What did Jimmy Carter mean by this

[ProSense]

comment about Snowden:

"If the United States can acquire custody of him, I'm sure he will be brought to trial, and that's the way the law should be implemented."

http://www.cnn.com/2013/06/28/us/snowden-lawyer-offer

[ProSense]

1. Anyone? n/t

[leftstreet]

2. What part of it don't you understand?

English is your first language, yes?

[ProSense]

4. Yes,

"What part of it don't you understand? English is your first language, yes?"

...but I wanted to know if anyone else understood it to mean that if Snowden returns to the U.S., he should face a trial as the law intended.

Did I misinterpret the meaning?

[tarheelsunc]

6. That's what I got out of it also. eom

[AgingAmerican]

10. Or not prosecuted

either or. Carter was pretty vague.

[MADem]

11. He should be tried; let the chips fall; "face the music" as Tester said. nt.

[ProSense]

17. Yes. n/t

[leftstreet]

12. Maybe Carter's hoping the laws would protect Snowden

That he'd be given a fair trial

That he wouldn't be gitmo-ed or something

[Yo_Mama]

32. I took it to mean that Snowden should not be imprisoned outside the US.

or assassinated, or Gitmoed, or condemned to any punishment without a US trial.

[Rex]

3. Where does Carter say that in the link?

nt.

[TroglodyteScholar]

5. 6th from last graf n/t

[Rex]

14. Thanks, the video about the father was the link.

Funny, the answer is only two paragraphs down from the quote.

"He's obviously violated the laws of America, for which he's responsible, but I think the invasion of human rights and American privacy has gone too far," he said.

Guess he didn't finish the article.

[ProSense]

7. It's there, read the article. n/t

[Rex]

9. Okay so it is not in the video I just watched.

Thanks.

[Dreamer Tatum]

8. He means, I believe, that everything you have ever said is correct and that you are awesome.

Why not just admit your agenda?

[MADem]

13. Hide Thread is your friend. Much better option than "personal insult," IMO. NT

[RudynJack]

15. I think he means

that if Snowden returns to the States, he should have a trial.

[struggle4progress]

16. Imma make a wild guess here that Mr Carter meant that if the US can take Mr Snowden into custody

then Mr Carter believes Mr Snowden will appropriately face the charges against him in court

[NuclearDem]

18. If you're having difficulty, this might help:

[ProSense]

20. You could have used that to come up with a better response.

[NuclearDem]

22. Hey, we can't all be starting threads asking for people to read a basic sentence for us.

[ProSense]

23. I know,

"Hey, we can't all be starting threads asking for people to read a basic sentence for us."

...it's amazing that a "basic sentence" can lead to such obfuscation.

[NuclearDem]

24. Propagandists are pretty good at that, donchaknow?

[ProSense]

26. Wait,

"Propagandists are pretty good at that, donchaknow?"

...is that an admission: http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023285902#post18

[NuclearDem]

29. What, my HOP propaganda?

I just strongly support early childhood language education.

[Aerows]

71. Obfuscation

I don't think that word means what you think it means.

[SunSeeker]

19. K & R

[msongs]

21. feel free to ignore all the other statements and pick only one that makes you happy nt

[Scootaloo]

25. Let me just decode this... oh... oh my...

"D R I N K Y O U R O V A L T I N E"

[Pholus]

28. Aaaaah, my eye! nt

[progressoid]

73. ...

[Pholus]

27. Same thing as the last time you selectively quoted him, THREE WEEKS AGO.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023119933

Once again taking only one sentence out of a nuanced statement. President Carter appears to understand this situation FAR better than you based on a reading of his entire message.

From your article, emphasis on Carter's entire message, not just the tiny bit that backs your "hang 'em high" narrative:

Ecuador's rationale appeared to have won support from former U.S. President Jimmy Carter. If another country wants to give haven to Snowden, "then that is their right as a sovereign nation," he told CNN's Suzanne Malveaux. "If the United States can acquire custody of him, I'm sure he will be brought to trial, and that's the way the law should be implemented."

Snowden's acts may have some positive impact, Carter said.

"He's obviously violated the laws of America, for which he's responsible, but I think the invasion of human rights and American privacy has gone too far," he said.

"I think that the secrecy that has been surrounding this invasion of privacy has been excessive, so I think that the bringing of it to the public notice has probably been, in the long term, beneficial."

Asked to elaborate, he said, "I think the American people deserve to know what their Congress is doing."

Fortunately, the daylight is starting to seep in to disinfect this putrid pool of "top secret" corruption.

[ProSense]

30. No,

"Same thing as the last time you selectively quoted him, THREE WEEKS AGO."

...I didn't "selectively" quote him. I posted a snip.

Still, I'm asking now about the specific comment in the OP.

You acknowledge the quote is accurate. Yes, he made other statements, I'm asking about the one in the OP.

[Pholus]

31. Post 14 demonstrates President Carter was not unclear in what he said.

Just like William Binney agreed that Snowden should be prosecuted, qualifying the statement by adding there were a lot of other prosecutions that should come first.

You say "just a snip," I say "selectively" -- so what -- both accurately admit that the full context of the statement and sentiment are dropped in the interests of convenience.

[Gravitycollapse]

34. It's not convenience. The OP has a specific agenda. The narrative must be maintained.

[ProSense]

36. Quoting Carter is a "specific agenda"?

"The narrative must be maintained."

Is Carter's statement part of "the narrative"?

[NuclearDem]

37. You tell us.

[ProSense]

38. LOL!

[NuclearDem]

39. The ROFL smiley? Well, I guess that settles that.

[ProSense]

40. Yup, your comment was hilarious. n/t

[NuclearDem]

41. Not nearly as good as half your threads!

[ProSense]

42. LOL!

"Not nearly as good as half your threads!"

What?

[Pholus]

45. Yeah I love that ROFL smiley.

It's usually a tell that no logical response is coming back at you...

[ProSense]

53. Some

"Yeah I love that ROFL smiley. It's usually a tell that no logical response is coming back at you... "

...comments are just hilarious.

[Gravitycollapse]

48. You've reappropriated it to fit your narrative.

[ProSense]

51. LOL!

[Le Taz Hot]

60. I just love the intellient discussion

on DU these days.

[ProSense]

61. Well,

"I just love the intellient discussion on DU these days."

...some people can't control themselves.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023285902#post34

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=profile&uid=302048&sub=trans

So what do you expect? Do you really believe this is the way to start an "intellient (sic) discussion"?

[Le Taz Hot]

62. As usual, your links have NOTHING

to do with the topic at hand and EVERYTHING to do with character assassinations. And this is what you deem is intelligent discussion. I just love it when people prove my point for me. It saves time.

[ProSense]

63. Who

"As usual, your links have NOTHING to do with the topic at hand and EVERYTHING to do with character assassinations. And this is what you deem is intelligent discussion. I just love it when people prove my point for me. It saves time."

...could have guessed that you weren't interested in "intelligent discussion."

You appear ready to dimiss "character assassinations" as long as they fit your bias.

[Le Taz Hot]

64. Hon, I don't even know what that means.

Now, if you don't mind, I got some good GodBud for my BD yesterday and I think I'm going to enjoy a Breakfast Roll.

You have yourself a good day, y'hear?

[ProSense]

66. "Hon," you have a good day too. n/t

[Pholus]

43. I would tend to agree with you, but was giving the benefit of the doubt.

As near as I can tell, the point is simply to "force" an admission that Snowden broke the law and so should be prosecuted so that "victory" can be claimed or something.

I guess by extension you're then supposed to conclude that his flight from prosecution is exactly why he should not be trusted. As with the pole-dancing girlfriend it is a variant of flinging everything you can fling hoping some of it sticks to avoid discussing the actual issue of domestic dragnet surveillance which is repugnant.

And you know, it might even be a compelling argument IF you didn't have the atrocious experiences of all the OTHER whistleblower victims to compare with.

I think what is most offensive about the OP is that President Carter, a formal naval officer, has probably been educated on the ethics of when it might become necessary to disobey an order. His response is almost the classic one -- there is a personal responsibility aspect which acknowledges that the rule of law means Snowden must pay the price if detained, but at the same time the circumstances and ethics of the situation almost certainly means we as a country are better off because he did break the law. Sometimes your sacrifice for our democracy is not as simple or as clean as merely taking a bullet.

That doesn't quite fit the "hang 'em high" narrative so it gets ignored.

[ProSense]

46. No,

"As near as I can tell, the point is simply to 'force' an admission that Snowden broke the law and so should be prosecuted so that 'victory' can be claimed or something."

...the point is to interpret Carter's statement. I mean, you don't have to admit that "Snowden broke the law."

"I think what is most offensive about the OP is that President Carter, a formal naval officer, has probably been educated on the ethics of when it might become necessary to disobey an order. His response is almost the classic one -- there is a personal responsibility aspect which acknowledges that the rule of law means Snowden must pay the price if detained, but at the same time the circumstances and ethics of the situation almost certainly means we as a country are better off because he did break the law. Sometimes your sacrifice for our democracy is not as simple or as clean as merely taking a bullet."

You're free to be offended by the OP, but facts are facts.

[Pholus]

47. Yup. Just make sure you don't cherry pick the one you like. nt

[ProSense]

35. What?

"Post 14 demonstrates President Carter was not unclear in what he said."

...that post is a different comment, and it still indicates that Snowden "violated the laws of America, for which he's responsible"

You appear to be having a hard time with the point of the OP statement.

[Pholus]

44. Then perhaps you should drop the charade of trying to pretend you don't know what he said. nt

[ProSense]

49. What?

"Then perhaps you should drop the charade of trying to pretend you don't know what he said."

The OP asks for other people's interpretation. I know what it means. Clearly, it's uncomfortable for you to acknowledge.

[Pholus]

50. Then perhaps you should enlighten me.

It will help me to determine what the color of the sky is in your world.

[ProSense]

52. Snowden

"It will help me to determine what the color of the sky is in your world."

...broke the law and will face the consequences. What's "the color of the sky is in your world"?

[Pholus]

54. I had your number in the first sentence of Post 43 then.

Pity you didn't read that.

[railsback]

55. Certainly explains why Carter doesn't call Snowden a 'whistleblower'.

Because, you know, he just thinking it… apparently.

[ZombieHorde]

33. I think he is talking about either torture, indefinite detention, or both.

I think he is saying Snowden probably won't be tortured or anything, and that is how it should be. I am not as optimistic as him.

[JDPriestly]

56. Let's put it back into context.

Ecuador's rationale appeared to have won support from former U.S. President Jimmy Carter. If another country wants to give haven to Snowden, "then that is their right as a sovereign nation," he told CNN's Suzanne Malveaux. "If the United States can acquire custody of him, I'm sure he will be brought to trial, and that's the way the law should be implemented."

Snowden's acts may have some positive impact, Carter said.

. . . . . (The sentence you quoted.)

"I think that the secrecy that has been surrounding this invasion of privacy has been excessive, so I think that the bringing of it to the public notice has probably been, in the long term, beneficial."

Asked to elaborate, he said, "I think the American people deserve to know what their Congress is doing."

http://www.cnn.com/2013/06/28/us/snowden-lawyer-offer

It's really easier to just be honest about what Carter really said. If individual sentences are posted completely out of context and so as to say what is not meant, the DUer who posts the comment loses credibility.

Honesty is the best policy. It kind of misrepresents the meaning to pick out and post a single sentence out of a statement that expresses something that is, overall, contrary to the meaning of the entire statement.

And, while we are at it, the Der Spiegel article quotes Carter as saying that this NSA program endangers the trustworthiness, the credibility of important American programs like Google and Facebook. I think that is the first time I have read that point, and I think it is an excellent one.

That last statement is in the last paragraph of this article.

http://www.spiegel.de/politik/ausland/nsa-affaere-jimmy-carter-kritisiert-usa-a-911589.html

[Go Vols]

68. +1

[Hekate]

57. Jimmy Carter: "We are a nation of laws." Our laws state that US citizens who break our laws ...

... shall have a trial. The law should be implemented that way (custody/trial) and not by assassination (as in a tv show or other vengeful fantasies) or by throwing persons willy-nilly into prison without a trial (as Bush-Cheney did in such a manner that we can't seem to undo it).

A toast to President Carter.

[ProSense]

59. Yes. n/t

[great white snark]

58. He means get courts involved to punish and also to change/rescind/define ambiguous laws.

Repugs in congress won't get off their asses so we need some judicial action.

Hello my dear Pro.

[hootinholler]

65. He meant you got your ass handed to you in that other thread

[ProSense]

67. No,

"He meant you got your ass handed to you in that other thread"

...I don't think that's what he meant, but you sure seem to get a kick out of your fantasy.

[galileoreloaded]

69. an appeal not to Vince Foster the guy, clearly

[stupidicus]

70. a thesaurus is your friend

Main Entry: implement
Part of Speech: verb
Definition: start, put into action
Synonyms: achieve, actualize, bring about, carry out, complete, effect, enable, enforce, execute, fulfill, invoke, make good, make possible, materialize, perform, provide the means, put into effect, realize, resolve

how long have you been struggling with things like this?

[Capt. Obvious]

72. Am I the only one who clicks on Prosense threads

and just scrolls right to the responses?

[NuclearDem]

74. Oh, you are far from the only one.

[Capt. Obvious]

77. Yay, I'm not alone!

Most of the time, the topic/body is of no consequence to the enjoyment of the thread.

[Safetykitten]

75. Well, you tell us. You are the expert on all things, even nuance.

[Jenoch]

76. Carter's statement seems vague,

but so does President Obama on the Snowden issue. He does not want Snowden to be extradited and does not wish there to be a trial. A trial would just prolong the issue. I believe President Obama would like Snowden to find a country in which to live in obscurity.

[Logical]

78. LOL, I new the Carter thing would annoy you. n-t