Baseball Player Killed Because Kids "Were Bored"

[Recursion]

http://espn.go.com/college-sports/story/_/id/9583091/baseball-player-killed-kids-were-bored

An Australian man attending an Oklahoma college on a baseball scholarship was shot and killed in what police described Monday as a random act of violence by three "bored" teenagers who decided to kill someone for the fun of it.

Christopher Lane, 22, of Melbourne, was found dead Friday while visiting the town of Duncan, where his girlfriend and her family live. Three boys, ages 15, 16, and 17, are in custody and face a court appearance Tuesday afternoon.

Duncan Police Chief Danny Ford said Monday a woman called 911 after she saw Lane stagger across the road and fall to the ground in the south-central Oklahoma town of about 24,000 residents. Ford said Lane, who was staying with his girlfriend and her family in Duncan, had jogged past a home where the three boys were staying. He said the shooting appeared to be completely random.

...

"They saw Christopher go by, and one of them said: 'There's our target,'" Ford said. "The boy who has talked to us said: 'We were bored and didn't have anything to do, so we decided to kill somebody.'"

WTF?

[Cha]

1. That's so sad. :( My son in law is from Melbourne, Australia..

who came to the Univ of Oregon on a tennis scholarship back in the late 80s.

It's unfathomable how deranged some people can be.

[AverageJoe90]

3. So true. So true. =( eom.

[AverageJoe90]

2. Gotta wonder about the background of these kids.....

I'm telling you, these guys were likely either abused as kids(or grew up in homes where physical violence and/or other malevolence was common), or are mentally ill, or even both!....that's usually the problem with people like this, as this stuff just does not happen with normal kids who grew up with good families(no matter if materially "spoiled" or not).

Rest in peace, Chris Lane......you died too young.

[malaise]

4. Maybe their folks are gun nuts

and all they do is play video games. Their lives are over - fuck em.

[B Calm]

9. I agree. Oklahoma has a few of those gun nuts running around.

[keroro gunsou]

11. excuse me...

all *I* do is play video games (when not working, baking, or reading DU)... so what's that tell you then....

[HereSince1628]

13. IMO that reply is mostly a casting about for a rationale...as was the post it is pointed at

being able to assign risk helps resolve the anxieties associated with the risk. And the benefit of lowering of anxiety really needn't be based on an accurate or a correct assignment of risk.

It makes all of us quite uncomfortable when 'we' get lumped in with 'them'. Most video game players aren't killers of random people. Similarly, I'm not very fond with an unnamed mental condition being set up as the ultimate bucket to catch a rationale.

[keroro gunsou]

70. my apologies...

i tend to get a little trigger happy... pardon the pun... when someone wants to blame video games for why people do stupid things.

[HereSince1628]

106. Nothing to apologize for, really. Understanding why people make hasty generalizations

helps me not go off when I resemble a remark as much as I once did.

But, it can still get to me.

[Ace Rothstein]

47. Thugs

Or they might have been thugs. A lot more of them going around shooting people in this country than gun nuts.

[rl6214]

53. I thought I'd read on DU by a member in the gun control group that

"Thugs" was a "dog whistle" term. I am not jumping on you for using it but do you believe "thugs" to be a dog whistle term?

[Ace Rothstein]

58. Criminal Lifestyle

I guess it can be. I've always used it to describe those that live a criminal lifestyle.

[rl6214]

60. I agree with you, thank you.

[BainsBane]

90. Yes, it's typically racial code

for black youth. Why that has to be part of a conversation of this horrific crime escapes me.

[spin]

105. I use the term for any aggressive criminal. ...

Skin color is irrelevant.

thug (thg)
n.
1. A cutthroat or ruffian; a hoodlum.
2. also Thug One of a band of professional assassins formerly active in northern India who worshiped Kali and offered their victims to her.

[Hindi hag, perhaps from Sanskrit sthaga, a cheat, from sthagati, sthagayati, he conceals; see (s)teg- in Indo-European roots.]
thugger·y n.
thuggish adj.
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/thug

Now I am 67 years old and over my lifetime political correctness has altered the meaning of many words.

1. thug
Share on twitter Share on facebook Share on more
4705 up, 2693 down
As Tupac defined it, a thug is someone who is going through struggles, has gone through struggles, and continues to live day by day with nothing for them. That person is a thug. and the life they are living is the thug life. A thug is NOT a gangster. Look up gangster and gangsta. Not even CLOSE, my friend.
"That boy ain't a gangsta, fo'sho'. Look at how he walks, he's a thug. life. That's the saddest face I've seen in all my life as a teen."
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=thug

Recently in a post I used the term street thug. Another poster insinuated that I must be a racist. That was insulting.

I know a lot of teen aged kids who have dropped out of school and are living a difficult life without much hope or future. The ones I know do not make a habit out of mugging people on the streets or bullying others so I do not label them as "thugs." The term is derogatory so I reserve it for those who it accurately describes.

[Ace Rothstein]

111. Did not know the race at the time.

Someone else said it was probably a gun nut, not sure why so many find that ok. Maybe nobody should jump to conclusions in these situations.

[LearningCurve]

112. They look thuggy to me.

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/three-teens-charged-over-murder-of-melbourne-baseball-player-chris-lane/story-fni0fiyv-1226700172461

[Ace Rothstein]

114. I base it on actions and not looks.

Based on what I've read about these 3 so far, calling them thugs would be appropriate.

[LearningCurve]

117. It's easy to rush to judgement this early but ...

Gotta say it's hard not to jump to conclusions about thugs here.

[Ace Rothstein]

122. Sometimes it is best to call a spade a spade.

That being said, I knew plenty of white thugs growing up in Bridgeport in Chicago. I went to high school with the thugs that beat up Lenard Clark.

[LearningCurve]

123. One of the thugs in this case appears to be white

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/three-teens-charged-over-murder-of-melbourne-baseball-player-chris-lane/story-fni0fiyv-1226700172461

[rl6214]

118. Why?

How are those mugshots any different that would make them look "thuggy"?

[LearningCurve]

119. Try these

http://www.heavy.com/news/2013/08/chris-lane-murder-chancey-luna-photos-pics/

[Recursion]

127. Well, strictly it's a racial slur against southern Indians

But, yeah, in the current context it often means "nonwhite teenagers".

[malaise]

136. True n/t

[GreenStormCloud]

133. They were Crips. N/T

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/man-who-dobbed-in-suspects-accused-of-murdering-melbourne-baseball-player-chris-lane-says-his-son-was-next/story-fni0fiyv-1226700172461

[Arkansas Granny]

43. But, what are the odds of having 3 of these kids hanging out together? Do they attract each other?

[KittyWampus]

48. egg each other on.

[HooptieWagon]

52. Ever been to a picnic where everyone brought their dog?

Individually, cute puppies. Together, an out of control wolf-pack.

[oberliner]

66. Check out their FB pages

Provides a little bit of insight.

[sakabatou]

5. WTF?!

[Recursion]

6. OTOH it's sometimes best to not be hasty with leaked confessions

So far we just have what the police are saying.

[sakabatou]

7. True...

[Blue_Tires]

14. If only the kids were savvy enough to make up some bullshit SYG defense

[GreenStormCloud]

134. Before you can claim SYG, you have to claim self-defense.

Rather hard to claim self-defense when, from a car, you shoot a pedestrian in the back.

[Blue_Tires]

139. I've seen more bullshit shooting scenarios than that defended here and elsewhere

but fwiw, I did use the 'sarcasm' tag...

[jtuck004]

8. Happens more than people realize, I suspect. n/t

[PowerToThePeople]

10. That will help international relations.

The poor boy's family. Their child came to the USA for something "better" than he could have had at home. Shot and killed.

[Violet_Crumble]

15. It's got nothing to do with international relations...

And there's very little that's "better" in the US. He got a baseball scholarship, and seeing how baseball is about as popular a sport here as cricket is in the US, it makes sense to study baseball in the US.

[Beaverhausen]

33. It doesn't get much better than Australia

In so many ways...including strict gun laws.

[chuckstevens]

12. Guns don't kill people....

MY ASS! This country has GOT to get a handle on its gun problem, but it never will because the NRA owns so many politicians. So many kids home alone with guns in the house and no parents to see what their "bored" teenagers are up to.

My deepest sympathy to Chris, his family, and girl friend. While I love the USA, this is one of those times when I am embarrassed to be an American.

[tallahasseedem]

16. +1

[rl6214]

54. So the gun is responsible, just like the bomb was responsible in the Boston marathon bombing?

[drhobo]

86. how do you figure?

So three teens decide that the solution to their boredom was murder... and you think the real problem was that they illegally had obtained a .22 revolver? Do you really think that without the gun they would have been staying home and playing Madden instead? If someone casually decides to murder a stranger, there are big psychological problems. Remove one avenue of gaining attention through violence and there is a high probability they will choose another. They might have decided on arson instead, or simply beat someone to death.

The primary concern here should be that these teens were so desensitized and violent.

[chuckstevens]

87. Yes..but

GUNS MAKE IT TOO DAM EASY! Talk about desensitized to violence! Do really think it would have just as likely that the teens would have stabbed or beat the Aussie kid to death if the convenient gun wasn't in the house? I don't think so.

[sarisataka]

92. Don't be too sure

http://www.twincities.com/crime/ci_23829526/st-paul-man-19-charged-east-side-beating?source=pkg

[LearningCurve]

113. The suspects are all under 18

So yeah, it's pretty easy to get a gun in the US.

[GreenStormCloud]

135. The kids were gang members. Crips specifically.

It was already illegal for them to have guns.

[PaulKersey]

144. also the gangster culture

[Logical]

19. Why do you care? n-t

[Paladin]

23. Answer the question: Why do you care? (nt)

[bettyellen]

24. No, why do you?

[Renew Deal]

35. Why do you care?

[Loudly]

31. I don't think Oklahoma has a hate crime statute. n/t

[CBGLuthier]

41. You are incorrect

We do. The only thing is it does not include sexual orientation, which has nothing to do with this case.

We got it before the pigs took over our legislature. I am sure they will repeal it as soon as they get done with vaginas and tort reform.

But you do not really need hate crime laws when it comes to murder. Murder is murder.

http://www.partnersagainsthate.org/laws/list-of-hate-crime-laws.html?state=ok

[geek tragedy]

18. Try them as adults, throw away the key.

These little monsters are without human empathy-they'll just kill and rape etc with zero compunction. They should never get the chance.

[bettyellen]

25. Take away all guns from that family for letting children do this too.

[GreenStormCloud]

137. Do you really think that would do anything?

They were gang members - Crips. They will get guns regardless of the parents.

[rl6214]

55. This is the correct answer

[Ruby the Liberal]

107. The captions under their mug shots say they will be tried as adults.

Good.

http://www.cnn.com/2013/08/20/justice/gallery/australia-student-killed/index.html?hpt=hp_t2

[geek tragedy]

108. The driver has already flipped and is cooperating.

These scum will be polluting prison cells for the next several decades.

[Blue Diadem]

21. One kid had posted on FB, "Bang. Two drops in two hours".

The police believe they were planning on killing more. More details at the news link:


http://www.news.com.au/national-news/victoria/three-teens-accused-of-murder-of-baseball-player-chris-lane-identified/story-fnii5sms-1226700172461

[oberliner]

65. It was "Bang Pt. 2 drops in two hours" - referencing the Chief Keef album release

Review: Chief Keef's "Bang Pt. 2"

At last, "Bang Pt. 2" has arrived. Unfortunately, it wasn't worth the wait.

After months of anticipation, Chief Keef finally released Bang Pt. 2 on his 18th birthday, August 15th.

http://www.hotnewhiphop.com/review-chief-keef-s-bang-pt-2-news.6875.html

[DesMoinesDem]

22. Looks like a hate crime to me.

[1-Old-Man]

34. You know, I think that's exactly wrong. It wasn't a hate crime, it was a crime of apathy.

Or, you know, I could be exactly wrong instead of you. But it seems to me that at least on its surface this is a crime of apathy. The three boys (but let's face it, only one pulled the trigger) didn't hate the fellow running by, they simply did not care one single whit about him. Now there may be some deep seated hatred of society in general that motivated the shooting at a level we can not see, and maybe that's true about any 'random' violence, but at least on its face this killing doesn't seem to fit the hate crime meme.

[Aristus]

28. They'll be acquitted, of course.

He was a foreigner, they used a gun, and it's fucking Oklahoma.

[hack89]

36. Depends how racist the OK justice system is

do you think they will miss an opportunity to put three black men in prison?

[DesMoinesDem]

39. Putting 3 black men in prison who are guilty of murder is racist? WTF?

[hack89]

40. Only white gun lovers get away with murder

Or so I have been told.

He was a foreigner, they used a gun, and it's fucking Oklahoma.

The implication being that in gun loving OK you can get away with murder.

I am saying that OK is racist therefore they will be convicted. Only white gun lovers get away with murder.

[DesMoinesDem]

45. OK is racist? That's quite the broad brush you have there.

[hack89]

46. It was a snarky reply to a stupid post

I don't really think OK is a racist state

[DesMoinesDem]

50. I see. I should have noticed the snark.

[hack89]

51. Subtle snark is an art form

[BainsBane]

91. Why does everything have to be about your narrow agenda?

Can't you reflect on the tragedy of this crime without grinding your ax against other members?

[hack89]

94. Did you bother to read the post I was replying to?

did you comdemn them for using a tragedy to advance their anti-gun agenda? Of course not - because you share their agenda.

Their post was idiotic - which I pointed out with some snark.

[BainsBane]

96. That post wasn't about a gun agenda

That is how you chose to read it. Note the poster. He is not one of your regular foes.

[hack89]

102. "He was a foreigner, they used a gun, it was Oklahoma."

so it was not a post suggesting that in gun loving OK you can get away with murder? Really?

[BainsBane]

103. gun was in the sentence

and for you that is red meat. But it could just as easily be read as a comment on Oklahoma and xenophobia.

[hack89]

104. Ok. nt

[Sotf]

129. So if this were three white teenagers..

... you are under the impression that they would be walking free?

[hack89]

130. No

go read the post I am replying to - the one that says that the killers will be acquited.

I am pointing out what a stupid post that is with a little snark.

I have no doubt that OK will punish murderers regardless of race. Or regardless of the fact they used a gun.

[oberliner]

68. Are you sure all 3 are black?

From where do you get that info?

[cigsandcoffee]

73. The NY Post is running photos. Wouldn't be the 1st time they got it wrong, but...

....it's probably correct.



http://www.nypost.com/p/news/national/police_australian_player_killed_J8hM1jhw9Us1DltFFWCGQM

[oberliner]

74. They did get it wrong

The photo under Michael Jones is not Michael Jones.

It is a second photo of Edwards (from his Facebook page).

[LearningCurve]

116. Here's the photo I have

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/three-teens-charged-over-murder-of-melbourne-baseball-player-chris-lane/story-fni0fiyv-1226700172461

I can't tell the race of the 3rd. Looks white to me, or mixed at a minimum.

[GreenStormCloud]

138. Do the Crips admit Whites? N/T

[Cali_Democrat]

72. All 3 are black and they're over 18?

Where did you get this info from?

[oberliner]

75. Pretty sure they are all under 18

And I believe 2 of the 3 are black. The ethnicity of the third is unclear.

Edit to Add: I believe Michael Jones is white.

[Cali_Democrat]

80. Then why did that poster say 3 black men?

What's up with all the misinformation?

[oberliner]

83. Some news outlets ran a photo of 3 black men

And claimed they were pictures of the three involved. However, one of the pictures was not accurate.

[JI7]

99. the pics i saw at a few other links show 2 black guys and 1 white guy

[oberliner]

125. It was wrong for a while at serveral sources

Glad they finally make the correction.

[alp227]

77. The Australian media showed their photos

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/three-teens-accused-of-murder-of-baseball-player-chris-lane-identified/story-fni0fiyv-1226700172461

As well as New York's tabloids the Daily News and Post. And those names subsequently got copied to a whole buncha right wing and blatantly racist websites.

[DesMoinesDem]

101. You're getting worked up over the use of the word men? LOL

I was just using the term the person I was responding to used, but the term was completely irrelevant to my post. Way to try to take an irrelevant term in a post and try to use semantics to make a huff about it. Would you prefer I used the term boys so you could call me racist, something that I saw many times during the Trayvon Martin incident? I couldn't care less what age these murderers are.

[Cali_Democrat]

120. 3 people under 18

and one suspect is white.

[Number23]

109. One of the shooters was a blue-eyed white boy. He was the oldest of the three

[oberliner]

140. He was not one of the shooters

The murder charges were only filed against the other two.

He was charged with being an accessory after the fact.

[Number23]

142. By that logic, there was only one shooter. And two accomplices.

[CBGLuthier]

42. The fuck they will. Your comment is very ignorant.

We punish murderers in this state all the time. Unlike some states where you can stalk a man, threaten him and then claim self-defense. We do not even have a SYG law.

[branford]

121. I believe that Oklahoma has a SYG law that is almost a mirror of Florida.

http://www.tulsaworld.com/article.aspx/Facts_about_Oklahomas_Stand_Your_Ground_Law/20130804_65_G1_Oklaho428749

[rl6214]

56. I have no ties to Oklahoma but

What did Oklahoma ever do to you?

[jberryhill]

76. Made me sit through a corny musical several times

[CBGLuthier]

79. Pulitzer Prize winning play. Academy Award winning film.

Over 2,000 performances of its original run in NEW YORK CITY.

Keep digging that hole we are all really impressed by your taste and manners.

[jberryhill]

84. Lighten up, Francis

I'm not a fan of that musical which, among other things, has a lead female character who "can't say 'no'."

I'm sure that people like it. Your question, however, was not "What did Oklahoma do to the Pulitzer committee, the Academy of Motion Picture Arts and Sciences, or Broadway box offices?" Had you asked that question, you would have gotten a different answer.

No, there is no requirement that I like that musical, or any other musical, in order to be a decent person.

[roamer65]

78. Nope...they'll be pretty quickly convicted and sentenced to life in prison.

Very quickly they are going to wish they had not done this...

[Xyzse]

30. Got quite mad when I heard about this

Either way, their parents should also be liable if they are the ones that own the gun, for not securing it.

[Phentex]

32. This was heartbreaking

and so senseless. I can't wrap my brain around it!

[rl6214]

57. Which poster was this that is no longer with us?

[rl6214]

71. That's pretty awefull

I hate when people throw out blanket statements, especially bigoted ones. Thanks.

[ileus]

49. I've been bored....but never that bored

And folks wonder why CHP's are popular.

[closeupready]

61. Do these juveniles have parents?

What kind of people raise children like this??? That's about as far as I'm going to comment.

[LeftinOH]

67. They clearly aren't "raising" their children. Producing children is one thing;

bringing them up with a sense of values requires some effort.

[zappaman]

64. Wow.

Those are some real pieces of shit there.
I don't care what their fucking upbringing was, this is just insane.

[oberliner]

69. There is a picture circulating of the three involved

However, the picture purporting to be of Michael Jones is not actually him, but is rather another picture of James Edwards.

[SummerSnow]

81. Disgraceful

[DisgustipatedinCA]

82. Let's see...sixty times three............180 years of boredom behind bars: coming right up.

Worthless (redacted-trying to be nice for a change).

[lpbk2713]

85. Life is like a video game to some.

OMFG

[Initech]

88. Wow, that sucks.

[BainsBane]

89. There is a level of sickness in this that is incomprehensible

but you hear of similar cases that have occurred. Does our culture today raise sociopaths, or people so disconnected from the consequences of violence that they think killing is "fun"?

[sarisataka]

93. From what is happening these days

both with and without guns, I am afraid the answer is yes.

Unfortunately the cause and solution is more complex than more guns/less guns. I wish we could reach a detente and make the hard effort to tackle this problem. I believe it would make a large part of the more/less problem moot so that can be addressed in a much less partisan fashion.

[BainsBane]

95. I don't see this as a gun case

other than they should not have had access to guns. They were underage and obviously unfit to use them. I think this is one of those situations where idle teens behave in incomprehensibly horrific ways. It's the way they described their motivation for killing the man that is so awful. "we were bored" and thought it would be "fun." It's chilling.

[sarisataka]

97. I agree

though many on both will focus on the how rather than the why.

Locally we are both seeing it this summer, senseless violence from youths. I do not want St Paul to take bragging rights from Minneapolis saying we have more gang violence but the last 4-6 weeks seems like we are trying it. Maybe like you and your car, it is much more noticeable when it is happening in your front yard.

The question hangs out there with no really good answer, why are youth so emotionally detached from those outside of there immediate group.

[Lee-Lee]

98. I think the number of sociopaths is the same, but conditions around them have changed

People killed people 20 years ago, 50, even 100.

Some did very horrifically.

But I think more and more people see graphic violence in the media and in games that you never saw before, and some people who are chemically/mentally already prone to disconnect more easily become so. I think if you add in the changes where there are fewer social systems people belong to that have a cultural pressure to "behave", it makes such behavior even easier.

So it is easier or more likely for those who are marginal to cross the line.

Not an easy question to answer.

There is a book entitled "On Killing" by Dave Grossman, who is a psychologist who has studied how militaries train people to overcome the basic human resistance to killing another human, along with the psychological effects that come from taking a life. It was required reading in the department I worked in. It is, while morbid, a very fascinating book. One thing he lays out is just how much some media and video games mirror the conditioning used in military training to overcome normal human resistance to killing.

It doesn't have all the answers, but it is worth reading to try and understand some of it.

http://www.amazon.com/On-Killing-Psychological-Learning-Society/dp/0316040932

But, on the flip side murder in this country peaked in the 80's and 90's and is now down close to the levels of the early 60's- so something society is doing is different....

[kiva]

124. Leopold and Loeb.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leopold_and_Loeb

Not disagreeing that there seem to be more sociopaths these days, but these two were right up there with crazy.

[DefenseLawyer]

141. 1924

You know, the good old days when everything was good and pure.

[Flatulo]

128. Apparently so. More and more people just seem to be missing some parts. nt

[YarnAddict]

100. This story is so heartbreaking

I hope the little maggots will be sentenced to a lifetime of boredom, day after day after day of nothing to do. Seems to be the most appropriate punishment possible. They will spend every minute of every day thinking of all the other things they could have done to alleviate their boredom, rather than killing an innocent stranger.

[Nye Bevan]

110. Life without parole in a 6 by 10 cell will be even more "boring".

Lock up those subhuman animals and throw away the key.

[defacto7]

126. Let the sit out their sentence

in an Australian jail.

[flvegan]

115. Their parents should be ashamed of having raised such monsters.

If they did, in fact, do this. Please don't let them get the death penalty if convicted. Punishment takes much, much longer.

[kentuck]

131. In order to be accepted into some gangs, you are required to murder someone.

It can be anyone at random. Most of them get away with it.

Most of them are very loyal to the gang because they know they will be killed if they betray the gangs code.

Also, many require a new member to take a beating before they can join the gang.

But, you knew this, right?

[cpwm17]

132. A similar thing happened recently in Kissimmee, Florida

Some kid's father bought him a mass-murder type weapon. Naturally that kid started shooting people and buildings for sport. It terrorized the town for several weeks. David Guerrero was gunned down and murdered for sport.

Yesterday the father was arrested:

The father of a 15-year-old Osceola County boy charged with murder let his son pick out the weapon used in two killings and more than 20 shootings this summer, according to police records.

The father also told police he bought the carbine and 100 rounds of ammunition because his son "was having problems with unidentified subjects in Poinciana, Florida," records state. And in a separate interview, the son told police that he regularly took the carbine from his father's house.

"Lothar learned of one of Konrad's shootings and took the firearm away from him," the affidavit stated. "However, Konrad was able to access it again and continue to commit shootings with it. … Konrad admitted to retrieving the firearm from Lothar's residence, and using it to commit multiple shootings as well as the murder of David Guerrero."

Based on those admissions, Lothar Schafer faces a felony charge of culpable negligence for allegedly leaving a loaded firearm within easy access of a minor who uses it to injure or kill someone, records show. He also faces a misdemeanor charge of allowing unlawful possession of a firearm.

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/breakingnews/os-shooting-arrest-murder-osceola-20130820,0,6349959.story

[PaulKersey]

143. possible hate crime