Another Day in Armed America

[Stinky The Clown]

So a shooter goes into an Atlanta area school with an AK-47. He leaves, fires a few bursts and goes back in. The kids run out. The cops show up and capture the gun guy.

Another school full of kids who will forever recall The Day They Shot At My School and Scared Me.

And then, in Oklahoma, three young men, claiming boredom as an excuse, choose a target at random and shoot him in the back as they drive past him in their car. A young man from Australia, in Oklahoma to go to college, will never return home. One of the perps is said to have laughed as he was busted.





Let's have a cheer for the NRA, who work their precious little asses off to keep us awash in guns.

Yeah, I know, guns don't kill people . . . . . . .

[MichiganVote]

1. Freedom...to kill kids and innocent bystanders.

[Junkdrawer]

2. The NRA hates criminals...but protects gun runners.

Try to pass a law, any law, that effectively stops gun running and WAIT for the howls.

[gopiscrap]

3. Fucking nut assholes who support the NRA

and excuse this shit!

[spin]

4. So how do we solve this problem? ...

First I should mention that I strongly support gun rights. However earlier this year I had some hope that our national gun laws could be improved in the following manner:

1) Universal background checks for the sale of all firearms would pass and become law.

2) The NICS background check system would be improved and all states would be required to add the names of those who are violent criminals or who have been legally adjudged as having serious mental issues to the NICS data base on a timely fashion.

3) The punishment for the straw purchase of firearms and the smuggling of such firearms into the inner cities of our streets would be increased significantly. More federal money would be spent to stop these activities.

These simple steps seemed possible after the Newtown school shooting. Unfortunately the gun control advocates pushed for more draconian measures such as a new assault weapons ban.

So instead of passing some reasonably effective laws, both sides of the debate ended up calling each other names. Many people feared new laws would pass and rushed down to the local gun stores to buy firearms and ammo and cleaned off the shelves. Gun shows had lines awaiting entry that stretched around the block. Membership in the NRA increased dramatically.

Today many people who never owned a firearm now do and many lack the basic safety training to safely handle such a dangerous item. Many gun owners who did not own a "black rifle" now do and have also bought a number of high cap magazines for their new toy. Gun owners bought even more firearms and now many have what could be considered an arsenal along with thousands and thousands of rounds for their weapons.

I also fear that the push for strong gun control will lead to the loss of many seats at state and national level held by good Democrats. Republicans and the Tea Party will definitely use their opposition to another assault weapons ban to gain votes and may win many tight elections.

The waters for the chances of improving existing gun laws have been poisoned by the overreach of the gun control advocates and the media. Today more people who have little reason to own a firearm now have one. Many are not target shooters or hunters. Many live in safe areas and have little to fear from criminals and lack the training to be able to effectively stop a criminal from breaking into their home with their firearm and are unwilling to spend the time and effort to gain proficiency with their new weapon. Many will refuse to store their weapons properly.

The sad part is that now both sides have cemented themselves into a position and refuse any compromise.

At this time I see little hope of passing new gun legislation at the national level although it is still possible at state level. I find this extremely disappointing.

[LearningCurve]

6. I'd like to concur and add number 4

Require all sold guns and bullets to be fingerprinted. Let the gun manufacturers pass along the cost of doing so to the consumer. If a gun or ammo gets lost or stolen, it must be reported immediately by law.

[spin]

9. I seriously doubt that your idea has any chance of becoming law ...

and even if it did, I doubt that it would be effective.

I'm not quite sure what you mean by fingerprinting. If you are referring a system where the firearm micro stamps the ammo when fired, this could easily be defeated by a file. Micro stamping the ammo during production might lead to finding the criminal by the rounds ejected from a pistol but then the criminal could simply use a revolver which does not eject fired rounds.

Of course a criminal could also use a stolen firearm and simply throw it away after he shot someone.

One idea I would support is to require anyone who wishes to buy ammo to have a card indicating that he had a background check and firearm safety training. This would be somewhat similar to the card a scuba diver uses to buy air for his tanks.

[LearningCurve]

11. It has the benefit of being Constitutional

Not that isn't still a fight. But by fingerprinting, yes, I do mean something like that. I'd like to find a way to do it that's difficult to work around, of course. However, I think this is simply a matter of desiring to do it.

[spin]

12. The major problem is that you have to convince enough people to agree with you...

and they have to elect representatives who will vote for your idea.

One major hurdle is the Senate in the U.S. congress. Many smaller states strongly support gun rights but they have the same number of Senators as the larger states who support gun control.

Of course your idea could pass at the state level in the states which do favor strong gun control. In fact we have seen strong gun control measures pass in states like New York.

The gun control issue is so controversial that I expect to see no major laws pass until after the mid term elections. Of course that assumes that we don't have more tragedies like the Newtown shooting.

Time will tell.

[LearningCurve]

13. Completely agree

The issue is, this really has to be done nationally, not state by state to be effective, excepting maybe Hawaii. Maryland tried this for a while, and it lead to solving only one homicide, I believe. It's the same reason gun control doesn't work in Chicago. Unless you do it everywhere, you can just get guns in places less restrictive.

[X_Digger]

15. New York scrapped their 'fingerprinting' system.

COBIS, I believe it was called- it *helped* solve one case- 11 years, $44 million dollars.

[LearningCurve]

17. Didn't realize New York had one

Thanks for letting me know. The only way it works, is if is done nationwide. Otherwise, you just get your guns elsewhere.

[X_Digger]

19. No, the problem is that fingerprinting doesn't work after 250 rounds.

If you have a gun that *just* fired a round, and the round isn't *too* damaged, you can get a match with a sufficient confidence interval. That confidence interval drops with every additional round fired from it.

Human fingerprints don't change much- you carry the same fingerprint at 80 years old you did at birth. The same can't be said for firearms. Rounds leave deposits of carbon, lead, and copper in the chamber and barrel. Even regular maintenance like cleaning can alter the 'fingerprint' of a firearm.

That's why older firearms often have barrels that are 'shot out' and have to be replaced- the process of firing rounds through them causes the rifling in the barrel (and therefore the 'fingerprint') to get slowly wiped away.

eta: And that doesn't take into account how simple a barrel swap is in most firearms.

[Boom Sound 416]

5. It seems the three in OK were under 18

Unless they had a hunting rifle, I doubt it was a legal carry to begin with

[Stinky The Clown]

7. At least one, I heard, was 25.

The youngest was 17.

[Boom Sound 416]

8. Yeah, seems to he a lot of conflicting reports right now

[one_voice]

10. So what do we do?

We can't un-arm everyone.

A ban on high capacity magazines would be fucking awesome.

Close the gun show loophole.

No private sales

Rigid background checks.

Re-checks every year.

Gun safety classes required

add to the list

[uponit7771]

16. Yes we can un-arm everyone. Give the penalty for being armed REALLY high and pay people a lot of

...money for their guns..

Carrot and stick, I think that's what they did in Oz

[one_voice]

20. Oz the HBO show...

or the Wizard of OZ and I'm not remember something big...

[uponit7771]

14. ALEC et al think we need more guns, this crap is sick

[WorseBeforeBetter]

18. And from North Carolina...

Four shot in Craven Co.

Vanceboro, N.C. — Authorities in Craven County said at least four people were shot near Vanceboro Tuesday evening.

Representatives of Duke Energy Progress told WNCT that some of the victims worked for contractor Townsend Trees and were clearing branches around power lines at the time of the shooting.

According to the Craven County Sheriff's Department, the person who initiated the shooting was shot by deputies, and that person along with the three victims was taken to an area hospital.

The identities of those involved, any motive and their conditions were not released Tuesday night.

http://www.wral.com/two-shot-in-craven-co-/12798932/