A couple of reasons you should be terrified of the surveillance state

[Vinnie From Indy]

Karl Rove
Dick Cheney
Scooter Libby
etc
etc
etc


Is there anyone on this board that thinks these people would not abuse the awesome power at their disposal to subvert democracy?

Anyone?

Also, is there not a separation of powers issue here if Congress is also being swept up in the vacuum?

[zbdent]

1. We warned them in 2001 ...

We said "Do you really want that power in the hands of President Hillary"?

And they said "If you have nothing to hide, why are you worried? Why do you hate America?"

[RobertEarl]

2. Good point... and what about if Romney?

[Mojo Electro]

3. But if you're not doing anything wrong, why are you worried?

[JaneyVee]

4. I am terrified of it.

[DirkGently]

5. Has any secret power of any government ever NOT been abused?

It's the nature of humanity. It's the reason for the Bill of Rights. Those in power will use every bit of it for selfish or amoral purposes. Period. No freedom of speech means someone's going to jail for having the wrong opinion. No freedom of the press means no unfavorable reports on government activities. No freedom of religion means someone will pick one for you.

The difference between "us" and "them" is not that "we" can be trusted with abusable power. It is that we accept limitations on government power, even when it's inconvenient, because we value a free and open society.

"We" need to remember who "we" are, or "they" will remind us why we have (had?) these protections and limitations surely enough.

[spanone]

6. they had this awesome power

[Vinnie From Indy]

7. There are a variety of ways to look at that fact actually

One could offer that they screwed up the first time they had it and didn't go far enough with it.

It might argued that they tried and simply failed to attain their objectives.

A cynic might offer that they have never given it up and are still using it to this very day and that the Obama Admin truly is the fourth term of GW Bush and the rest is just Kabuki theater for the masses.

There are several more I could offer.
Cheers!

[spanone]

8. you're right vinny! and i grew up in indy!