Absolute Immunity... just so you know where we stand. The ICE agents have ABSOLUTE IMMUNITY.

[mikelewis]

ICE agent has 'absolute immunity' to do his job, says Vance
published at 13:58
13:58
Vance is asked about Minnesota's state agencies being cut off from the investigation by the US attorney's office.

The vice-president says he wishes state officials would investigate why "so many people" are using vehicles to interfere with law enforcement.

He says the ICE agent involved has "absolute immunity" to do his job, which is a "federal issue".

Vance says it would be unprecedented for a local official to prosecute a federal official with absolute immunity, referring to the ICE agent.

https://www.bbc.com/news/live/c7510l1135wt?post=asset%3A076c4908-21bd-4a6e-bd1c-6840fbb5b647#post

Just so we are clear. They start out with Absolute Immunity. No waiting for an investigation. Nothing.

How do they know he wasn't an ex boyfriend?

Absolute Immunity... that's a bad precedent.

[Fiendish Thingy]

1. Vance is not the final word on this question. Nt

[mikelewis]

2. You're right... but it's interesting to see how they reveal thier real agenda.

They already have talking points ready.

[FakeNoose]

3. We don't even know why ICE goons were in that peaceful residential neighborhood

There were no illegal immigrants anywhere in that video. They had no reason to have set up a roadblock. But now an innocent woman is dead. Let's hear what the reasons are ... what were they doing there?

What do Vance and Noem have to say about that? The entire thing seems completely unjustified.
It's cold-blooded murder.

[GusBob]

14. There was a school a block away, I read

They have been terrorizing schools lately. They assaulted students at one later that day in MSP

Ms Good had just dropped her son off there I believe

If that is all true, it takes away from the bullcrap claim that she was a professional agitator or domestic terrorist looking for trouble

She was just a mom doing mom stuff
It was murder

[Wiz Imp]

4. Federal law is clear. Law Enforcement agents have "Qualified" immunity. NOT "absolute" immunity.

Vance (and Trump) may actually be stupid enough to believe they have absolute immunity, but they do not, so it doesn't matter what either of them say. I still expect th State of Minnesota to indict the murderer and then the Feds will try to have it dismissed (won't work) or have it move to Federal court which would result in a hearing before a judge. It's pretty clear that the murderer's actions should nullify any qualified immunity claims, but that will ultimately be decided by a Federal judge. I would guess 75% of Federal judges (including many appointed by Republicans) would rule against the murderer, but that remains to be seen.

[FBaggins]

15. It's actually neither in this case

Qualified immunity protects an officer from a civil lawsuit but not criminal charges. It likely applies in this case, but isn't releated to the "absolute" argument.

"Absolute" immunity applies to government officials (judges/legislators/presidents) and isn't really "absolute" in the normal sense of the word... but either way I haven't seen it applied to law enforcement until now.

The immunity involved here is more commonly called "Supremacy Clause Immunity" - which protects federal officers from state prosecution for charges involving enforcing federal law. So, for instance, a federal marshall can't be charged with speeding by a state if he's chasing a suspect down the highway. It likely does apply here - but only protects the ICE officer from state prosecution... he isn't immune from federal prosecution.

[Ol Janx Spirit]

19. "which protects federal officers from state prosecution for charges involving enforcing federal law."

The question in this case will be, how was what the officer did "enforcing federal law"?

And further, even if he was "enforcing federal law", was the shooting justified?

It is a question whether the immunity shields the officer in this case.

Sure, when everything is done by the book any immunity applies, but when you venture outside of that you always open yourself up to charges from all sides.

[FBaggins]

20. Right - but the question isn't whether shooting was enforcing federal law

It's whether detaining her was. That is - if she's obstructing federal law enforcement... then ordering her out of the car is within their jurisdiction.

Whether the shooting itself was justified in that case becomes a question for a federal court (which means it won't be asked)

[Ol Janx Spirit]

21. With a car having just passed her, and her trying to wave the truck that the ICE agents that tried to open her door...

...by--it is a little hard to see how they will even argue obstruction.

In any case, an obstruction charge does not warrant execution. It is the assault with a deadly weapon (car in this case) that is the crux of the case. All of the video evidence available casts extreme doubt on that.

I believe that is why the Hennepin County Attorney Mary Moriarty is asking the public for information and saying they can potentially bring charges.

[AZJonnie]

5. What's "unprecedented", you asshole, is declaring that any federal agent has "absolute immunity"

DoJ policy even says shooting at a driver in this fashion is against the rules. If he hadn't stopped to pull out his gun and start blasting, he'd have EASILY gotten WELL away from the trajectory of the vehicle, which was CLEARLY NOT aiming for him.

This guy put himself in front of the running vehicle for no good reason, contrary to what every LEO is trained not to do. On top of that, the vehicle was too close for him to have defended himself by shooting the driver.

HE fucking executed beautiful mom Renee ON PURPOSE, demonstrated by the fact he continued firing (twice) after he was completely out of harms way.

Walz and the state of MN needs to tell Vance to go get fucked, and bring state-level 2nd degree murder charges against Jonathan Ross.

[RedWhiteBlueIsRacist]

6. Many of Vance's outlandish claims are always couched in jabberwocky.

[Scrivener7]

7. Was that his pet name for it?

[mikelewis]

9. You said "Couched"...

About Vance

Sorry, I'm a child. LOL

[DoBW]

10. so what's his name

vice whatever is cosplaying being a judge now?

[viva la]

11. I think the state courts might weigh in on that.

See how Vance is spreading the Supreme Court "immunity" from Trump to everyone who does Trump's evil for him.

[Swede]

12. Just listened to some prosecutor being interviewed. There is now law preventing state charges.

Presecution will be tough if the feds do not share evidence, however.

[FBaggins]

17. That was likely in response to something Miller said

He implied that anyone bringing state charges would be guilty of a felony. The prosector you listened to was likely responding to that nonsense.

However, while there isn't a law preventing a state charge, there is a recognized immunity that would probably make such a charge have a very short lifespan before it was tossed.

And yes - if the Feds keep the state from collecting evidence that would make a prosecution more difficult... but the incident was caught on video so they aren't entirely without evidence.

[B.See]

13. aka straight up NAZI shit.

[themaguffin]

16. Then there is no need for a Fed investigation, right? In any case, they don't have state immunity.

[mikelewis]

18. Well, honestly if they declare it an act of Terrorism... even the FBI is limited by Homeland Security.

That's why they are branding people Terrorists so event the FBI's hands are tied.

They can only go so far and shooting a terrorist is not the same thing as shooting a civilian.

They are playing the legal cards to ensure if they shoot you, no one will ever pay for any reason whatsoever.

[LudwigPastorius]

22. Fuck you, Maybelline Hillbilly.

It ain't true just because you say it is.

[iemanja]

23. They do not

No law enforcement officer does. Even the pedophile in chief doesn't have absolute immunity.

[mikelewis]

24. Well... reality doesn't seem to support that...

They litterally shot someone dead live on national tv and called it heroic.

They heroically shot and killed a mother of a 6 year old on her own street for blowing a whistle and smiling at an officer. When you see that the passenger of the vehicle was out filming him... you could see he was aggravated. He pulled out his gun as she was backing away... not driving at him.

He shot her right in the head and no one can or will do a thing.

I'm pretty sure that's immunity.

[iemanja]

35. That's illegal coverup

not legal immunity. That Trump is running a gestapo now doesn't mean they can't be held to account later.

[Buckeyeblue]

25. For now. At some point there will be a reckoning

[CrispyQ]

26. There are more of us than there are of them.

There are a ton of videos out there showing how they turn tail & run when confronted by US citizens who know their rights & the rights of the persecuted.

I realize that's no guarantee of anything, but never forget how the media amplifies their voice & diminishes ours & also how they report all of Trump's lawsuits but never when the judges rule against him. I don't mean to lessen the difficulties we face, but it's not hopeless & there's always that old saying, this too shall pass. It will, & our duty is to continue to persevere to move our trajectory in a more positive direction.

I googled what to do if ICE shows up near you & you're a US citizen & here's the AI overview.

If you witness Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) activity involving someone else, you can act as a legal observer, document the incident, and assert that the person has a right to remain silent. Never physically interfere with the agents, as this could result in your arrest and endanger others.

Document and observe from a safe distance

>> Keep a safe, visible distance. You have the right to observe and record law enforcement activity in public spaces, but you must not interfere. This includes following any orders from agents to step back for safety reasons. Stay far enough away that officers do not perceive you as a threat.

>> Record the interaction. Use your phone or camera to record the incident. Filming visibly is recommended. Capture details such as:

The names, badges, and vehicles of the agents involved.

The time and location.

Any conversations you can hear.

The context of the detention, including any street signs or landmarks.

Narrate and secure your footage. If possible, narrate the details you are observing in the recording. Once you finish, secure the footage by backing it up to encrypted cloud storage.

Remind others of their rights.

>> Announce the person's rights. You can loudly state that the person being questioned has the right to remain silent and does not have to answer questions about their immigration status.

>> Never give legal advice. You can inform people of their rights, but do not pretend to be a lawyer or offer legal advice. Instead, you can provide the phone number of a rapid response network or an immigration lawyer.

What to do if ICE is at someone's door. If ICE is at a neighbor's door, you can help by calmly and clearly asserting their rights from a safe, legal distance.

>> Remind them not to open the door. Shout to the person inside that they do not have to open the door unless the agents have a valid judicial warrant signed by a judge.

>> Distinguish warrants. Most ICE warrants are administrative, signed by an ICE official, and do not grant them authority to enter a home without consent. A valid judicial warrant must be issued and signed by a court judge.

>> Document and notify. Record the interaction and alert your local rapid response network or immigration defense organizations.

What not to do

>> Do not physically interfere. Never physically obstruct, touch, or resist an agent. Doing so can lead to your own arrest and may endanger others.

>> Do not lie. Providing false information to agents can have serious consequences. It is safer to remain silent.

>> Avoid posting sensitive information. Be cautious about livestreaming or posting identifying photos on social media, as it can expose the identities of vulnerable individuals.

Follow up after the incident.

>> Contact legal support. Notify your local rapid response network or an immigrant rights organization to report the incident and share your video and notes. They can help track the person who was detained.

>> Check the ICE detainee locator. If you know the person's name, you can use ICE's online detainee locator to help their family find them.

======================================

Get a mobile recording device so you don't risk your phone. You can store them on your visor & clip them on your shirt. Learn some basic Spanish, even just "What is your name?" so if you see someone being ICEd you can ask them who they are & try to contact their family. Carry little PDFs of our Constitutional rights written in Spanish & other languages.

How to say What is your name in Spanish: ¿Cómo se llama? (koh-moh se yah-mah)

Bilingual rights cards in multiple languages are available at the first link below. PRINT CARD will take you to the English version. Click one of the many languages to go to that PDF.

https://www.nilc.org/resources/know-your-rights-card

Spanish version: https://www.nilc.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/rights-card.pdf

The link below has a good flyer, too, in both English & Spanish. It reminds that these rights apply to everyone, not just citizens or people here legally.

https://www.ilrc.org/community-resources/know-your-rights/know-your-rights-when-confronted-ice-flyer

Fuck these ICE bastards who can't even read or write & fuck all the other ones, too.

[C_U_L8R]

27. Our right to live trumps their impulse to kill.

Maybe those giving out orders and ‘immunities’ should be charged with murder. Let’s see what happens then.

[mikelewis]

28. They can't be... that's the point.

And... as fucked up as it sounds... there's a real justification for the laws they are hiding behind.

The laws that allow federal agents to take out real terrorists are in place for a very great and amazingly real and necessary reason.

IF she was a real terrorist... ticking timebomb situtuation... what that officer did was and is totally what you want to happen.

Sorry, it just is. The laws are great. I mean, not great but they're the best that's there so if a REAL situation happens, no one's hands are tied.

A soccer mom isn't a real terrorist.

By branding her one... they make us all less secure.

There really are real terrorist out there and these jack booted thugs aren't fighting them... they're just trying to terrify Democrats before an election.

Urgudan does it... Murdero did it and trump and his congressfreinds and his loyalists that run the legal system are trying to ensure the election goes his way.

If you think he doesn't think he can actually overturn things and get Congress to repeal the amendment and allow him to run again, you're crazy. That's precisely what he's thinking and he may be right...

Nothing he's doing is new... it's just never been allowed to happen in America before... there used to be people that would stop this shit before it happened.

[delisen]

29. I would not want a "real terrorist" to be executed on the spot under these circumstances

What I want is the rule of law to prevail in the US.

[mikelewis]

32. Right... I absolutely agree with you...

But sometimes terrible shit happens and you have to make an awful call.

And anyone who's ever done the job knows that... it's not a question... you don't stand around pondering these things. You just know them. It's how you are trained. You honestly just do what you're told without even knowing it.

So in a hollywood style scenario... sometimes things can get skewed. The ambiguity of the laws was meant to protect law enforcements ability to react and share information so it could handle real terrorist threats.

By branding Tran Argua as terrorists, any actions ICE takes now are protected by Homeland Security and not subject to local or even FBI authority.

The FBI director would have to fight and then quit to get anything to happen and that will never happen... that spineless little toad would sell out his mother to keep his job. He don't give a shit about law... he supports trump law and that's it.

[C_U_L8R]

30. The problem with letting people be judge and executioner

…Is that they might be wrong. Or worse, be purposely using this loophole for their own advantage.

[in2herbs]

31. Police have qualified, not absolute, immunity. That has been the USSC standard for years.

[Iggo]

33. Says the Vice president.

And he’s wrong.

[Timewas]

34. Maybe

They shared a couch