Playing a new song in the gungeon.

[Warren Stupidity]

It seems to me that the old standby: "ain't nevah gonna happen", has been replaced by "ain't no way it's gonna work". I kind of like the new song better.

P.S. We will make it work.

[Agnosticsherbet]

1. Laws, fines, and jail time for drunk driving violations hasn't stopped drunk driving.

But over thirty years its has cut the body count by at least 75%.

There is no perfect system, but the system can always be improved.

[Deep13]

3. The only solution to drunk driving is MORE drinking.

The only thing that can stop a bad drunk with a car is a good drunk with a car.

Is this necessary -->

[Jeff In Milwaukee]

4. Ironically...

I believe that 2010 marked the first time that gun homicides exceeded DUI fatalities.

2010 DUI Fatalities - 10,228
2010 Gun Homicides - 11,105

So guns are more deadly than drunk driving.

[Deep13]

9. Wow. nt

[Agnosticsherbet]

15. Now that is historical...

In a bad, end of history sort of way.

[Tempest]

101. Now you've done it. Injecting factual evidence into the record. n/t

[Jeff In Milwaukee]

103. Sorry...

[Tempest]

105. Bailiff, whack his pee pee. n/t

[Squinch]

5. This is self evident. Drunks don't kill people, cars kill people. And spoons. Spoons do too.

Last edited Thu Jan 10, 2013, 05:21 PM - Edit history (1)

And besides, there was a guy in Idaho who was trying to rob another guy, so the second guy shot the first guy. So that means I need to have 19 guns.

If you don't get that, you just don't understand gun terminology, so I can't talk to you.

+++++++
Edited later, after this post appeared to be misunderstood to add the following:

These things that I just said here in this post are batshit crazy. I was being sarcastic. Because really, who would be so dumb as to seriously forward arguments like this?

Oh, wait....

[Deep13]

10. Drunks and cars are each necessary for drunk driving.

Violent person and a high-capacity, semi-auto gun are each necessary for a mass killing. Take away either thing and it's impossible.

So people kill people, guns kill people, and guns allow people to kill a lot of people, instantly, and from a distance.

[Squinch]

12. (you know I was being sarcastic too, right?)

[Deep13]

24. Yeah, I know...

...but some people are advancing something like that argument seriously.

No! Only people kill people! Anything can be a weapon! Yeah, remember all those people killed in that mass rock-throwing crime? Since only people kill people, the army has no need for guns since they have people.

[Squinch]

60. Tons of them are. I know what you mean.

[CreekDog]

51. you can't kill 26 people in a minute with a spoon

if you seriously think we are that dumb, then why waste the effort trying to convince us with such a bogus statement?

[Squinch]

61. OK, I'm losing track of the sarcasm here. My post was completely sarcastic. The arguments in it

are the ones that I think are the most ridiculous arguments circulating today. The ones that are truly batshit crazy.

I am guessing that was not clear.

[Tempest]

102. The Blue Raja could. n/t

[Ed Suspicious]

78. Guns. Intoxicants for gun nuts. n/t

[samsingh]

84. nra

[EOTE]

63. If only those victims had been drunk too, they might be alive today. nt

[jp76]

66. Hmmmm....

Being drunk while driving is what makes him a bad person.

I am not aware of any cases of a good person, aka cop, chasing down a drunk driver on foot.

Crazy world, I'm sure it's happened, but I seriously doubt it happens regularly.

[dlwickham]

76. if you're passed out face first you certainly can't drive

so more alcohol could work

just saying

[samsingh]

83. that's nra logic

[Recursion]

13. Yup. Notice how neither cars nor booze were banned

Drunk driving is where we should be looking, not Prohibition.

[VanillaRhapsody]

31. We prohibit hand grenades....

I don't remember the last mass murder in a movie theater with a hand grenade..

[Recursion]

40. Columbine

Though that was a high school, not a theatre

[quakerboy]

50. I just reread the reports

All injuries and deaths I see reported are due to being shot. With a Gun.

Except one, which was due to splinters from a desk. Which was shot. With a gun.

No mention of any massacre, individual deaths, or even injuries due to grenades of any type.

[Recursion]

53. They used the grenades to corral people

That's their main military use, too

[EOTE]

64. I'd rather be corralled than shot.

Maybe that's just me. The point is that, once again, without the guns and their easy access, those people would most likely still be alive today.

[A Simple Game]

46. Nor do you have to do any actual damage to be arrested for drunk driving.

You can be driving perfectly, be stopped and still go to jail if your blood alcohol content is over a certain percentage.

So the analogy you are aiming for is; get caught with an assault weapon, whether you are using it or not, and go to jail? Sounds pretty harsh, but I can go for it.

[Recursion]

56. Why should you go to jail for what shape your rifle is?

*shrug*

[A Simple Game]

57. Why should I go to jail for drunk driving? n/t

[Recursion]

58. Because it endangers people. How does the shape of a rifle endanger people? (nt)

[A Simple Game]

70. I am not going to look it up because it doesn't really pertain, but

I dare say more people are killed by sober drivers than by drunk drivers.

Just driving in traffic endangers me.

[Recursion]

71. Right, a drunk driver is more dangerous. An assault weapon is not more dangerous than a non-assault

weapon.

I don't see how the two are comparable.

[A Simple Game]

73. But I'm more likely to get killed by a sober driver.

If they aren't comparable, why did you compare them?

[Recursion]

74. I didn't. You equated having an assault weapon with driving drunk

Suggesting people should be arrested for both.

You're making two errors here.

1. While it's true that you're more likely to be injured by a sober driver than by a drunk driver, that's because there are many more sober drivers on the road at any given moment than drunk ones. The drunk drivers are still a greater risk (you are more likely to be injured by a sober driver than a drunk driver, but the drunk driver is more likely to injure someone than the sober driver is -- probability is fun). This is why we arrest people for driving drunk, even if they haven't hurt anyone.

2. On the other hand, an assault weapon does not pose a greater risk to people around it than a non-assault weapon. For that matter a handgun is the most likely weapon to injure someone; it's the drunk driver of this situation.

[A Simple Game]

75. I believe most people that die by gunshot get shot by pistols. Wouldn't that

make pistols the sober drivers?

[Recursion]

77. No, because pistols are also more common than rifles

It is both the case that you are more likely to be shot by a pistol than a rifle and that a given pistol is more likely to shoot someone than a given rifle. Pistols are more dangerous and more common. Drunk drivers are more dangerous and less common.

[A Simple Game]

79. If you are right and pistols are a majority of all guns, and if it is true

that pistols kill more people than rifles, and if as I believe drunk drivers are a minority of all drivers then pistols are analogous to sober drivers and rifles to drunk drivers.

So I believe you are wrong, drunk drivers are less common and less likely to injure me.

[Erose999]

95. That shape allows it to hold extra ammunition which facilitates easier mass killings. Thats part of

it. The smaller shape and bore diameter of the cartridges allows magazines to have higher capacities with lower weight, and for the weapon to have lower recoil as well.

Theres a reason the AR platform rifles are a favorite of these killers. Don't be naive.

[Recursion]

96. OK, ArmaLite releases a new lower receiver without a pistol grip

The previously ban-compliant models are now compliant with Feinstein's proposed new ban with this new lower receiver.

If the proposed ban passes, this will happen. In about 30 minutes.

What's been accomplished, other than making ArmaLite a lot of money?

[Erose999]

98. Its not the pistol grip, its the magazines. You can find a Remington Woodsmaster in every other

closet in rural America, or at any pawnshop nationwide for $300. Why don't we see those type weapons used in these shootings?

the stock and reciever are heavier
the mag doesn't change as quickly
limited mag capacity (semi auto, 5 round capacity)
heavier, larger ammunition
more recoil

I suppose if they have an AR lower thats limited to a 5 round magazine and a regular stock it wouldn't be an assault rifle, it'd just be a small hunting rifle.

[Recursion]

100. Then why is it the pistol grip rather than the magazine we're trying to ban?

I think Congress has pretty wide Constitutional latitude to ban (or at least schedule) whatever classes of weapons it wants. I'm completely frustrated by the fact that Feinstein, our leading advocate on this, is introducing a bill to keep semi-automatic carbines with detachable magazines from having pistol grips, while still letting people have semi-automatic carbines with detachable magazines. It's solving the wrong problem, at great political cost.

[Ikonoklast]

68. In Ohio, you can be asleep in the back seat, and be charged with DUI if the keys are in the car.

Car doesn't have to even be moving or running.

[A Simple Game]

69. Same in New York, had a friend get one while sleeping in the front seat. n/t

[samsingh]

85. good catch

[Deep13]

2. Even that crappy '94 ban helped somewhat.

I certainly have noticed that a lot of these mass shootings happened since its expiration. Maybe the economy has something to do with it too. Maybe that Freakanomics guy was right and that with abortion restrictions there were more criminals born in the past 20 years. But availability of high-capacity magazines and the machines that use them surely does not help matters.

[ProgressiveProfessor]

7. The stats really do not support your conclusion

[Warren Stupidity]

16. That's the ticket!

See the new tune is far more catchy!

[Warren Stupidity]

18. With a little work that could have been a real zinger.

Too many "only"s. Plus as a headline snark it needs to be less wordy.

[ProgressiveProfessor]

19. Comment noted, but I have not changed my tune in the least

[RetroLounge]

29. That's because of your NRA provided autotuner

RL

[ProgressiveProfessor]

35. I don't have one of them, would you please describe it?

Admittedly I dance to a different drummer, but I am pretty sure its unique and not provided by anyone. My wolf spirit agrees with that.

[RetroLounge]

36. ...

uh huh



RL

[A Simple Game]

47. A wolf sticking up for guns? If you say so. n/t

[samsingh]

87. then you shouldn't need guns

[Deep13]

25. Will you elaborate?

What statistics?

[samsingh]

88. there aren't any or selective at best

see that street over there, deaths by assault weapons went down after 1994 - for a week. Don't bother me about the trend over time or the country as a whole

[Deep13]

90. I wasn't bothering you at all! nt

[samsingh]

92. i was supporting your question!

[Deep13]

93. Thanks. I'm way too literal sometimes. nt

[samsingh]

94. no problem

[Recursion]

14. Lead abatement (nt)

[Deep13]

26. huh?

[Recursion]

28. The absolute collapse in violent crime over the past 20 years

Is very strongly associated with lead abatement.

[Deep13]

37. interesting. nt

[Recursion]

42. I'll add a link tomorrow when I'm not on my phone

There's a reason Obama focused on lead in Chicago

[bobclark86]

44. Crime started going down in the 1990s...

Actually, about 16-21 years after Roe V. Wade went through... Fewer children born into poverty means fewer going into crime and violence to make their way.

[cbrer]

6. How about "Bungle in the Jungle"? nt

[Logical]

8. You will never ban semi-auto, handguns, ammo, etc. This is all we have been saying.....

The best we will get is maybe a ban on large magazines (which will not help mass shootings much) and maybe closing the private sale loophole (which will not stop mass shootings).

This place was saying a gun ban was possible. Or banning semi-auto's was possible. Or collecting all guns was possible.

And it is not. It will never happen.

[Warren Stupidity]

11. Oh sure play it again for old time's sake.

Get with the program. The new song is "nevah gonna work". Go check back at hq.

[Logical]

22. Tell me what you think will be the biggest win in gun control this year!!

[Robb]

32. Universal, mandatory firearm registration.

Total inventory of everything that fires bullets. And penalties for nonparticipation with teeth.

Bet on it.

[hack89]

34. No politician has even proposed such a law

and it cannot be done by executive order.

You really think a repuke controlled House is going to pass such a law? Really?

[Logical]

41. No way! Mark this post!

[spanone]

20. wanna bet?

[Logical]

21. Yep. What is the bet? Favorite charity?

[VanillaRhapsody]

33. hand grenades are banned....how many do you have?

[SQUEE]

54. No, they are not.

they are classed as destructive devices, requiring a $200 dollar tax stamp and secure and safe storage requirements.

[link:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Title_II_weapon|

[samsingh]

89. then what are you and the people stocking up on guns and supplies worried about?

or are they all crazy to worry about something that isn't going to happen anyway?

[theKed]

91. In response to this, I will direct you

to one of Canada's greatest Prime Ministers, Mr. Pierre Trudeau.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=DeTsQQ22Uwc#t=8s

The importance of a lawful, orderly society supercedes gun fetishism.

It will never happen? Just watch us.

[countryjake]

27. No, here's yours...

[alcibiades_mystery]

30. Arguments against feasibility are pure bluff

But yes, that's the new old tune.

There is a public health crisis, and we will deal with it, whether these fucking jackasses like it or not.

[Initech]

39. How about this Weird Al classic:

[Skip Intro]

43. What is "it," exactly? What, exactly, are you going to make work? nt

[thucythucy]

45. Thank you Warren for all your posts on this topic.

I don't have anything to add to what's already been said on this thread, except to thank you for hanging on to this topic and for speaking truth to (fire)power.

I always look for your posts now, knowing I'll find something right to the point of the issue.

Please keep up the good work. You speak for a lot of us who are sick of the cult of the almighty gun.

[ellisonz]

48. Well except for the hardline Wayne LaPierre stooges...

...they're still doing the Alex Jones froth.

I truly wish I could be optimistic about Congress actually passing anything, but I'm not and it makes me

Fuck the NRA.

[Spitfire of ATJ]

49. It was outrage over the Chicago Gangland that prohibited machine guns...

A lot of people don't know that law also outlawed hand grenades.

I don't hear any gun nuts claiming they NEED their hand grenades.

[Warren DeMontague]

52. It's the same playbook the Oil Companies use on global warming.

Needs more study
it's too complicated
it's too difficult
there's no point
there's no problem
it will never work
needs more study
etc

[Motown_Johnny]

55. How about....

[Warren Stupidity]

59. "works for me". nt.

[derby378]

62. Ain't gonna happen

Sorry, but it won't. You had your chance in 1994, and look what happened. Newt Gingrich, Clinton's impeachment, a stolen Presidental election, etc. No, thank you.

[LanternWaste]

67. Post Hoc Ergo Prompter Hoc is wonderful if played to the tune of Happiness is A Warm Gun

Post Hoc Ergo Prompter Hoc is wonderful if played to the tune of Happiness is A Warm Gun

[Paladin]

72. If I Were A Gun Rights Militant, I'd Be Clinging To The Past, Too. (nt)

[barbtries]

65. i rec'd because

i think i know what you mean.

[morningfog]

80. Soon to be followed up with "Dems is gonna lose" and "outta my cold dead hands."

[NutmegYankee]

81. All this tough talk reminds me of a great comedy scene

[samsingh]

82. sounds about right

[Hugabear]

86. Gungeoneers on DU are no different than Gungeoneers in freeperville

They obsess over their guns, declare any sort of gun control a failure before it's even been tried. They love to argue over semantics.

Fuck them all.

[bongbong]

104. Careful!

They're very delicate. Like little flowers.

But oh so manly! It's the complete package: super-sensitive Rambo.

[samsingh]

97. kick

[Chorophyll]

99. It works pretty well in other countries, and it will work here.

Unless the gungeon thinks Americans are stupider than other people. And I'm sure they don't think that, do they?