If there was no "Stand your ground" law, would there be any doubt as to Zimmerman's guilt?

[hedgehog]

[onehandle]

1. If there was no Gun Culture, would Trayvon Martin be alive?

[ksoze]

2. SYG not part of this trial

Not being used as a defense.

[Hoyt]

3. It really is part of the trial. Many are still under impression that you buy a gun and can

get/shoot the guy who kicks sand in your face or scares you.

[ksoze]

4. I meant it is not being used as a defense in this trial

[premium]

5. SYG is not part of the trial. nt.

[Hoyt]

8. Yes it is, you are just too myopic to see it.

[premium]

10. It doesn't matter how many times you say it is Hoyt,

it doesn't change the fact that SYG is not part of the trial.

[galileoreloaded]

23. they are or you are?

that's a pretty out there statement.

[moondust]

6. SYG is lurking in the background even if not technically used.

It's about relaxing gun laws, as many states have been doing. I think a lot of gun nuts want the "freedom" to carry their guns around everywhere and shoot people they don't like who "threaten" them. An acquittal in this case would be a signal that it's okay to go ahead and shoot 'em up if you feel "threatened."

[Hoyt]

9. Exactly. And gunners are too myopic to see it, or they just don't want the to be bound by laws

that make them responsible for the use of their guns.

I swear, I think most are concerned they might end up like Zimmerman someday -- after making a mistake and killing an unarmed teen -- and want every possible way to get out of legal responsibility.

[Bake]

22. And your bias is showing. Big surprise there!

SYG not in play. This is simple self defense. The media has tried to make this about SYG but its not.

Bake

[HolyMoley]

7. Irrelevant.

As others have already pointed out, SYG isn't being used as a defense.

SYG laws state that one does not have a duty or obligation to retreat if confronted or faced with a potentially dangerous or threatening situation outside of ones home.

It's an extension of castle laws/castle doctrine that states one has no duty or obligation to retreat or withdraw from ones home if confronted or faced with a potentially dangerous or threatening situation.

Previously to some states enacting castle doctrine laws, if someone was breaking into your home in the middle of the night, and you had an accessible or nearby means of escape, you were required to withdraw.
Shooting, confronting the individual(s) would only be acceptable as a last resort.

Regardless of SYG (and the castle doctrine), the right to self defense is never denied, if that person has a reasonable belief that their life or safety is in immediate danger.

There dozens of states that don't have SYG laws, yet there are daily occurrences where armed
citizens have legally defended themselves (sometimes inflicting fatalities), outside the home, and charges were never brought forward.

[Hoyt]

19. Not when it comes to bigots and guns, because they have no legitimate facts.

Where I grew up, this fucker used to run for public office, he claimed he wasn't a racist, but the facts are/were obvious (he also was finally convicted of bombing a black church in Alabama).

[premium]

18. That's quite the rant there Hoyt,

too bad none of it is true.

[HolyMoley]

21. Whaaa?

[Lizzie Poppet]

17. Nor, in some cases, does logic or reason.

But it's both entertaining and illuminating to see it used as yet another excuse to spew smug, broad-brushed vitriol at millions of people and indulge in yet another outburst of bullshit amateur psychoanalysis.

Good times...

[Nye Bevan]

14. You have always been able to claim self-defense, irrespective of SYG.

Which is exactly what Zimmerman is doing here.

So yes.

[cthulu2016]

24. You started off right, then got wrong

SYG has nothing to do with this trial

*true*

Z already waived it

*false*

What was waived was the right to seek a pre-trial dismissal based on SYG. SYG, however, remains the governing law in the trial, and could not possibly be waived by anyone. It is enmeshed in the legal definition f self-defense in the Florida code.

But since there is no circumstance in the case relevant to SYG it's a non-issue.

[jmg257]

16. Even with SYG, there should be no question of Zimmerman's culpability.

The 2 aren't really related.

He initiated a confrontation where he shot an innocent & unarmed kid...certainly he is guilty of that, whether he had a duty to try to retreat, or not.

[Ikonoklast]

26. Go away.

Really, just...go away.

[Just Saying]

31. That didn't take long.

Good riddance!

[cthulu2016]

20. SYG plays no role in this case so the question makes no sense

[Bay Boy]

27. Stand Your Ground....just curious has the term been used at all during this trial?

I don't recall hearing it said by either side, but I haven't watched gavel to gavel.

[GiaGiovanni]

28. There would still be doubt because this isn't a Stand Your Ground case

It's a self defense case.

Zimmerman's defense team went with a straight self-defense case that required nothing from the Stand Your Ground law. You could transplant the Zimmerman case to California and it would still be the same, even though we are, thank God, not a Stand Your Ground state.

Zimmerman claims that Trayvon attacked him, went after him with deadly (MMA) force & tried to grab his gun. Under these conditions (if true), Zimmerman would have been in reasonable fear for his life and was justified in using deadly force. The job of the prosecution was to prove that Zimmerman was not acting in self defense but with malice aforethought.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

32. Zimmerman and his lying defense team couldn't get him acquitted based on Stand Your Ground

They had to pursue the alternative strategy: self defense. It's so full of shit!!!!!

[Just Saying]

33. People just don't get that it's not about whether or not

Zimmerman ended up using SYG. It's about the attitude laws like that give people. It makes folks like Zimmerman think its okay to kill people. We shouldn't be encouraging people to take the law into their own hands.