If Martin and Zimmerman had passed each other on their evening stroll...

[MrScorpio]

And both had continued to go about their own business, then there would have never been any reason to have a struggle that would have ended in the death of one or the other.

Except that one of them wasn't out there to mind his own business that night.

Because of that, the other person was made a victim... A dead victim.

[noiretextatique]

1. and what if Martin somehow managed to get the gun and kill Zimmerman

would some people be calling him "a hero who deserves a medal?" would the rw noise machine be concerned about Martin getting a fair trial? would any of the faux commentators be supporting Martin? or gun "enthusiasts?" NO.

[uponit7771]

2. +1

[MrScorpio]

3. We both know the answer to that question nt

[Captain Stern]

5. That's an interesting hypothetical scenario

I think that if Martin had gotten Zimmerman's gun and killed him with it during their struggle the following would have happened:

1) The police would have done a far more thorough investigation than they did.
2) It wouldn't have taken anywhere near 46 days to arrest Martin.
3) Martin would have been charged with Manslaughter.
4) Martin would have been found 'not guilty' by reason of self-defense (based mainly on his testimony that a creepy guy that had been following him, attacked him)

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

6. You know it!!

[BainsBane]

26. Martin would be on death row by now

charged with first degree murder.

[denverbill]

7. Under Florida law, if Martin had a gun, he could have shot Zimmerman instead of hitting him.

He had a right to 'stand his ground' and shoot if he felt threatened. Somebody following you around in the dark, first in a car, then on foot, would definitely threaten me.

[justanaverageguy]

8. not If I were on the jury....

Before you convince me that you felt that you were in so much fear of your life that you had no choice but to shoot someone you would have to come at me with more than "well it was dark and he was following me." It's not a question of if you felt threaten but rather was your fear and reaction reasonable under the circumstances.

I can reasonably feel some level of threat if an 80 year old grandma is hitting me with her purse, but pulling out a .45 and blowing her brains out is not a reasonable reaction. By the same token, shooting someone for simply following you may be a reasonable reason to feel some threat, but shooting them for following you is not a reasonable reaction.

[Lizzie Poppet]

10. Technically, no (he was a minor: illegal to carry), but I agree with your main point.

I consider Zimmerman's actions to be such that Martin would have had reason to fear for his safety (a fear that proved tragically justified). In his place, I wouldn't have immediately opened fire as Zimmerman finally approached...but I'd have been prepared to draw and fire. I would NOT be okay with allowing someone who'd been following me around like that getting within arm's reach.

[ManiacJoe]

20. Just "being followed" does not meet the legal requirements

for lethal self-defense in any jurisdiction regardless of how scared you may be.

[displacedtexan]

11. We'd still have GZ's creepy 911 call crap.

"There's a suspicious guy, looks like he's on drugs or sumpin'."

tHat's never going away, fortunately.

[gollygee]

16. +1

I had not heard that anyone was calling Zimmerman a hero who needs a medal! How disgusting is that?

[noiretextatique]

17. some asshole on faux new TODAY...there is a thread here about it

"the poor guy was jus trying to defend himself" i believe that's the title of the thread.

[JohnnyLib2]

4. So true, and so sad.

[Hubert Flottz]

9. I think Zimmerman was and probably still is, a simmering psychopath.

Probably always bailed out of trouble by his father the judge. He just needed his chance to turn into the role of that player he played on the night he attacked and killed that child. Because a boy who is just a few days past being a 15 year old, is still a child. Even the Army thinks boys that age are too young to be sent off to be slaughtered "for the cause."

Zimmerman has a Barney Fife Complex and he was just silly and evil enough to want to try out his weapon and "Training" on the first unlucky guy or child, that fit the sight picture he'd formed in his Ted Bundy like mind.

Zimmerman needs to be locked up for a very long time in super max housing, where he poses no threat to society or his sad ass self.

I can't believe the state never went for murder one, but then I remember that Zimmy's dad, still probably had some political pull.

[suzanner]

13. I agree. Things don't add up.

First, back when networks covered the incident, they had maps and Zim's own story that he circled around to intercept Martin. Second, the phone call Martin was having doesn't add up to the confrontation Zim claims took place. Third, if Martin was on top, how was it that Zim got not a drop of Martin's blood on himself? Fourth, the injuries to Zim were minor and my gut tells me self-inflicted after the fact. Fifth, someone who has taken classes and is a wanna-be cop in his own mind would NOT be calling for help. Sixth, he was told by the police not to leave his car but he did anyway. I could go on and on. Zim is guilty of pre-meditated murder IMO, from the moment he stepped out of his car. He'd been hoping for such an incident for months.
PS. I haven't followed closely at all, but it sounds like the prosecution was very weak. Why??

[noiretextatique]

15. the only people who zimmerman's story makes any sense to

are racists who believe black males are "punks" and "suspicious." zimmermna's story is little more than an appeal to racism.

[Hubert Flottz]

24. You raise some good points.

I haven't followed the trial on TV either, but from the bits and pieces I have seen, I have to agree that the prosecution's case was weak. The "why" has me stumped too.

To let Zimmerman off the hook, could spark a nasty nationwide protest, that the media has helped to set the stage for. Boys and Girls, the media could really make some dough covering America's cities on fire, with blood running in the streets again, like in the 60s. Trouble is, in today's America, there'd be no money to rebuild those cities. No High Court willing to defend anyone's civil rights.

[world wide wally]

12. As I said since day one...

It was Trayvon Martin who was standing his ground if anyone.
Zimmerman's ground was his car.

[NightWatcher]

14. Trayvon just wanted to go get Skittles and tea

Zimmy was packing a gun and a hard on to get one of "those assholes...they always get away".

[Renew Deal]

18. I think that's the point

If Zimmerman didn't confront Martin, this wouldn't have happened. Maybe the cops would have overreacted

[noiretextatique]

21. true...martin might have been doomed anyway

if the cops had showed up before zimmerman shot him, they might have shot him.

[HipChick]

19. Zimmerman molested a woman for 10 years, and proud of his racist family

Assaulted a police officer, and his ex-GF...he belongs in jail..sees how fares being a bully with some prison justice

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/07/16/george-zimmerman_n_1676729.html

[suzanner]

22. Also, lied to the court about his income/net worth

if you recall.

[HipChick]

23. Both him and family seem to have a problem with the truth..

[Judi Lynn]

25. Zimmerman wouldn't have had the guts to threaten him on an equal to equal basis.

He had to call his posse first, after feeding them the great lie about the "stranger" in the neighborhood, for psychological fuel to power him as he dragged his sorry ass forward to accost the very young man.

The knowledge he had played the cops to arrive quickly gave him assurance he wouldn't be there along long, and he could always lie his ass off in his explanation for calling them, in case he hadn't been able to kill the human being first.

[DonCoquixote]

27. I'll see that and raise you one

A lot of what drives GUN sales is the idea that a scared person can shoot those scary minorities. Many people buy them because they want to intimidate, and they want to intimidate because they are a bunch of scared little boys.

Again I say, if Zimmerman walks, expect 2014 and 2016 to be bloody, as the powers that be know that the threat of bullets will keep people home,especially if the timing is right.