The FBI can secretly turn on your cellphone mic to eavesdrop on you

[AZ Progressive]

You think the NSA recording all your emails and messages is bad? How about recording all your in-person conversations without you even knowing it? Say you are in a "subversive" organization like an antiwar group or women's rights group (as the FBI defined such groups during the days of Cointelpro) and the FBI or NSA records what you are saying to other people in person. Your phone could be used against you. This has been used by the FBI but one must conclude that the NSA could be using it as well. An article from 2006:

http://news.cnet.com/2100-1029_3-6140191.html

"The technique is called a "roving bug," and was approved by top U.S. Department of Justice officials for use against members of a New York organized crime family who were wary of conventional surveillance techniques such as tailing a suspect or wiretapping him.

Nextel cell phones owned by two alleged mobsters, John Ardito and his attorney Peter Peluso, were used by the FBI to listen in on nearby conversations. The FBI views Ardito as one of the most powerful men in the Genovese family, a major part of the national Mafia."

.......

Kaplan's opinion said that the eavesdropping technique "functioned whether the phone was powered on or off." Some handsets can't be fully powered down without removing the battery; for instance, some Nokia models will wake up when turned off if an alarm is set.
While the Genovese crime family prosecution appears to be the first time a remote-eavesdropping mechanism has been used in a criminal case, the technique has been discussed in security circles for years.

The U.S. Commerce Department's security office warns that "a cellular telephone can be turned into a microphone and transmitter for the purpose of listening to conversations in the vicinity of the phone." An article in the Financial Times last year said mobile providers can "remotely install a piece of software on to any handset, without the owner's knowledge, which will activate the microphone even when its owner is not making a call."

[AnotherMcIntosh]

1. FBI usage would just be a start. Out of jealousy, local cops will ultimately want to do this as well

[dorkzilla]

9. I know a cop who used this method to catch his wife cheating (n/t)

[JaneQPublic]

2. Hackers (Not Government) can turn your laptop into a spycam

http://www.nbcnews.com/video/nightly-news/50580620#50580620

[MADem]

3. A school loaned out computers and turned on the cameras and microphones to see what the students

were doing in their HOMES...who remembers that story from a while back? Ah, yes, here it is...


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robbins_v._Lower_Merion_School_District

The suit alleged that, in what was dubbed the "WebcamGate" scandal, the schools secretly spied on the students while they were in the privacy of their homes.[3][4] School authorities surreptitiously and remotely activated webcams embedded in school-issued laptops the students were using at home.[5][6] After the suit was brought, the school district, of which the two high schools are part, revealed that it had secretly snapped more than 66,000 images.[7][8] The suit charged that in doing so the district infringed on its students' privacy rights.[5][9][10] A federal judge issued a preliminary injunction, ordering the school district to stop its secret webcam monitoring, and ordered the district to pay the plaintiffs' attorney fees.[11][12][13]

I should think if that could be done, turning on a phone and listening should be a piece of cake. They'd better get a warrant first, though.

[ElsewheresDaughter]

10. I remember that.....don't talk in your cars either...OnStar

[defacto7]

4. Why does this keep coming up?

Anyone can download software that will do this and it's old news... years this has been around. I guess it's just more timely for such a reload.

Anyone can do this if you know how to get and use the ware.

[Monkie]

19. this is not about downloading, but your providers ability to do "silent" updates

it is also old news, and legal for the FBI to use, with a warrant, but you would never know.
your internet provider can do the same to your cable/dsl modem ( routing all your traffic through the FBI for example).
and microsoft could do this to windows too, without your knowledge.
so if a warrant is served on your provider or microsoft then this is legal.

[defacto7]

34. Understood... I wasn't discussing download vulnerabilities.

The OP states that the FBI can secretly do things with your cell phone or whatever.

I am not disagreeing with the fact that the FBI or other governmental bodies can do such things... but I am saying anyone can do it... anyone can download the software and anyone can use it without the victims knowledge and it's old tech due to vulnerabilities in the hardware. Go after the hardware manufacturers if you want security.

Honestly, I would be more worried about China since they are the intruders I deal with almost daily, and in that lies the a realistic worry where availability of meta-data is concerned. If the holders of large quantities of meta-data were compromised, it could be a very nasty thing. That does not mean I am not concerned about the US doing the snooping, but I am worried at a different level in that meta-data is being spread around making it more hackable.

BTW-2, I have had my mail servers approached by the FBI and their corporate sidekicks and I did trace their antics to a Florida office. My servers were not rerouted without my knowledge, but on a personal level I am simply reporting that it is happening.

[Control-Z]

5. Seems they would have to treat

this ability to turn on the mic the same as wiretapping a hard line. With warrants. That ability to wiretap any of our phones, with good reason and a warrant, would apply. Same old law applied to new technology. Plus it sounds like the phone has to be "set up" in order to work. Not to say it hasn't already become a standard feature in cell/smart phones.

[ElsewheresDaughter]

8. no your phone doesn't have to be "set up"

[East Coast Pirate]

16. How do you connect to it without setting it up?

[Monkie]

18. your provider, or a government, can "push" "silent" updates to your phone

you would never know, same goes for your cable modem, it is pretty old news but relevant to the times.
many/most more modern "feature" phones cant even be switched off, they go into standby.
this is something the FBI is allowed to do, with a warrant of course.

[East Coast Pirate]

23. Would that take a warrent or is "probable cause" now good enough?

Is it case by case or can they do it with a batch of potential "terrorists"?

These are questions we need answers to.

[ThomThom]

15. this is beyond wire tapping this is bugging

no criminal or terrorist will have a phone now

[Control-Z]

35. Would that be bad

or good?

"no criminal or terrorist will have a phone now"

Either way, they will still have their guns.

[ThomThom]

36. just a fact

bad if your a cop or victim
inconvenient if your a terrorist or crook
good for disposable prepaid phones sales
just saying

[ElsewheresDaughter]

37. "roving bugging"

[ashling]

6. Just think what they'd get if they turned on Mith NcConnels phone

during campaign "strategy sessions" . . . or just about any damn time.

(only slightly tongue in cheek)

[ElsewheresDaughter]

7. I read about this in Wired years ago...remove your battery to prevent eavesdroppinhg

[quakerboy]

11. On an Iphone?

I am about 99% certain that Iphones can be used in this way, since i have fairly good indications that someone used mine to record conversations in my own home. And no Battery to take out.

One thought occurred after that incident, which was storing the phone in the freezer while not in use. Slightly inconvenient for use, but a bit more private.

[PuffedMica]

13. They sell RF shielded cell phone pouches

There are several to choose from.

http://www.ramayes.com/RF_Shielded_Pouch.htm#RF%20Shielded%20Pouch%20Cell%20Phone

[hobbit709]

20. All the more reason not to get one.

If it doesn't have a removable battery, I won't buy it.

[GeorgeGist]

14. Also prevents usefulness.

[quaker bill]

12. Given that the cellphone is in the room with you

not so much if it is plugged into the charger on your desk a half mile away..

[DCKit]

32. And you live alone and don't talk to yourself.

OMG, they're recording the dialog from the cartoons and TV show I watch on Netflix.

Someone (a real hero) on DU recently suggested that we'd be better off spending this cash on social programs. I'd have to agree.

[Recursion]

17. Glad we live in a country where that requires a warrant, aren't you? (nt)

[Orrex]

21. Do they charge you for roaming?

[kentauros]

29. No,

but the "opt out" fee would pay off a good chunk of the national debt.

[Orrex]

31. Well played!

[kentuck]

22. Smoke 'em if you got 'em...

[datasuspect]

24. i'd kinda like it if some government dick listened to me sing nonsense songs about testicles

and elephants while i'm on long drives out of state.

[kentuck]

25. We pay them good.

We hope everyone is happy.

[darkangel218]

26. Lmao!!

[cbdo2007]

27. Which is why real criminals use temprary cell-phones.....

doesn't anybody watch Breaking Bad? There's a reason Saul breaks his cell phones after every call, so nobody knows he has that number/phone for all his shady business.

[kentauros]

28. The answer to this problem is obvious:

[ElsewheresDaughter]

38. now that made me laugh..ty

[kentauros]

40. YOu're welcome :)

And if you look online, people have made cellphone versions. I can imagine being on a bus or train and having someone say to me, "Your shoe is ringing."

[dipsydoodle]

30. Fat lot of good it would do them with me

unless they like the sound of silence , occasionally broken by the sounds of cats, or listening to jazz etc.

[dotymed]

33. The tecnology that

BIG BROTHER uses against us is way more than we know...

The federal surveillance programs revealed in media reports are just "the tip of the iceberg," a House Democrat said Wednesday.

Rep. Loretta Sanchez (D-Calif.) said lawmakers learned "significantly more" about the spy programs at the National Security Agency (NSA) during a briefing on Tuesday with counterterrorism officials.

"What we learned in there," Sanchez said, "is significantly more than what is out in the media today."

Lawmakers are barred from revealing the classified information they receive in intelligence briefings, and Sanchez was careful not to specify what members might have learned about the NSA's work.

If they really wanted to stop organized crime, they should (and probably do, for blackmail) use this technology against "our" government. They are the largest criminal organization in existence.

[KurtNYC]

39. and THAT can hardly be a secret in China where all the phones are made

For decades they have been able to turn on the handset mic in landline phones. I had an answering machine in the 80s that would let you turn on the mic and listen remotely to whatever is going on in your house.