitis and gall bladder crud as caused by COVID.

Pancreatitis is only one of the serious sequelae to COVID - more are being discovered the longer we are able to watch post-COVID patterns.

That said, I agree as to groceries. COVID is spread primarily through the air - not by contact. There's really no need to be as obsessive as people were at the beginning of COVID. (I was - and still am - obsessive about mask wearing. But I never took any additional steps with groceries to stay safe.)

[wnylib]

6. True, who knows? The virus is spread mostly by inhalation.

Although infection by surface contamination seems to be less likely, it is apparently possible according to the article. I guess it could happen if items are handled after someone sneezes or coughs on them. If you wash or sanitize your hands before rubbing your eyes or eating, you'd be ok. But if you buy a contaminated fresh vegetable to be eaten fresh, apparently there is a risk, especially if you don't wash the vegetable or your hands.

I was surprised on a recent medical appointment by something the nurse who drew my blood said. She worked for several years in the local hospital before joining a private practice and has friends at the hospital. She told me that the covid infection rate in my area is very high and that she is very careful about buying fresh vegetables, especially bell peppers, because of potential contamination by people handling them before buying.

I always rinse all fresh vegetables and then wash my hands before eating them. But I don't know how effective that is since you can't use soap on them. Is water, even if it's hot water, enough to get the virus off? And most people use cold water when rinsing veggies like lettuce and celery.

So, who knows? But I found the article interesting.

[2naSalit]

10. A friend of mine...

Used to rinse fresh things off with vinegar water. When we would harvest wild greens to eat, she would soak them in vinegar water for 15 minutes first thing.

That was before the pandemic. I don't know if vinegar is sufficient for a virus, not that it's expected to kill it but to wash the particles off the surface.

[wnylib]

18. Grocery stores sometimes use vinegar water to preserve produce.

It is primarily to protect produce from fungi and bacteria. But it is not effective on most viruses, including covid, according to the following link.

https://www.healthline.com/health/is-vinegar-a-disinfectant#products

[2naSalit]

24. Good to know!

[Chellee]

23. A vinegar rinse

is very good at getting insects to abandon the produce and sink to the bottom of the water bowl. I, for one, do not want my salad to have unauthorized protein bits. 😬

[2naSalit]

45. That was her reason for doing it.

[littlemissmartypants]

25. Our hospital infection control nurse used to emphasize that soap and most

Importantly friction both are necessary to break the protective membrane that covers the germ, viral or bacterial. It was her specialty area and she had decades of experience and I never questioned her. So I've followed that rule for years. ❤️

[Fiendish Thingy]

4. I'm not worried.

Get back to me when there is conclusive evidence of anyone catching COVID from groceries.

I’m fully vaxed, wear a mask in all indoor public places. I’m not going to stress about COVID coated groceries.

From the linked article:

While the CDC also says the virus can be spread via contaminated surfaces in some cases, the organization says there is currently no evidence that handling or consuming food can spread COVID-19.

[Demsrule86]

11. I feel the same way Fiendish...you know when I got Covid? I took my mask off for a wedding

in New York...and I had the full monty-the blood clots, covid pneumonia, and sadly heart issues. Wear a mask, people.

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

28. I agree.

Just as, early on, stores were wiping down counters and checkout lanes after every customer, and I want to scream at them. We weren't getting Covid from those surfaces.

Which is why I am very skeptical about this particular report.

[Quakerfriend]

5. Not noted in this article but,

Covid can survive for up to 2 years in the freezer.

[BlackSkimmer]

16. Most viruses are kept in freezers in labs.

So that doesn’t seem surprising.

[Hortensis]

7. This article doesn't contradict anything but provides more confirming info.

There was never a claim that the virus didn't survive at all on surfaces, and we were told it could survive longer on refrigerated items, and, as said, a long time in the freezer. But the main route of transmission was and still is between people through respiratory fluids.

The foods that were tested, the research team said, “are commonly sold loose on supermarkets shelves or uncovered at deli counters or market stalls, they may be difficult to wash, and they are often consumed without any further processing i.e., cooking.”

They also tested food packaging materials that are either very common or used on products where consumption of the food may involve direct contact between the mouth and the packaging. ...

Some goods, including bell peppers, bread, ham, and cheese, had infectious virus detected on them several days after they were contaminated. On some surfaces, like croissants, the virus remained present and transmissible for hours.

Btw, please let's remember the other HUGE reason for not spreading Covid: NOT SPREADING A KILLER DISEASE TO OTHERS. Over 1.2 million Americans have already died from this (mostly!) RW-spite-powered holocaust and more are still dying every day. And another pandemic is coming any time.

Easy takeaways: Wash our hands as long and frequently as we were taught in school. If you're not going to wash salad items or cook raw veggies, don't serve them to elderly guests and don't touch others. Isolate yourself when sick.

[NullTuples]

31. "If you're not going to wash salad items or cook raw veggies..." good advice even w/o COVID!

Store bought produce can have anything from pesticides, to "enhancers" like wax and worse, to human feces on it. Home grown can have insect & bird feces, which can carry bacteria or parasites.

Always wash your produce. All it takes is a mild soap - like a drop of dish soap - and presto! No bacteria, no parasites, no COVID.

[Takket]

8. your takeaway from this should be that there is zero reason to clean food packaging.

the number of steps that virus has to go through to infect you this way make that chances of it actually succeeding virtually zero.

[Demsrule86]

9. I am sorry but that is BS...Covid has taught us that viruses like colds and flus are transmitted

via the air.

[wnylib]

14. Not quite accurate. First, covid is not the flu.

While it's true that covid is transmitted primarily through inhalation, flu and colds can be transmitted by fomites (contaminated surfaces) as well as by inhalation.

Under CAUSES at the following Mayo Clinic link, it says:
"Influenza viruses travel through the air in droplets when someone with the infection coughs, sneezes, or talks. You can inhale the droplets directly. Or you can pick up the germs from an object - telephone or computer keyboard - and then transfer them to your eyes, nose, or mouth."

https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/flu/symptoms-causes/syc-20351719

[littlemissmartypants]

27. Mucous membranes, entry point. eom

[love_katz]

12. Pay wall.

Can't read.

[intrepidity]

13. Nooooooooooooo not this again!!

Are we living Groundhog Day? aaaaargh!

(not directed at OP author, just the thought of spraying down everything again)

[Meowmee]

17. I wonder what the level of transmission this way has been

But I stopped doing that at some point I always have washed my fruits and vegetables though. I think the main mode of transmission is still aerosol. There were studies done that said SARS cov had been transmitted between family members who were taking care of an infected member. So, they recommended not only wearing masks etc. and isolating but also washing bedding and other items of clothes, keeping the bathroom very clean and such. They recommended to use bleach. The toilet bowl is a way that things could get aerosolized.

[wnylib]

20. Agree. I think covid is mainly transmitted by air droplets,

but that there is smaller chance of it being transmitted by surface contact, too. How much smaller? I don't know of any studies that compare the statistics between air borne versus surface contact.

[Meowmee]

22. I will google it to see

[wnylib]

21. What a peculiar sense of humor.

It's just an article reporting on a study. The information is available for people to make their own decisions.

[mahina]

32. Don't lick the credit card keypad

That’s the worst.
I have soap and water in the car and wash my hands for about a minute after I touch that thing, even before COVID. It’s a potential vector.

That aside I’m not really worried.

[Martin68]

35. I lick it every time I swipe my card, because I'm the Rambo of virus deniers. But, seriously, unless

you are immune-compromised, you don't need to be paranoid about tapping the credit card keypad or elevator buttons with one little finger. I got in the elevator yesterday with a woman who uses her knee to push the elevator buttons.

[mahina]

39. lol. Was her last name Clouseau?

She sounds like his lovely bride!

[NullTuples]

40. My spouse & I usually use hand sanitizer after the checkout after loading bags into the car

We bring them inside & put everything away, then wash our hands.

Pantry items likely sit for a minimum of 24 hrs (often far longer), after which most of the surface viruses have broken down.

Produce gets washed before we use or eat it.

The only higher risk items are packaged goods that go in the fridge or freezer, but we've been doing this for coming up on three years now and none of those items have infected us either. I'm guessing because we frequently wash our hands during food prep, too. Turns out e. coli and salmonella precautions likely work for COVID, too.

None of this (except the hand sanitizer in the car) is new because of COVID.

I'm guessing if a few viruses do make it through all that, statistically the quantity that do just haven't been enough to infect us so far.

Plus since the start we've kept our boosters current, always mask around others, don't eat indoors with strangers, avoid indoor crowds, etc..

[Martin68]

33. OK, it's like the germs on your kitchen counter. Do they survive in the number necessary to

overwhelm you immune system? For most of us, the answer is "NO!" There are pathological germs and viruses all around us, but seldom in quantities necessary to penetrate a healthy person's natural immune defenses. It's only when our immune system is compromised the we need to take ultra-cautious steps to protect ourselves.

[NullTuples]

34. Link to the actual study:

If anyone is interested in reading the source.

https://www.food.gov.uk/sites/default/files/media/document/Survival%20of%20SARS-CoV-2%20on%20the%20surfaces%20of%20food%20and%20food%20packaging%20materials%20.pdf

From page 14-16:

"A risk assessment published by the Foods Standards Agency (FSA) in 2020
concluded that it was very unlikely that you could catch coronavirus via food. This
assessment included the worst-case assumption that, if food became contaminated
during production, no significant inactivation of virus would occur before
consumption. However, the rate of inactivation of virus on products sold at various
temperatures was identified as a key uncertainty, because if inactivation does occur
more rapidly in some situations, then a lower risk may be more appropriate. This
project was commissioned to measure the rate of inactivation of virus on the surface
of various types of food and food packaging, reducing that uncertainty. The results
will be used to consider whether the assumption currently made in the risk
assessment remains appropriate for food kept at a range of temperatures, or
whether a lower risk is more appropriate for some.

For most foods tested there was a significant drop in levels of virus contamination
over the first 24 hours. However, for cheddar cheese and sliced ham, stored in
refrigerated conditions and a range of relative humidity, the virus levels remained
high up to a week later, when the testing period was stopped. Both cheddar cheese
and sliced ham have high moisture, protein and saturated fat content, possibly
offering protection to the virus. When apples and olives were tested, the virus was
inactivated to the limit of detection very quickly, within an hour, when the first time
point was measured. We suggest that chemicals, such as flavonoids, present in the
skin of apples and olives inactivate the virus. The rate of viral decrease was rapid,
within a few hours, for croissants and pain au chocolat. These pastries are both
coated with a liquid egg wash, which may have an inhibitory effect on the virus. Food
packaging materials tested had variable virus survival. For all food packaging, there
was a significant drop in levels of virus contamination over the first 24 hours, in all
relative humidity conditions and at both 6°C and 21°C; these included PET1 bottles
and trays, aluminium cans and composite drinks cartons."

[wnylib]

36. Thanks for the more complete background information.

[Yavin4]

38. Everyone on planet earth will be exposed to covid at some point in their lives.

It's impossible for it to go away whether you wear a mask or not. The best thing to do is get vaccinated and boosted. Eat right and exercise. You will be fine.

[Celerity]

41. The study's actual conclusions are not worrisome IMHO. nt

[Hermit-The-Prog]

42. I've always considered packaging to be contaminated with -something-.

I washed everything with a bleach solution in 2020. Won't go back to that, but will continue to keep unwashed hands away from my face.

(Anyone who has ever had to work with things like wheel bearings, gear oil, anti-seize, or dirty diapers will understand about always treating your hands as if contaminated).

[helpisontheway]

43. I still wipe down all grocery packages. I started at the beginning of the pandemic..nt

[Silent3]

44. I can survive on groceries for a few days too

But then I just have to get out of the house and eat out somewhere.

[Maru Kitteh]

47. I too can survive for days on groceries.

However, like the lowly coronavirus, if I were going to kill someone, I wouldn’t bet on getting it done with a lovely heirloom tomato 🍅.