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Eliot Rosewater

(34,152 posts)
Wed Sep 17, 2025, 12:32 PM Wednesday

One of the ways we got here, the 60-year-old lie that anti-Vietnam war protesters spit on

Returning military members. There’s actually no proof it ever actually really happened, there is a famous book written about it.



https://nyupress.org/9780814751473/the-spitting-image/

“The Spitting Image“

I have a relative who was told this by his father who served in Vietnam, an extreme right winger.

This relative who is a very intelligent person believes to this day that Democrats and liberals are all part of the group that did this that we are all descendants of that ideology.

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One of the ways we got here, the 60-year-old lie that anti-Vietnam war protesters spit on (Original Post) Eliot Rosewater Wednesday OP
I got a call from a Vietnam vet shortly after George Floyd. He's a public safety union guy. LeftInTX Wednesday #1
The biggest step to get us where we are was the supreme court in 2010 Autumn Wednesday #2
... Prairie Gates Wednesday #3
Same with angry witchy feminists destroying families cbabe Wednesday #4
We can connect this to what happened to Hillary Eliot Rosewater Wednesday #5
I was insulated b/c my Vietnam year was my first year of 4 yr enlistment, meaning UTUSN Wednesday #6
Thank you for your service. Eliot Rosewater Wednesday #7
Thank you for YOURS! - and, yes, I sort of went tangential on your main point that the spitting part UTUSN Wednesday #8
Couple of things, when you thank you me for my service do you mean Eliot Rosewater Wednesday #9
No, I had no inkling UTUSN Wednesday #10

LeftInTX

(34,006 posts)
1. I got a call from a Vietnam vet shortly after George Floyd. He's a public safety union guy.
Wed Sep 17, 2025, 12:39 PM
Wednesday

He was freaking out about the antipolice rhetoric and said that he was harassed at the airport when he returned from Vietnam. He went on and on about it. He seemed a bit traumatized about how he was treated when he returned.

Autumn

(48,373 posts)
2. The biggest step to get us where we are was the supreme court in 2010
Wed Sep 17, 2025, 12:41 PM
Wednesday

That was what reset the power of Americas politics. The beginning of making voters irrelevant.

cbabe

(5,621 posts)
4. Same with angry witchy feminists destroying families
Wed Sep 17, 2025, 12:46 PM
Wednesday

BBC
https://www.bbc.com › news › world-45303069

100 Women: The truth behind the 'bra-burning' feminists - BBC

Protesting outside Miss America 1968, women threw mops, make-up and bras into a "Freedom Trash Can" - but never set them alight.

Eliot Rosewater

(34,152 posts)
5. We can connect this to what happened to Hillary
Wed Sep 17, 2025, 01:11 PM
Wednesday

When she said she wasn’t gonna stay home and bake cookies, the decades long propaganda campaign against her filled with lies promoted by all mainstream media and ultimately used by some on the left to hate her and to convince others to hate her etc.

To this day there are people reading what I just said and getting mad as hell wishing they could come on to tell me how wrong I am how all of the garbage about her was actually true and how she was really a bad candidate and really a bad person etc.

In fact some of them refused to vote for Kamala for the same reason but they know they can’t admit it.

UTUSN

(75,779 posts)
6. I was insulated b/c my Vietnam year was my first year of 4 yr enlistment, meaning
Wed Sep 17, 2025, 01:46 PM
Wednesday

that I wasn't out there in the real, civilian world for three years when maybe the worst of the coming-home experience happened to other vets. I don't know about the spitting although heard that version. I *do* know/believe that anti-military feelings ran deep in the protesters. I also have come to believe that a very significant component of the protests was more anti-DRAFT than just anti-WAR or for PEACE. And my corollary to this is that the only lesson the Neo-Cons of the Iraq Attack learned from Vietnam was *NOT* to use the Draft, hence the all-volunteer strategy - coddling against the anti-military attitude with "thank you for your service (to vets)" and the horrendous multi-years tours instead of the one-year Vietnam tour.

I was on a very active protester university campus, and back then 50 years ago, my third generation Democratic allegiance was totally there, but what now might be called "mainstream" (do we still say "DLC"? ) and fully supported LBJ. That said, I was nowhere so politically nuanced then as we are in DU, and I enlisted (not Drafted) in the middle of that campus. And as the Dem erstwhile hero Charlie RANGEL often said, that the reason there were more Minority members in the military, along with fatalities, was that the military was a way out for recruits who had very lessened opportunities for education and jobs. And I joined because of economic factors, not to kill Commies.

*** So I was core *civilian* in heart and reluctance to drink up the military authoritarian mindset. And when my enlistment was up, I never looked back, and almost put it out of mind to soak back my civilian life and outlook. I even joined the Reserves about ten years afterward out of a semi-nostalgia, which soon reminded me why I had resumed my civilian-ness. And it wasn't until another decade that I saw my service as service and actively honored it as a valuable part of my life and started a modified reconnection via joing the VFW (in a generic post, without participation in the rituals), basically wearing my ship's ball cap and dog tag everywhere without being pleased with the ty-for-ur-service thingy these provoke.

*** But to the OP's topic: So I was all civilian immediately after getting out and didn't experience the hostility to Vietnam vets, and when I started going to the VFW bar I saw some of the vets railing loudly (and drunkenly) about having been mistreated, not to mention PTSD.

One of the complaints was against the behavior of "the greatest generation" WW II vets, which I didn't pay that much attention to. Until years later my first hand experience (much milder than that of other vets) was this: I had long gone to a flea market and seen a WW II vet selling stuff there, him wearing his ship's ball cap. When I was wearing my cap, I went up to him and held out my hand to shake and said, "Hi, shipmate." He made no move to shake hands and said, "No. I was in the *BIG* war." I felt the blood rising to my eyeballs and grabbed his hand and said, "Give me your f***ing HAND!" And shook it HARD and THREW it back to him.

A local radio talkshow wingnut said, when I told about my rebuffing the W. Shrub/CHEENEE "ty-for-ur-service" thingy, "Can't you just be GRACIOUS?" I was always selective, was "gracious" when it was from sincere/naive persons and not for the obvious MAGAts. And that whole thing has seemed to lessen, to the point that when a young cashier said it, I responded, "Thank you for YOURS." And he was all flustered and said, "I'm not a veteran, sir." I said, "You perform service when you come to work and are courteous and helpful to others." And he was bursting with modest gratitude. And the radio wingnut said, "That was very nice what you did with that kid."




Eliot Rosewater

(34,152 posts)
7. Thank you for your service.
Wed Sep 17, 2025, 01:52 PM
Wednesday

I have learned from reading what you have said, it’s a good thing to remind people of and point out that yes much of the anti-war protest from younger people who were all dubbed as hippies or whatever, was based on the fact that they didn’t wanna have to go to war and die for no reason.

The main concern about it is that it was used to demonize an entire generation of Democrats liberals progressive etc. To this day people that will not vote for a Democrat because they think they’re all connected to this stuff, some of which didn’t actually happen.

UTUSN

(75,779 posts)
8. Thank you for YOURS! - and, yes, I sort of went tangential on your main point that the spitting part
Wed Sep 17, 2025, 02:10 PM
Wednesday

has been extended to smear *ALL* of the Left by some. Same as when I encountered a wingnut who claimed that all Lefties are extremists to the point of violence. I was stumped and let it gnaw at me until the next encounter when I demanded to know why he thought that. He replied that he got it from the environmentalists' violent protests and that in his mind Libs' including the environment as a main agenda point meant that.

Back your point, I'll say that, despite my Dem-ness, I do believe that hostility to military has been credibly attested to in the CLINTONs by military members assigned to them. And one of those revisionist re-hashings when we lose elections has been that McGOVERN, with his distinguished service in WW II, would have improved his chances if he had played up his service instead of his almost hidding it. As one of his voters, I never knew of it until a couple of decades ago.







Eliot Rosewater

(34,152 posts)
9. Couple of things, when you thank you me for my service do you mean
Wed Sep 17, 2025, 02:32 PM
Wednesday

That you saw me at one point here mentioned I was in the Navy briefly or just as a patriot who cares about his country?

And please tell me what you mean by the Clintons treating military around them poorly, or allegedly that that happened. I might remember something vaguely but I find it hard to believe that that’s true.

UTUSN

(75,779 posts)
10. No, I had no inkling
Wed Sep 17, 2025, 03:31 PM
Wednesday

that you had any connection to the Navy or military, was only returning your thank-you on the basis of "service" being Lib good will. But your military connection doubles what I meant. - Honestly, I don't know personal specifics about where 90% of DUers are coming from aside from our generic Democratic agenda.

About the CLINTONs - and it's bygone known I was/am a big supporter - first of all, their big intro into political activity was door-to-door canvassing for McGOVERN and they were integral with the anti-Vietnam protesters, correct? And, I don't swallow wingnut propaganda but also weigh and decide about what might be constructive criticism (a Lib trait, to look inward for root causes and room for improvement), and they were placed in the anti-military umbrella of protests that conflated anti-Vietnam with anti-military that you were originally talking about. And while I believe the wingnuts have made hay with anything anti-CLINTONs, it is credible to me that HRC has shown bad/hostile treatment to military in contact with her. I can't cite the proof.




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