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Jackpine Radical

(45,274 posts)
Wed Aug 21, 2013, 09:55 AM Aug 2013

How can anyone with even a minimal awareness of Surveillancegate

not see that the Adults in the Room are doing everything they can to shut down whistleblowers and critics of the Establishment?

And that Establishment is a single coin with two sides. When the "D" side is up, peripheral policies are enacted so that things get a little better for gays, women & little kids, and when the "R" side is up, the peripheral policies tend to favor the fundamentalist authoritarian part of the Booboisie, but no matter which side is up, the core agenda moves along.

Social Security is at risk. The corporations tighten their grip. High-tech surveillance sends its tentacles around the globe like a metastasizing cancer, ultimately invading the brain of every human being on the planet. The playing field continues to tip. Money finds ways to accumulate more money, at the expense of all humane values.

Nobody except a few "fringe leftists" (who are carefully kept far from the levers of power) dares challenge the oil companies, the military machine, or the industries that support them. Keystone rumbles ahead with the blessing of the State Department despite the clear warnings from a few honest souls in the Department of Interior.

People like DiFi and Eric Cantor are, first and foremost, oligarchs, and only secondarily Republicans or Democrats; their party branding has about as much significance as the "flags of convenience" flown by the superships that bring Walmart's plastic trash from China.

78 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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How can anyone with even a minimal awareness of Surveillancegate (Original Post) Jackpine Radical Aug 2013 OP
K&R! Fire Walk With Me Aug 2013 #1
Rec #5 an off to the Greatest Page Lifelong Protester Aug 2013 #2
We are screwn tk2kewl Aug 2013 #3
I would not count on that. zeemike Aug 2013 #9
K & R Vinnie From Indy Aug 2013 #4
I know! snooper2 Aug 2013 #5
Unbelievable, isn't it? Obviously, though, loyalty to a political leader/party is what it's all MotherPetrie Aug 2013 #6
I can't wrap my brain around that. bvar22 Aug 2013 #43
Excellent summary. Thank you. K&R n/t OneGrassRoot Aug 2013 #7
K&R G_j Aug 2013 #8
Nailed it! N_E_1 for Tennis Aug 2013 #10
They know that in the near future they will be overrun with problems like climate change, Nay Aug 2013 #18
This. CrispyQ Aug 2013 #22
There is a way out, but it would require radical changes, Jackpine Radical Aug 2013 #23
Flags of convenience, indeed. JEB Aug 2013 #11
DURec leftstreet Aug 2013 #12
Kick and Rec. Fuddnik Aug 2013 #13
HUGE K & R !!! - THANK YOU !!! WillyT Aug 2013 #14
Some only see or hear what they choose to. LWolf Aug 2013 #15
I stand... onyourleft Aug 2013 #25
Agree 100% bvar22 Aug 2013 #44
,,,or that mosquito that buzzes your ear.....right as your ready to snappyturtle Aug 2013 #58
Three run shot to the upper deck by Jackpine. Scuba Aug 2013 #16
K&R Arctic Dave Aug 2013 #17
70-90% of Americans want gun registration, SS, Plan E, peace, no fracking, etc.--but the bounds of MisterP Aug 2013 #19
Funny you should mention that partisan fanatic thing. Jackpine Radical Aug 2013 #20
on top of that, it's "da Bears" nt MisterP Aug 2013 #21
"Adults in the Room" belongs in sarcastic / scare quotes. DirkGently Aug 2013 #24
Surveillancegate? Summer Hathaway Aug 2013 #26
OMG--You must have hacked into Jackpine Radical Aug 2013 #28
Actually, no Summer Hathaway Aug 2013 #31
**Blush** Jackpine Radical Aug 2013 #33
No need to blush ... Summer Hathaway Aug 2013 #35
OMG again-- Jackpine Radical Aug 2013 #36
Hmmmm ... Summer Hathaway Aug 2013 #41
Are you blinded? RobertEarl Aug 2013 #30
Along with any semblance of intelligent discussion, Summer Hathaway Aug 2013 #32
then why are you even here? nt grasswire Aug 2013 #52
More and more Americans see this, but what to do about it... polichick Aug 2013 #27
I'm playing with that question. Jackpine Radical Aug 2013 #29
'voting them out' doesnt work because markiv Aug 2013 #37
Our neighbors in Latin America have given us a Blue Print for "change". bvar22 Aug 2013 #45
Excellent point - that is the blueprint! Thanks :) polichick Aug 2013 #47
'When the "D" side is up, peripheral policies are enacted so that things get a little better for' markiv Aug 2013 #34
I wish more people had asked that question in 2006... LanternWaste Aug 2013 #38
It was obviously happening then, but we had a solution. Jackpine Radical Aug 2013 #40
You mean on DEMOCRATIC underground there are people that like the Democratic party Johonny Aug 2013 #39
So why is Obama asking for Bushco to be immune to war crimes prosecution Hydra Aug 2013 #42
I keep trying to point out that Anarchists are trying to take over Democratic Underground... VanillaRhapsody Aug 2013 #54
Anarchists? I thought they were Libertarians? neverforget Aug 2013 #57
Who knows at this point....they just hate Democrats..... on a Democrat blog.... VanillaRhapsody Aug 2013 #59
Who hates Democrats? Can you point them out? neverforget Aug 2013 #60
"two sides of the same coin" ring a bell? But otherwise hang around and see it for yourself! VanillaRhapsody Aug 2013 #61
I've been here since July 2001. neverforget Aug 2013 #62
Oh good gawd! VanillaRhapsody Aug 2013 #63
Never used those names or any other name. So Good God yourself. neverforget Aug 2013 #64
So then what is your point....because YOU didn't didn't use those...YOU get to berate me? VanillaRhapsody Aug 2013 #65
You're the one that used those names. neverforget Aug 2013 #66
Neither...did you actually have anything to add...or are you just policing the area? VanillaRhapsody Aug 2013 #67
Am I getting on your nerves for calling you out on calling people neverforget Aug 2013 #68
nope not at all...you are just boring....anything of substance to add...or is your butt still hurt VanillaRhapsody Aug 2013 #69
lol. called what? neverforget Aug 2013 #71
KUDOS, & a DUREC! bvar22 Aug 2013 #46
K&R! n/t Catherina Aug 2013 #48
Yep. kentuck Aug 2013 #49
"...'flags of convenience' flown by the superships that bring Walmart's plastic trash from China." scarletwoman Aug 2013 #50
Rage, rage Jackpine Radical Aug 2013 #53
Back atcha, JR! scarletwoman Aug 2013 #55
Well that's all certainly mutual. Jackpine Radical Aug 2013 #56
I don't know, maybe those that can't see are the lucky ones Bonobo Aug 2013 #74
'They' do say chervilant Aug 2013 #76
Turn yourself in. Immediately. PETRUS Aug 2013 #51
k&r n/t RainDog Aug 2013 #70
A Hero of mine Tommy Douglas spoke about this enigmatic Aug 2013 #72
Thanks, I had to go to youtube to see it though. Error came up and it stopped here. n/t AnotherDreamWeaver Aug 2013 #75
An extremely succinct and clear vision of the current situation. K&R. nt Bonobo Aug 2013 #73
Still think there's no difference? Bernardo de La Paz Aug 2013 #77
I didn't exactly say there is no difference, now, did I? Jackpine Radical Aug 2013 #78
 

tk2kewl

(18,133 posts)
3. We are screwn
Wed Aug 21, 2013, 09:59 AM
Aug 2013

We are not far from a time when dissent==terrorism.

When the climate and/or economy really tanks in the next decade or two, I fully expect Cairo's in the western world.

zeemike

(18,998 posts)
9. I would not count on that.
Wed Aug 21, 2013, 10:19 AM
Aug 2013

This country is too well controlled and manipulated for mass uprising
They know full well how to keep us divided and fighting among ourselves for such a thing.

 

snooper2

(30,151 posts)
5. I know!
Wed Aug 21, 2013, 10:04 AM
Aug 2013

And meanwhile some lucky folks at Motor Trend are burning the tires of a range of cars in this years Best Drivers Car of the year contest.







 

MotherPetrie

(3,145 posts)
6. Unbelievable, isn't it? Obviously, though, loyalty to a political leader/party is what it's all
Wed Aug 21, 2013, 10:07 AM
Aug 2013

About, not consistency to core principles -- for some who are eager to defend what would be condemned if it came from/when it came from the other side.

bvar22

(39,909 posts)
43. I can't wrap my brain around that.
Wed Aug 21, 2013, 05:42 PM
Aug 2013

Pledging blind allegiance to a Person or a Political Party
over PRINCIPLE is alien to me.
My parents and mentors taught me that THAT was something that should raise Red Flags.

Historically, other cultures and societies have demanded that type of blind allegiance.
Historically, they ALL ended badly.

N_E_1 for Tennis

(9,664 posts)
10. Nailed it!
Wed Aug 21, 2013, 11:05 AM
Aug 2013

Money aside, power aside, what and why is the real agenda that we are kept in the dark about?
Tin foil hat time I know.

But, really and why?

Then what the hell can we do? How do we fight back to regain the liberties we enjoyed?

Shedding a light on the problem is a first step, understanding is the second. I have no idea.
All I have are questions. I feel we, in this time, will have no answer. I'm too old to wait for the answer, I fear.

I will continue to support the "D" side of the coin because it will make life a little more tolerable than the other side.

Thank you for your post.

Nay

(12,051 posts)
18. They know that in the near future they will be overrun with problems like climate change,
Wed Aug 21, 2013, 01:01 PM
Aug 2013

overpopulation, resource scarcity, etc., and they are putting the scaffolding in place that will control the masses sufficiently to avoid 1) their own overthrow, and 2) a complete dieout of the human race. IMO, the second reason is a distant second; their own safety is paramount. If you will be useful to them, maybe they will take you on as a servant, but otherwise you get to die with the rest.

CrispyQ

(36,424 posts)
22. This.
Wed Aug 21, 2013, 02:30 PM
Aug 2013

They are building the apparatus while looting the commons. When the water wars get going, well, won't that be interesting? In WWII when America had rationing, everyone got ration stamps. My mother, who was just a little girl, had her own booklet. She was a citizen, so she was entitled to an allotment of the ration.

This time? Pft. Rationing will be done by bank account. If you can afford it you can buy it, if not, tough shit. Oh, we're talking about water? Well, if you weren't such a loser you could afford it. Tough shit for you, bully for me. This is the culture you get when everything is for profit, when things have more value than people, when greed is good.

"Imagine no possessions, I wonder if you can?"

Personally, the way we've treated the planet & the other living beings on it, I think we deserve to be tossed into the evolutionary dustbin of history. Too bad we decided to trash the joint.

Jackpine Radical

(45,274 posts)
23. There is a way out, but it would require radical changes,
Wed Aug 21, 2013, 02:33 PM
Aug 2013

most profoundly so in individual and cultural values.

LWolf

(46,179 posts)
15. Some only see or hear what they choose to.
Wed Aug 21, 2013, 12:26 PM
Aug 2013

If they have an investment in the Establishment, they aren't going to acknowledge anything that doesn't make the Establishment look good.

It's dishonest, it's immoral, it's unethical, it's hypocritical, and it's imbecilic. In my opinion.


bvar22

(39,909 posts)
44. Agree 100%
Wed Aug 21, 2013, 05:46 PM
Aug 2013
"It's dishonest, it's immoral, it's unethical, it's hypocritical, and it's imbecilic,"


AND its ALL over DU like that idiot who runs around naked at a football game.

snappyturtle

(14,656 posts)
58. ,,,or that mosquito that buzzes your ear.....right as your ready to
Wed Aug 21, 2013, 09:56 PM
Aug 2013

drift off to sleep. What I dislike about it here is that is shuts
down honest disccourse and instead a snark fest ensues.

MisterP

(23,730 posts)
19. 70-90% of Americans want gun registration, SS, Plan E, peace, no fracking, etc.--but the bounds of
Wed Aug 21, 2013, 02:19 PM
Aug 2013

acceptable discourse have been moved to deliberately exclude that, while the two parties fight tooth and nail to 1) make it seem like a choice and 2) generate content-free partisan fanatics to defend the system

Jackpine Radical

(45,274 posts)
20. Funny you should mention that partisan fanatic thing.
Wed Aug 21, 2013, 02:27 PM
Aug 2013

I got an email from my state party chair this morning & glanced at it before deleting it. He had the temerity to make a football analogy out of Walker & Ryan, comparing them to "the Vikings and the Bears." It almost made me gag, not just because of his thoughtless banalizing of true evil, but because of the transparent "Rah Team Rah" appeal to "team spirit" at the level of sports fandom.

Summer Hathaway

(2,770 posts)
31. Actually, no
Wed Aug 21, 2013, 03:12 PM
Aug 2013

I think I got the info from Obama - he called me right after reading all of your emails and listening to all of your phone calls.



Jackpine Radical

(45,274 posts)
33. **Blush**
Wed Aug 21, 2013, 03:29 PM
Aug 2013

I'm so flattered--I had no idea he was paying so much attention to Li'l Ol' Me. I was sure he had my case farmed out to some underling.

Summer Hathaway

(2,770 posts)
35. No need to blush ...
Wed Aug 21, 2013, 03:37 PM
Aug 2013

I will never breathe a word of what he told me to another soul - unless, of course, there's a tell-all book deal in it for me!

Summer Hathaway

(2,770 posts)
41. Hmmmm ...
Wed Aug 21, 2013, 04:03 PM
Aug 2013

Actually, I do.

But I didn't get that story from Obama. I got it from Yahoo News.

As they say, there is no real privacy on the internet.

Really, JP, you are one very naughty (but highly creative) boy.

 

RobertEarl

(13,685 posts)
30. Are you blinded?
Wed Aug 21, 2013, 03:10 PM
Aug 2013

You can not see that the Adults in the Room are doing everything they can to shut down whistleblowers and critics of the Establishment?

All you have is this BS for us? Calling JPR a fox news employee really does make you look awful. You should be ashamed of yourself. An apology is in order.

Summer Hathaway

(2,770 posts)
32. Along with any semblance of intelligent discussion,
Wed Aug 21, 2013, 03:14 PM
Aug 2013

DU has also lost its sense of humor.

No surprise there - I find that one usually follows the other.

polichick

(37,152 posts)
27. More and more Americans see this, but what to do about it...
Wed Aug 21, 2013, 03:03 PM
Aug 2013

has yet to be tackled.

The old "vote them out" plan doesn't work when neither party works for the people.

WHAT NOW? is the question.

bvar22

(39,909 posts)
45. Our neighbors in Latin America have given us a Blue Print for "change".
Wed Aug 21, 2013, 05:54 PM
Aug 2013

In many Latin American countries, their People have successfully wrested their governments back from the hands of the Global 1%
in near bloodless Ballot Box Revolutions.
It begins with "None of the Above".

The had one advantage that we don't have.
They have transparent, verifiable democratic elections in most Latin American countries.
We no longer have those in the USA.
Our elections were Privatized with the active support of BOTH dominant Parties, so we will have to deal with that first.

When the Working Class & The Poor realize WE have more in common with each other
than we have in common with the Ruling 1% and their Mouth Pieces in Washington,
THEN we can have "change" too!

Spread the WORD.
It CAN happen here too.
VIVA Democracy!
I pray we get some here soon!



You will know them by their [font size=3]WORKS.[/font]

 

markiv

(1,489 posts)
34. 'When the "D" side is up, peripheral policies are enacted so that things get a little better for'
Wed Aug 21, 2013, 03:36 PM
Aug 2013

boy, isn't that the truth

and i'm so tired of being scolded by those who are most concerned about those peripheral policies that i'm obligated to turn a blind eye to everything else and obediently vote in support of those peripheral policies

 

LanternWaste

(37,748 posts)
38. I wish more people had asked that question in 2006...
Wed Aug 21, 2013, 03:46 PM
Aug 2013

I wish more people had asked that very question in 2006...

Johonny

(20,819 posts)
39. You mean on DEMOCRATIC underground there are people that like the Democratic party
Wed Aug 21, 2013, 03:51 PM
Aug 2013

and don't see every move by Obama as a secret move to undermine humanity. A guy that violated the law went to jail. I'm shocked. Damn you Obama!

Seriously this is the democratic underground and while pointing out areas your disagree with party policy is common the tired two sides of the same coin is generally laughed at. Or at least it used to be...

Hydra

(14,459 posts)
42. So why is Obama asking for Bushco to be immune to war crimes prosecution
Wed Aug 21, 2013, 05:17 PM
Aug 2013

While demanding life in jail for Bradley Manning for exposing those crimes?

1 + 1 = 2. Pretty simple math going on here.

 

VanillaRhapsody

(21,115 posts)
54. I keep trying to point out that Anarchists are trying to take over Democratic Underground...
Wed Aug 21, 2013, 09:44 PM
Aug 2013

Now they are all on a blog CALLED Democratic Underground...trashing ALL Democrats! Its like a coup attempt. If they hate the Party so much why are they still in the pool? Shouldn't they just throw their own?

 

VanillaRhapsody

(21,115 posts)
59. Who knows at this point....they just hate Democrats..... on a Democrat blog....
Wed Aug 21, 2013, 10:12 PM
Aug 2013

and then cannot understand why "everyone doesn't agree with them". It is entertaining I will stay that.

neverforget

(9,436 posts)
60. Who hates Democrats? Can you point them out?
Wed Aug 21, 2013, 11:22 PM
Aug 2013

Can you point out the words they use to display their hatred of Democrats?

neverforget

(9,436 posts)
62. I've been here since July 2001.
Wed Aug 21, 2013, 11:34 PM
Aug 2013

I've seen it all including people like you who start labeling people Libertarians and Anarchists because they disagree with your view.

 

VanillaRhapsody

(21,115 posts)
65. So then what is your point....because YOU didn't didn't use those...YOU get to berate me?
Wed Aug 21, 2013, 11:52 PM
Aug 2013

How superior of you! Good Gawd indeed.

neverforget

(9,436 posts)
68. Am I getting on your nerves for calling you out on calling people
Wed Aug 21, 2013, 11:57 PM
Aug 2013

Libertarians or Anarchists? Is that adding anything by calling other people names?

 

VanillaRhapsody

(21,115 posts)
69. nope not at all...you are just boring....anything of substance to add...or is your butt still hurt
Wed Aug 21, 2013, 11:59 PM
Aug 2013

over being called that?

at least try to write something half entertaining..it passes the time better.

bvar22

(39,909 posts)
46. KUDOS, & a DUREC!
Wed Aug 21, 2013, 05:56 PM
Aug 2013

Great last line:
[font size=3]"their party branding has about as much significance as the "flags of convenience" flown by the superships that bring Walmart's plastic trash from China. "[/font]




You will know them by their [font size=3]WORKS.[/font]




scarletwoman

(31,893 posts)
50. "...'flags of convenience' flown by the superships that bring Walmart's plastic trash from China."
Wed Aug 21, 2013, 09:29 PM
Aug 2013

Brilliant analogy, man! And, brilliant OP! Well and succinctly said!

Yes, "the core agenda moves on." I pity the folks who cannot or will not see this. It's just going to keep getting more and more difficult for them to keep trying to distract from, and paper over, the hard truth. The apologists for power can revile and mock those who refuse to go gentle into this dark night, but I'll side with those who'd rather die on their feet than live on their knees.

sw

Jackpine Radical

(45,274 posts)
53. Rage, rage
Wed Aug 21, 2013, 09:43 PM
Aug 2013

against the dying of the light.

Hi SW. Been meaning to be in closer touch, but things got away from me this year.

scarletwoman

(31,893 posts)
55. Back atcha, JR!
Wed Aug 21, 2013, 09:52 PM
Aug 2013

Please don't worry about not being in touch - you are always close to me, whether we're in touch or not. And I'm always immeasurably cheered to see a post from you here!


sw

Jackpine Radical

(45,274 posts)
56. Well that's all certainly mutual.
Wed Aug 21, 2013, 09:55 PM
Aug 2013

Always a delight to see one of yours, knowing that you have dropped another kernel of sanity & wisdom into the ferment.

Bonobo

(29,257 posts)
74. I don't know, maybe those that can't see are the lucky ones
Thu Aug 22, 2013, 12:14 AM
Aug 2013

They think they're eating a juicy steak.



chervilant

(8,267 posts)
76. 'They' do say
Thu Aug 22, 2013, 07:36 AM
Aug 2013

"Ignorance is bliss!" for good reason.

(Also, I see lots more folks on DU seeking the wisdom we're gonna need to weather these turbulent times -- so the sanctimonious snarks from the hothouse flower(s) herein above do not surprise...)

Bernardo de La Paz

(48,965 posts)
77. Still think there's no difference?
Thu Aug 22, 2013, 09:35 AM
Aug 2013
People like DiFi and Eric Cantor are, first and foremost, oligarchs, and only secondarily Republicans or Democrats; their party branding has about as much significance as the "flags of convenience" flown by the superships that bring Walmart's plastic trash from China.


Think there's no difference between the parties? This doesn't count?

www.democraticunderground.com/10023501371

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