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rainy

(6,088 posts)
Sat Aug 17, 2013, 06:46 PM Aug 2013

Foreign workers, why are so many here? Everywhere I go at the beach

there are foreign workers. Even the most remote fruit stand in NC has foreign workers. I had a discussion with a friend and I was thinking it's because they don't have to be paid as much but she said they all have to make minimum wage. Is that correct? I googled and the info i found was inconclusive as some visas are different. Does anyone have any good info on this topic?

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Foreign workers, why are so many here? Everywhere I go at the beach (Original Post) rainy Aug 2013 OP
tech has had wholesale replacement by H-1b/L1 work visas markiv Aug 2013 #1
If yr at the beach, how do you know who's a 'foreign worker' or not? n/t Violet_Crumble Aug 2013 #2
Accents and language skills. rainy Aug 2013 #8
Citizenship now requires passing an accent exam? muriel_volestrangler Aug 2013 #19
talking to them and asking about it. when I was in Nantucket I was surprised at how many Irish bettyellen Aug 2013 #21
What's foreign? HipChick Aug 2013 #3
At my beach gvstn Aug 2013 #4
All of our schools start after labor day for that reason so the local businesses rainy Aug 2013 #10
Could be a simple as language difference..broken English...that clued DU'er in KoKo Aug 2013 #5
I dunno. Many tourists have those funny foreign accents... Violet_Crumble Aug 2013 #6
That was happening here but there today still lots of foreign workers. rainy Aug 2013 #11
actually they are white, good looking, in the restaurants, at the fruit stands, rainy Aug 2013 #9
We took vacation at "Outer Banks, NC" about six years ago...and the restaurant KoKo Aug 2013 #7
This is what I suspected and I can't find too much supporting rainy Aug 2013 #12
J-1 Student Visa Abuse: Foreign Students Forced To Work In Strip Clubs, Eat On Floor KoKo Aug 2013 #14
Thanks, good info! rainy Aug 2013 #18
J-1 visas have grown exponentially Yo_Mama Aug 2013 #16
In my hometown: Blue_Tires Aug 2013 #27
Ha ha that is my hometown and exactly what I'm talking about. rainy Aug 2013 #29
I don't go out to the oceanfront anywhere near as much as I used to Blue_Tires Aug 2013 #31
I live near a collection of "tourist towns:" Fawke Em Aug 2013 #20
Not to them, I'm sure. Spider Jerusalem Aug 2013 #22
Used to be in the south, anyway, a foreigner was anyone from north of the Purrfessor Aug 2013 #25
My point for posting was not racism of course but more rainy Aug 2013 #13
I just posted an article. And...some here didn't understand... KoKo Aug 2013 #15
And more to the point, when we have such high youth unemployment here, Yo_Mama Aug 2013 #17
Agree...And, if Businesses could afford to pay College Students in years KoKo Aug 2013 #23
Money: it's cheaper to hire foreign workers at rock-bottom or lower wages Retrograde Aug 2013 #24
I ask them. They have to get minimum wage but that's paid by their contractor who brings them in. Sunlei Aug 2013 #26
Kick...for the "Underground Workers" we bring in..and why we need to be Wary KoKo Aug 2013 #28
Do you ask them their citizenship? Recursion Aug 2013 #30
Read this: rainy Aug 2013 #32
 

markiv

(1,489 posts)
1. tech has had wholesale replacement by H-1b/L1 work visas
Sat Aug 17, 2013, 07:00 PM
Aug 2013

many citizens having to train their own replacement before being fired

rainy

(6,088 posts)
8. Accents and language skills.
Sat Aug 17, 2013, 08:45 PM
Aug 2013

There have been stories about this beach town and foreign workers and I see it. It's different than 10 years ago when all the local high-school kids worked the summer jobs here.

muriel_volestrangler

(101,258 posts)
19. Citizenship now requires passing an accent exam?
Sun Aug 18, 2013, 10:13 AM
Aug 2013

Who knew?

On the bright side, this means the USA could chuck Kissinger out ...

 

bettyellen

(47,209 posts)
21. talking to them and asking about it. when I was in Nantucket I was surprised at how many Irish
Sun Aug 18, 2013, 10:23 AM
Aug 2013

kids came over to work for the summer in bars and restaurants. They explained there was an agency that facilitated that kind of thing there for years. I have heard of others, for Russians and East Europeans down the Jersey Shore. It just takes people who know the process and have a connect on the other side. I think the major advantage is, they aren't going to go anywhere when you have helped them with transportation and housing too. FWIW, I have always seen a mix in Jersey.

gvstn

(2,805 posts)
4. At my beach
Sat Aug 17, 2013, 07:53 PM
Aug 2013

Foreign is persons with a foreign accent. Lots of kids from Eastern Europe and in the last few years Ireland.

My guess as to why is that employers consider them more reliable. They really need the money and will show up everyday. They also won't quit halfway through the season because they are bored or met a boy/girl they want to spend more time with. That is what I was told by some businesses a few years back; these days there may be more local kids that are willing to work for the summer but with the ways many schools start in August there is still the attrition problem.

rainy

(6,088 posts)
10. All of our schools start after labor day for that reason so the local businesses
Sat Aug 17, 2013, 08:48 PM
Aug 2013

can have workers.

KoKo

(84,711 posts)
5. Could be a simple as language difference..broken English...that clued DU'er in
Sat Aug 17, 2013, 07:56 PM
Aug 2013

So I wouldn't be quick to judge racism ...until I saw them answer what clued them in.

In many parts of the country who don't have as many influxes of new immigrants ...it might seem out of place to hear an accent and not some kind of prejudice going on.

But, then I don't know what the poster was talking about...but, just trying to say we shouldn't jump all over them.

BTW: Foreign Workers being abused in Beach/Resort Communties up and down the East Coast were a problem. NYT did a big EXPOSE on it a few years back...but, I've not seen much since. They were promising workers from Eastern European Countries "Summer Internships" and once they got here they were sent to some place in Coast where they worked in Restaurants for almost no money and were housed in really disgusting housing.

Just saying...

Violet_Crumble

(35,955 posts)
6. I dunno. Many tourists have those funny foreign accents...
Sat Aug 17, 2013, 08:03 PM
Aug 2013

And I'm taking a wild guess that there'd be Americans who don't have American accents. I'm thinking the beach isn't the best example to use when talking about foreign workers.

rainy

(6,088 posts)
9. actually they are white, good looking, in the restaurants, at the fruit stands,
Sat Aug 17, 2013, 08:47 PM
Aug 2013

in the hotels, everywhere.

KoKo

(84,711 posts)
7. We took vacation at "Outer Banks, NC" about six years ago...and the restaurant
Sat Aug 17, 2013, 08:04 PM
Aug 2013

servers were mostly Eastern European with accents. We asked our server where she was from and she didn't want to reply.

But, as I said in post above...there are people on the East Coast who are making money off of Young People from other countries, promising them Educational Opportunites and Internships and they they ship them into towns give them low paying jobs in Restaurants and sub-standard housing.

When I grew up it used to be College Kids could get those Jobs in Resort/Beach Communities and the housing was not substandard and the kids loved it and so did the patrons who knew they were giving these students Summer Employment. We used to tip heavily...because the kids were so great to talk to...plus they took their job seriously.

But..that has changed in the last 15 or more years..

KoKo

(84,711 posts)
14. J-1 Student Visa Abuse: Foreign Students Forced To Work In Strip Clubs, Eat On Floor
Sat Aug 17, 2013, 09:15 PM
Aug 2013

Here's one article where AP tried to call out the abuse. It didn't go far...though. This is from 2004.
----------------

J-1 Student Visa Abuse: Foreign Students Forced To Work In Strip Clubs, Eat On Floor

HOLBROOK MOHR, MITCH WEISS and MIKE BAKER 12/ 6/10 04:18 PM ET

MYRTLE BEACH, S.C. — Lured by unsupervised, third-party brokers with promises of steady jobs and a chance to sightsee, some foreign college students on summer work programs in the U.S. get a far different taste of life in America.

An Associated Press investigation found students forced to work in strip clubs instead of restaurants. Others take home $1 an hour or even less. Some live in apartments so crowded that they sleep in shifts because there aren't enough beds. Others have to eat on floors.

They are among more than 100,000 college students who come to the U.S. each year on popular J-1 visas, which supply resorts with cheap seasonal labor as part of a program aimed at fostering cultural understanding.

Government auditors have warned about problems in the program for 20 years, but the State Department, which is in charge of it, only now says it is working on new rules. Officials won't say what those rules are or discuss on the record the problems that have plagued J-1 visas.

John Woods, deputy assistant director of national security for Immigrations and Customs Enforcement, told the AP there were at least two federal investigations under way into human trafficking related to J-1 visas. He would not provide details.

The AP interviewed students, advocates, local authorities and social service agencies, and reviewed thousands of pages of confidential records, police reports and court cases. Among the findings:

_ Many foreign students pay recruiters to help find employment, then don't get work or wind up making little or no money at menial jobs. Labor recruiters charge students exorbitant rent for packing them into filthy, sparsely furnished apartments so crowded that some endure "hotbunking," where they sleep in shifts.

Students routinely get threatened with deportation or eviction if they quit, or even if they just complain too loudly. Some resort to stealing essentials like food, toothpaste and underwear, according to police.

"The vast majority of participating students in this program find it a rewarding experience and return home safely," the State Department said in an e-mail to the AP.

But it's not hard to find exceptions. Most of the nearly 70 students the AP interviewed in 10 states, hailing from 16 countries, said they were disappointed, and some were angry.

"This is not what I thought when I paid all this money to come here," said Natalia Berlinschi, a Romanian who came to the U.S. on a J-1 visa hoping to save up for dental school but got stuck in South Carolina this summer without a job. She took to begging for work on the Myrtle Beach boardwalk and sharing a three-bedroom house with 30 other exchange students.

"I was treated very, very badly," Berlinschi said. "I will never come back."

_ The State Department failed to even keep up with the number of student complaints until this year, and has consistently shifted responsibility for policing the program to the 50 or so companies that sponsor students for fees that can run up to several thousand dollars. That has left businesses to monitor their own treatment of participants.

The program generates millions for the sponsor companies and third-party labor recruiters.

Businesses that hire students can save 8 percent by using a foreign worker over an American because they don't have to pay Medicare, Social Security and unemployment taxes. The students are required to have health insurance before they arrive, another cost that employers don't have to bear.

Many businesses say they need the seasonal work force to meet the demand of tourist season.

"There's been a massive failure on the part of the United States to bring any accountability to the temporary work visa programs, and it's especially true for the J-1," said Terry Coonan, a former prosecutor and the executive director of Florida State University's Center for the Advancement of Human Rights.

The issues are serious enough that the former Soviet republic of Belarus told its young people in 2006 to avoid going to the U.S. on a J-1, warning of a "high level of danger" after one of its citizens in the program was murdered, another died in what investigators in the U.S. said was a suicide, and a third was robbed.

_ Strip clubs and adult entertainment companies openly solicit J-1 workers, even though government regulations ban students from taking jobs "that might bring the Department of State into notoriety or disrepute."

"If you wish to dance in USA as a J-1 exchange visitor, contact us," ZM Studios, a broker for topless dancers, advertised on its website this year. The ad said ZM Studios is "affiliated with designated visa sponsors" and can get women J-1 visas and jobs at topless clubs in cities like Las Vegas and Los Angeles.

MUCH MORE OF ARTICLE AT:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/12/06/j1-student-visa-abuse-for_n_792354.html

Yo_Mama

(8,303 posts)
16. J-1 visas have grown exponentially
Sat Aug 17, 2013, 10:14 PM
Aug 2013
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/17/us/hershey-foreign-exchange-students-pleas-were-ignored.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

Here's an article from the NY Times. Yes, they are being used to replace the summer jobs college students used to get, and if you analyze what's really going on, they get low wages.

Because the economy in Europe is so bad, it's relatively easy for them to get students to sign up, and the program keeps growing.

Blue_Tires

(55,445 posts)
31. I don't go out to the oceanfront anywhere near as much as I used to
Mon Aug 19, 2013, 08:38 AM
Aug 2013

But for whatever reasons (complaints, corruption, low wages, whatever) I've seen a lot less Eastern European employees working there the past couple of summers...Back when that piece was written, like 3 out of 4 cashiers/waitresses/parking lot attendants, etc. were clearly Polish/Czech/Russian....

(and yes, at least as far as the women were concerned, I never met one of them who wasn't incredibly attractive)

Fawke Em

(11,366 posts)
20. I live near a collection of "tourist towns:"
Sun Aug 18, 2013, 10:22 AM
Aug 2013

Gatlinburg, Pigeon Forge and Sevierville - all near the Great Smoky Mountains National Park.

We go there a few times a year to take the kids to Dollywood.

When were eating at a nearby restaurant, I noticed several of the servers were Russian (husband speaks Russian, so we noticed it right away).

For some reason, that made me laugh. It just seems that Pigeon Forge is far less exotic than wherever these beautiful, white and Russian-speaking servers were from.

 

Spider Jerusalem

(21,786 posts)
22. Not to them, I'm sure.
Sun Aug 18, 2013, 11:38 AM
Aug 2013

I walk past a 700-year-old castle almost every day; it doesn't seem exotic because I live here. "Exotic" depends on what you're used to.

Purrfessor

(1,188 posts)
25. Used to be in the south, anyway, a foreigner was anyone from north of the
Sun Aug 18, 2013, 02:21 PM
Aug 2013

Mason-Dixon Line and west of the Mississippi River. As a native Floridian we used to call them snowbirds, and what we really hated more than anything else was the increased traffic.

rainy

(6,088 posts)
13. My point for posting was not racism of course but more
Sat Aug 17, 2013, 09:06 PM
Aug 2013

of an attitude of workers being hired for cheep on visas so that employers didn't have to pay a minimum wage.

KoKo

(84,711 posts)
15. I just posted an article. And...some here didn't understand...
Sat Aug 17, 2013, 09:43 PM
Aug 2013

but, as I said, I've had experience with East Coast Beach places. We have relatives up and down the coast and we love the beach. So we've been many places and noticed what you did.

These should be US College or late High School Student jobs...and not bringing in Foreign Students to be abused. Many of us in the 60's through the 80's put ourselves through college on the Summer Resort and Beach Jobs. In these times with Student Education Debt it's important for us to take care of our own kids...and I wouldn't want to see them abused either.

Yo_Mama

(8,303 posts)
17. And more to the point, when we have such high youth unemployment here,
Sat Aug 17, 2013, 10:19 PM
Aug 2013

why are we doing this?

Those working in the US on J-1 visas aren't subject to FICA taxes, so their employers don't have to pay the FICA match:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/J-1_visa

Employers who hire J1 visitors may also save up on payroll taxes. When J1 visitors do not pay Social Security, Medicare or Federal Unemployment taxes, employers do not have to match these taxes. A typical employer who hires 5 Work/Travel J1 visitors and pays $8/hour each may save over $2317 in a typical 4-months season.

KoKo

(84,711 posts)
23. Agree...And, if Businesses could afford to pay College Students in years
Sun Aug 18, 2013, 12:18 PM
Aug 2013

past for Summer Temp employment...then why do they need to import J1Workers now.

So they can "exploit them" is what it seems from not only this article I posted but, NYT did an article back a few years ago about the exploitation of workers in those "Asian Restaurants" that pop up in every town in strip shopping centers. Those workers are moved around the country in buses and they are exploited by putting them up in run down motels in deplorable conditions, barely giving them enough to live on and then move them out of town so they don't have way of complaining to anyone.

Makes me wonder when Repugs & Dems want more "worker visas" for US as part of the Immigration Reform Bill.

Retrograde

(10,119 posts)
24. Money: it's cheaper to hire foreign workers at rock-bottom or lower wages
Sun Aug 18, 2013, 01:38 PM
Aug 2013

There are J-1 visas that let employers bring in young people from overseas as a "learning experience": supposedly they get exposed to American culture while having a place to stay and some pocket money. In reality, it's a short-term savings for employers because they can pay sub-minimum wages, with no federal withholding taxes.

Sunlei

(22,651 posts)
26. I ask them. They have to get minimum wage but that's paid by their contractor who brings them in.
Sun Aug 18, 2013, 02:28 PM
Aug 2013

A lot of them pay, sometimes thousands to the contractor who advertises for them in foreign countries. The contractor takes care of the visas, the paychecks, housing, sets the 'rules'.

All the Corp has to do is order the work crew or teachers or nurses or whatever 'workers' they want from the contractor.

If they don't follow the 'rules' all the contractor has to do is call and have them deported. on the federal dime of course.

KoKo

(84,711 posts)
28. Kick...for the "Underground Workers" we bring in..and why we need to be Wary
Sun Aug 18, 2013, 08:47 PM
Aug 2013

of Immigration Reform ...because there are "hidden things" in that Bill that neither Repugs or Dems want to talk about. J-1 visas taking jobs away from American Youth to EXPLOIT innocent Foreign Students.

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