Nashville mass school shooter Audrey Hale was rejected by her Christian parents who 'couldn't accept

[Demovictory9]

Nashville mass school shooter Audrey Hale was rejected by her Christian parents who 'couldn't accept' she was gay and trans - as cops reveal she also planned to shoot relatives

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11912163/Nashville-school-shooter-Audrey-Hales-parents-accept-gay-trans.html

Church coordinator Norma, 61, and her husband Ronald, 64, refused to let Hale - who had recently adopted the name Aiden and used he/him pronouns - dress as a man in their home.


The 28-year-old loner would instead wait until she left their $700,000 Nashville property to change outfits, according to a well-placed source.

'You only see what you want to see. Their religion does not allow them to accept homosexuality,' the source told DailyMail.com.

[Botany]

1. Audrey Hale was rejected by her Christian parents

Just like the GOP is doing across America to LGBT people. If we had sensible gun laws
and less dumb fuck hate from our Christian Taliban this shooting might never have happened.

Take a bow Gov. DeSantis, Fox News, Pastor Jeffries, the GOP, Marsha Blackburn, and so on.

[maxsolomon]

2. Predictable back story.

You can't make people different from how they are. It only causes misery.

That said, there is no excuse for a Rampage Shooting. There is always another way.

[ProfessorGAC]

4. Hey, Max!

I'm replying to your 30,000th post! Congrats on the milestone!!
But, actually I posted to share your sentiment about the rampage.
Have we heard anything about motive as to why she just didn't shoot herself, instead of taking others first?
A way to assure suicide by cop?

[maxsolomon]

17. Thanks, hadn't realized I was at 30K!

I probably regret only about a third of those.

The rationale I think many (most?) Rampage Killers have is to make others hurt like they hurt, to make the world see their pain, their grievances. Suicide doesn't accomplish that.

[mgardener]

21. If she committed suicide her parents could cover up her transition.

The suicide would be hard for the family's reputation and religion, transitioning would be impossible for them to cover up with this very public, horrific act.
She made sure the world knew.

Please do not think I agree with her heinous act.
I am appalled that children and staff are not safe in schools.

[AllyCat]

23. Just wondering if he/him/his is more appropriate here?

Not that I care one whit for the feelings of a murderer of innocent people.

[ProfessorGAC]

43. The Pathetic Thing For Me...

...is this. I started substituting math & science after I retired from being a scientist.
I have made it a habit to scan the room for potential weapons, especially the fire extinguisher, in every room, just in case if comes to fighting back.
That type of awareness shouldn't be necessary. It's pathetic that I have to consider this.

[CanonRay]

22. I'm guessing she wanted revenge on the school.

She was probably miserable there, but who kn.

[ProfessorGAC]

45. I Read She Was Only There Through Grade 4

Of course, the information is fluid, so I can't be sure that's accurate.

[womanofthehills]

54. One report said she originally planned to kill in another place

But changed her mind because there was too much security. So many articles now - it will be awhile before we get the real info. Also sounds like she was living with her parents - as that’s the place police are searching.

[marshall]

148. I want to know more about the other place's security

Whatever they’re doing should be promoted elsewhere.

[samir.g]

139. *He

[NullTuples]

52. I grew up in a conservative Christian world; suicide is simply not an option

As in, it doesn't even exist. Even if one rejects the religious teachings, your worldview simply does not include suicide. It's too drilled in. Or in many cases, beaten in or emotionally abused in to even recognize that it's possible. That's about the best as I can explain it; it stems from us being taught that everything negative is a moral failing.

Yes, I know so is murder but I think that's a much, much higher threshold. My guess is that he (the shooter) at that point had been pushed so far, he snapped.

You cannot look for rationality at that point.

But you can look for underlying causes.

[Jedi Guy]

77. "I grew up in a conservative Christian world; suicide is simply not an option."

So did I, and you are unfortunately incorrect. It very much can be an option. My family is Lutheran Church Missouri Synod, so pretty damn conservative. A couple years ago, the teenage son of the pastor at the main church in my hometown killed himself. His parents were devastated, had no idea he was suffering until he killed himself.

I was actually pleasantly surprised by the congregations' reaction. The main branch is a little more old-school, the offshoot branch a little more modern, but despite the church's stance on suicide being identical, no one made shitty remarks about knowing where he ended up or something horrible like that and everyone was kind and supportive.

But long story short... suicide is, sadly, an option, even among conservative Christians. Probably not at the same rate as the general population, but it does still happen.

[Hekate]

97. A friend of my daughter's killed herself after much mental anguish, & the minister had the gall...

… to address it at the funeral as a moral failing and heinous sin. My daughter and her 12 year old son were there as mourners, not members of the congregation. Afterward my grandson approached the man and said simply, “You are wrong.” I was SO proud when my daughter told me of this.

[Jedi Guy]

122. Sadly, that's on brand for a lot of Christian denominations.

They view life as a gift from God, and ending one's life is throwing the gift back in God's face. There's a little variance between denominations, but most of them view suicide as guaranteed damnation to Hell.

It's pretty gross that a minister, who is in theory supposed to provide comfort and support to the loved ones of a person who has died, went out of his way to worsen their pain and humiliate them during an intensely difficult moment. Good on your grandson for calling him out for his shitty behavior.

Shitty people make everything harder, unfortunately.

[NullTuples]

102. I apologize for generalizing: In the conservative Christian world *I* was raised in.

I don't doubt that it does happen, and certainly was not meaning to reduce or dismiss those that have happened. I was trying to speak to the state of mind that is too often taught and enforced in some communities.

Something that occurred to me as I typed this, a sort of parallel or analogy. Growing up, suicide and being trans or gay were in the same category. They were something that was so horrible, so "sinful" that it should not be spoken of, ever. I don't think I heard anyone say the words, "gay" or "transsexual" (the term back then)...or suicide. At best there were vague allusions that I now realize were intended to not even expose children or teens to the very concepts of such things.

So if someone did die of suicide (or came out as LGBTQ), it was simply not spoken of. Loved ones were expected to bear whatever burden that placed upon them...alone. And that burden, because of the community's values, was shame.

I'm not so sure that's a wise value system, since murder may well fall into the same category in that system of judgement.

[Jedi Guy]

123. Sounds very similar to the Christian community I remember from when I grew up.

Suicide and homosexuality were both Hell-worthy offenses to the vast majority of the people I went to church with as a kid. I came of age in the late 90s, and I don't ever recall hearing about transfolk prior to that. Obviously they existed, but a middle-class kid from a Christian family in southern Mississippi sure wasn't likely to hear much about them. Homosexuality was barely discussed, and when it was, it was in whispers that so-and-so's child might be gay, and how awful that must be for them, etc. etc. I'm sure you're familiar with the whisper campaign.

My first experience with LGBTQ+ folks was when I got into community theatre. Stereotypes aside, there were a lot of LGBTQ+ people in our troupe, and my parents were a little unnerved when they found out I was associating with them. My dad was an elder in the church at the time. My folks cloaked it in concern that I was stretching myself too far and risking my GPA, but I'm sure that wasn't all of it.

Fortunately, our pastor was a really good guy, very progressive (by LCMS standards, at least), and when the scandalized whispers that I was hanging out with gay people started up, Pastor Tom pointed out that Jesus hung out with whores and tax collectors. That toned it down some.

[Earth-shine]

66. I think this shooter, like most, wanted the notoriety. If it were just suicide ...

we wouldn't hear about it or be discussing it.

Specifically, it seems she wanted revenge on her parents for their puritanical attitudes and cruelty.

This grand act of murder has exposed the parents, making them seem like monsters to us, but heroes to those like them.

There are monsters everywhere, and the shooter was one as well. The bell tolls for them, their victims, and for thee.

[Boomerproud]

7. K&R

nt

[jimfields33]

37. At 28 years old, you tell your parents. Thank you, but I wear what I want.

I mean visits to the home were how often? Maybe should have cut down on the visits.

[womanofthehills]

46. From the reports it sounds like Aubrey was living with her parents

Or her father. Sounds like that’s where the cops are searching.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

49. Her parents knew. Did you not read the excerpt in the OP? They knew multiple aspects. . . nt

[womanofthehills]

64. There are only about 100 articles about this story online now

I have no idea what you are saying. Knew that she changed clothes when she left the house? Knew what?

Just about everyone who ever knew her is now telling stories -

[Bernardo de La Paz]

81. Very first sentence of the OP "Christian parents who 'couldn't accept' she was gay and trans"

They knew she was gay and trans.

The person I replied to didn't read the OP and said the shooter was old enough and should have told the parents.

They knew.

[Captain Zero]

114. Except he depended on them for a place to live

In their $700k home.

[Roisin Ni Fiachra]

127. Well said. Simple and eloquent. nt

[Elessar Zappa]

3. Sad.

But no excuse for murdering children.

[NoRethugFriends]

5. His, not her

[BlackSkimmer]

9. The shooter is being referred to as "she" almost everywhere.

I've not seen anything definitive.

I don't really care anything about school shooters and their lives...to me, they are all "the shooter."

[AkFemDem]

13. I am 100% confused as to proper pronoun here

I’ve seen art signed by this artist by both the masculine and feminine names. Neighbors and friends spoke to them in recent times and say they still referred to themself as “she/her”.

At first, when I read they were trans I assumed this was a male to female transition- hence all the “she’s”. But then I learned they were born female.

I guess the only reliable option is they/them, which also still runs the risk of dehumanizing them if they identified as she or he so I don’t know. I just don’t know.

[yardwork]

74. I'm hearing references switch to "he."

The shooter identified as male and used male pronouns on social media.

[hamsterjill]

105. Exactly.

I will not entertain excuses for anyone shooting up a school. There is no justification ever good enough.

[LostOne4Ever]

31. Thank you.

Shooter is scum, but misgendering him implies that their gender identity is frivolous and not real.

He needs to be referred to as Aiden and as a “he” for living trans people who had no part in this shooting. Not for the sake of the dirtbag child murderer.

[BlackSkimmer]

6. So this shooter decides to shoot two nine year olds, an eight year old, a custodian and two teachers

at a school they attended in elementary school. Yeah, that makes a lot of sense.

At 28 years old, one would think the shooter would have found a life away from mommy and daddy at this point, wouldn't one?

"The 28 year old loner would instead wait until she left their $700,000 Nashville property to change outfits..." Why didn't this 28 year old loner have a home of their own where they could dress as they please?

[Gore1FL]

29. I suspect, given his upbringing, family situation, etc it was a random rampage.

Or perhaps suicide-by-cop.

Obviously, I'm just spit-balling here, but I don't the victims served any purpose other than "extras" in the perp's mind.

[womanofthehills]

48. A friend of Aubrey's posted a message from Aubrey - it's online

Last edited Tue Mar 28, 2023, 07:27 PM - Edit history (1)

Saying they were going to kill themselves & her friend would read about it in the news.

[Shipwack]

61. Did they live at home?

Did they have a job? Maybe their parents kept them from assuming adult responsibilities so they were in a Catch-22…

They couldn’t move out because they had no money or job. Their parents wouldn’t “let” them get a job so they had no money to get out.

Or perhaps they had anxiety, or other mental/physical issues that prevented them from living on their own.

I don’t want to appear to be making excuse so for their actions… Most people in bad situations don’t become mass shooters. I only wish they had gotten the mental care and acceptance they needed.

[questionseverything]

71. They bought seven guns so money wasn't a problem

[jimfields33]

72. 28 years old!!!! Parents won't let them get a job????? Really????? 28!!!!

18 MAYBE.

[gay texan]

87. It's all about the control

That's how it works in these families.

[womanofthehills]

79. Sounds like they lived at home but had various jobs

Logo Illustrator, cat sitter, and I forget the others but lower paying part time jobs

[LeftInTX]

137. I read mild autism spectrum

A professor said Audrey/aiden stormed out of class when they couldn't figure out a password.
She was also a cat sitter.
While artistically talented, seemed to have other issues.
The art world is very LGBT accepting. So I don't think that was an issue there. However, autism spectrum can prevent people from being gainfully employed, not matter how talented they are.

[Eyeball_Kid]

84. Is it too skeptical to suspect that the shooter's "emotional" problems...

were associated with an overly dependent relationship with her rigid parents?

[GuppyGal]

93. +1000

[Ilsa]

116. It's not as easy financially, to live away from parents any more. If he

was seeing a professional counselor, maybe his emotional issues prevented him from getting a college degree. Having been born with female hormones, maybe he wasn't physically strong enough for a job using manual labor. Maybe the parents were helping with his insurance and medical payments but on the condition he remain at home.

[sarisataka]

8. Daily Mail.... ? nt

[Nevilledog]

14. Anything from The Daily Mail is suspect IMHO

[AllyCat]

24. True

[womanofthehills]

50. There are hundreds of sites now covering this story

With more & more info coming out from people who knew shooter.

[AllyCat]

73. Yes. This post, however, linked the mail.

That is always suspect. IMO, just another asshole with easy access to lethal weapons.

[spooky3]

10. Should we refer to Hale as Aiden/he, as the article suggests Hale was

Transitioning to that identity?

No excuses for murdering innocent people, but I do feel sorry for Hale.

[Dorian Gray]

111. Any sympathy I may have felt for Hale

died when Hale murdered 6 innocent people.

[onethatcares]

11. I don't care what kinda house the parents owned

I care about how they treated their own daughter..As Jesus said,, "Love one another as you would be loved".

[cannabis_flower]

15. Son

[Hekate]

99. Child

[ShazzieB]

16. Just about what I suspected.

In fact, this is EXACTLY what I was pretty darned sure of.

Those parents sound positively odious. Garbage humans, for sure.

[regnaD kciN]

19. Doesn't excuse killing 9-year-olds...

…period.

And not something that will accomplish anything other than enabling further persecution of transgendered persons. As someone with trans family members, I can only dread what’s going to happen now.

[ShazzieB]

51. No, it doesn't. 😦

I honestly don't understand what drives a person to do someting like this. I can absolutely relate to being depressed and suicidal. I can understand being so miserable that you just don't want to live anymore. But taking nonconsenting strangers with you, especially children? I just can't get my head around it.

The ones that are true hate crimes seem relatively straightforward by comparison. Gunman hates black people, or Asians, or Jews, or Muslims, or LGBTQ+ folks, or fill in the blank so much that they feel compelled to go shoot a bunch of them? Horrific, but it's not that hard to figure out what the motivation was.

But killing a bunch of random total strangers? That's something I can't fathom. I can't help but think that a person who does that must be in a degree of pain that I can't even begin to imagine. No, that does NOT excuse such actions, but the more we can to come understand about what drives people to do such things, the better a position we'll be in to be able to identify people who are in trouble and help them before the unthinkable happens. (While ALSO passing qppropriate gun control legislation, OF COURSE.)

[Silent3]

134. That's the kind of thing that most baffles me about mass shooters

I can sort of understand losing control and going after particular people who have been tormenting you, or who share the same prejudices that lead to your torment.

But shooting just anyone, especially little kids?

How does a person not realize (or not care) that they are becoming at least as bad, if not far worse, than the people who have hurt them?

[Hortensis]

18. What'd he inherit from those extremists? Nature and nurture?

How much of which? But it looks like there's plenty of reason to suspect bad influences from both.

He's dead, of course, beyond interviewing and testing. But hopefully researchers will have enough information to add his to the body of information. How to help those who turn to violence before they do?

[Chainfire]

20. Right wingers like to claim that guns don't kill people, that people kill people.

I suspect the parents can claim their share of responsibility in this. Treat people, that you should love, like degenerate outcast and when the victims lash out, be all shocked about it. Of course, I am sure that they will be forgiven... I am not trying to detract from the personal responsibility of the shooter, but the shooter may have been hand-made at home.

People wonder why I don't trust "born again Christians."

[Sympthsical]

25. Already sick of seeing this shit

A lot of LGBTers have rough upbringings. My parents were Catholic types who didn't come around until I was in my mid-20s.

We didn't kill children because of it.

Seems to be an awful lot of "wondering" and "trying to understand" surrounding this. I don't often get a full court press of bullshit about trying to figure out if that white supremacist murderer was bullied.

It increasingly seems like some people want to inch around promoting "other people made this person do it, who's really a victim when you think about it, because of those people I hate" without outright saying so. Maybe because there's still at least a slim vestige of decency and understanding hanging by a thread about how gross it would sound if said honestly aloud.

Super not interested. It's a disservice to the 99.99999999999% of LGBTers who had it tough with our families and society and didn't murder children because of it.

[Ace Rothstein]

28. You consistently have my favorite post in almost every thread.

I would subscribe to your newsletter.

[SickOfTheOnePct]

35. Spot on n/t

[ProfessorGAC]

47. Excellent Post

Good first person perspective.

[Jedi Guy]

53. Well said. N/T

[Zeitghost]

56. Thank You

n/t

[Alexander Of Assyria]

57. The Gun is the common element. It's the Gun. Period. Walmart Gun, sale on Fridays, no Death!

[Sympthsical]

58. Yep

We know what the problem is in these incidents.

[Scrivener7]

59. Yep. I don't care about the angst of ANY murderer of children.

[RobinA]

112. You Need To Care

Without understanding WHY these people act as they do we will never be able solve the problem. Understanding is not excusing or feeling sorry for, it's just adding to the knowledge that's out there. Giving up to the supposed inherent "evil" of these people is just that - giving up.

[yardwork]

120. Removing the guns would help a lot.

Lots of people are troubled, sad, angry. The vast majority don't murder people because of it.

[Scrivener7]

124. No. Really. I don't. Regulate the fucking guns. The idea that there is a

reason other than the guns ignores the fact that NO OTHER country has this problem. And every other country has troubled people.

Once more: I do not care about this person's reasons. I do not need to know what excuse they would have given for having done this. There is NO reason for this.

[RobinA]

133. And You Can Not Care

if that is your choice. However, you will never solve the problem if you don't understand it.

[Scrivener7]

143. Gosh. Thanks for the permission. And thanks but I understand the problem perfectly.

It's the guns. That's why it happens here with numbing regularity and nowhere else.

[Paladin]

69. Well done, thanks. (nt)

[questionseverything]

76. I agree with most of your post but

Why are you calling him a white supremacist?

His best friend was black

Is there more info I haven’t seen?

[Sympthsical]

80. I might've been unclear

I was saying I don't usually see deep dives into the rationales and potential hardships of white supremacists who murder in online spaces I frequent. Not a lot of articles out there about how hard Dylan Roof had it. And rightfully so.

So, I'm not very happy to see it in this case. It feels like I've been encountering it quite a bit in the past 24 hours on social media.

[RobinA]

135. Well, We're Not Allowed

to talk about WHY people did what we don't like, especially if we don't like them. Try to start a conversation on why Hitler was Hitler and you will get shut down very fast in polite circles because you are "making excuses" for Hitler. Same applies to white supremists, Charles Manson, and any number of really, really bad guys and girls. Personally, in my world we'd be talking about nothing but why Hitler was Hitler so we have a good understanding and can do our level best to not have it happen again.

Same with the shootings. I have no problem with regulating guns, couldn't hurt. But are we really so sure that the problem will be solved by doing that? I'm not. In my history books, prohibitions are generally not known for solving the problems they were supposed to. Actually, my newspaper tells me that prohibitions don't work. Why would a gun prohibition be any different.

[Texasgal]

78. BRAVO!!!!

THANK YOU!

[GuppyGal]

94. +1000

[yardwork]

119. Agreed. And, we don't see these deep dives into the other mass murderers because nothing is revealed

Most of the time after a mass murder, we hear nothing about the perpetrator. The media has rushed to reveal details about this particular killer.

Your comment about white supremacists is spot on.

[Novara]

26. We're failing our kids

So many of these school shooters desperately need help and support and instead we're (as a society) allowing them to purchase killing machines. WTF does anybody think will happen?

77% of school shooters legally obtained the guns they used to kill kids. Combine mental issues with no support or help with easy access to guns and this is the predictable result.

Parents are making it worse by banning books and keeping their kids uninformed. All that repression and close-mindedness produced this killer. It will keep producing more.

[Oliver Bolliver Butt]

27. I don't want to know anything about this person.

We go very wrong by making them famous.

[Evolve Dammit]

33. You're not reading or understanding the content of this issue...

[Oliver Bolliver Butt]

38. Damn right.

[Evolve Dammit]

41. Bye Oliver.

[muriel_volestrangler]

62. That seems unnecessary - the idea that giving publicity to mass murderers is bad is quite common

on the grounds that the more we discuss them, the more other potential murderers think "if I kill, people will pay attention to me at last". See eg https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.1177/0002764218763476

In recent years, major media organizations have wondered if their coverage of mass shooters actually increases the risk of future attacks, and have asked how their reporting could be improved. In response, 149 experts have called for media to stop publishing the names and photos of mass killers (except during ongoing searches for escaped suspects), but continue reporting the other details of these crimes as needed. Here, we review some of the most important scientific findings on (a) the nature of media coverage of mass killers, (b) its consequences, and (c) solutions that could help make this coverage safer, and summarize how new studies published in this special issue of American Behavioral Scientist add to this valuable knowledge base.

[Oliver Bolliver Butt]

68. Exactly.

Obviously the guns are the primary problem, but the race to publish photos and diaries and manifestos is creating more events.

[Jedi Guy]

60. How does "the content of this issue" change anything?

It seems like you're trying to draw a distinction between this shooting and other mass shootings, and there is no meaningful distinction here.

[Scrivener7]

63. "This issue" is the murder of children and their teachers.

This person's personal trials give no more excuse for murdering children than any other school shooter's personal trials.

Saying this person's gender is an excuse or reason is an insult to transgender people.

[boston bean]

32. So, shoot up a school? Sorry, I just don't have any sympathy.

[Evolve Dammit]

40. People excluded from society; minimalized, marginalized or maligned react to that. Not endorsing

the killings, but saying the way we treat humans has ramifications. In all walks of life. We are a very INTOLERANT society and becoming more so every year. It was not this bad in my youth. The gun violence is going to kill us. Literally and figuratively.

[boston bean]

92. I don't care. This person killed children.

Nothing done to this person is EVER is any excuse for doing what they did.

I have zero zip nada understanding or sympathy at all. May they rest in hell.

Should people not bully others, yes. But it has no bearing when children are slaughtered at their school. Many people are bullied for all sorts of reasons. They don;t go shooting up schools.

[Joinfortmill]

34. This was preventable..shame America.

[MarcA]

36. Abused children often lead to abusive adults. n/t

[boston bean]

98. And many times not.

[rainin]

39. Aiden's parent's will be the first parents of a school shooter who are venerated. Watch and see n/t

[MissB]

70. Spot on

Rather hope you’re wrong.

[gay texan]

86. Precisely n/t

[Kaleva]

42. Easy access to guns is the only relevant issue here

There is no justification for the murder of children or innocent adults.

I feel the same way for this mass shooter as I do all the rest who died. No sympathy whatsoever.

[RobinA]

113. Understanding

is not justification, but it is necessary to be able to make a dent in the problem.

[Kaleva]

115. We already know there needs to be tighter controls on guns

[ForgedCrank]

55. I've got

zero damns to give. This person murdered 6 people in cold blood, 3 of them being small children. None of them had jack to do with the background. Forgive me for having zero sympathy, but I don't.
The parents being crummy parents is an entirely different discussion altogether.

[honest.abe]

65. Many people have issues with their parents.

At 28 she/he should have found a way to get out. Join the Peace Corps is one option that takes no money and get you far away from family and others who aren't supportive... and is an incredible adventure.

[LeftInTX]

130. Yeah..It's also the Daily Mail

My SIL and BIL are holy rollers, Liberty University you name it. . Their daughter is lesbian and appears she may also transition. They eventually accepted her and she's getting married in a few months. She's been with her GF for years. She is 29.
We don't know how bad the problem was or if there are other factors.

[honest.abe]

147. Yep. Who knows for sure what was going on with this person.

[LeftInTX]

149. Found out they also had a form of autism

Hale went to an arts magnet public high school where she would often dress up as Ellien Page's character from Juno.

[lame54]

75. So, she kills a janitor...

And 3 kids and 2 teachers
And makes it even harder for every trans person in this country
Asshole parents are no excuse

[SouthernDem4ever]

82. True. The transgender issue has nothing to do with being a cold-blooded murderer

But there a lot of stupid people that can't realize that disconnection.

[samir.g]

140. *He

[lame54]

144. Because that's what's important

[Warpy]

83. I've heard this story a great many times

but this is the only time one of the aggrieved children bought an arsenal and shot up a school, killing 3 adults and 3 children.

It the GUNS, people, the semi auto killing machines that anyone with a grudge can get.

[pinkstarburst]

89. I am so sorry for Aiden and what he went through

just like I was sickened when I learned the shooter at Uvalde was bullied for stuttering and his teachers had for years recommended he get sp ed services and the school system did nothing to help him.

Nothing justifies getting a gun and slaughtering others because you are in pain.

The guns are the problem. Having such easy access to assault rifles is the problem. We can and MUST do better about mental health. We must treat everyone in this country better. But we will never catch every instance, never be able to find every person who is quietly suffering. Having easy access to guns means this will happen again and again and again.

[Warpy]

91. It's also the semi auto pistols

(cue howls of pain from men who love them). They make mass killing easy, too, just fire into a crowd, you're bound to hit people.

Most of the shootings around here are by semi auto pistol.

I want all the killing machines off the street. People can keep the ones you need to aim because they're slow to reload. That alone will cut down on the carnage.

I'm sick of the steady reporting of people killed in mass shootings, the bystanders killed because they were there. The gun lover's hobbyt is just costing us too much. It has to end.

[gay texan]

85. I've seen this play before

I had a feeling this was going to come out. I felt it in my gut.

I watched this very thing Happen to a friend of mine with extremely hard-core religious parents.

He was my best friend in grade school and in high school. To his parents, anything that brought him the slightest amount of joy was a sin. He was constantly punished for everything. I do mean everything, backed up by the justification of religion sprinkled with Bible verses.

I had the misfortune of meeting the mom twice. She was a slender thing with dark long hair. The eyes though, told you the story: literally a black abyss, cold, fucking goddamn evil. Still creeps me out to this day. Even as a 13 year old kid I knew something was wrong.

He was forced into a marriage. We all knew he was gay or at least not straight. Even out of the house, he was punished. On and on and on it went. Surprise visits from mom and dad to make sure the marriage was biblical. This is a grown ass man in his late 20's.

This went on until one day he snapped at the age of 32. It could have gone either way I suppose: yes, he had the potential of hurting innocent people in his rage, he was THAT insane and THAT rage filled by this point, but instead he chose to corner his mother and blow his brains out with a revolver in front of her. He wanted to leave a lasting memory for all the pain they caused.

I'm not excusing this shooters actions. Don't for a second think that.

I'm here to tell you that children can be driven to the point of violent rage when sexuality and overly religious parents are mixed together.

[Bluepinky]

109. What a sad story.

Your friend was, unfortunately, born into the wrong family. He must have experienced so much hurt and pain in his short lifetime.

Even in his darkest, most desperate moment, his final action was designed to affect the persons who caused him the most pain and anguish without including innocent people.

Gay and trans people have been here since the beginning of time; it’s time to accept them and move on.

[LiberalArkie]

88. I had 3 exorcisms as a child in the 50's for what is now called Aspergers.

Parents, priests and doctors said it had to be demons that caused my acting out as a kid

[Luciferous]

90. He was 28 years old, he didn't have to

live with his parents or live the way they wanted. I have zero sympathy for someone who takes out their issues on innocent children.

[GuppyGal]

95. I don't give a shit who was rejected by whom there is no excuse for this but it seems as if

people are making excuses...JUST WOW

[RobinA]

117. People Are Trying

understand, which is not the same as making excuses.

It's strikes me that unwillingness to understand is much the same as the old religious game of assigning "evil" to people who do things we don't like. Like it's some magical power that is just bestowed by God on some people who then go through life doing bad things. People seem more comfortable with the notion that evil is a random power randomly imposed from...I don't know where, rather than the result of fairly well understood factors in the "evil" person's environment. I guess people are more at ease with throwing up their hands and saying, "This person is just evil, nothing can be done," rather than "What brought this person to do such a heinous thing?"

[Scrivener7]

125. Do you work hard to understand motives when it is a white supremacist pulling

the trigger? I sure don't.

And am I assigning evil to this act? Absolutely. Yes, I am.

[RobinA]

132. Absolutely

White supremists are people, too. If you don't understand them you are at their mercy.

I do not assign evil, as I don't believe in evil as a noun. Hitler was an evil (adjective) man . Evil (noun) did not make him do what he did, there's no such thing as evil (a thing). There are evil acts, but evil doesn't cause acts.

[Scrivener7]

142. That's very nice for you. I don't see this as an occasion for sophistry.

[vercetti2021]

96. And?

He killed fucking children. I was rejected by my dad for being trans as well. But I didn't go and kill innocent people. 99.9% of the time when we are rejected. We either commit suicide or escape them. We don't kill people. We find one statistical anomaly and its WE KNEW THEY HAD MENTAL PROBLEMS! I'm fucking sick of this crap.

[BlueIdaho]

100. How very Christian of them... nt.

[Oneironaut]

101. So was I, sadly. I've never thought about killing anyone.

As usual, the Daily Mail puts out utter crap.

[Seeking Serenity]

103. If this is the case, arrest and convict the parents as aiders and abetters

Life without parole.

And the surviving parents of the slain children should sue them until they're out of that $700k mansion and are completely destitute.

Maybe that will teach evil Christians to accept their children no matter what they are.

[RobinA]

118. A More Nuanced Approach

might lead to better solutions. You can't take the human factor out when dealing with human behavior.

[yardwork]

121. What?! At what point should the parents have done that?

I hope your post doesn't mean what it appears to mean.

[Seeking Serenity]

126. I'm sorry I missed the now-removed reply (n/t)

[yardwork]

128. I'm genuinely shocked. I didn't alert on that post.

I wanted the poster to explain, because what it sounded like is pretty appalling. I hope I misunderstood.

[blogslug]

106. Just another story to add to the pile of our long long list of mass-shooters

All mass-murderers have stories. The point is they arrived at a decision to kill people. We live in a country that provides them easy access to the weapons that they use.

Ban high-powered guns and rifles

Regulate and tax the shit out of ammunition

Close the gun-sale loopholes

Stop allowing individuals to build personal armories

[BlueTsunami2018]

107. Yeah? So what?

Oh boo hoo. My parents can’t accept me so I have to go murder people. What a bunch of bullshit. This person was a full grown adult. Tell mom and dad to piss off and go find people who will accept and embrace you. There’s no excuse for any of this.

[Kaleva]

108. I agree.

[Patton French]

110. It's no excuse for what she did. Period. NT

[samir.g]

141. *He

[GodlessX]

129. Shitty Christian parents

Who chose their belief in magic and mythology
instead of loving their child as he was and
not what they wanted him to be. They cared
more about their invisible god and what their
church thought about them than the well-being
and mental health of their troubled son.

Instead of killing 6 innocent people, he should’ve
just killed his hateful, shitty ass parents and then
himself.

[LeftInTX]

131. I also read that Hale had a form of autism

Last edited Wed Mar 29, 2023, 01:48 PM - Edit history (2)

Can't find the article now.
This would likely be a bigger factor than LGBT issues. This is because many LGBT have had issues with parents and have peer support. However, peer support is almost non-existent for autism spectrum.
Even within the LGBT community, it's difficult for people with spectrum disorders.

Additionally, Hale stormed out of a college classroom when she couldn't figure out a password. (Frustration threshold issues, but I'm sure it's tied to the spectrum)

[meadowlander]

136. Bullshit.

https://autismsociety.org/

https://autismawarenesscentre.com/resource-regions/united-states/

There's also an explosion of people with autism on YouTube and TikTok talking about their experiences and networking with people in the comments.

"I killed people because I'm autistic" doesn't make any more sense than "I killed people because I'm trans."

I'll say as an autistic (and trans) person, neither one is a "factor" in being a mass murderer and suggesting that it is perpetuates harmful and inaccurate stereotypes about autistic people lacking empathy.

There are a ton of support communities for adults with autism, especially for people who are verbal and have fewer support needs.

[LeftInTX]

138. I'm talking about coping

I think autism is more difficult to cope with.
I've got bad ADHD. It's a tough ride. It doesn't make me kill people, but it sucks.

[Deep State Witch]

145. Well, Congratulations, Aiden

By your actions, you just put a big fat target on every trans and NB person in America.

[Buckeyeblue]

146. To me this discussion is a red herring. The issue is guns. And only guns.

I don't care if he was transsexuals or autistic or even depressed, the issue is that he used guns to murder children who had no idea who he was.

Had he not been able purchase such weapons so easily (or at all), he would not have been able to commit murder the way he did.

It comes back to guns.