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shraby

(21,946 posts)
Sat Feb 18, 2012, 10:22 AM Feb 2012

What the battle over birth control is really about

A very good diary examining the question on dailykos. Well worth the read. I saw it last night and saved it for this morning so more would see it.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/02/17/1065740/-What-the-battle-over-birth-control-is-really-about?via=siderec

(snip)
Robinson argues that biology condemned women to a role organized around childbearing, which allowed men to benefit, including establishing dominance in many areas. As she writes

They got full economic and social control over our bodies, our labor, our affections, and our futures. They got to make the rules, name the gods we would worship, and dictate the terms we would live under. In most cultures, they had the right to sex on demand within the marriage, and also to break their marriage vows with impunity — a luxury that would get women banished or killed. As long as pregnancy remained the defining fact of our lives, they got to run the whole show. The world was their party, and they had a fabulous time.
As I read these words I thought of three Ks - not as applied to American culture, but to the latter part of the first half of the last century in Germany: for the Nazis, the role of women was defined as Kinder, Kirche, Kuche - kids, church and kitchen. For too many patriarchal males today, that phraseology still seems to represent their thinking.
Safe and effective contraception - the IUD as well as the pill, for example - meant that women were no longer defined by their biology:

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What the battle over birth control is really about (Original Post) shraby Feb 2012 OP
I'm kicking this so it won't fall off the page. shraby Feb 2012 #1
K&R'd. snot Feb 2012 #2
K&R!!! yellerpup Feb 2012 #3
k&r greendog Feb 2012 #4
K & R! lonestarnot Feb 2012 #5
I think there is a component of racism too. These rich white guys don't want to become a minority peacebird Feb 2012 #6
k&r northoftheborder Feb 2012 #7
kickski Snarkoleptic Feb 2012 #8
K & R !!! WillyT Feb 2012 #9
The good thing about this whole issue is that a couple of generations get to be educated lunatica Feb 2012 #10
+1 for this and OP #1 BlancheSplanchnik Feb 2012 #11
I've heard the same facts cited as counterarguments. Igel Feb 2012 #12
I would argue that we've been moving away from children being commodities XemaSab Feb 2012 #13
Point well taken. Rhiannon12866 Feb 2012 #24
I would argue your first point Mojorabbit Feb 2012 #23
Though there are many good points in the OP superpatriotman Feb 2012 #14
k&r recommended reading for Everyone Whisp Feb 2012 #15
Pregnancy and bearing children is a strength, not a weakness. AllyCat Feb 2012 #16
K&R! n/t Lugnut Feb 2012 #17
Actually birth control was widely practiced in the ancient world with an herb called Sylphion. Cleita Feb 2012 #18
That's clearly where Santorum is coming from. Good piece. DirkGently Feb 2012 #19
I can condense it to two words. tavalon Feb 2012 #20
Precisely Sherman A1 Feb 2012 #28
A good start -- here's more, about the ROOT of the problem Remember Me Feb 2012 #21
My mother gave us this to read as teenagers malaise Feb 2012 #22
Right. Why do most women have babies? Because they get pregnant. valerief Feb 2012 #25
">>>They are, above everything else, desperate to get their women back under firm control."<<< n/t ProfessionalLeftist Feb 2012 #26
k&r nt steve2470 Feb 2012 #27
It's also very much about electoral politics Martin Eden Feb 2012 #29

peacebird

(14,195 posts)
6. I think there is a component of racism too. These rich white guys don't want to become a minority
Sat Feb 18, 2012, 11:25 AM
Feb 2012

Out of fear that the new racial majority would treat them as second class citizens.

lunatica

(53,410 posts)
10. The good thing about this whole issue is that a couple of generations get to be educated
Sat Feb 18, 2012, 12:51 PM
Feb 2012

all over again. I think that's great actually. They've been lucky enough to be able to take their rights for granted, but this will give them a taste of what it would be like to have those rights taken away. No one gives up their rights, even the ones they take for granted when it comes down to it. No one.

Igel

(35,316 posts)
12. I've heard the same facts cited as counterarguments.
Sat Feb 18, 2012, 02:34 PM
Feb 2012

They create uncertainty in whether a man's actually the father or a cuckold, they granted women undue influence in the structure of early society since they tended to stay at home and organize home life and raise the children. It's harder being a single herder without somebody organizing the household that provides food, shelter, clothing, and heat.

Hence matriarchies are posited as the earliest form of human social structure. Oddly, they're always romanticized as good.

Arguably, early societies, in which children are scarce, were organized around childbearing--not just the women's lifestyle, but also the men's. Lots of training of children, getting extra food for children, protecting the offspring against intraclan, intratribal rivalries. On top of that you have the adults all competing for their own selfish interests. Recently men were better at it than women, if only because it's likely women were more interested in the children they invested so much time with and bonded with. (My family was the opposite: My mother worked for herself and took care of herself; my father worked to feed me and provide for me. It's no prettier when the mother is a selfish sexist racist ogre than when the man is. It's just less stereotypical and so can be ignored as a possible variant to be considered in an argument.)

The biggest change since the Paleolithic is that currently, for many people, children are commodities. You need a certain level of luxury for that to be the case and even places like Afghanistan have long since reached that level.

XemaSab

(60,212 posts)
13. I would argue that we've been moving away from children being commodities
Sat Feb 18, 2012, 02:42 PM
Feb 2012

A hundred years ago, 10 kids meant 10 farmhands or factory workers and 10 whole other families to send you money in your old age.

Now 10 kids means 10 college tuitions and doctor bills, while old people don't have to depend on their families for money.

Mojorabbit

(16,020 posts)
23. I would argue your first point
Sat Feb 18, 2012, 09:26 PM
Feb 2012

It does not matter who the father is if you have a matriarchal line of succession. One always knows who the mother is. I would also argue that a tribal form of community leaves many both male and female that can organize the child care and home life and both male and female that can be the hunter gatherers. So I think there is an agenda when you see a form of control being made on women in all areas of existence both spiritual, personal, and societal.

superpatriotman

(6,249 posts)
14. Though there are many good points in the OP
Sat Feb 18, 2012, 02:44 PM
Feb 2012

and several responses in the thread, the fact is this:

BIRTH CONTROL IS A WEDGE ISSUE!


AllyCat

(16,187 posts)
16. Pregnancy and bearing children is a strength, not a weakness.
Sat Feb 18, 2012, 03:07 PM
Feb 2012

I'm not saying those who can't or don't want to have children are "not strong", but the perceived ability to bring forth life as well as nurture children is a STRONG point and maybe we need to reframe the debate. That's way too weak a description for what needs to happen, but I feel we need a mindset change. Not sure how to make that happen except to start evaluating our own talk.

Cleita

(75,480 posts)
18. Actually birth control was widely practiced in the ancient world with an herb called Sylphion.
Sat Feb 18, 2012, 03:27 PM
Feb 2012

It was so popular that it became rare and costly. http://www.sisterzeus.com/Silphio.htm

Also, the church never was interested in women's affairs like pro-creation until the Renaissance. Up until then it was in the realm of mid-wives. No men were needed. It's when men clerics started becoming physicians and started treating women for women's ailments and child birth that the whole birth control debacle became Church doctrine.

Sherman A1

(38,958 posts)
28. Precisely
Sun Feb 19, 2012, 04:23 AM
Feb 2012

I would go with the phrase "Men want their cake & to eat it too", but yours is much shorter.

 

Remember Me

(1,532 posts)
21. A good start -- here's more, about the ROOT of the problem
Sat Feb 18, 2012, 08:51 PM
Feb 2012

I was just revisiting a book that has been extremely important in my life: Homophobia, A Weapon of Sexism by Suzanne Pharr. I wasn't the only one who found it worthwhile -- it was, and still is, used in Women's Studies curricula, starting not long after its original publishing in 1988.

As I skimmed it again the other day, I found a few things a bit dated, but societal sexism and misogyny don't change all that much.

Here's a passage from the introduction that puts the entire thing into sharp focus. I wish I could share it with every single person of the 99% Movement:

Actually, we have to look at economics not only as the root cause of sexism but also as the underlying, driving force that keeps all the oppressions in place. In the United States, our economic system is shaped like a pyramid, with a few people at the top, primarily white males, being supported by large numbers of unpaid or low-paid workers at the bottom. When we look at this pyramid, we begin to understand the major connection between sexism and racism because those groups at the bottom of the pyramid are women and people of color. We then begin to understand why there is such a fervent effort to keep those oppressive systems (racism and sexism and all the ways they are manifested) in place to maintain the unpaid and low-paid labor.

Susan DeMarco and Jim Hightower, writing for Mother Jones, report that Forbes magazine indicated that “the 400 richest families in America last year had an average net worth of $550 million each. These and less than a million other families—roughly one percent of our population—are at the prosperous tip of our society. In 1976, the wealthiest 1 percent of America’s families owned 19.2 percent of the nation’s total wealth. (This sum of wealth counts all of America’s cash, real estate, stocks, bonds, factories, art, personal property, and anything else of financial value.) By 1983, those at this 1 percent tip of our economy owned 34.3 percent of our wealth. Today, the top 1 percent of Americans possesses more net wealth than the bottom 90 percent.” (small snip)

In order for this top-heavy system of economic inequity to maintain itself, the 90 percent on the bottom must keep supplying cheap labor. A very complex, intricate system of institutionalized oppressions is necessary to maintain the status quo so that the vast majority will not demand its fair share of wealth and resources and bring the system down. Every institution—schools, banks, churches, government, courts, media, etc—as well as individuals must be enlisted in the campaign to maintain such a system of gross inequity.

snip

Economics is the great controller in both sexism and racism. If a person can’t acquire food, shelter, and clothing and provide them for children, then that person can be forced to do many things in order to survive. The major tactic, worldwide, is to provide unrecompensed or inadequately recompensed labor for the benefit of those who control wealth. Hence, we see women performing unpaid labor in the home or filling low-paid jobs, and we see people of color in the lowest-paid jobs available.

The method is complex: limit educational and training opportunities for women and for people of color and then withhold adequate paying jobs with the excuse that people of color and women are incapable of filling them. Blame the economic victim and keep the victim’s self-esteem low through invisibility and distortion within the media and education. Allow a few people of color and women to succeed among the profit-makers so that blaming those who don’t “make it” can be intensified. Encourage those few who succeed in gaining power now to turn against those who remain behind rather than to use their resources to make change for all. Maintain the myth of scarcity—that there are not enough jobs, resources, etc., to go around—among the middleclass so that they will not unite with laborers, immigrants, and the unemployed. The method keeps in place a system of control and profit by a few and a constant source of cheap labor to maintain it.

If anyone steps out of line, take her/his job away. Let homelessness and hunger do their work. The economic weapon works. And we end up saying, “I would do this or that—be openly who I am, speak out against injustice, work for civil rights, join a labor union, go to a political march, etc.—if I didn’t have this job. I can’t afford to lose it.” We stay in an abusive situation because we see no other way to survive.


This is why feminists like me (tho, alas, not all feminists since not all of them understand this, or even know or think of Patriarchy as a problem) can be heard saying something like this: "It's all of a piece; it's all related; you can't hope to stamp out one oppression without also addressing the others; every time you stand up against one oppression you stand up against all of them' there is no hierarchy of oppression (that's a patriarchal divide-and-conquer myth); etc.

If the 99%ers want to change the system, IMO the only way to REALLY change it is to overthrow Patriarchy.

And THAT by the way is why some of us are called "radical feminists" -- because we believe that the root, the radix, is Patriarchy and must be overthrown if we are to have equality.

Oh, my lads and oh, my lassies, what a grand life we'd have then. NOW you can see how much our economics for the other 99% depends on it too.

There's a line from one of my other favorite feminist books, The Chalice and the Blade by Riane Eisler, describing early goddess-worshipping societies, and it mentions something like "an easy and comfortable relationship (which included sexuality) between the sexes," in its description. And much more that made it sound like heaven to me.

valerief

(53,235 posts)
25. Right. Why do most women have babies? Because they get pregnant.
Sat Feb 18, 2012, 09:49 PM
Feb 2012

Not because they necessary want them. Because they get pregnant.

Martin Eden

(12,869 posts)
29. It's also very much about electoral politics
Sun Feb 19, 2012, 09:26 AM
Feb 2012

The Repukes are using the "Obamacare" BC coverage requirement and the objection of the Catholic church to reinforce their false narrative that Christianity and religious freedom are under assault by liberalism in general and Obama in particular.

It's just one more example of pandering to religious folk and playing the fear card.

And, of course, it is emblamatic of the chauvinism still lodged in the mindset of reationaries and men in power.

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