OMFG - Lady Di was not Anglo-Saxon -is this the end of the monarchy???

[malaise]

http://gma.yahoo.com/princess-dianas-hidden-ancestral-secret-revealed-170430408--abc-news-topstories.html
<snip>
Once upon a time, a woman from India named Eliza Kewark was shunned by her family because of her race.

The father of her child referred to her as the "housekeeper" and the "purported mother" of their daughter, Katharine.

Katharine was sent off without her mother to England, and that's where this story might have ended. But Katherine gave birth to Jane, who gave birth to Ruth, who had another Ruth, who had Frances, who had Diana.

As in Princess Diana.

Which means that Great Britain will, one day, have a monarch with Indian blood, and the Commonwealth will be led by a king with a clear genetic link to its most populous nation.

Eliza Kewark is Prince William's great-great-great-great-great-grandmother. She has long been described as Armenian, but Kewark was at least half-Indian, the genetic ancestry testing company BritainsDNA announced today.

[The Magistrate]

1. Hard To say, Ma'am, Since The Current Royals Are German....

They ditched the original name during the Great War. George the First arrived speaking no English.

[BainsBane]

2. Exactly. The Queen isn't Anglo-Saxon either

[malaise]

6. But but but

She white and pure although there were rumors about Victoria

[BainsBane]

7. Yeah, though they never liked Diana anyway.

It doesn't get much whiter than prince harry.

[malaise]

9. Well looks are deceiving

He ain't pure either

The truth is that all the energy wasted on race is one big joke - we're all mixed up.

[BainsBane]

12. Especially since there is no such thing as biological race

It's all about how people perceive others. Harry and William are perceived white, so they are white.

[pnwmom]

14. Since there is no such thing as biological race, how can there be such a thing

as Indian blood?

[idwiyo]

37. There isn't.

[BainsBane]

67. There isn't

not in a biological sense. Such concepts are culturally bound. A scientist might be able to determine if someone comes from that general geographic area, but not their race or nationality, since both are cultural inventions.

[flamingdem]

28. He's probably Celtic

Éireannach go brách !

[TexasProgresive]

34. Could it be that the Saxons

came from Saxony? Now where might that be?
And the current royal family's name was Hanover as in:"Hanover or Hannover [nb 1], on the river Leine, is the capital of the federal state of Lower Saxony (Niedersachsen)," Wikipedia
And those Angles-
Rome abandoned Britannia and the Germans took over only to succumb to Bill and his Normans.

[aquart]

49. Uh...those Angles and Saxons....German.

[malaise]

4. But my dear Sir the future Royals

are the issue - hopefully the end is nigh. You know my views on all Royalty.

[flamingdem]

29. Couldn't they work on the Dna and you know

.. remove that part?

[leveymg]

31. Actually the German origins of the Brit Royals goes back to George I (Georg Ludwig of Hanover)

George I (George Louis; German: Georg Ludwig; 28 May 1660 – 11 June 1727[1]) was King of Great Britain and Ireland from 1 August 1714 until his death, and ruler of the Duchy and Electorate of Brunswick-Lüneburg (Hanover) in the Holy Roman Empire from 1698.

George was born in Hanover, in what is now Germany, and inherited the titles and lands of the Duchy of Brunswick-Lüneburg from his father and uncles. A succession of European wars expanded his German domains during his lifetime, and in 1708 he was ratified as prince-elector of Hanover. At the age of 54, after the death of Queen Anne of Great Britain, George ascended the British throne as the first monarch of the House of Hanover. Although over fifty Roman Catholics bore closer blood relationships to Anne, the Act of Settlement 1701 prohibited Catholics from inheriting the British throne; George was Anne's closest living Protestant relative. In reaction, Jacobites attempted to depose George and replace him with Anne's Catholic half-brother, James Francis Edward Stuart, but their attempts failed. Wiki: George I

[MADem]

51. Prince Albert in a can, Victoria's husband, wasn't British either....

Prince Albert of Saxe-Coburg and Gotha (Francis Albert Augustus Charles Emmanuel;[1] later The Prince Consort; 26 August 1819 – 14 December 1861) was the husband of Queen Victoria of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland.

He was born in the Saxon duchy of Saxe-Coburg-Saalfeld to a family connected to many of Europe's ruling monarchs. At the age of 20 he married his first cousin, Queen Victoria, with whom he would ultimately have nine children. At first, Albert felt constrained by his position as consort, which did not confer any power or duties upon him. Over time he adopted many public causes, such as educational reform and a worldwide abolition of slavery, and took on the responsibilities of running the Queen's household, estates and office. He was heavily involved with the organisation of the Great Exhibition of 1851. Albert aided in the development of Britain's constitutional monarchy by persuading his wife to show less partisanship in her dealings with Parliament—although he actively disagreed with the interventionist foreign policy pursued during Lord Palmerston's tenure as Foreign Secretary.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert,_Prince_Consort

And much more recently, let's look at old "Foot in Mouth Phil"-- Prince Phillip. He's ....GREEK!

Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh KG KT PC OM GBE AC ONZ QSO GCL CC CMM PC(Can) AdC(P) (born Prince Philip of Greece and Denmark,[2] 10 June 1921)[fn 1] is the husband of Queen Elizabeth II. He is the Commonwealth realms' longest-serving consort, the oldest-ever spouse of a reigning British monarch, and the oldest-ever male member of the British royal family.

A member of the House of Schleswig-Holstein-Sonderburg-Glücksburg, Prince Philip was born in Greece into the Greek and Danish royal families, but his family was exiled from Greece when he was a child. After being educated in France, England, Germany and Scotland, he joined the British Royal Navy at the age of 18 in 1939. From July 1939, he began corresponding with the 13-year-old Princess Elizabeth (his third cousin through Queen Victoria and the elder daughter and heiress presumptive of King George VI) whom he had first met in 1934. During World War II he served with the Mediterranean and Pacific fleets.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prince_Philip,_Duke_of_Edinburgh

[MNBrewer]

68. Yes, actually, George I was born in Hannover

in the current German State of Lower Saxony. I guess that would make them "saxon".

[WinkyDink]

73. And Greek. And Danish. Mmmmmm.....Danish.

[LiberalEsto]

83. Cherry or cheese?

[CokeMachine]

94. Why not both??

[arely staircase]

84. Changed from Hanover to Windsor right?

nt

[The Magistrate]

85. A Bit More Elaborate, Sir

Saxce-Gotheberg, or some mouthful like that, anyway.

England's royals have not been English ( rooted in the original Anglo-Saxon monarchy ) for nigh on a thousand years.

The Plantagenets were Norman-French.

The Tudors were Welsh.

The Stuarts were Scotch, but originating in Brittany.

William and Mary of Orange were imported from Holland.

Queen Anne was as much of Scotland as Holland.

The current run was imported from Hannover after the death of Queen Anne, and has held on since.

Not an Englishman in the bunch....

[arely staircase]

87. ah, FROM Hannover

thanks .

[Hekate]

95. Thank you, Sir

That bunch gets around. A dash of Indian is nothing to them.

[Taverner]

86. I was gonna say, aren't they all Hapsburgs in the house of Windsor?

[muriel_volestrangler]

91. No, that's one line of European monarchy they're not connected with - they're Catholic

Plenty of Danes and Germans; the odd marriage to a Russian. But the monarch, or anyone high up in the line of succession, isn't allowed to marry a Catholic, let alone be one (this will be changed soon, along with the rule that says any male child inherits before a female sibling).

[hobbit709]

89. And the ones for several hundred years before that were Normans-i.e. Frenchified Vikings.

[magellan]

3. Wait'll the EDL and BNP hear about this!

They'll implode! Or explode. Or both.

[malaise]

5. That's a freaking DUzy

[eShirl]

8. Neither was William the Conqueror

[malaise]

10. Convince the racists

[Marr]

20. No kidding-- this story is about a thousand years late.

[flamingdem]

30. Bloody 'ell

'e were a Celt methinks

[loli phabay]

11. who cares, the people of the uk even are not anglo saxons but a mixture

I hate to also tell you that even the anglo saxons where a misture as well.

[malaise]

13. Clearly you don't get the joke n/t

[loli phabay]

15. well if its a joke should it not be funny, as i said who cares what his dna is

And i am a royalist.

[RobinA]

16. But...

the real question is, was Diana a Chinese spy? India is just south of China, separated only by a large mountain range. Seems to me the Indian relatives could have had some cross-mountain communication, even contact, with the Chinese, which means that Diana could have been related to someone who was related to someone who knew someone who was Chinese. And didn't she wear silk dresses sometimes? Silk can come from China, ya know.

[malaise]

18. Silk comes from India too

[freshwest]

21. And Japan, can't forget about the Land of the Rising Sun. Always facing at the USA. Eek!!!

Sorry, sometimes I get carried away.

So many paranoid fantasies, so little time.

[malaise]

22. Didn't they just come up with a new mass produced silk?

[csziggy]

35. GMO silk, I believe!

Transgenic Silkworms Spin Artificial Spider Silk

When it comes to high strength and elasticity for suture materials, bandages, and soft tissue repair, nothing surpasses natural spider silk. Unfortunately, it is not commercially viable to use spider silk; but if you could genetically alter silkworms, a whole new array of products using artificial spider silk would be possible.

http://research.nd.edu/breakthrough/

[malaise]

60. Thanks csziggy and freshwest

[freshwest]

45. They did indeed, but always had mass production of cocoons to get silk.

Although silk originated in China, the Japanese have had a long history with it:

http://factsanddetails.com/japan.php?itemid=745&

They keep on thinking up new things.

[Nye Bevan]

17. Meh. Somehow they will muddle through this terrible crisis.

It's not like the British Monarchy has always been completely smooth sailing.

[DevonRex]

19. Hey, the Welsh want the bloody fucking Prince to give up the title, too.

&feature=youtube_gdata_player

He ain't a bit Welsh. Dammit.

[malaise]

23. Ha

[freshwest]

25. Hey, speak English! This is Amurika!

[DevonRex]

41. Hey, just wait until I learn to count at you

In Welsh. Something about adding twenties

[Warpy]

24. Good, gives the German monarchy a little class

which, after Prince Charles and his antics and ridiculous pronouncements on everything from architecture to the efficacy of homeopathy (he thinks it works) they desperately needed.

Unless a person in the UK is an analog of our lovely people in the Klan, I think this news will be welcomed with a big yawn.

[kestrel91316]

26. THAT explains why she was so pretty............

European nobility aren't exactly known for their physical attractiveness.

I'm descended from all sorts of them, and they passed on some pretty funky looks. Some of those old portraits you see show noses and chins that would make any normal person weep. I blame them for my overly prominent but bony nose.

[derby378]

27. Uh, guys...?

I think the reason the British have been harping on the bloodline of the royal family is not to prove that they're Angles or Saxons or Normans or Germans or whatever, but merely to prove that they are direct descendants of David. As in ancient Israel. It's a big thing with them. The Japanese have the same obsession with blood lineage in their emperors, too.

[malaise]

32. I hear you

[starroute]

44. Nobody has ever been able to prove descent from the kings of Israel

Or ever from anybody at all in the Roman Empire. I messed around with medieval genealogy at one point, and a lot of pedigrees go back to Charlemagne and Alfred the Great, and past them to a handful of barbarian invaders with funny names -- and there it stops short.

As I recall, the British monarchy does claim descent from Mohammed -- I think by way of some Spanish princess who married one of the medieval kings. And that's about as good as it gets. Europe really doesn't have much of a documented history, not compared to most of the rest of the world.

[MattBaggins]

33. End of the Monarchy? One can always hope.

[Nye Bevan]

36. The Monarchy enjoys overwhelming public support in the UK (nt)

[MattBaggins]

39. So fucking what?

People love fucking McDonalds. That food sucks.

People love Michael Jackson. Yeah.

People overwhelmingly supported the silly war with Iraq. It was stupid.

Here is a simple idea. I have a right to my opinion as well, and the monarchy is dumb.

[Nye Bevan]

40. Eloquent, and persuasive. (nt)

[MattBaggins]

43. As eloquent and persuasive

as the tired old argument of, "but everybody likes it".

Boring at best.

[loli phabay]

58. if your not a british subject then you dont really get a say. so why care if the brits have a

Monarchy, for the record i am a royalist.

[MattBaggins]

63. Because this is an American political

discussion board.

Someone posts some news or an opinion and we talk about it.

If I shouldn't have an opinion on the Monarchy because I am an American, then why would any foreigners be on DU at all?

[loli phabay]

65. probuably because american policies effect othwr countries, whereas the monarchy does not

Effect you. You are allowed an opinion just dont be shocked if the people who actually live in yhe other country dont care what it is.

[MattBaggins]

66. Britain is a mighty powerful nation as well

and contrary to prevailing belief, the Monarchy does in fact wield power which can affect the entire world.

Monarchy and House of Lords, get rid of them both.

[loli phabay]

69. the queen has some power but parliament is the power, house of lords is part of the check

And balances, as i said its the british who get to choose regardless of what you think and the system has worked for decades.

[MattBaggins]

75. And America gets to choose regardless of what you think

Although I feel that's a pretty dumb thing to say on a POLITICAL DISCUSSION board.

But you have a nice day anyway.

[malaise]

77. Hmmmmmmmmmmm that should be

affect

[loli phabay]

81. ah the autocorrect police are on scene

[malaise]

76. That should leave a mark

[MattBaggins]

78. Don't really want to "leave a mark"

I just find that every time someone posts that they don't support Monarchies people post the tired arguments of "popular" and "Americans are not allowed to have an opinion".

I really appreciate all the people around the world that stand with us Democrats. I do the same for them, and for me that includes standing with British Republicans.

Yes alerters, I said I stand with the Republicans.

[malaise]

80. I'm anti-royal everywhere n/t

[idwiyo]

48. Nah, they are good for tourism and provide us with countless hours of entertainment.

I bet they are going to be even more popular now. Maybe not all of them but William definitely will be.

Regardless, LEAVE OUR MONARCHY ALONE!

[LittleBlue]

53. Exactly

The UK doesn't have a Hollywood, no Kardashians, no Jersey Shore. What would fill the tabloids without the royal family?

[malaise]

56. Not to mention those one billion plus Indians

[malaise]

61. That's my hope for the planet

We cannot have monarchies and democracies - either we're equal or we're not

[idwiyo]

38. Explains why she was the only good looking one in entire royal family.

[Iggo]

46. Ba-zamm!!!

He-yah!

[loli phabay]

59. erm, you ever seen pics of the queen when she was younger, wow

[muriel_volestrangler]

62. For that matter, Philip was reckoned good looking when he still had his hair

[loli phabay]

64. yup, people forget the prince is in his nineties now.

[pipi_k]

100. Oh, I dunno...

I think Elizabeth II was quite attractive when she was younger...

Or, at least not an ugly troll anyway...

[FarCenter]

42. I thought that William the Conqueror put an end to Anglo Saxon royalty

Weren't they all Normans after that until the Germans took over?

[Bad Thoughts]

47. Will UK have its own version of birthers? eom

[Hekate]

50. So many peoples have lived in England, sometimes conquered it, that not an eyebrow will be raised

It can be traced in the words of the English language itself: rich, multifaceted, of many origins, flexible, embracing of new words.

In no particular order, and with some repetition:

Britons
Picts
Celts
Gaels
Scotii
Angles
Saxons
Jutes
Romans
Norsemen
Vikings
Normans
French

It can be traced in the names of kings, as well. King Canute is a Latinized form of Knute. There's not much continuity of individual family among the Royals, going back hundreds and hundreds of years; if you are looking for some unbroken line of succession it ain't there. As Terry Pratchett observes in one of his novels: "Among royalty, assassination IS death by natural causes." House of This, House of That: the names change, the throne and land are what are important. Princesses were swapped around ("their hand given in marriage&quot for treaty purposes and to consolidate tracts of land and wealth, all over Europe and into Russia. Second and third sons likewise. Bastardy was pretty common (see Shakespeare). As long as legitimate and illegitimate sons didn't compete for a crown with swords, it could be managed. The custom of letters being addressed as My Dear Cousin from a Royal in one country to a Royal in another was fairly literal after awhile.

I don't think this particular revelation as being anything staggering -- just interesting.

I keep being called away from finishing this post, so perhaps someone else has already said all this.

[malaise]

54. Very nice post

Thanks

I find it hilarious that it even matters

[Hekate]

92. What's also hilarious is that some Americans these days seem to think "white" = "Anglo Saxon"...

... = WASP.

I was sitting in a subcommittee of the Affirmative Action Commission (sigh, a long time ago, when it still existed) when a young Latino member referred to those of us present as WASPs. I laughed aloud, and said, "None, by definition!" White Anglo Saxon Protestants? Two present were Irish, two Jewish, and I can't remember the other one, maybe Italian? The acronym has lost its meaning somewhere along the way. Anyway, nothing against the young man -- I like him; he was just young and full of fire, and has gone on to do good work in the community.

I don't think it matters to the Royals at all. Kate's parents are self-made wealthy, and the nobility have been marrying money for well over a century, and probably forever. I'm reading a book called "Lady Almina and the Real Downton Abbey" by the current Lady Carnarvon.

Lady Almina was the daughter of the exceedingly wealthy industrialist Alfred de Rothschild and his mistress. "Uncle Alfred" bestowed a fabulous dowry on his "god-daughter," which enabled her to marry the very cash-poor Earl of Carnarvon who was then able to preserve the family estate. Everyone was happy -- Rothschild got a child into the British nobility, Carnarvon was able to keep his estate intact (along with the many jobs he provided in the local economy), and best of all the young couple actually loved each other (not exactly a given in such financially-fraught transactions).

[malaise]

93. My knowledge of the Carnarvons is all related to cricket

and there were links to apartheid South Africa

[Hekate]

98. Lady Almina's Earl was an early and enthusiastic scholar/archaeologist of ancient Egypt

A chunk of her money was used to finance extensive trips to Egypt, and his was the party that discovered Tutankhamen's tomb.

The book is a fun read -- it's all Edwardian (like the PBS series), a transitional era.

[pipi_k]

101. This...

I don't think it matters to the Royals at all. Kate's parents are self-made wealthy, and the nobility have been marrying money for well over a century...

Read a book a month or two ago on that very subject...how American heiresses during the 1800s and after would marry British nobility in a sort of deal that would benefit both parties.

The nearly impoverished Lord or Earl or whatever would get access to his bride's fortune, and the bride would get herself a title.

[Spitfire of ATJ]

52. The world is a mutt....

And after this, it's gonna roll in your bed.

[a la izquierda]

97. My butthole dog did that yesterday.

I wanted to punch him (I did no such thing, but I wanted to).

[Spitfire of ATJ]

99. Wouldn't be so bad if they didn't grin at you because it was so much fun.

[Are_grits_groceries]

55. Queen Victoria and her 9 children really mixed up European royalty:

Victoria Adelaide Mary Louise: b.1840, d. 1901
Was given the title Princess Royal because she was the eldest daughter. She married Frederick (Fritz) of Prussia, 1858 and was given the additional title of Empress of Germany.
Edward Albert: b. 1841, d.1910.
Edward was born on 9 November 1841 as the Duke of Cornwall and the Duke of Rothesay. He became the Prince of Wales a month later because he was next in line to the throne. He married Princess Alexandra of Denmark in 1863. Edward succeeded the British Throne as King Edward VII when Queen Victoria died and reigned until his death on 6th May 1910.
Alice Maud Mary: b. 1843, d. 1878
After marrying married Prince Louis of Hesse-Darmstadt in 1862, Alice was given the additional title of Grand Duchess of Hesse-Darmstadt.
Alfred Ernest Albert: b. 1844, d.1900
Was given the title of Duke of Edinburgh and Saxe-Coburg-Gotha. He married Princess Marie of Russia in 1874. He was the first member of the Royal family to visit Australia.
Helena Augusta Victoria: b.1846, d.1923
After marring Prince Christian of Schleswig-Holstein she was given the the additional title of Princess Helena of Schleswig-Holstein.
Louise Caroline Alberta: b.1848, d.1939
After marrying Marquess of Lorne in 1871, was given the the additional title of Dowager Duchess of Argyll
Arthur William Patrick Albert: b.1850, d.1942
Known as Duke of Connaught. He married Princess Louise of Prussia
Leopold George Duncan Albert: b.1853, d.1884
Knon as Duke of Albany. He married Princess Helena of Waldeck-Pyrmont.
Beatrice Mary Victoria Feodore: b. 1856, d. 1944
After marrying Prince Henry of Battenberg she was given the additional title of Princess Beatrice of Battenberg.
The Royal Family today is related to many European monarchies because of the marriages of Queen Victoria's children. Eight of Victoria's children sat on the thrones of Europe, those of Great Britain, Prussia, Greece, Romania, Russia, Norway, Sweden and Spain.

Queen Victoria was survived by 6 children, 40 grandchildren and 37 great-grandchildren, including four future sovereigns of England: Edward VII, George V, Edward VIII and George VI.
http://homeworkhelp.stjohnssevenoaks.com/victorians/victoriaschildren.html

I know somebody keeps up with how people are related. There was so much intermarriage between cousins that if they are royalty, they are royal mutts.

[malaise]

103. That is some history there

Thanks sis

[Enthusiast]

57. Lady Di might well have had 3% neanderthal genes. Oh, no!

She was tainted!

The most recent discoveries in paleogenetics tell us that the human race, Homo Sapiens, had a long history of cross breeding with several archaic human types, both in and out of Africa.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2213219/Neanderthals-bred-modern-humans-Europe-recently-37-000-years-ago.html

[treestar]

70. Let's have a look at Kate's ancestry too!

That brings more new blood into the line!

Who knows what is to be found there?

[WinkyDink]

74. Let's not. I find the Middletons to be loathsome social climbers, and I do not exclude Catherine.

[MattBaggins]

79. Do you really mean that?

Please tell me that was tongue in cheek.

[WinkyDink]

106. Well, I kind of do about mere et pere. And Kate is a wee too WAG in her fashion sense for me. But I

am otherwise an inveterate Anglophile, and hope to see King Charles III in my lifetime!

[WinkyDink]

71. That's hardly NOT being "Anglo-Saxon" in the main.

[SoCalDem]

72. Imagine if DNA-testing had always been available to Royals..

There have probably been many royals with "sketchy" lineage

Now., what about Harry's "real" Dad.

[malaise]

104. Guess that one's going to the grave

[tularetom]

82. More than coincidence?

For those who remember B. Kliban cartoons

[Motown_Johnny]

88. 0.78125%

Assuming everyone in the bloodline is 100% Anglo-Saxon other than Katharine's mother, who I assume was full blooded Indian. Of course Her mother might have already been mixed race which would lower the percentage even more.


Katharine 50% Indian
Jane 25%
Ruth 12.5%
Ruth 6.25%
Frances 3.125%
Diana 1.5625%

Diana's Children 0.78125%

[cloudbase]

90. Don't forget the Jewish roots.

Eliza Kewark was the daughter of Murray Kewark.

[MrScorpio]

96. What's the point of having an empire if you can't have sex the people that you're colonizing?

Too bad that dirty little secret got out.

[intaglio]

102. And African ancestry, (because we all do)

She will also have had Neanderthal genes, French ancestors - Good Grief there may even be Scots somewhere in the background - the Empire would never stand for that, by Jove.

Sorry, underwhelmed by this essentially racist story.

[yawnmaster]

105. When has being anglo-saxon been a requirement?? eom