Can we discuss the many tours we asked of our troops serving overseas?

[90-percent]

This DU thread

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=3514216

about the lives of two gay national guardsmen’s last decade in the neighborhood prompted me to ask a question in that thread.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=3514667

I was asked to turn the above post into an OP. Most of my OP's resonate like 80,000 of you have me on ignore. My hopes for greatest page are always dashed, but I persevere!

My late in life political coming of age happened after the 2000 Election and really kicked in following 9-11. I was against this war since it’s inception, as I got enough real news from DU links and other internet sources to know it was bullshit. I even took a bus to DC for a War Protest in Jan 2003 before the war began.

So I’ve seethed at all the crime and torture and lies of the last 12 years and like most Americans, I have severe scandal over load. (I need a primer for this current spaghetti bowl of snowden-nsa-clapper-etc latest and greatest scandal and the possible end of our Democracy)

But, there’s one thing that’s always pissed me off, because it’s just unfair and inhuman and unappreciated, and that is the treatment of our National Guard since the Iraq Invasion. And I am just so pissed about all the multiple tours and years of active duty they forced on those from the Guard. They did the same thing to full time active duty troops and that too is utterly contemptible.
Why has this escaped our national radar? We know our government fucked troops over in a lot of areas, like after they come home, and being ordered to torture and being dehumanized enough to murder innocents. We need more of a national appreciation of how much a crime it was to make these poor guys go through multiple tours.

Imagine you’re fighting in a war and your term of duty is indefinite? No wonder the suicide rate in the armed forces is rising. This was a cruel and unusual way to treat patriotic young people!

-90% Jimmy

PS – I never served, but would appreciate comments from those that did. Esp Nat Guard people

[AnotherMcIntosh]

1. Yes, as much as we can discuss how long it will take them to pay their share for this madness.

You asked for comments from those who served. My ancestors fought in every war this country has had and every war that we had before this country was formed on this continent, including the Pequot War. None of them ever signed up for a draft, not did I. I was one of Uncle Sam's misguided children. It ends with me. None of my children, nor my grandchildren will ever put on another uniform for this country. The same is true for the children and grand-children of my brothers.

[Arctic Dave]

2. I'm glad they are finally able to get married but

that is about as far as my respect for them goes.

You think they had it tough with multiple tours, how about all the Iraqis who lived theirs lives every day in a war zone and still do?

They had guns in their faces. They were brutalized. Tortured. They had their schools, homes, hospitals, power plants, offices blown up. They had their families destroyed. Husbands killed. Wives killed. Children killed. Elders killed.

Like I said, I'm glad they are able to get married but other then that, I don't want to hear about "their sacrifices" or any other sob story about how bad off they are. They volunteered, no one forced them to keep going once they found it was all lies.


I know this is a unpopular viewpoint but it is one that I won't back away from.

[madokie]

3. I'm pissed that the war was fought using National Guard members rather than the Army and Marines

National Guard is for protection of the home country or was
Vietnam seen many three and four deployments if I remember correctly. I served 15 months in country myself.

[Link Speed]

5. 39 months, here

Catch-22

I was really good at what I did (navigator, extraction team) and they claimed that I couldn't be replaced. It almost drove me insane.

[enlightenment]

4. Roman soldiers served a couple of decades . . .

For the chance to own a little property.

Seems to be where we are headed in our state of perpetual war.

[Lee-Lee]

6. Look at WWII

The National Guard was called up mostly in 1940-41, and served continuously until 1945-46. Compared to that, we had it easy.

The reliance on reserve components dates back to the anti-war movement post-Vietnam. They fought to restructure the military so that wars could not be fought without using reserve components. The theory was that using only active forces insulated the public from war too much and made unpopular wars politically feasible. By requiring reserve forces they said it would be much harder to fight a major war politically.

[90-percent]

7. Thanks for all the responses

I have to say that some of the responses have a Dick Cheney; "So what? They volunteered!" vibe to them.

The moral courage some here suggest should have been used by those in the military I think is beyond the nature of human behavior. Kind of like suggesting the Jews getting off the train at Auschwitz should have immediately attacked their German captors. They were going to die anyway, why not go out in a blaze of glory?

It has been proven by banned psychological studies that most people will obey authority even if it means they "know" they are killing the test subject.

So the conclusion I draw here is it's their own fault they had ten years of their lives taken from them. They should have mutinied or not sign up in the first place. Not signing up is a rough choice for those who's only hope for a secure future is the educational benefits of joining the military. If they get through their military service unscathed mentally or physically, they can go to college and get a competitive edge up on living what's left of the American Dream.

-90% Jimmy