June: Hillary on Snowden's "outrageous behavior"

[ProSense]

Hillary Clinton faults China on NSA leaker flight

MICHAEL R. BLOODJune 25, 2013

LOS ANGELES (AP) — Hillary Rodham Clinton said Monday that China damaged its relationship with the U.S. by allowing National Security Agency leaker Edward Snowden to flee from Hong Kong, despite a U.S. request to arrest him for extradition.

"That kind of action is not only detrimental to the U.S.-China relationship but it sets a bad precedent that could unravel the intricate international agreements about how countries respect the laws — and particularly the extradition treaties," the former secretary of state and possible 2016 presidential contender told an audience in Los Angeles.

Clinton's remarks echoed criticism from White House officials that Hong Kong's refusal to detain Snowden had "unquestionably" hurt relations between the two countries. Hong Kong has a high degree of autonomy from the rest of China, although experts believe Beijing probably orchestrated Snowden's exit in an effort to remove an irritant in relations with the U.S.

Clinton said the former CIA employee engaged in "outrageous behavior" by releasing sensitive documents that he contends show privacy violations by an authoritarian government. Snowden is now in Russia, and the White House wants him sent to the U.S. to face espionage charges.

- more -

http://news.yahoo.com/hillary-clinton-faults-china-nsa-leaker-flight-061609977.html

[hobbit709]

1. CHEESUS!

[ProSense]

6. ? n/t

[hobbit709]

12. "What does it all mean, Mr. Natural?"

It means if you gotta ask, you'll never understand.

[Aerows]

20. :D

[Aerows]

11. Cheesus!

[Puzzledtraveller]

13. CREPES!

[Aerows]

18. Crikey! :D n/t

[R. Daneel Olivaw]

51. Holy Cheesus of Nazerath, Batman!

[Zorra]

2. August: Zorra on Hillary's outrageous behavior

Senate Roll Call: Iraq Resolution

New York Hillary Clinton (D): Yes

[DisgustipatedinCA]

14. Very good response. +1.

[avaistheone1]

39. .SNAP

[snappyturtle]

3. Well, I can add this to the list of reasons I won't support

another Clinton candidacy.

[NuclearDem]

4. Hillary defending the establishment?

Shocked. I mean, SHOCKED to the core, I am.

[dkf]

5. I hope you realize you are doing her no favors.

[Jackpine Radical]

8. To put it in other terms,

"Proceed, Ma'am."

[Aerows]

23. Amen.

When I see someone digging a hole for themselves, I hand them a shovel. Hell, I'll lend them a backhoe

[ProSense]

15. What? It's her opinion. n/t

[dkf]

17. Back then sure...

[ProSense]

21. Are you saying she changed her mind? n/t

[Nuclear Unicorn]

32. I'm sure she's just as wrong now as she was then.

Perhaps even more so.

[Aerows]

26. Stop toying with it.

It will give you germs if you keep playing with it like that!

[ProSense]

27. Things that drive people mad:

disagreeing with them.

[Aerows]

40. LOL

i think there are other ways that people get driven mad, obsessive compulsive disorder is the start. .

[ProSense]

41. It's not

"i think there are other ways that people get driven mad, obsessive compulsive disorder is the start."

...good sign when one pretends to be a pyschologist on the Internets.

[Aerows]

42. It isn't a good sign when

you display traits that anyone who has taken a psychology course can spot from a mile away.

[ProSense]

44. So

"It isn't a good sign when you display traits that anyone who has taken a psychology course can spot from a mile away."

...you're admitting you're not a psychologist, but that you play one on the Internets?

Did you sleep at a Holiday Inn last night?

[Aerows]

46. Maybe

I travel a lot. It doesn't make me stupid or naive. I'm sure I'll have a different opinion when I can actually hit the hay in my own house. Sweet, sweet, fluffy sheets.

[Vinnie From Indy]

7. Add this to the list of why I won't be voting for Hillary

In almost every profession - whether it's law or journalism, finance or medicine or academia or running a small business - people rely on confidential communications to do their jobs. We count on the space of trust that confidentiality provides. When someone breaches that trust, we are all worse off for it.
Hillary Clinton

[HooptieWagon]

9. Pro-War, Pro-TPP, Pro-DLC Hillary?

Nothing she says is of interest to me....nor will she get my vote.

[David Krout]

10. As early as 2011, Greenwald explained how Hillary was a hypocrite and enemy of internet freedom

http://www.salon.com/2011/12/09/hillary_clinton_and_internet_freedom/

If your goal was to paint Hillary as a civil liberties advocate who opposes Snowden, I regret to tell you...wrong choice of person.

[kelliekat44]

48. Yes, and I believe that Greenwald's, Snowden's, and Manning's objective was more to harm

certain people in power than any true motivation for the good of the country. Each one of them has his own personal issues with the US government. They really don't care whom they hurt or how much damage they do to the US of the UK.

[Le Taz Hot]

16. Oh, look. Once again

Hillary is on the wrong side of history. Color me surprised. Not.

[mick063]

19. China is in big, big trouble

Until Walmart sends off another purchase order.

[Puzzledtraveller]

22. Seems like Old Times

[cthulu2016]

24. Like swinging blindly at a Pinata

[hobbit709]

28. And whacking yourself on the head.

[ProSense]

29. Who Hillary? What do you think of her opinion? n/t

[NuclearDem]

30. Guess again. You can take the blindfold off if that helps.

[ProSense]

33. You're responding for the other poster? Do you know that poster's opinion of Hillary's comment? n/t

[NuclearDem]

34. I told you it was okay to take off the blindfold.

It might help you see what the other poster is getting at.

[cthulu2016]

36. NuclearDem is reading for comprehension just fine.

You think that you are rallying support against the devil Snowden, but your flailing is just another Kamikaze attack on the Democratic Party.

Rather than admit your choice of battlefield is impossible to defend you insist on dragging as much of the Party as possible into harm's way.

You are driving a wedge into OUR Party. You motives in doing so are your own.

[ProSense]

38. What do you think of Hillary's comment?

Why can't you comment on her point?

You think that you are rallying support against the devil Snowden, but your flailing is just another Kamikaze attack on the Democratic Party.

Rather than admit your choice of battlefield is impossible to defend you insist on dragging as much of the Party as possible into harm's way.

You are driving a wedge into OUR Party. You motives in doing so are your own.

Maybe you can explain how posting Hillary's opinion is "driving a wedge into OUR Party"?

I look forward to your explanation.

[cthulu2016]

45. I see no profound distinction between Hillary and Obama on this issue, or

on any issue I can think of.

If there is a meaningful policy difference I can not name it.

But I have never seen the Snowden story as about Obama. I doubt that anyone in the 2008 primaries would have handled the wars or surveillance very differently, except Kucinich and Gravel who I consider too loony for the job.

There are a few folks whose interest in hating the NSA appears to be an extension of a general animus toward Obama. I am not one of those people and cannot speak for them.

I voted twice for Obama. I will vote twice for Hillary if she ends up being the Dem nominee twice.

And I will be morally disgusted by a lot of things she will do, as I am with a lot of things Obama does.

None of us asked for a two-party system, but we have one and Dems are better.

I suspect Hillary is a little worse on national security issues than Obama and have never thought for a moment she was on Snowden's side... and I doubt anyone thinks that.

Thus the recycling of old comments to disabuse people of notions that nobody has to begin with appears to be gratuitous shit-stirring, whatever your intent.

If you are trying to smoke out a handful of PUMA racist types (a few probably exist) then that's your game, and have at it. But it's a pretty wedgey game.

[ProSense]

47. "I voted twice for Obama. I will vote twice for Hillary if she ends up being the Dem nominee twice."

I voted twice for Obama. I will vote twice for Hillary if she ends up being the Dem nominee twice.

And I will be morally disgusted by a lot of things she will do, as I am with a lot of things Obama does.

That's good to know.

I suspect Hillary is a little worse on national security issues than Obama and have never thought for a moment she was on Snowden's side... and I doubt anyone thinks that.

Thus the recycling of old comments to disabuse people of notions that nobody has to begin with appears to be gratuitous shit-stirring, whatever your intent.

Hmmm "old comments," huh? Her two-month old opinion on this issue is just extremely relevant. The fact that you consider posting it "shit-stirring" tells me that seeing it posted bothers you more than you admit.

If you are trying to smoke out a handful of PUMA racist types (a few probably exist) then that's your game, and have at it. But it's a pretty wedgey game.

Um, WTF are you talking about? Again, that bizarre deflection tells me you're bother more about seeing Hillary's opinion posted than you admit.

Also, I find it highly disingenouous that someone who posted this (http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023494658) would accuse anyone of "driving a wedge into OUR Party," especially in response to posting Hillary's opinion.

[NuclearDem]

53. No. No, no, no. Calling out the insane abandonment of the left by the DNC

isnt driving a fucking wedge. It's attempting to pull the party back towards the left and get them to stop mocking and betraying the actual leftists who historically have fought like hell for progressive ideas in favor of nominating Wall Street hacks like Booker simply because they're "electable."

You'd realize that if you were an actual progressive rather than just all-but an unpaid DNC intern.

[ProSense]

54. Apparently

No. No, no, no. Calling out the insane abandonment of the left by the DNC

isnt driving a fucking wedge. It's attempting to pull the party back towards the left and get them to stop mocking and betraying the actual leftists who historically have fought like hell for progressive ideas in favor of nominating Wall Street hacks like Booker simply because they're "electable."

You'd realize that if you were an actual progressive rather than just all-but an unpaid DNC intern.

...your idea of an "actual progressive" is silly accusations and name calling.

[R. Daneel Olivaw]

56. Perhaps ND is wrong on remuneration?

[NuclearDem]

58. You would know about silly accusations and name calling wouldn't you?

After all, criticism of Obama is just racism, right?

Fact is, the DNC is dragging the party to the right, and your constant cheerleading is just enabling it.

[ProSense]

62. No, and

You would know about silly accusations and name calling wouldn't you?

After all, criticism of Obama is just racism, right?

Fact is, the DNC is dragging the party to the right, and your constant cheerleading is just enabling it.

...it appears to be your thing, complete with the lame straw man.

[bowens43]

25. blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah.....etc

Your attempts to divert attention away from the real issue, Obama's massive, illegal domestic spy program, are becoming more sad and pathetic every day.

[boston bean]

31. Hillary ought to change her outlook on this. She is wrong! nt

[Broward]

35. What a shame it would be if she is our nominee in 2016

[whatchamacallit]

37. Good thing I don't give a fuck what HC thinks. n/t

[MineralMan]

43. ZOMG! How many times can Hillary be run over by that bus,

and still get elected as the first woman President? That's what I want to know. I hope I'm still around in 2016, so I can find out.

[SwampG8r]

49. i think she is confused

since she seems to think she is talking about "a former CIA employee "
he was a booz allen contract employee in the real world
this is the second time I have seen someone stalwartly defending the undefendable with the addition of this fresh lie

[stevenleser]

65. She's not confused. In addition to other past jobs, he is a former CIA employee.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edward_Snowden#Career

[SwampG8r]

67. i find it interesting

that you will use his claims of being a "cia agent" (and any mention of the cia in the wiki is his own unbacked by any other statement)as pure truth while labeling much else from his mouth as a lie
he was a contract employee of booz allen

[stevenleser]

68. WTF? The NY Times cites him as such, various other media, his own video, etc.

I don't take his word, I take the word of dozens of media who have reported on his resume including, yes, wikipedia. Not to mention, if Snowden had lied about that, the CIA would have disavowed him. I'm sure they would rather not be associated with him at this point.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/jun/09/edward-snowden-nsa-whistleblower-surveillance

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/06/10/us/former-cia-worker-says-he-leaked-surveillance-data.html?pagewanted=all

http://www.policymic.com/articles/47327/edward-snowden-former-cia-employee-revealed-as-prism-whistleblower

http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/ticket/snowden-nsa-leak-whistleblower-cia-204241311.html

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-06-09/nsa-whistleblower-is-29-year-old-american-guardian-reports.html

[Enrique]

50. there goes her reputation as a champion of civil liberties

[HardTimes99]

52. HIllary: Wrong on Iraq, Wrong on the NSA, Just Wrong - nt

[Half-Century Man]

55. After reading all the Snowden threads...

...I have to side with the Constitution. Our current administration has overstepped or allowed overstepping with/by our intelligence industry. We can get a new guard dog, ours current one seems to have rabies. It desperately needs to be driven back into it's den or killed.
I can easily understand how someone opposed to a power wielded by adversary could become enraptured by the same power now in their hands. After watching multiple corruptions from the same source, do we doubt the evil influence of that source?
As far as it being time for any certain type of president. I'm looking for one to end the pointless (yeah I know, the profit for the war mongers is a point; technically) wars we are locked into terror, drugs, etc. At this point I don't care if the candidate was a tattooed transgender Muslim used-to-be sex worker who's grandfather was an escaped nazi war criminal, If they could competently carry out the duties of President of the United States.
Because who you might have been twenty years ago, who might be in your family tree, who you like to have sex with, who or if you worship, or what technique you used to use to urinate, it really doesn't fucking matter.
As long as you understand that there are 317 million Americans, who's lives matter; not just 2000 rich ones.

And I do wonder about Ms. Clinton concerning that point.

[Celefin]

57. Great, thoughtful post.

Thank you.

[RC]

59. Very good post.

Colorful and get the point across. DU can use more like you.

We definitely do need a person who can competently carry out the duties of President of the United States. Someone with an understanding of the Constitution and the Spirit in which it was written. It seems we currently have a Constitutional scholar without either of those qualities.

[ProSense]

60. Really?

"We definitely do need a person who can competently carry out the duties of President of the United States. Someone with an understanding of the Constitution and the Spirit in which it was written. It seems we currently have a Constitutional scholar without either of those qualities."

I think that's the fantasy of those seem to lack an understanding of government.

[RC]

63. Look at who seems to be lacking an understand of government.

Where do you stand on "We the people..." versus the spying on everyone, all the time by our government?

[ProSense]

61. Interesting

"As far as it being time for any certain type of president. I'm looking for one to end the pointless (yeah I know, the profit for the war mongers is a point; technically) wars we are locked into terror, drugs, etc. At this point I don't care if the candidate was a tattooed transgender Muslim used-to-be sex worker who's grandfather was an escaped nazi war criminal, If they could competently carry out the duties of President of the United States. "

...description. Did you have anyone in mind?

[stevenleser]

66. The folks who interpret the Constitution, i.e. Federal appellate courts, disagree.

Since I am sure you are going to disagree with the scores of appellate decisions that contradict you, where is your law degree from?

[Half-Century Man]

69. Of course I disagree with people, I am a human being and would...

...make different decisions based on my experiences.
I want to point out that legal and moral are different things. At one point in our history, we could legally own other human beings. At the same time the morality of that was questioned. Fairly recently, decisions our highest court has made have dumbfounded me. How could a legal construct for profit, a paper entity, have a political conscience?
I suppose it could be argued that a corporation is a sub-society with a motive (trading resources for gain), and, as it is made of actual people, it has a group conscience. I'll counter with as the prime motive is exclusively focused on. The resulting sub-society is driven by gain, that instead of a hive mind we have constructed a hive sociopath. I'm kind of against sharing political power with a known sociopath who lies, pollutes, exploits, and suppresses for profit.

I have no law degree, and maybe by being out in the world interacting with people instead of locking myself in the ivory tower of justice, I might have a better understand of humanity. Just lack the ability to expound in legalese.

[Logical]

64. Nonsense, reporting shit from JUNE now? Classic! n-t