General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsCheck in here to support an immediate pardon for Bradley Manning.
There is no way in hell that that kid deserves to spend 35 years in a military just for making sure that the world knows the truth.
And it's bullshit to say that Nixon should've been pardoned but Manning shouldn't.
Autumn
(44,980 posts)rec
forestpath
(3,102 posts)NuclearDem
(16,184 posts)Cram the war criminals into his jail cell instead.
liberal_at_heart
(12,081 posts)Tierra_y_Libertad
(50,414 posts)HardTimes99
(2,049 posts)markpkessinger
(8,392 posts)gopiscrap
(23,726 posts)until Obama's last day in office.
RC
(25,592 posts)I think we all know why.
But anyway, count me in too. I think he should have been released with a General Discharge and time served.
gopiscrap
(23,726 posts)Obama? Didn't he say something negative about what Manning did? I'm thinking he did.
gopiscrap
(23,726 posts)RC
(25,592 posts)Not much, in fact he has committed his own, some of which Manning exposed.
sinkingfeeling
(51,438 posts)Hayduke Bomgarte
(1,965 posts)HardTimes99
(2,049 posts)DisgustipatedinCA
(12,530 posts)zipplewrath
(16,646 posts)Time serve and abuse endured.
Mc Mike
(9,111 posts)'Scooter Libby' got one before his judicial paths were exhausted.
And his leak actually endangered national security, to boot.
markiv
(1,489 posts)Both betrayed confidentiality agreements but
Snowden released more of a condensed conclusion of direct interest to American citizens
whereas Manning did more of a 'data dump' of massive amounts of information/documents
for a revelation against policy to be morally compelling, it has to be more surgical, revealing no more than is necessary to make the point
NoMoreWarNow
(1,259 posts)that was a massive dump to the NYTimes.
markiv
(1,489 posts)and elsberg was part of the study, part of the 'work product' was his
it was not jusr a 'data dump'
zipplewrath
(16,646 posts)Although one might make a case for some of the filtering, the stuff one might filter out is probably the least damaging of the release. And really, the point in many ways was the totality of what was going on, not any single thing.
markiv
(1,489 posts)the issue was breaching security by leaking a document
if you're going to make an arguement that it was justified (and i think to a large degree snowden is), the burdon of proof is on the leaker for *each document leaked* that it was necessary
the process has to leave in place the integrity of the concept of document security, because it is a legitimate necessity for any government, good or bad
no government can allow or excuse massive data dumps of classified documents
FiveGoodMen
(20,018 posts)Hydra
(14,459 posts)But this Admin has said "Fuck Bradley Manning."
This is how they wanted it, in fact they wanted more time for him.
Pardon Manning!!
AnotherDreamWeaver
(2,849 posts)fasttense
(17,301 posts)sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)rescind the verdict, throw it out.
A pardon implies guilt and forgiveness. He did not commit any crimes.
But I agree with the spirit of your OP, completelyl.
Ken Burch
(50,254 posts)My point is, it seemed to me to be the only way to get the kid out.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)for once.
ljm2002
(10,751 posts)He deserves it.
K&R
Laelth
(32,017 posts)-Laelth
DreamGypsy
(2,252 posts)We petition the Obama administration to: Restore the United States human rights record and grant clemency to Pvt. Bradley Manning!
Ken Burch
(50,254 posts)totodeinhere
(13,056 posts)leftstreet
(36,098 posts)BuelahWitch
(9,083 posts)WillyT
(72,631 posts)snappyturtle
(14,656 posts)MisterP
(23,730 posts)DLevine
(1,788 posts)Spitfire of ATJ
(32,723 posts)Joe would do it for a price...
....you betcha....
Fuddnik
(8,846 posts)TinkerTot55
(198 posts)Manning should've been sentenced to time served.......since he was actually TORTURED ( severe mental cruelty, deprivation, isolation, etc. ) which amounted to cruel and unusual punishment.
Try the damn war criminals from the Bush, Sr. through Bush Jr. years, AND the financial miscreants who nearly toppled the civilized world, and THEN we can talk "justice" for people like Manning and Snowden.
neohippie
(1,142 posts)The Truth should set us all free
Laughing Mirror
(4,185 posts)for how generous they were, bringing it down from two life sentences to one, with time off for good behavior, of course.
99th_Monkey
(19,326 posts)Blue State Bandit
(2,122 posts)MotherPetrie
(3,145 posts)countmyvote4real
(4,023 posts)Egalitarian Thug
(12,448 posts)grntuscarora
(1,249 posts)nt
SammyWinstonJack
(44,129 posts)historylovr
(1,557 posts)Daniel537
(1,560 posts)christx30
(6,241 posts)Deserves immediate pardon.
Rebellious Republican
(5,029 posts)Blue_In_AK
(46,436 posts)so should Bradley Manning. It's more dangerous to report on war crimes than it is to commit them.
Mira
(22,380 posts)benld74
(9,901 posts)KaryninMiami
(3,073 posts)Just outrageous - and totally unnecessary. K&R
JoeyT
(6,785 posts)I don't have much hope of it happening, but it's the right thing to do.
Jack Rabbit
(45,984 posts). . . and while you're at it, Mr. President, stop spying on us.
caseymoz
(5,763 posts)Demo_Chris
(6,234 posts)Skeeter Barnes
(994 posts)PowerToThePeople
(9,610 posts)Ninga
(8,272 posts)krispos42
(49,445 posts)...and he hears strange and alarming noises coming from a house.
He jumps the fence and peers through a window to see a young, nude girl being beaten by a man. He takes a video with his phone, then calls the cops.
The cops arrive and proceed to arrest the caller for trespassing, voyeurism, creating child pornography, and possessing child pornography.
The abusive man is neither investigated nor charged. Ever.
Justice?
WHEN CRABS ROAR
(3,813 posts)What is this country so afraid of?
The truth?
The Magistrate
(95,243 posts)The sentence handed down is extremely unjust.
Anything more than time served, particularly given the torturous conditions of confinement, shocks the conscience.
kardonb
(777 posts)ABSOLUTELY NOT !! He got off far too lightly .
Ken Burch
(50,254 posts)Support for harshness towards this kid can't be consistent with support for any progressive or humanistic ideas at all...if you defend the national security state, you are defending every horrible thing the U.S. ever did in the world.
And you do realize that he will probably be killed by somebody if he spends any significant amount of time in a normal military prison.
RoccoR5955
(12,471 posts)But commute his sentence to time already served.
That way nobody could say that he did no time for his "crime."
colsohlibgal
(5,275 posts)burnodo
(2,017 posts)Another whistleblower who must face the wrath of the totalitarian state.
NoMoreWarNow
(1,259 posts)too bad he's not an elite fucktard like Bush and Cheney
yurbud
(39,405 posts)for military folks, especially those who expose rather than commit war crimes.
faithnomore
(41 posts)He should be pardoned immediately and the major players in the Bush administration should serve his 35 years.
Myrina
(12,296 posts)nt
samsingh
(17,590 posts)DinahMoeHum
(21,774 posts).
morningfog
(18,115 posts)mike_c
(36,269 posts)eom
winter is coming
(11,785 posts)PatrynXX
(5,668 posts)n/t
Ken Burch
(50,254 posts)DonCoquixote
(13,616 posts)even though I hate spying, he was actually spying for us, as opposed to GG wanting 15 minutes of fame.
bvar22
(39,909 posts)but for THIS one,
DURec!
You will know them by their [font size=3]WORKS.[/font]
Cryptoad
(8,254 posts)better recount yall's numbers.... most Democrats feel he is Traitor and a thief and got off too easy!
Ken Burch
(50,254 posts)Like everyone else here, you speak only for yourself.
Why would you ever defend a life-destroying sentence for a man who did no harm? There was no reason, for example, that the secret U.S. Army murder of a journalist in Iraq should ever have been KEPT secret...or should ever have happened.
None of the secrets Manning revealed were ever aimed at any honorable or progressive objectives-the national security state HAS no non-evil intentions.
Maineman
(854 posts)Justice in this country is as poor as the distribution of wealth. Sooner or later, things are going to explode.
Hell Hath No Fury
(16,327 posts)Free Manning!
the_sly_pig
(740 posts)rainy
(6,088 posts)libodem
(19,288 posts)Kick
Agony
(2,605 posts)redgreenandblue
(2,088 posts)Enthusiast
(50,983 posts)Throw the REAL criminals in prison, like the Wall Street fraudsters, the torturers, and the war profiteers.
Mickju
(1,797 posts)99Forever
(14,524 posts)Fucking murdering, torturing, thieving monsters not just walking free, but getting filthy fucking rich and not even being prosecuted, let alone sentenced to the terms they DESERVE. But tell the truth about their crimes and get 35 years.
How's that "look forward" horseshit working?
Response to Ken Burch (Original post)
Name removed Message auto-removed
Mokito
(717 posts)nt
Lugnut
(9,791 posts)1monster
(11,012 posts)tardybar
(22 posts)Fm
cascadiance
(19,537 posts)to slap our increasingly FASCIST government in the face!
Gator_Matt
(188 posts)The cockroaches in government don't like having the light shone on them.
another_liberal
(8,821 posts)Send Dick Cheney and George W. to prison.
Rockyj
(538 posts)after reading how Bradley comforted his legal team.
"He said Manning looked at him and said: Its OK. Its all right, dont worry about it. I know you did your best. Its OK. Im gonna be OK. Im gonna get through this.
Coombs added: Im in a position where my client is cheering me up. That shouldnt happen, but he is a resilient young man. If nothing else, he is resilient, for sure.
http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2013/08/21/bradley-manning-comforts-his-own-sobbing-legal-team-im-gonna-be-ok/
struggle4progress
(118,228 posts)By Medina Roshan
FORT MEADE, Maryland
Thu Feb 28, 2013 6:50pm EST
... Military judge Colonel Denise Lind accepted the guilty pleas late in the afternoon. Manning pleaded guilty to a series of 10 lesser charges that he misused classified information and faces a maximum of 20 years in prison for those offenses ...
http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/02/28/us-usa-wikileaks-manning-idUSBRE91R0T720130228
Spirochete
(5,264 posts)to come in here and post that? Isn't that special?
struggle4progress
(118,228 posts)of documents he hadn't read
It's not entirely clear why he did so. A defense witness said he had diagnosed Manning as having gender dysphoria ... as well as narcissism and obsessive-compulsive behavior. Those problems were compounded by the unraveling of a romantic relationship, the stress of serving in a Baghdad combat base and post-adolescent idealism
I consider the notion, evident throughout this thread -- that a PFC should be entitled to interfere in US diplomacy without major consequence -- to be an extremely ill-conceived and dangerous notion. Allowing a PFC to do so can only lead to such behavior from cabals of young lieutenants or from groups of generals, who might act with less naivete but more experience, more skill, and more malice
Vincardog
(20,234 posts)NorthCarolina
(11,197 posts)Protect Whistleblowers: Often the best source of information about waste, fraud, and abuse in government is an existing government employee committed to public integrity and willing to speak out. Such acts of courage and patriotism, which can sometimes save lives and often save taxpayer dollars, should be encouraged rather than stifled. We need to empower federal employees as watchdogs of wrongdoing and partners in performance. Barack Obama will strengthen whistleblower laws to protect federal workers who expose waste, fraud, and abuse of authority in government. Obama will ensure that federal agencies expedite the process for reviewing whistleblower claims and whistleblowers have full access to courts and due process. (SCRUBBED)
http://www.thenewamerican.com/usnews/politics/item/16184-obama-promise-to-protect-whistleblowers-scrubbed-from-website
NJCher
(35,619 posts)Soon!
Cher
limpyhobbler
(8,244 posts)Short link: http://wh.gov/lgG58
The prosecution of Bradley Manning starkly contrasts to the US govt's repeated failure to deliver justice for serious human rights violations committed during counter-terror operations of the past decade.
Manning, who released classified information exposing potential breaches of international humanitarian law by US forces, was sentenced in military court on Aug 21st to 35 yrs in prison.
Manning's severe sentence contrasts with the leniency given those responsible for torture and other types of grave human rights violations he revealed.
To reduce this blight on the US human rights record, President Obama should grant Manning clemency for time served, protect whistleblowers, and provide accountability for crimes like those Manning exposed.
AMNESTY INTERNATIONAL
PARDON.BRADLEYMANNING.ORG
TBF
(32,004 posts)myrna minx
(22,772 posts)rhett o rick
(55,981 posts)and the gang. It's class warfare.
Ken Burch
(50,254 posts)It's not as if the admin. benefits from the last Democratic governor of Alabama dying in a prison cell.
rhett o rick
(55,981 posts)Gov Siegelman.
xocet
(3,871 posts)Duval
(4,280 posts)EVDebs
(11,578 posts)Let's See ACTION
Pyrzqxgl
(1,356 posts)Ilsa
(61,690 posts)KoKo
(84,711 posts)MissDeeds
(7,499 posts)And K&R
orpupilofnature57
(15,472 posts)Pardon immediately
NeverAsItSeems
(3 posts)Yes, Bradley manning should be pardoned and released immediately!
Bigmack
(8,020 posts)Pardon Bradley who "quaintly" thought I should know what "my" government was doing! Ms Bigmack
Luminous Animal
(27,310 posts)DeSwiss
(27,137 posts)JNelson6563
(28,151 posts)war criminals and the banksters.
Sadly things are too FUBAR for anything of the sort to happen.
Julie
Agony
(2,605 posts)would be my vote
YOHABLO
(7,358 posts)and you folks should know that. We're headed down the road to a total militaristic state .. it's here.
on point
(2,506 posts)Gravitycollapse
(8,155 posts)Euphoria
(448 posts)Agony
(2,605 posts)sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)This country is a disgrace.
whatchamacallit
(15,558 posts)NealK
(1,851 posts)Agony
(2,605 posts)thanks for the OP Ken.
Bragi
(7,650 posts)raindaddy
(1,370 posts)Scootaloo
(25,699 posts)annm4peace
(6,119 posts)Minneapolis, MN About 50 supporters of WikiLeaks whistleblower Bradley Manning joined an emergency rally at the Federal Building here, Aug. 21, in response to Military Judge Denise Linds sentencing him to 35 years in prison. The protest was called by Free Bradley Manning-Minneapolis and was one of the many held across the U.S. sponsored or coordinated by the Bradley Manning Support Network.
A statement from protest organizers demanded President Obama fulfill his campaign promises to promote government transparency and protect whistleblowers by pardoning Bradley Manning.
Jess Sundin, a leader of the Anti-War Committee and one of the activists raided by the FBI in 2010, told the crowd, According the ACLU, 35 years is the longest-ever prison sentence for leaking government secrets to the media. The government prosecuted Bradley Manning for espionage, but we know that his real crime, in their eyes, was to expose the inhumane conduct of the American war machine. He told the world the truth about secrets shared by war criminals. We are here today, because prosecuting this man is the shameful act of cowards, afraid for the world to know what kind of monsters they really are. We are here today, because we know why Bradley Manning has been targeted, and we will not stand by silently while this injustice is carried out in our names.
defacto7
(13,485 posts)defacto7
(13,485 posts)Peregrine Took
(7,412 posts)felix_numinous
(5,198 posts)it is not only emboldening more people to follow in these whistleblowers' footsteps, but ruining the public trust and foreign relations.
Intimidation is a sign of desperation and lack of imagination and negotiating skills, of which have long lasting benefits for all.
I remember when 'We don't negotiate with terrorists' became our new foreign policy. The mantra of arms dealers. People were not interesting anymore, they were either obedient or terrorists, the art of diplomacy became a lost art. The world (as reported to us by increasingly incorporated news) became much harsher, simplistic and violent.
These are the endgames and results of having our information interfered with-- more extremism, ignorance and infighting. Less understanding and patience--and the gradual dehumanization of targeted groups-- who ever happens to be the biggest threat to the status quo. Right now that happens to be information, and who has access to it.
But next time who will be the targets? And what will be the methods of intimidation then? This is a very bad trajectory
Unless the public trust means nothing.
bluestateboomer
(505 posts)BillyRibs
(787 posts)Zorra
(27,670 posts)burrowowl
(17,632 posts)raging moderate
(4,292 posts)If we can pardon the psychopathic mass-murderers who lied to start the Iraq war in search of higher profits, then we can surely pardon Bradley Manning.
Michigan-Arizona
(762 posts)Recursion
(56,582 posts)He was a kid who got in over his head with some shady characters, seems genuinely remorseful, and is obviously not likely to do anything like this again.
William769
(55,144 posts)grahamhgreen
(15,741 posts)hrmjustin
(71,265 posts)Milliesmom
(493 posts)lofty1
(62 posts)It's going to take a movement to make this happen. This NSA shadow government does not want top give up its power.
enigmatic
(15,021 posts)avaistheone1
(14,626 posts)Immediate pardon for Bradley Manning.
donheld
(21,311 posts)spike91nz
(180 posts)now
LittleBlue
(10,362 posts)Obama won't do it as his administration has been implicated.
blkmusclmachine
(16,149 posts)jtuck004
(15,882 posts)burnodo
(2,017 posts)Douglas Carpenter
(20,226 posts)polynomial
(750 posts)Reading important reasoning about the effect Manning and Snowden added to this new age, or some are saying opened America up to the real America that needs repair.
This is the most serious part of the infrastructure that America has failed at. The morality, the disgrace, the reputation and especially the political behavior in what actions we endure and witness. America finds out we have secret courts, secret legislation, secret prosecution, secret agencies secret judges, that are government elected or appointed that collect data that ultimately is used to profiteer to make money off the American public.
A Republic, a Democracy in secret ?Does not sound normal. That is tyranny.
Our tax money is used against us as the majority figure this out Americans realize we did not have the freedom or liberty by the people as called out in the Constitution. We even argue with venom, prejudice, and hate to keep our selves healthy Americans are in a political dishonorable warp drive that stalls the very healthcare industry we need. Daily political people freely work to demonize the way to be healthy, torturing with lies daily via the mainstream media. Besides the lies about war to use the government system to profiteer murder gerrymander power.
All these action by elected officials appear to be traditional law not the real system law. Imagine interpreting law in secret all very frightening propelling cynicism especially distrust. The results are a citizen ship broken along with the government that is broken. So some brave Americans take a chance to dump the reasons, secret stuff to the public then we the people get to see if those secret choices are a benefit for the one percent or for everyone.
tomg
(2,574 posts)Dustlawyer
(10,494 posts)Is enough to make your heart break with the injustice of it all. I wonder what those American drone operators feel knowing what they did in their blood lust to shoot 1st and ask questions later.
George II
(67,782 posts)Politicub
(12,165 posts)I strongly support a pardon for Manning. And I'm proud of her bravery to live as the gender she feels she is.
Giving her hormone therapy should be considered a civil right.
And if people don't know what I'm referring to with Chelsea, check out the article here:
http://m.cbsnews.com/storysynopsis.rbml?pageType=national&url=http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-201_162-57599677/bradley-manning-i-want-to-live-as-a-woman-named-chelsea/&feed_id=1&videoid=37&catid=57599677
steve2470
(37,457 posts)Theyletmeeatcake2
(348 posts)And those that don't agree ,I hope something similar happens to them!
Little Star
(17,055 posts)maddiemom
(5,106 posts)Cronus Protagonist
(15,574 posts)She did the country a great service.
orbitalman
(1,098 posts)TheKentuckian
(25,020 posts)RedCloud
(9,230 posts)His duty is to us, to protect us from what the jackoffs do to us.
Faryn Balyncd
(5,125 posts)He put his life and liberty in peril by taking his oath to "support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same." seriously, and expose illegal crimes which the powers that be have chosen to defend.
Because of his willingness to take moral action despite peril to his life and liberty, Manning should get what he deserves:
(1.) a pardon
(2.) the Congressional Medal of Honor
(3.) the Nobel Peace Prize
(4.) a parade
Hissyspit
(45,788 posts)rwsanders
(2,594 posts)It won't happen, because as in the old USSR, there is a need for the authoritarian government to save face.
Without pressure, parole might happen in a few years, with it he may join Leonard Peltier.
RedCloud2
(8 posts)This never changed, Why must they punish those who do good and reward or hide (as the torturers)those who do evil?