I supported and defended the ACA. Sucker that I was.

[cali]

The Administration has given in to big business and given them a buy year. Individuals? Not so much. They'll be forced to buy lousy insurance that further enriches insurance companies. And c'mon, with their record, why wouldn't it be reasonable to assume that a heck of a lot of people are going to stuck with lousy coverage? And how is the government possibly going to implement effective oversight to ensure that doesn't happen. What will they do about it? Sue? How long will that take?

Does anyone believe that some businesses won't dump health insurance altogether, forcing employees onto the exchanges and into the welcoming arms of insurance companies?

The administration had frickin' years to fix whatever was wrong with the employer mandate. Why didn't they?

[AnotherMcIntosh]

1. Before the vote, I wondered how many politicians and parties related to them became stockholders

in health insurance companies.

I suspect that they didn't push us all into this for free.

[gcomeau]

2. The ACA was far from ideal...

...but the idea that it was worse than not implementing it is ludicrous.

California and Montana have both progressed to the point where the quotes for plans on their exchanges are firming up and they're both showing that costs of those plans are lower.

http://medcitynews.com/2013/06/montana-average-price-of-health-insurance-lower-with-obamacare/

"Lindeen noted that many had expected the policies to be more expensive, because, under the law, they must offer a set of "essential health benefits" and insurers cannot turn away or charge more for unhealthy people.

However, the analysis shows that the products sold on the marketplace will cover more services and more people, yet still cost less than policies sold without ACA rules, she said.

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/27/opinion/krugman-the-obamacare-shock.html?_r=0

Well, the California bids are in — that is, insurers have submitted the prices at which they are willing to offer coverage on the state’s newly created Obamacare exchange. And the prices, it turns out, are surprisingly low. A handful of healthy people may find themselves paying more for coverage, but it looks as if Obamacare’s first year in California is going to be an overwhelmingly positive experience.

"Does anyone believe that some businesses won't dump health insurance altogether, forcing employees onto the exchanges and into the welcoming arms of insurance companies? "

You do realize that businesses get that insurance for their employees FROM INSURANCE COMPANIES TOO... right? You're "in the welcoming arms of the insurance companies" either way so what are you talking about???

[cali]

3. why, yes. yes I do. You do realize that businesses can save a lot

money by dropping health insurance for employees altogether and dumping them on the exchanges, right?

So that's what I'm talking about. Doesn't take a genius to figure that out. duh.

[gcomeau]

12. Still trying to figure out what you think the big problem is...

...that didn't already exist before.

[merrily]

16. For one thing, employers are reducing full time employees and

hiring part timers instead.

For another thing, health insurance costs started going up before ACA was even passed, in anticpation of ACA. So, the fact that ACA finally makes those costs somewhat lower is an illusory improvement.

[Sheldon Cooper]

24. Yep. My company has over 100 employees, and we are already planning to hire only part-timers

when attrition occurs. Current employees are union so they are protected, but any new ones will be hosed.

[NutmegYankee]

23. What stopped companies from just dropping the insurance before?

It's not like most give two shits about their slaves employees.

[Sheldon Cooper]

25. Unions.

[cali]

31. optics, in part. they didn't have the exchange to dump them on.

[Pretzel_Warrior]

5. and some companies have horrible risk pools and bad negotiating leverage

so it is dumb to assume thousands of HR managers and benefits administrators who only do this once a year are making sound decisions about coverage compared with a more consolidated statewide POOL of insurance customers on exchanges.

[leftstreet]

7. You make a good case for eliminating Medicare

Talk about a horrible risk pool

[progressoid]

4. Why didn't they?

That's rhetorical right?

[99th_Monkey]

6. Hey, U can't say THAT, STFU... because that's what those crazy Tea Party freaks are saying!!

and have been for awhile now.

[MineralMan]

8. An old etching that is apropos.

[rhett o rick]

10. Is that a centrist carrying water for the 1% Oligarchs? nm

[Hydra]

15. Why, yes it is!

Should we offer him a mirror?

[Ruby the Liberal]

9. Well, if it helps, it does pop the air out of GOP 2014 talking points

I know, it isn't much - but it is something. The only other good I see is that it may force us to single payer.

Trying to find a silver lining here...

[onethatcares]

11. I would have liked to see

single payer at the outset of negotiations.

This leading from behind is driving me nutz.

I also don't approve of the drone killings, but I'm probably just one of many.

[merrily]

18. "Trying to find a silver lining here..."

Why?

Wouldn't trying to find the reality of the situation be a more productive exercise?

[Ruby the Liberal]

19. I believe 2014 midterms ARE the reality of the situation, actually.

Another reality is that employer mandates now don't start until 2015 - so now what? What do you propose we do?

[NaturalHigh]

13. The ACA, in my opinion, was bought and paid for...

by the insurance industry. Big money corrupts politics once again.

[Safetykitten]

14. Maybe some here can opine on the "Pre-existing" thing. Apparently I cannot read.

[zeemike]

17. I don't know why, but I keep thinking of Alice in Wonderland..

How doth the little cooperation
Improve his shining tail,
And pour the waters of the deNile
On every golden scale!

How cheerfully he seems to grin
,How neatly spreads his claws,
And welcomes little fishes in
With gently smiling jaws!

[rhett o rick]

20. I knew at Rick Warren that I had been had. Obama pretended to be progressive but with Mr. Warren

he gave us the bird. With Rahm Emanuel he spit in our faces. He no longer had a need for us. Bernanke, Clapper, Mueller, and many, many Republicans later, we see what a mess the country is in. The conservatives rule. I am betting the coup de grace will be the pardons of Bush and Cheney.

And if you think we have a chance in 2016, you are wrong. The Oligarchs will decide on both nominees. Probably Christie vs. Clinton, or Christie vs. Romney.

[Honeycombe8]

26. If you thought Obama was progressive, you were wearing rose colored glasses. I knew he was moderate.

He never made any bones about that. He was clearly moderate.

I suspect you actually supported someone else and then ultimately voted for Obama, so that you weren't really familiar with him. He was always in favor of, say, the Afghanistan War, some other wars, a strong defense, health care reform (which was passed) (he at one pt liked the public option, then he didn't), etc.

He is the kind of Democrat who gets elected to high office: a moderate. Progressives don't get elected. I guess because they don't appeal to the main chunk of voters: the ones in the middle.

[rhett o rick]

28. He wanted single payer health care, he wanted to shut down the Patriot Act, he wanted to

put the bankers in their place, etc. That's not a moderate. And he isnt a moderate today. He only appoints Republicans, hard right Republicans. He isnt a moderate. He loves the Patriot Act, he loves Wall Street, he hates medical marijuana users, he loves domestic spying. He is not a moderate.

[Honeycombe8]

29. That was early on, and only for a few things. He was clearly moderate.

You need to distinguish between Obama and the DOJ, also. He has influence, but it is separate and is charged with its own duties and responsibilities. The Prez is not supposed to run the DOJ.

He is a lot like Clinton, only believes in social programs more.

I thought from the beginning he was moderate. Now, he's become more than moderate in some areas. He's become to the right, or centrist. But he still likes social programs more than the Clintons.

[rhett o rick]

30. He has supported social programs, but his stands on the Patriot Act and domestic spying are hard

right. And it has nothing to do with the DoJ. He appointed Clapper and Mueller. He also appointed Tim Geitner, Lawrence Summers, Ben Bernanke, William M. Daley, Jeff Immelt, Alan Simpson, Dave Cote, Jeb Bush, Robert Gates, Gen Stanley McChrystal, Jacob Lew, Jeremiah Norton, Gen Petraeus, John Brennen, Chuck Hegal, Michael Taylor, James Comey. They are all corporitist Republicans.
That's not moderate. He is not moderate.

[ProSense]

21. Howard Dean: Mandate Delay Begins Shift To Government-Financed Health Care System

Howard Dean: Mandate Delay Begins Shift To Government-Financed Health Care System
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023162211

[cali]

32. Maybe so, but it's going to be an awfully painful shift.

[Honeycombe8]

22. Some posters in DU have been complaining about the effect the ACA will have on small bus.

So there should be some happy DU posters. Where are they?

[Safetykitten]

27. The ACA was a terrible thing to do. We will have insurance companies tied to us for the rest of our

lives.