Contradicting NSA claims, Sen Leahy hasn't seen "dozens or even several terrorist plots" thwarted by

[Catherina]

Contradicting NSA claims, Senator Leahy hasn't seen "dozens or even several terrorist plots" thwarted by mass surveillance

Senate Panel Presses N.S.A. on Phone Logs
By CHARLIE SAVAGE and DAVID E. SANGER

At a Senate Judiciary Committee hearing, the chairman, Patrick J. Leahy, Democrat of Vermont, accused Obama administration officials of overstating the success of the domestic call log program. He said he had been shown a classified list of “terrorist events” detected through surveillance, and it did not show that “dozens or even several terrorist plots” had been thwarted by the domestic program.

...

“If this program is not effective it has to end. So far, I’m not convinced by what I’ve seen,” Mr. Leahy said, citing the “massive privacy implications” of keeping records of every American’s domestic calls.

...

The Obama administration has been trying to build public support for its surveillance programs, which trace back to the Bush administration, by arguing that they are subject to strict safeguards and court oversight and that they have helped thwart as many as 54 terrorist events. That figure, Mr. Leahy emphasized, relies upon conflating another program that allows surveillance targeted at noncitizens abroad, which has apparently been quite valuable, with the domestic one.



Still, Senator Dianne Feinstein, the California Democrat who is chairwoman of the Senate Intelligence Committee, said she supported overhauling the program but keeping it in place because it generates information that might prevent attacks.

John C. Inglis, the deputy director of the N.S.A., said there had been 13 investigations in which the domestic call tracking program made a “contribution.” He cited two discoveries: that several men in San Diego were sending money to a terrorist group in Somalia, and that a suspect who was already under scrutiny in a subway bomb plot was using a different phone.
...

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/08/01/us/nsa-surveillance.html?ref=politics&_r=0

[pipoman]

1. Bravo Senator Leahy, and shame on you Senator Feinstein..

apparently the "Change" promised was a change from Democrats being adversarial to the overreaching of thugs in the "war on Terra" to absolute agreement with every sinister plan put in place by Bush...

[Catherina]

2. Feinstein is a walking disgrace, from her votes to her war profiteering

She absurdly claims that:

Balancing privacy rights with our nation’s security is difficult to achieve, but I know of no federal program for which audits, congressional oversight and scrutiny by the Justice Department, the intelligence community and the courts are stronger or more sustained.

I read enough intelligence on terrorists to know that if they can, they will attack us.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/senate-intelligence-committee-chair-reform-nsa-programs/2013/07/30/9b66d9f2-f93a-11e2-8e84-c56731a202fb_story.html

I hope she'll be replaced with someone who does a better job representing her constituents soon. Very soon.

[frylock]

6. that won't happen until she's dead..

she isn't going anywhere anytime soon. not voting for her this last election was quite cathartic.

[Catherina]

7. I hope you're wrong. I don't think you are but I really hope so n/t

[Pholus]

3. Leahy's "conflating" statement has interesting implications....

He seems to indicate that the apparently productive program (actual foreign surveillance, the NSA mission) is being used to cover for the apparently non-productive program (domestic surveillance).

The non-productive program obviously has a purpose, but what is it? It isn't something we've actually been told because the truth is too precious (and offensive) to just lay out there.

My guess is that domestic surveillance provides data to some initiatives of the Darpa SMISC program (aided by the dodge that collection and computer analysis cannot be considered "spying" as long as a human doesn't look).

That program's stated goal is to ascertain and influence public opinion on the fly in rapid response to events.

We are still suspects, but perhaps we will cooperate with the goals of the state better if we are fed the right line at just the right time.

[Catherina]

4. You nailed it n/t

[xchrom]

5. Du rec. Nt

[bigtree]

8. Leahy

. . . tells it like it is.

Feinstein, not so much, on this issue and others related to defense and intelligence. I could see her deliberately 'conflating' programs to try and keep her spy club together . . . prevaricating as she gives lip service to civil liberties and privacy rights.

rec'd