My ultra-liberal husband said he will vote for orange

[MOMFUDSKI]

clown. Said the Country must be destroyed completely. Then maybe it can rise again using the Constitution. Our court system is corrupt and cannot be fixed. He is taking a different tack now.

[kimbutgar]

1. Have your contacted a divorce lawyer yet?

I could not live with a husband who supported that orange menace.

[hlthe2b]

2. I hope he regains his sanity... n/t

[MOMFUDSKI]

16. He will.

He is so pissed right now. But I did think he had a valid point.

[robbob]

28. That was also Susan Sarandon's "point"

and we ended up with 4 years of tRump. How’d that work out?

[kcr]

63. Not even a hint of a valid point

[yardwork]

64. What valid point does he have?

[Cha]

68. I Don't Think it's a "Valid point". Sanrandon tried

that SHIT in 2016 and it got us Fucking SCOTUS. And Fascism in our WH.

AND So many Dead form COVID that would not be if Hillary were President.

[LetMyPeopleVote]

80. Sarandon is responsible for the loss of Roe v. Wade and the stacking of the federal courts

Link to tweet

[Cha]

82. Yeah that was Stupid! TY

[Oneironaut]

3. That's idiotic.

There won’t be a Constitution. Just Fascism.

What your husband thinks will happen has never shown to ever happen before. Once you have authoritarianism, it’s almost impossible to get rid of.

[TheBlackAdder]

75. The Bourgeois said the same thing about the French Monarchy before descending the country into a century of chaos.

A 5-year-old destroys things that take time, money and labor to create.

Changes need to be incremental, as sudden change enters the unknown, and most often it's worse.

[bucolic_frolic]

4. Only the most corrupt can clean up corruption!

Yeah, that'll work out fine.

[TwilightZone]

5. Same argument was made in 2016. It didn't work.

It just gave us decades of hardship because McConnell was able to pack the courts.

Pardon me for saying so, but it's a stupid assertion. The country would survive another Trump administration, the doomsaying notwithstanding, but it would be markedly different from the one that would emerge from another four years of Biden, combined with a Democratic (if only slightly) Congress.

[OneGrassRoot]

54. A selfish, privileged assertion, imo. n/t

[JohnSJ]

6. Then he is no liberal. The best I would characterize him as is an anarchist. I assume though

that much of his frustration is short term because of everything trump seems to get away with, and that he will come to his senses in November, and vote for Biden, and a straight Democratic ticket on the ballot.

This cutting one's nose off to spite one's face is not a good strategy.

[obamanut2012]

8. He is an Accelerationist

[JohnSJ]

11. That is self-destruction. Fortunately I believe there are more sane people who WILL protect our

Democracy, and vote straight Democratic down the ballot.

[obamanut2012]

7. Your husband is not "ultra liberal," he is an Accelerationist, which is a right wing ideology

Quite a few J6 insurrectionists are also Accelerationists.

It is a cruel and pretty evil ideology. Are you okay with this?

[sop]

35. Accelerationism sounds cool, but it's just modern-day corporate Republicanism run amok.

Accelerationism: "A range of revolutionary and reactionary ideas that call for the drastic intensification of capitalist growth, technological change, infrastructure sabotage and other processes of social change to destabilize existing systems and create radical social transformations."

[obamanut2012]

56. Oh, I agree -- far right/ALT right are driving it in thsi country

Including, apparently, the OP's husband.

[sop]

59. There are more than a few people on the left driving it as well.

The lefties believe that if good people do nothing and simply allow our current system to go up in flames, some utopian world will rise from the ashes like the mythical phoenix, and goodness and justice will prevail forever.

I'm not convinced.

[yardwork]

62. It will be the dawning of the age of Aquarius.

And the lambs will lie down with lions. And we'll all join hands and sing. Until the petty bickering begins, about five minutes in, and then sociopaths swoop in and take everything.

[herding cats]

9. Shades of Susan Sarandon circa: 2016.

It's completely impossible to take the "destroy it all!!!11" people seriously.

My condolences on the state of your marriage.

[Aristus]

17. I was going to say: That's some Susan Sarandon-level horseshit right there.

Make things worse to bring about the revolution is not a liberal ideal; it would cause lots and lots of suffering, which is also not a liberal ideal.

[herding cats]

25. Exactly.

It's ignorant extremism akin to what a lot of Trump's zealots believe. They, too, want to burn down the government so that they can rebuild it into something more to their liking. With absolutely zero regard, or understanding, of the destruction that would wreck on society.

[Vinca]

10. Tell your husband, for me, that's the dumbest thing I've ever heard.

Then whack him up side the head.

[TBF]

12. I came pretty close to thinking that - but the insurrection cured me of any of those thoughts

it will obviously not be the revolution he is seeking given what we saw here on Jan. 6th. I'm sure there are white men who think they can survive the fascism, but so many others will not. And the constitution is barely surviving the current supreme court so I don't know how anyone could think that would be saved (not that it's so great anyway - another document written by and for rich white men) .

[RandySF]

13. Not this shit again.

[Sympthsical]

14. America cannot be destroyed

As addicted to "It's All Over People!" and going full Lovejoy as people are on social media and in regular media, a Trump win will not destroy democracy or kill the country.

It will increase suffering. It will make our country shittier for four years and beyond depending on what he manages (see: Supreme Court). But the country will carry on. Decline in some ways. Modern western democracies don't tend to self-destruct. They decline. We could end up looking like England circa 1970s/80s. Which would be no fun for anyone at all.

A vote for Trump won't achieve your husband's goals. It will just enable shittiness for other citizens.

And while I myself am a huge fan of doing things out of spite, not even I'm that much of an asshole.

[Hermit-The-Prog]

32. See project2025.

[Sympthsical]

36. That would be the shittiness mentioned

But not the apocalypse people seem to lust for (for a myriad of reasons that are obvious at cursory glance). I also remember when re-electing Bush in 2004 meant FEMA concentration camps in Wyoming and Montana were coming.

Meanwhile, back on earth . . .

And low grade shittiness is worse in its own way. It tends to last longer, more invisibly, and those who lose their lives or are affected by it tend to go unremarked upon.

Trump's election would lead to an objectively worse country, but there will still be a country as always.

And given this morning, I think it prudent to set aside extreme unrealistic predictions. They don't seem to have worked out for anyone today.

[TwilightZone]

48. There's very little in that that's new.

It's just a summary of pipe dreams that the right has been trial-ballooning for decades. The packaging is the only thing that's new.

[GuppyGal]

15. "Ultra Liberal" LOLZ He sounds like a deep thinker. LOL nt

[CTyankee]

18. Nothing surprises me any more. I have a lovely neighbor, good guy and very helpful to us, who once said on Facebook that

he couldn't "believe a word out of Biden's mouth" and wrote admiringly of one of the Jan. 6 insurrectionists (Ashley Babbit). He got such a HUGE pushback on Facebook that he never mentioned politics again.

[MineralMan]

19. That's just stupid.

That trick never works, and falls right into the hands of the right.

[ismnotwasm]

20. Yeah well he doesn't have a uterus.

Also, That kind of thinking is mental mastubation. The country is far more likely to be turned into a right-wing dystopia before it is ever ‘destroyed’

[tblue37]

21. Remember Susan Sarandon saying the same thing back in the 2016 election?

“Really, some people feel that Donald Trump will bring the revolution immediately if he gets in, things will really explode,” Sarandon told Hayes. Asked if she thinks that’s “dangerous,” she replied, “It’s dangerous to think that we can continue the way we are with the militarized police force, with privatized prisons, with the death penalty, with the low minimum wage, threats to women’s rights and think you can’t do something huge to turn that around.”

https://www.thedailybeast.com/stephen-colbert-confronts-susan-sarandon-about-her-trump-statements

[marble falls]

29. Yeah well, a lot of us said the same thing in '68.

[electric_blue68]

44. I started becoming active in politics when my dad had me go w him through our apt building putting flyers under our....

neighbors' doors when I was around 13 in '66.

After being devastated by Sen RFK's assassination, and the partial wreck that was the Chicago Convention....
at first I wasn't going to work for Humphrey.

But taking a look at Nixon again I realized I had to do GOTV. Which I did out of HHH's NYC Midtown Campaign Office.

[marble falls]

52. I read 'Fear and Loathing on the Campaign Trail', Hunter S. Thompson's diescription of HHH as a ...

Last edited Mon Mar 25, 2024, 02:03 PM - Edit history (1)

... "ward heeling hack" kinda resounded with me after I read it in '72. I stayed with the SDS and the only election I didn't vote in was '68.

I was reading 'Revolution for the Hell of It' and 'Steal This Book', 'Fuck the System', the Port Huron Statement.

From Abbie Hoffman:

'Every age and generation must be as free to act for itself, in all cases, as the ages and generations which preceded it. Man has no property in man, neither has any generation a property in the generations which are to follow.'"

"You are talking to a leftist. I believe in the redistribution of wealth and power in the world. I believe in universal hospital care for everyone. I believe that we should not have a single homeless person in the richest country in the world. And I believe that we should not have a CIA that goes around overwhelming governments and assassinating political leaders, working for tight oligarchies around the world to protect the tight oligarchy here at home."

[MOMFUDSKI]

22. We are fighting for scraps left over from our

Courts. Who is doing the accelerating? Our Courts using ultimate power.

[Autumn]

23. He is right. Our court system is so corrupt I don't see how it can be fixed.

But voting for Trump will only speed up the demise of our country. Trump will only ensure that more corrupt people are put in place. I have no idea what solution there is for that. This shit has been casually put in place for years to do what it is now doing. The only way it can be fixed is by Democrats. Sadly I think they will not be able to fix any of it, there is no will to rock the boat.

I think your husband is just blowing off steam. to you and him.

[haele]

24. He thinks the Constitution will still be in effect if TFG gets the White House?

He's got to be joking.
By all indications, TFG will get rid of anyone in government who doesn't swear allegiance to him. All the way to Program Manager positions.
The old "Tear it all down so we can sing Kumbaya and rebuild it the way it's supposed" to be has never ended up well for anyone but the ruling gang family that takes over in the chaos and confusion.
It's going to be Might makes Right for generations. No equal representation under some sort of law, no providing for the general welfare, no privacy, no enumerated rights for people without money or political influence, no free speech, no redress - none of that.
Technocrats and Christian Nationalists fighting it out for who gets to run the country 'like a private business' is what you're going to get if you vote for Trump.
Positive change always comes from the inside. The New Deal did not come out of a Revolution or a dictatorship. It came from hard work and intelligent, dedicated elected representation.

Haele

[MOMFUDSKI]

41. No he doesn't.

It has to be a complete tear down. Dems in power can’t fix the captured courts.

[obamanut2012]

57. So he thinks what happened in Cambodia or North Korea is the way to go

Wow.

[Emile]

26. Egads, all the people who fought and died for this country are

rolling over in their graves.

[Squaredeal]

27. He's a dummy.

A real “treasure” for you. You should keep him.

[sarisataka]

30. Direct him to read about Fritz von Pappen

You are mistaken. We've hired him.

-Response to a conservative who told Papen that he was placing himself in Hitler's hands by supporting him being appointed Chancellor (late January 1933), quoted in Ian Kershaw, Hitler, 1889–1936: Hubris (2001), p. 421

[greatauntoftriplets]

31. We have to destroy the country to save it?

That failed spectacularly in Vietnam. We don't need to try it again on our own country.

[Initech]

33. Yeah somehow I don't think that if a constitional convention is ever called...

That we will be the ones who get to do the rewrite.

[electric_blue68]

40. Unfortunately, that became my feelings years ago.

[RKP5637]

34. And in comes Project 25. The end of the country and it isn't returning if destroyed!

[Turbineguy]

37. That's one theory that makes some sense.

We seem to elect enough republicans to keep things slightly fucked up. And not enough Democrats to fix things. So things muddle along. We should elect more republicans to get things thoroughly fucked up.

But, the Law of Power is that no matter how fucked up the country is, those in power won't relinquish it, just to allow others to make things better. At that point it will take a violent revolution.

Millions will die.

[DemocratInPa]

38. I have 2 Gen Z that

Arent even voting for Biden.

One even phone banked for Biden. He said everything has changed. They will vote D on state elections.

Be prepared cause I sadly think DT wins.

Hopefully something changes, but Israel is playing Biden so hard.

[lapucelle]

70. We didn't phone bank in NY in 2020 due to covid.

[bif]

39. Time to lock the liquor cabinet.

What a dumb fucking move.

[Takket]

42. I don't share the opinion but I certainly understand the frustration driving it

This justice system is complete bullshit. Our prisons are overflowing with people because they cannot afford the top lawyers and drumpf is running free.

[Silent Type]

43. Democrats who felt the same in 2016 helped give us trump.

[Orangepeel]

76. and he fucked up the courts. the only way out now

is to elect democrats for a generation

[budkin]

45. He needs therapy asap

Seriously.

[JustAnotherGen]

46. May I ask

Is he a white male? And how old is he?

[dalton99a]

47. Don't count on the courts to save us

GOTV.

There is no other option

[bedazzled]

49. My condolences on having to deal with that

Hopefully you can gently influence him in the next few months.

[Bettie]

50. Keep talkign to him

you are probably the person who can convince him.

Remind him of project 2025. Show it to him, so he knows what is coming.

[Demsrule86]

51. That is such bullshit...countries who get autocrats are destroyed for years...you husband is

just wrong...plain and simple.

[Aviation Pro]

53. Lois had a reaction

[Caliman73]

55. Not a very smart thing to consider.

People who think that "Destroying something completely" will yield some kind of rebirth according to their desires, are naive, at best. There is no guarantee that the US would be able to "rise again" using the Constitution rather than say, getting picked over by Canada, Mexico, China, etc... becoming a despotic nation under some kind of right wing authoritarian, or simply causing a global crisis and catastrophe.

Think about the Soviet Union and China, they had revolutions and brought down their Imperial systems, only to be plunged into civil war for decades where the European powers and the United States put their thumbs on the scale and helped to create the Stalinist regime in Russia and Maoism in China. There were no "Workers' Utopia" as the Bolsheviks or Maoists envisioned, only consolidation through repression, and famine, and suffering.

Our system is as it has always been. The wealthy have the resources to influence the system. The only way that we can try to put some balance into the system is to be active, to get people into office that can better resist and change the way things operate. Money is powerful but people power has a chance to beat it. The problem is that people power is difficult to achieve and sustain and most people just want to go about living their lives to sustain campaigns for reform. They see "revolution" as easier when it certainly is not.

[Freethinker65]

58. Insane, but my Uber liberal son thus far says he will vote for neither because he is in a safe blue State

FWIW, I recently returned from a family wedding in Louisiana. Most of my Uber GOP in-laws were very anti-Trump. While refusing to ever vote for a Democrat, they indicated since they lived in a safe red State they intended to not vote for anyone for President. They got into a very brief argument with a MAGA family member.

As for my son, he is upset about Gaza, and disappointed that Democrats appear to cave more to Republicans, even when Democrats are in power. I think he will ultimately vote for Biden, but he is correct that his vote for President in a solid Blue State won't really matter.

[dlk]

60. Too often when a culture is burned to the ground, what replaces it is even worse

I hope you husband studies history.

[ShazzieB]

85. The Russian Revolution comes to mind.

[yardwork]

61. That approach hasn't worked yet.

I heard it in 1968, 1980, 2000, 2004, and 2016. The magical revolution hasn't materialized yet. Instead, we just get worse off.

Democrats could fix a lot of problems if we elected them into a majority.

[ornotna]

65. You misspelled maroon

[ProfessorGAC]

66. Ah, The Burn It All Down So It Will Be Better Strategy

That's incredibly unrealistic & intellectually lazy.
Except in a few cases involving dynastic monarchies, it's never worked out for the better.
To think otherwise is both ignorant of history & naive.

[LiberalFighter]

67. The scumbag said he would be dictator on day one.

The Constitution will be gone for good.

[Niagara]

69. I'm not going to let that happen. There's other members here that aren't going to let that happen.

Barack and Michelle Obama aren't voting for the TSF. Neither is Joe or Jill Biden. Neither are Bill and Hillary Rodham Clinton.



Here's a refresher course from 7 years ago; from an extremely wise man.

&t=9s


GOTV!
Vote Blue!
Vote Joe!

[BlueWaveNeverEnd]

71. nooooooooooooooo

[jcgoldie]

72. Are you married to Susan Sarandon?

That plan worked so well when that moron said it in 2016. Stupid.

[betsuni]

73. That's not liberal. Not the meaning of the word.

[Stuckinthebush]

74. My two LGBTQ daughters may not survive that dystopia

I choose to fight for them and everyone who will be considered evil by the white evangelical Christian men who will run the hell hole left. No one will be around to rise against this twisted new world. So please encourage your ultra liberal husband to rethink that position for my daughter’s sakes and for the sake of all the non privileged in that sad new world. I beg him. Please.

[Oneironaut]

86. "Some of you may die, but, that's a sacrifice I'm willing to make!"

AKA the Lord Farquaad mentality.

[Stuckinthebush]

90. No kidding!

Ugh.

[SocialDemocrat61]

77. To quote Alfred

Some men just want to see the world burn.

[Silent Type]

78. Rightly or wrongly, lots of people don't really see the current system capable of improving things.

Clearly, right now is not the time to risk allowing trump to regain office.

I’m a Democrat because I believe in our policies are preferable, but damn I really don’t see any major legislation— healthcare, climate, etc. — happening in next 20 years.

I think our finger pointing is accurate, but we aren’t getting anywhere doing it. I’ll take not moving farther toward right as some sort of victory, but that’s not what the country needs.

I can see others feeling like that at times, but most will face the reality come November.

[H2O Man]

79. gosh

[EllieBC]

81. So he's a Tankie?

My condolences.

Tankies always see themselves at the top of the heap after the whole thing burns down and their utopia is established. They never picture themselves in the bread lines with the rest of the rabble.

[LoisB]

83. That is very sad to hear. I hope you will be able to convince him otherwise. nt

[Mountainguy]

84. No offense

but that's the dumbest idea I've ever heard.

[xmas74]

87. When your divorce is finalized he can hook up with

Susan Sarandon. They seem to have the same views.

[Hotler]

88. Once fascism takes hold only blood shed will remove it. nt

[Patton French]

89. Not productive NT