Experts fear handwriting will become a lost art

[proud2BlibKansan]

Handwriting still has a place in the digital age, its proponents say, and they hoped that what they billed as a "summit" on the subject this week would spotlight their case for the enduring value of handwriting in the learning process.

The Washington conference was designed to draw together research from psychology, occupational therapy, education, and neuroscience to demonstrate handwriting's role in students' physical and cognitive development, states' learning standards, and the classroom.

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Doubt about the continued worth of handwriting skill is "similar to what happened with math as calculators and computers came into vogue," said Daniel A. Domenech, the executive director of the American Association of School Administrators, which co-sponsored the gathering with Zaner-Bloser, a Columbus, Ohio, company that produces a handwriting curriculum. "People wondered whether students needed to learn how to do math. The answer in both cases is absolutely yes. Writing is not obsolete."

Proponents of teaching—in some cases, reintroducing—handwriting in the school curriculum say their concern over the fading importance of handwriting became more urgent with the advent of the Common Core State Standards. The standards, which were released in 2010 and have been adopted by all but four states, mention keyboarding but not handwriting.

more . . . http://www.edweek.org/ew/articles/2012/01/25/18handwriting_ep.h31.html?tkn=UUOFXH3VEzlv%2BDUrtg4S06RjPJw0XbTUwkQB&cmp=ENL-CM-VIEWS1

[Justice wanted]

1. It is becoming a lost art and it is ashame.

[proud2BlibKansan]

2. Kids still need to learn to sign their names

I don't see the day a signature is no longer necessary.

I still teach handwriting.

[Justice wanted]

5. I've seen kids using printed letters to sign their names on things. I give you credit for teaching

them.

[Gin]

18. question

I am in my 60's and have noticed my handwriting is awful...starts out okay then quickly is unreadable.....are there exercises I can do to regain decent handwriting skills.

Not sure if it is age or using the computer a lot that has degraded my handwriting skills. I have older sisters who still write legibly....any advice?

[proud2BlibKansan]

19. They still sell handwriting workbooks at KMart and Target

They aren't very expensive. And practice makes perfect.

[kestrel91316]

51. Indeed. And I GUARANTEE you, all the fundie home-schoolers are being taught

handwriting.

We abandon it at our peril.

[proud2BlibKansan]

53. In spite of several comments made in this thread,

we have to continue teaching it due to the connection to fine motor skills and their role in child development.

[gateley]

78. Do you remember the Palmer Method -- and the OOOOOOs we had to practice?

Someone told me that if you do the OOOOOOs slanting to the left, practice that a while, and that will help. I haven't tried it but I need to. My handwriting has become illegible. Part of the reason is because I'm so impatient because I'm more used to typing, now -- much faster.

So instead of -> OOOOOOOO do them slanting <- that way.

I'm happy to hear there are handwriting books available!

[PatriciaNAM]

79. another answer to your question

You are welcome to check out the archives of the Handwriting Matters Yahoo group.
It was set up with teachers in mind, but there is no reason you can't tap into it as well.
There are dozens of links to free handwriting resources stored there. It's free to join,
and you can unsubscribe at any point.

[Suich]

109. I've got the same problem, Gin!

About the only thing I write now is my grocery or to-do list. I pay bills on-line so I'm not writing checks anymore. All of my correspondence is either by phone or computer. If I have to fill out any forms, I print them. I don't know of any exercises other than maybe writing more...I really have no idea.

Funny story: My sister showed her son, who was 25 at the time, a note from an older cousin, beautifully written in cursive, and he couldn't read it.

Good luck!

[obamanut2012]

23. There is no legal need to "sign" your name

You can just print it, or even make an "x."

I learned cursive, so I use it for my signature, but I print everything else, and have since I left elementary school. I'm old enough to have spent hours and hours and hours learning cursive. imo it has a place in art class, but not in the regular curriculum. It is archaic, and was invented because it made writing with quill pens easier.

[proud2BlibKansan]

25. Ok. I'll start putting an X on my checks.

And the reason we teach cursive has more to do with speed than quill pens. Until we had keyboards, we needed to teach kids to write quickly so they could take notes.

[obamanut2012]

27. Go ahead -- it's legal

It can be taught in art class.

It had to do because of quill pens, and we have keyboards now. I can print as quickly as I can write cursive, and it's also much neater.

[proud2BlibKansan]

29. So because YOU can do something everyone can??

LOL

My best friend is a bank officer. She assures me if I started signing with an X the bank would stop processing my checks and plastic purchases. It's an urban myth that an X is perfectly legal.

[obamanut2012]

35. Your friend is wrong

Your signature is anything you want it to be: cursive, printed, initials, or a symbol. It just has be consistent. That is is the law. It isn't an urban myth at all.

[proud2BlibKansan]

58. Ok I'll tell her someone on the Internet said she was wrong

[obamanut2012]

61. No, the law says she's wrong

It has nothing to do with me. I suspect a simple Google search could teach someone this.

[laundry_queen]

95. When I worked in a bank

albeit I'm in Canada, our company also had banks in the US, I worked in an area with a really high rate of illteracy and many people used X as a signature. As long as it matched what was on their signature cards, then all was fine.

Yes, a google search will probably show you are right.

[FarCenter]

39. There is no requirement that a signature be legible

It just has to be consistent with the scrawl on the signature card.

[obamanut2012]

44. This what a signature legally is

A signature acts as the intent to affirm a contract, not as proof of your identity.

That's what a passport, birth certificate, license, etc. if for.

[eShirl]

31. Then why don't we make kids learn shorthand?

[obamanut2012]

38. Yup, that would be the logical outcome

It WAS for speed: back when we used quill pens, and non-cartidge fountain pens.

I think it definitely has a place in art class, because it is a form of calligraphy.

[Mariana]

101. All the teachers would have to learn it, first.

Good luck with that.

[ananda]

41. I come across a lot of students who don't know cursive.

It is indeed going the way of the dodo.

[ZombieHorde]

82. I usually sign with a smile face.

If I want to be more formal, I just scribble "VVVVVVVVV."

If I want to be really, really formal, I will use one of the letters from my name, and then write "VVVVVVV."

I think any mark is legal for a signature, so I almost always use a smile face.

I used to sing my first and last name, but then I became a smart ass about it. It is more fun for me.

[arely staircase]

84. so do i

are there schools that don't?

[Dulcinea]

111. It's still taught in school.

Both of my kids were taught cursive. They're actually proud of it.

[spartan61]

3. As a retired second grade teacher,

I am sick about the fact that handwriting is not being taught in schools anymore. The kids want to learn how to do cursive writing. My grand-daughter was proud that she could "write" and when I saw how she was forming the letters, I asked her if her teacher taught her this way because it wasn't correct. That's when she informed me that she isn't learning it in school and is teaching herself. Of course, Nana gave her a lesson. There will always be a need for handwriting skills. I guess written thank you notes will go the way of he dinasaurs.

[proud2BlibKansan]

4. Blame it on Common Core

That's why I bolded that part of the OP.

CC is really nasty. Just unbelievably developmentally inappropriate. Now it's the main reason we no longer teach handwriting.

[FarCenter]

40. Twitter is for thank you notes.

[obamanut2012]

46. I don't mind emailed or texted thank yous

From my nephews.

[FarCenter]

49. Plus, snail mail would cost them 45 cents

And an email or text is likely to be sent more quickly.

[obamanut2012]

91. That's how high school and college kids communicate

I'm impressed they actually send thank yous!

[pitohui]

70. handwritten notes have already gone the way of the dinosaurs

why a handwritten note when i can get/send a thank you note in minutes by email and the person who sent me the gift doesn't have to wait and wonder for weeks if i got it?

[hack89]

6. I can't remember the last time I hand wrote any thing longer than a note to school. nt

[proud2BlibKansan]

8. At least you knew how.

[hack89]

9. It was actually a struggle - took me two attempts.

It is an obsolete skill in my world - both personally and professionally.

[proud2BlibKansan]

11. I sit in meetings a couple times a week where I take notes.

I have to sign in at work every day.

I have to sign the receipt when I use plastic to pay for things.

Everyone needs to learn to sign their names. It's positively criminal that we aren't teaching children to do this at school.

[jody]

7. To those experts add one non-expert Me. Not only penmanship but the ability to

organize words logically and make a point..

I tire of reading reports that force me to search for a conclusion or recommendation.

[proud2BlibKansan]

13. Handwriting is an important fine motor skill as well

[a la izquierda]

34. And my students wonder why...

I make them write a lot (I'm a college professor). I explain that they may never study history again after my class, but almost all jobs will require reports of some kind.

[jody]

56. Yes, and in today electronic workplace, I judge people who I've never met by the quality of their

writing.

That can make the difference in getting a promotion.

[a la izquierda]

92. Absolutely...

Poor writing skills used to drive my uncle bananas. He worked for a very large company and had new hires from top universities. Most of these kids could not write at all, and he ended up spending his own time redoing their work.

[jody]

93. One more skill; we teach reading, writing, speaking, but not listening! I

want to go ballistic when anyone, particularly a subordinate, interrupts me to answer a question they thought I was going to ask but it was a superfluous question.

Needless to say I never, but never, add them to my special team when I have a challenging problem to solve.

A chaplain friend from Vietnam when we were much younger said "When all is said and done, more is said than done."

I've added a corollary for the email age, "When all is read and done, more is read than done."

Check your mail for a message.

[joeglow3]

10. Good

Cursive is worthless. Why not teach calligraphy?

Seriously, our schools are already overwhelmed with what they need to teach. Let them focus on more important things.

[proud2BlibKansan]

12. Do you sign your name in cursive?

As long as signatures are necessary, we absolutely have to teach kids to write their own names in cursive.

[tridim]

14. I sign my name in squigglies, I have since day one.

I can still write in actual cursive, but rarely do.

[proud2BlibKansan]

16. Someone taught you how.

We can't just stop teaching kids how to write.

[Ikonoklast]

20. A signature does NOT have to be in cursive.

There is no legal requirement to sign any document in cursive, in fact, your signature can be almost anything you designate as such.

[obamanut2012]

24. You don't have to use cursive for your signature

You can print, make an X, use your initials, etc. It's all legally the same.

[kestrel91316]

50. Yes, but your longhand signature is usually much more unique and harder to fake.

[obamanut2012]

57. Your signature is not meant as proof of your identity

Your government-issued identity documents do that. Your signature is only meant to affirm your intent to uphold a contract (lease, loan, mortgage, check

People who accept your checks have no idea what your signature looks like, nor does the bank, unless there is a problem and they have a sig card on file. My bank didn't even ask me for a signature card when I opened an account with them about thee years ago,

My point is: if the only point of learning cursive is to teach a signature, then teach kids their signature when they're in middle school or something, and there's also no legal reason to even have a cursive signature. Class time is so pared down now in schools, that I think the time should be spent learning actual basic skills. Also, fine motor skills can be taught in many different ways. Printing, which kids can use and do use and will use, teaches this.

[proud2BlibKansan]

59. Exactly

[obamanut2012]

65. Your signature is not proof of identify

[hunter]

33. I once had a job where I'd sign dozens of papers every day.

My legible signature died there, but I'm pretty happy with the evolved squiggles and flourishes which are much related to the geometry of my hand

I've been watching my kids and their friends growing up and moving off to college. Their cursive skills are atrocious, but most of them have created pretty interesting signatures from scratch, not especially following the writing methods we older generations were taught in gradeschool.

[a la izquierda]

36. If I hadn't learned cursive

I'd be up a creek. I'm a historian. I read documents from the 15th-19th century, which are handwritten (and in another language, but that's a different story).
If I didn't read cursive, I couldn't do my job. Perhaps in 200 years the documents I read will be transcribed...but I kind of doubt it.

[joeglow3]

43. So, make that criteria for your degree

I couldn't do a lot of things in my job if not for certain skills. However, many of those skills are unique to my profession and were taught in specific courses in college for my degree. This is no different.

[FarCenter]

54. There are a lot of different scripts that have been used historically, and some are very difficult

Learning modern cursive as taught in schools won't necessarily help with reading older documents.

If you go back far enough, some scripts more resemble forms of printing.

Besides speed, cursive probably helped minimize blotting due to lifting and depressing the pen nib, which isn't much of an issue with modern writing instruments.

I'd note that technical lettering is also a lost branch of calligraphy once learned by engineers and draftsmen.

[Princess Turandot]

15. It's really too bad. Handwriting communicates something more than its words, I think.

There's a sense of someone's individualism in it. Summer breaks from college always involved the pleasure of sending/getting letters from friends living in other places. A quick glance at the envelope's writing would tell you who had sent it.

I have to admit this: I received an F in penmanship for one term in 5th grade! It wasn't for lack of trying, but they were still teaching the Palmer's method in that historical period and I just couldn't do it. (My script was worse than my left-handed brother's.)

[mainstreetonce]

17. I think if you wait until about age 10

then students could learn to sign their names with cursive letters in about five or six simple lessons. More obstruction should be optional. School time is too valuable to spend on hours of " Palmer Method" .

[proud2BlibKansan]

32. I agree.

But we still need to spend some time teaching kids this skill. Not as much time as we once did, but we need to continue teaching it. Common Core eliminates handwriting entirely.

[obamanut2012]

21. Cursive was invented because of quill pens

Who uses quill pens, or even non-cartridge fountain pens anymore on a regular basis?

We spent hours and hours in elementary school learning how to write cursive, including making those weird, floppy capital Q's (who the hell ever used those after we weren't being graded on handwriting anymore?).

I personally think there's really no reason to have this as part of the regular curriculum. Schools that still have an art program could and maybe should add it, but I don't see the big deal.

[FarCenter]

42. About half of the cursive capitals are completely useless

I use block capitals instead for most letters except abbreviated styles of M, N, etc.

[obamanut2012]

47. Where did that weird Q ever come from???

[TheKentuckian]

83. That is what I'm saying. I was thinking the argument is on thin ice

based on the Q alone.

[obamanut2012]

86. Seriously

It's like something from The Devil.

[link:|

[kestrel91316]

48. My assistant and I were discussing this the other day. Longhand

upper case letters, by all rights, should just be larger-scale versions of the lower case.

Capital "Q" is an especially bizarre example.

[obamanut2012]

60. Even as a 2nd Grader, I thought the "Q" was insane

Our teacher told us it was "A Floppy 2 tired from doing homework."

WTF???

[Speck Tater]

22. Cursive handwriting as an art, like artistic basket weaving, is nice thing to know,...

but it's not necessary. I had handwriting drilled into me in the early 50's but I was never good at it, and I'm still not good at it. I print or type, but I never use cursive, and I haven't since high school in 1962, so all those hours in class practicing Pittman were a huge waste of time.

Bemoaning the fact that few people use cursive is like bemoaning the fact that few people can write in hieroglyphics anymore. It's a lost art. So?

[obamanut2012]

26. +1

I wrote something very similar right above you, although I'm probably 20-25 years younger. 100% agree.

[proud2BlibKansan]

37. It's an easy way to develop fine motor skills

If we didn't teach handwriting then we'd need to teach sewing or some other fine motor skill. We can't ignore the importance of fine motor development for our children. It's all connected to brain development.

[FarCenter]

55. According to the Palmer Method, movement of the fingers is minimized; video games are better

Palmer's method involved 'muscle motion' in which the more proximal muscles of the arm were used for movement, rather than allowing the fingers to move in writing.

The style is now experiencing renewed attention, from those working in facilitated communication for the disabled. Because the Palmer method has a focus on shoulder and arm movements, it is helpful for many with limited movement of the fingers.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palmer_Method

Video game controllers involve lots of fine motion of the hands, and it develops more finger dexterity in both hands.

[obamanut2012]

62. I learned cursive via the Palmer Method

And you are correct. I also had an Old School teacher who would tape the best Palmer exemplars on the wall (ie the Floppy 2's), and give those students classroom perks.

[TheKentuckian]

85. I'd gladly exchange cursive for sewing.

Seriously, you are telling me that instead of jacking around with an antiquated and highly inconsistent form of writing/almost a font, I could have some sewing skills and have worked the same connections?!?


I actually resent cursive on this note. At almost an hour a day for four or five years, I could actually do something useful and at least desirable to me personally.

[proud2BlibKansan]

89. An hour a day for four or five years?

Where the FUCK did you go to school?

[sarge43]

100. The same elementary school I went to. We did Palmer practice every day for a period, 50 minutes.

As memory serves from 2nd to 4th grade. Back in the days before readily available typewriters or word processors, cursive was the only quick and easy way to write anything longer than paragraph.

I hated the drill, but I'm still glad I can write cursive even though I can type 80wpm.

[proud2BlibKansan]

102. I've been teaching elementary school for more than 30 years

And I've never taught in any school that required an hour of handwriting every day. More like 30 minute a couple times a week.

[sarge43]

105. I started elementary school in 1948. A couple of our teachers were in their mid fifties.

They probably were taught by Palmer.

[FarCenter]

107. Too bad, mine was maybe 19-20, after one year of Normal school

Of course, I was too young to appreciate it at the time. She got married and quit after second grade.

[FarCenter]

104. Part of the drill was not even writing

You were supposed to be able to make a perfect line of overlapping ovals, evenly spaced, uniformly dense, perfectly shaped, touching the correct upper and lower lines.

Technical lettering, which used to be taught to first year engineers, was more useful.

[sarge43]

106. Remember it well and the perfectly slanted, spaced, etc connected lines.

Supposed to fine tune the hand muscles; just gave me hand cramps and a lot of frustration. However, as said I am glad I learn to write a reasonably decent cursive.

[Mariana]

110. We did it three periods a week

from 2nd to 5th grade. It was the Palmer method. From 3rd grade on until high school, in all subjects we'd get marked off for lettering instead of using cursive, OR for writing "incorrectly" - even for no slant or leftward slant, no matter how neat and legible it was. My writing naturally slants to the left, so Palmer method cursive was and still is difficult and time-consuming for me. My lettering is very fast and extremely neat, leftward slant and all.

[TheKentuckian]

116. Jefferson County, we had writing/penmanship daily. I had extra work because mine sucked.

But we all did it daily, maybe after a few decades and seen through the eyes of a little kid, the time spent per day got embellished some but I don't think so other than losing the gist of how the day was divided in elementary school. I guess it could have been a half hour or forty minutes, still time better spent sewing or better yet on another language.

Writing/penmanship was daily like PE, reading, math, spelling, etc and not a few days a week like music or art.

[Mumble]

28. I can't spell worth a wooden nickel.

And I talk in a murmur. I blame public education.

[proud2BlibKansan]

90. You should file a lawsuit

[DavidDvorkin]

30. As happened to the ability to write cuneiform

Neither is a loss.

[kestrel91316]

45. GOOD handwriting will become a lost art. But crappy chicken scratching like mine

will live forever, lol.

My mom had lovely handwriting, and my sister and niece do. But I had to quit longhand in junior high because of its embarrassing resemblance to a third grader's. I print everything but my signature and have since about 1971.

[FreeJoe]

52. My kids can't...

write hieroglyphs. Their stone masonry skills are terrible. They don't know how to do calligraphy. What is the world coming to?

Seriously, I don't know anyone that writes in cursive anymore. I certainly don't. I don't even use real cursive for my signature. My sig is more of an impressionistic version of cursive.

To be honest, know one pays any attention to signatures. I have a friend that has "check driver's license" written on all of his bank cards instead of a signature. No one ever asks to see his DL.

[MadHound]

63. Cursive is still needed for a few reasons,

First of all, most competent cursive writers can take note as fast, if not faster, than entering them into a keyboard. Not to mention that not every student is going to have access to a laptop full or part time. Furthermore, as we see in classrooms across the country, having a laptop to take notes in class also leads, for a lot of students, to not taking notes as all, as they become more interested in cruising the 'net, tweeting, updating facebook, checking scores, anything except taking notes.

Second, cursive leads to improved fine motor skills. There is no doubt about this.

Third, and perhaps more important, taking notes in cursive gives the student an extra way of learning. When you are listening to a lecture, you are engaged in verbal learning. When are listening to a lecture AND taking notes, by hand, you are engaged in kinesthetic learning through the physical act of putting pen to paper. This activation of kinesthetic learning does not happen when you are keyboarding, only when you are writing. Thus, you are doubling your learning capability, and thus enhancing what you learn.

I teach in a rural district, one that doesn't have laptops for every kid. Guess what, we are a top flight school, the kids learn more, in part because they learn both verbally and kinesthetically.

Computers are not the be all and end all solution to educating our kids, in fact in many way they are a detriment. But computers, computers, computers is the line being pushed by corporate education experts because guess what, pushing computers helps the bottom line, and that's all they really care about.

[obamanut2012]

64. Printing, Printing, and Printing n/t

[MadHound]

66. The vast majority of students can't print anywhere fast enough to take effective notes.

Not to mention that you don't fully develop the related fine motor skills when printing.

[FarCenter]

67. Typing is faster, shop teaches better motor skills, and the learing is probably visual

Most competent typists can type faster than they can write in longhand - at least legibly! After getting a typewriter in the early '60s, I switched to composing papers and reports on the typewriter. It faster and it better matches the speed of writing to the speed of thinking. Longhand is too slow to keep up with the thought process. A double-spaced typescript is a lot better for editing and marking up, and typing is easier than longhand for making the final copy.

Fine motor skills are better developed by video games. However, I'd also be concerned about the lack of crafts and shop classes these days. These teach motor skills and they teach people how to make and repair things. Also, some kids shine at "industrial arts" rather than academic subjects, and it helps them with motivation and self-confidence.

I'm one of the people who learns very poorly from listening, but if I see something it is retained very well. Much of your "kinesthetic learning" is really visual learning.

[MadHound]

68. Typing is faster in an office setting,

Not taking notes.

Video games don't address the same fine motor skills that writing does, not to mention that not everybody likes video games, and video games bring their own raft of problems

Not all kids want to take "shop" classes.

I suggest that you educate yourself on kinesthetic learning theory, for you obviously don't know what it is if you're saying it is really visual learning.

Do you have access to the J-Stor database? If so, I can point you to some fine articles on these issues.

[FarCenter]

73. Learning handwriting involves kinesthetic learning

But writing down what the teacher is saying about the Battle of Trenton? Not so much.

Kinesthetic learning is better exploited by, for example, having the student actually build and operate the classes of lever in Physics lab or having the student learn the relative positions and appearance of organs through dissection in Biology lab.

I don't have access to J-Stor.

[MadHound]

75. A shame, then I could point you to the studies that show your contention to be wrong

Time and time again it has been shown that writing activates kinesthetic learning. Perhaps you can go do some research at your local college or university library, educate yourself.

[FarCenter]

81. Here's an interesting resource that recommends typing for kinesthetic learners

http://www.salt.arizona.edu/sites/salt.arizona.edu/files/tutoringfiles/handouts/Learning%20Styles%20and%20the%20Writing%20Process.pdf

Learning Styles and the Writing Process

Drafting -- Kinesthetic Learners

Use a Computer

Computer keyboards are wonderful for kinesthetic learners. Typing will help reinforce your ideas, so that you more fully understand your own points. Further, your fingers can often learn skills, such as spelling, better than your eyes. Typing on a computer, as always, will also make revision easier.

[MadHound]

96. Well, since you don't have access to J-STOR

I'll give these cites, but you'll have to look them up for yourself.

"Memory in Our Body: Thick Participation and the Translation of Kinesthetic Experience" American Ethnologist Vol. 35, No. 4, Nov., 2008

"The Fragility of Healing" # Ethos Vol. 29, No. 1, Mar., 2001

"Living Systems: The Organism" The Quarterly Review of Biology, Vol. 48, No. 1, Part 2

"On Synthesis and Memory with Prefatory Note" The Journal of Philosophy, Vol. 67, No. 1

Here is an article summation on the internet:

"Better Learning Through Handwriting

ScienceDaily (Jan. 19, 2011) — Writing by hand strengthens the learning process. When typing on a keyboard, this process may be impaired."
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2011/01/110119095458.htm

More evidence from the popular press

"She's right. Using advanced tools such as magnetic resonance imaging, researchers are finding that writing by hand is more than just a way to communicate. The practice helps with learning letters and shapes, can improve idea composition and expression, and may aid fine motor-skill development.

It's not just children who benefit. Adults studying new symbols, such as Chinese characters, might enhance recognition by writing the characters by hand, researchers say. Some physicians say handwriting could be a good cognitive exercise for baby boomers working to keep their minds sharp as they age."
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704631504575531932754922518.html

I think I'll take the word of respected researchers, doctors and academians, backed with evidence, published in peer reviewed journals over an unsubstantiated one paragraph blurb from U of AZ's alternative learning center.

[pitohui]

71. i bet you have cell phones for every kid

the world is moving away from laptops and toward tablets, smart phones, etc

kids will need to be able to learn to type quickly and effectively on these devices, which are cheap and most kids have (or soon have) them anyway

maybe "every" kid doesn't have a laptop (altho i suspect virtually every kid DOES have a laptop) but it's 2012, they all have phones

cursive handwriting can be taught as part of an arts program if anyone is interested

[MadHound]

74. Actually no, we don't.

The rural poor can't afford such luxuries. Those who do have cell phones are required to turn them off at the door, otherwise they are confiscated for the day. Too much of classroom distraction.

And no, not every kid in the district has a laptop, and probably a good forty percent don't have any other access to a computer other than what is in our media center or at the public library.

Typing on a smart phone or cell phone is neither fast, nor effective. Typing in general, especially with kids whose bodies are still developing leads to carpal tunnel syndrome and other physical harm. Writing doesn't.

Not to mention the other advantages of handwriting that I mentioned.

It is not an either/or proposition. I learned my cursive in elementary school, my typing in high school. There is a place, and need, for both.

[proud2BlibKansan]

76. The majority of the kids I teach don't have access to computers and keyboards at home

And access at school is still limited. With budget cuts and this crappy economy, I don't expect that to change much soon.

I will continue to teach handwriting, both manuscript AND cursive, until they pry the pencils from . . .

Well, you know the rest. LOL

[pitohui]

69. it will become an art, but not a lost art

it simply isn't important to be able to hand write any longer, that said, it will not become a "lost art" since there will always be artists/calligraphers who can do this

not everyone needs to know how to say, paint a watercolor, and not everyone needs to know how to make pretty handwriting

however, teachers who pretend that everyone needs to be able to write cursive are just silly, what "everyone" needs to be able to do is type

writing will never be obsolete but there are better techniques for writing now, i can type over 100 words a minute on my computer keyboard and i can even type as fast as most middle schoolers on my cell phone...i can have my notes and thoughts and letters (now emails and text messages) at my fingertips much faster than i could ever have with scribbling notes in cursive

this is not a sad or a bad thing, we have actually IMPROVED something in this world, why not celebrate this change?

[RebelOne]

72. I am so accustomed to using the computer for everything:

writing letters, paying bills online, etc., that I have a hard time now writing anything by hand. Once when I lost my debit card and was waiting for the bank to send me a new one, it was a real chore to write checks when I went shopping,

[The Genealogist]

77. Yes! Down with handwriting!

Next, we can get rid of spelling and grammar training! Just teach the kids WTF, OMG and n00b! I already know a lot of people who communicate this way when using a written medium, and it seems that this is how people communicate more often all the time. WTF? Complete sentences are for n00bs! So after we have tossed handwriting, why not just move on to spelling and grammar? They too seem to be dying out. As for for people too poor to buy a computer or other electronic device that allows data entry, well, they just need to pull themselves up by their bootstraps, now don't they?

And now, about teaching history...

just in case.

[obamanut2012]

87. Just cursive

What is wrong with printing? My printing is far neater than my cursive anyway.

[The Genealogist]

98. I don't see why we would maintain one and not the other

If cursive is so archaic, why would printing be any less so? Further, it takes me far longer to print something out rather than write it out in cursive. I don't know about you, but there are not a lot of occasions where I have extra time to print something out. I'd never have made it through high school, much less a BA and an MA by printing lecture notes. I still fill up several notebooks per year, writing down quick notes and other information. I honestly don't know how I would function without cursive handwriting.

[obamanut2012]

103. I can print faster than I can write

I learned the Palmer Method back in elementary school, and haven't used it after I no longer was made to.

You have to teach a child to write, so why do you teach them two ways? Cursive should definitely be taught in art, at least for a while, while printing can be taught with keyboarding as part of the curriculum.

[Odin2005]

80. They said the same about buggy whips in 1910.

[mahatmakanejeeves]

88. I sent out one Christmas card this year.

Whoops, I mean holiday card. What am I thinking?

It went to someone I hadn't seen in years. I sat down and wrote it out a lengthy accompanying message by hand. When I was done, I couldn't read my own writing.

I sent it by the USPS too.

[frazzled]

94. On the other hand

In my case, at least, I think we used to spend too much time on it. I will never forget my fourth-grade teacher, probably the worst I ever had. (This would have been around 1958 or so.) All we did all year was practice handwriting. I swear, we learned almost nothing else. He'd hand out those sheets of lined newsprint paper (the kind with the dotted line in the middle so the mid-point of your letter would hit it just so), and he'd announce: "Okay, we're practicing cursive 'a' today." We'd have to write 500 letter a's, and if a single loop didn't meet exactly, he'd make you write another 500. I kid you not! Literally hours each day were devoted to it.

Just to rebel, I think, my handwriting became increasingly idiosyncratic as I advanced in school. (Now, it's pretty bad, because I have no patience for it, even though I do use writing in my work, though only for my own notations, which I then transcribe using the "tracking" function onto manuscripts on the computer.)

Of course, in those days, handwriting was all you had, even in college to take notes. Getting a typewriter for college for papers was a big deal. We had to take typing class in 7th or 8th grade as well.

My children had to learn handwriting in school, though not nearly as much time was given to it. My daughter was left-handed, so we cut her some slack. My son never got past holding his pencil like a baboon, despite all the triangular pencil covers and other tricks we tried to use. He mostly half-printed. Oddly, now in his mid-twenties, he has decided to take an online course on handwriting--and to motivate himself to continue, he bought himself a fancy fountain pen. I think it's a kind of "retro" style thing that's coming back with silk pocket squares and tweeds and such. Go figure. (He's a mathematician.)

I think some attention should be given to printing and handwriting up to fourth grade or so. Then, let's face it, we don't use it for a lot these days. My father (aged 95) has the most beautiful handwriting imaginable, and he's ambidextrous: can do it with both hands.

[DevonRex]

97. My handwriting was terrible in grammar school. But when I learned Cyrillic

it was beautiful. Cursive Cyrillic, I mean.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

99. What I'm seeing in this thread is intellectual laziness

When I was teaching Japanese, I made my students practice writing their kanji in the correct stroke order. Some of them thought I was a terrible bitch for doing this, but in fact, the students who wrote in the correct stroke order and practiced doing so REMEMBERED the kanji better than those who just used flash cards. (Three thousand years of that kind of writing in Asia, and they have learned something about how to internalize the system.) The students who thought practicing writing was a waste of time? They invariably made the same kinds of mistakes in writing, leaving out strokes that they would not have left out if they had been using the correct order.

Furthermore, when I was taking lecture courses (in English, history, biology, whatever), I found that handwriting sent the material through my brain an extra time much more effectively than just listening did. And outlining the chapter from the textbook in my own handwriting was a much more effective study technique than just highlighting. (For me, it was the step after highlighting: taking the highlighted portions and copying them over in outline form with topics and subtopics.)

When learning languages other than Japanese, doing written exercises was one of my most effective study techniques. Yes, listening to audio was vital for listening comprehension, but nothing beat copying the dialogues and reading passages by hand for internalizing the grammar and vocabulary.

(At one point, I ended up with a Japanese class whose achievements were shaped like a reverse bell curve--everyone did either very well or very poorly, with almost no one in the middle. After the third test that showed this kind of pattern, I asked the "A" students to write anonymously how they studied for tests. Every one of them--and I mean every one--copied out all the dialogues and reading passages by hand at the very least. One super-ambitious student then translated them into English and then back into Japanese and matched her result with the original. The "D" and "F" students whined, "But that's a lot of work!" Precisely!)

But it's just like with calculators. The lazy students moan about having to learn basic arithmetic, but you don't always enter your numbers correctly on a keypad, and it's helpful to have some idea when your answer is totally off base. Furthermore, as someone who was educated before calculators, I can balance my checkbook anywhere and estimate out how much my grocery bill is going to be as I add each item to the basket, all without relying on a piece of electronics.

Oh, my I add a final reason to write by hand? By copying good prose, I gained a physical sense of what constitutes good prose.

[Mariana]

112. I also learn things much better

if I copy or at least outline the material by hand and take handwritten notes. But, I don't do it in cursive.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

115. Then you are making extra work for yourself

[Withywindle]

108. I write by hand every single day

Pages and pages - I write fiction, and there is something about the muscle-memory of just letting the pen go that stimulates my thoughts in a different way than typing does.

Also, I like to wander around the city and write in a lot of different places, and I prefer to do it on something that won't break if dropped and no one is likely to rob me for and if I lose it I'm not out several hundred dollars at least and I don't have to worry about time on the battery.

I love my laptop for editing and 2nd - 3rd drafts, but there's nothing like a pen and paper for the first draft.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

114. I totally agree--I wrote the first draft of my Ph.D. dissertation in longhand

Word processing was in its infancy in those days, but I wrote the first draft of each chapter in longhand on narrow ruled legal pads and typed them up for my advisor to read.

[WinkyDink]

113. To the Pro-Printers: Why stop there? Why not just go back to hieroglyphics?

Birds, hands, wavy lines,....