'If you weren't skeptical about intervention in Syria before, this should make you think twice'

[bigtree]

________________________

. . . Mr. President.

from digby:

Weekly Standard promotes: 'Experts to Obama: Here Is What to Do in Syria"

Dear Mr. President:

Syrian dictator Bashar al-Assad has once again violated your red line, using chemical weapons to kill as many as 1,400 people in the suburbs of Damascus. You have said that large-scale use of chemical weapons in Syria would implicate “core national interests,” including “making sure that weapons of mass destruction are not proliferating, as well as needing to protect our allies and our bases in the region.” The world—including Iran, North Korea, and other potential aggressors who seek or possess weapons of mass of destruction—is now watching to see how you respond.

We urge you to respond decisively by imposing meaningful consequences on the Assad regime. At a minimum, the United States, along with willing allies and partners, should use standoff weapons and airpower to target the Syrian dictatorship’s military units that were involved in the recent large-scale use of chemical weapons. It should also provide vetted moderate elements of Syria’s armed opposition with the military support required to identify and strike regime units armed with chemical weapons.

Moreover, the United States and other willing nations should consider direct military strikes against the pillars of the Assad regime. The objectives should be not only to ensure that Assad’s chemical weapons no longer threaten America, our allies in the region or the Syrian people, but also to deter or destroy the Assad regime’s airpower and other conventional military means of committing atrocities against civilian non-combatants. At the same time, the United States should accelerate efforts to vet, train, and arm moderate elements of Syria’s armed opposition, with the goal of empowering them to prevail against both the Assad regime and the growing presence of Al Qaeda-affiliated and other extremist rebel factions in the country.

Left unanswered, the Assad regime’s mounting attacks with chemical weapons will show the world that America’s red lines are only empty threats. It is a dangerous and destabilizing message that will surely come to haunt us—one that will certainly embolden Iran’s efforts to develop nuclear weapons capability despite your repeated warnings that doing so is unacceptable. It is therefore time for the United States to take meaningful and decisive actions to stem the Assad regime’s relentless aggression, and help shape and influence the foundations for the post-Assad Syria that you have said is inevitable.

Sincerely,

Ammar Abdulhamid
Elliott Abrams
Dr. Fouad Ajami
Dr. Michael Auslin
Gary Bauer
Paul Berman
Max Boot
Ellen Bork
Ambassador L. Paul Bremer (Interim Iraqi 'Authority')
Matthew R. J. Brodsky
Dr. Eliot A. Cohen
Senator Norm Coleman
Ambassador William Courtney
Seth Cropsey
James S. Denton
Paula A. DeSutter
Larry Diamond
Dr. Paula J. Dobriansky
Thomas Donnelly
Dr. Michael Doran
Mark Dubowitz
Dr. Colin Dueck
Dr. Nicholas Eberstadt
Ambassador Eric S. Edelman
Reuel Marc Gerecht
Abe Greenwald
Christopher J. Griffin
John P. Hannah
Bruce Pitcairn Jackson
Ash Jain
Dr. Kenneth Jensen
Allison Johnson
Dr. Robert G. Joseph
Dr. Robert Kagan
Lawrence F. Kaplan
Jamie Kirchick
Irina Krasovskaya
Dr. William Kristol
Bernard-Henri Levy
Dr. Robert J. Lieber
Senator Joseph I. Lieberman
Tod Lindberg
Dr. Thomas G. Mahnken
Dr. Michael Makovsky
Ann Marlowe
Dr. Clifford D. May
Dr. Alan Mendoza
Dr. Joshua Muravchik
Governor Tim Pawlenty
Martin Peretz
Danielle Pletka
Dr. David Pollock
Arch Puddington
Karl Rove
Randy Scheunemann
Dan Senor
Ambassador John Shattuck
Lee Smith
Henry D. Sokolski
James Traub
Ambassador Mark D. Wallace
Michael Weiss
Leon Wieseltier
Khawla Yusuf
Robert Zarate
Dr. Radwan Ziadeh

read more: http://digbysblog.blogspot.com/2013/08/the-iraq-supergroup-reunion.html?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

________________________________________


This group and letter reminds me of the pre-invasion, 'Committee for the Liberation of Iraq' and their influence in launching the U.S. on the most devastatingly tragic blunder in our military history.

excerpt from my, 'Power of Mischief':

In the fall of 2002 the 'Committee for the Liberation of Iraq' was established in the Washington offices of the right-wing American Enterprise Institute. The CLI engaged in educational and advocacy efforts to mobilize U.S. and international support for policies aimed at ending the regime of Saddam Hussein. This advocacy came at the same time that Condoleezza Rice and her then-deputy Stephen Hadley were engaged in a series of briefings with foreign policy groups, Iraq specialists and other opinion makers that was termed as a "new phase," by a White House spokesman, who described the goal as building fresh public support for Bush administration policy vs. Iraq.

Members of the CLI met in November of 2002 with President Bush's national security adviser, Rice, in an effort they described as "education and advocacy efforts to mobilize U.S. and international support freeing the Iraqi people from tyranny." Members of the Committee for the Liberation of Iraq included, John McCain, Newt Gingrich, William Kristol, General Barry McCaffrey, and former CIA director James Woolsey. George Shultz, Amb. Jeane J. Kirkpatrick, Under Secretary for Arms Control and International Security John Bolton, and Elliot Abrams were also involved with the group. Abrams and Bolton were founding members of the CLI.

The CLI lobbied for the installation of the so-called Iraqi National Congress to replace the Hussein dictatorship. This group was the creation of the U.S. Congress which, following testimony from Chalabi, and defense policy executive, Zalmay Khalilzad (later appointed ambassador to Iraq), and the co-sponsoring of Sen. John McCain, passed the Iraq Liberation Act in 1998, and sanctioned the new U.S. policy of regime change.

Among the other participants in the CLI were, Gary Schmitt (director of the conservative foundation, Project for the New American Century) and Richard Perle, (chairman of Rumsfeld's Defense Policy Board, also closely associated with PNAC. Also involved was co-founder, president and executive director of the Committee for the Liberation of Iraq, Randy Scheunemann who served as a consultant on Iraq to Donald Rumsfeld and now serves as John McCain's top foreign policy aide.

The new Committee on Iraq appears to be a spin-off from the Project for a New American Century (PNAC), a front group consisting mainly of neoconservative Jews and heavy-hitters from the Christian Right whose public recommendations on fighting President George W. Bush's "war against terrorism" and alignment with Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon in the second intifada have anticipated to a remarkable degree the administration's policy course.

from Jim Lobe:

The new Committee on Iraq appear(ed) to be a spin-off from the Project for a New American Century (PNAC), a front group consisting mainly of neoconservative Jews and heavy-hitters from the Christian Right whose public recommendations on fighting President George W. Bush's "war against terrorism" and alignment with Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon in the second intifada have anticipated to a remarkable degree the administration's policy course.

Both Scheunemann and Bruce Jackson (signed recent Syria letter) have signed a number of PNAC's open letters to Bush, including one sent just eight days after the September 11 attacks on New York and the Pentagon, calling for Washington to carry the anti-terrorist campaign beyond al Qaeda to Syria, Iran, Hezbollah in Lebanon, the Palestine Authority and, of course, Iraq . . .

from sourcewatch - Members of the 'Committee for the Liberation of Iraq'

Randy Scheunemann, CLI's executive director, is former chief national-security adviser to U.S. Senator Trent Lott who has also worked for Donald H. Rumsfeld as a consultant on Iraq policy. While working for Lott in 1998, Scheunemann drafted the "Iraq Liberation Act" that authorized $98 million for the Iraqi National Congress. Randy is currently John McCain's top foreign policy adviser.
Mahdi Al-Bassam, Iraq Liberation Action Committee
Carl Bildt, former Prime Minister of Sweden, and current Minister for Foreign Affairs (Sweden)[1]
Barry Blechman, DFI International, a company that offers "tailored research, analysis, knowledge management, and consulting services to senior decision-makers in industry and government. Our Corporate Services Group supports clients in the defense, aerospace, telecommunications, and high-tech industries. DFI Government Services assists US government leaders in the development and implementation of national security programs and policies."[2]
Eliot Cohen, Johns Hopkins School of Advanced International Studies
Thomas A. Dine, Radio Free Europe/Radio Liberty
General Wayne Downing, U.S. Army (retired), has been a lobbyist for the Iraqi National Congress, the CIA-bankrolled opposition to Saddam Hussein
Rend Rahim Francke, Iraq Foundation
Newt Gingrich, former Speaker of the U.S. House of Representatives
Lt. General Buster Glosson, U.S. Air Force (retired)
James R. Hoffa, Jr., International Brotherhood of Teamsters
Bruce P. Jackson, chairman, is the former vice president of weapons contractor Lockheed Martin. He also chaired the Republican Party Platform's subcommittee for National Security and Foreign Policy when George W. Bush ran for president in 2000.
Howell Jackson, Professor of Law, Harvard Law School
B Kerrey, former Democratic U.S. Senator
Jeane J. Kirkpatrick, American Enterprise Institute
William Kristol, editor of the Weekly Standard
Bernard Lewis, Princeton University
General Barry McCaffrey, U.S. Army (retired); former U.S. "drug czar"
John McCain, U.S. Senator
Will Marshall, Progressive Policy Institute
Richard N. Perle, former Assistant Secretary of Defense
Danielle Pletka, American Enterprise Institute
Gary Schmitt is executive director of the Project for the New American Century
George P. Shultz, former U.S. secretary of state under Ronald Reagan
Richard Shultz, The Fletcher School of Law and Diplomacy
Stephen Solarz, former Member of Congress
Ruth Wedgwood, Johns Hopkins School of Advanced International Studies
Leon Wieseltier, The New Republic
Chris Williams, Johnston and Associates
R. James Woolsey, Jr., former CIA Director

Read through the list of names . . . many of the same warmongers on this former 'Iraq' list as there are on the 'Syria' letter today. I remember when candidate and Senator Obama knew this history of Bush-era military interventionism, chapter and verse. Here's a good reminder where the battle-lines are drawn today.

[HooptieWagon]

1. That looks like a membership list for PNAC.

Once again, the Personality Cult synchophants are allying themselves with the BFEE. What tools.

[bigtree]

6. I'll bet you COULD fill out a few more names

. . . by comparing it to the PNAC membership list. I just gave it a summary look.

[Coyotl]

46. Looks like a major stockholders list in Exxon-Mobil!!!!

[Rockyj]

52. Syria's Pipelineistan war

"Deep beneath "Damascus volcano" and "the battle of Aleppo", the tectonic plates of the global energy chessboard keep on rumbling. Beyond the tragedy and grief of civil war, Syria is also a Pipelineistan power play.

More than a year ago, a $10 billion Pipelineistan deal was clinched between Iran, Iraq and Syria for a natural gas pipeline to be built by 2016 from Iran's giant South Pars field, traversing Iraq and Syria, with a possible extension to Lebanon. Key export target market: Europe.

During the past 12 months, with Syria plunged into civil war, there was no pipeline talk. Up until now. The European Union's supreme paranoia is to become a hostage of Russia's Gazprom. The Iran-Iraq-Syria gas pipeline would be essential to diversify Europe's energy supplies away from Russia."

http://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/opinion/2012/08/201285133440424621.html

Its always about oil...

[Coyotl]

59. Syria worries send oil to six-month high; stocks tumble - NEW YORK | Tue Aug 27, 2013 4:39pm EDT

SURPRISE, SURPRISE!

http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/08/27/us-markets-global-idUSBRE96S00E20130827

You know who will be blamed for $6.00 gas in 2014:

[obxhead]

104. And it will be his fault in part at least

if not in full.

[Ikonoklast]

95. And this country will be exporting huge amounts of CNG to the EU just as fast as the terminals

can be built on the east coast of this country.

[CANDO]

120. Drill Here/Drill Now! Drill Baby Drill!

The morons actually thought the stuff would be ours to keep!

[Ikonoklast]

121. We are now exporting enormous amounts of refined petroleum products to the world market.

If people actually believed that drilling here would lower prices of gasoline and diesel, they do not understand fungible commodities in a world market.

We will pay market price, period. Local supply and demand is meaningless.

[CANDO]

123. Correct-o-mundo!

I laugh remembering the bumper sticker slogans. Your average wing nut seemed to really believe we'd have our own oil/gas to keep for ourselves, if only the evil Democrats would let us drill for it.

[Live and Learn]

77. +1 nt

[myrna minx]

2. This is straight out of the PNAC playbook. Outrageous. K&R

[tblue]

98. Literally. Why does BO listen to them?

We should have expected this from PNAC, but not this response from Obama. .

[leveymg]

3. Yes, it's the same group urging the same neocon plan.

One precedent was Cheney's Energy Task Force that was already carving up Iran before we invaded Iraq.

Now, they want to get rid of Syria, and planning for that goes back to the PNAC documents, including the 1997 "Clean Break" manifesto, part of the New Israel Project written for then PM Benjamin Netanyahu by a group of American neocons,including Doug Feith, the Wurmsers,and Richard Perle who went on to head up the Pentagon unit in charge of cooked intelligence for the Iraq invasion. The Clean Break document called for grand strategy of serial regime changes starting in Iraq, followed by Syria and Lebanon, and finally Iran: http://www.israeleconomy.org/strat1.htm

Then, there is the religious war against the Shi'ia, a 1,200 year old Jihad, spreading across MENA, financed by Saudi oil revenues . . . there's a whole Perfect Storm of influences at work pushing the US into war in Syria.

[BlueStreak]

24. You would think they could at least hire somebody to write a fresh script

They just scanned in the Saddam thing and did a mass edit to change Hussein to al-Assad. I'm surprised they accidentally edit the President's name as Barack al-Assad Obama. Does al-Assad have some siblings named Qusay and Uday by any chance?

[leveymg]

30. They are very cheap and will put minimal funding into new development projects

If there's any hope, AIPAC has been downsized and outsources much of their influence peddling to phone rooms in Asia, and the Saudis often balk at financing new ventures, preferring to concentrate on projects started in the 7th Century.

[zeemike]

40. Why change?...it worked so well last time.

Besides if there are objections and someone points out it is the same who will call them on it?...not the press for sure.

We will complain again and again they will just tune it out, and get the third way dems to tell us to STFU because we are hurting the party.
They own this country and we don't.

[BlueStreak]

58. You are right, of course. It just seems like they are rubbing it in now.

Using EXACTLY the same play book. And I'm sure our 9-dimensional chess POTUS thinks the best way to handle that is to lob a few cruise missiles into Syria so he can say "See, I told you not to cross my bright red line."

It was really foolish for him to have allowed himself to get cornered like that. Maybe the chess master was having an off day. Maybe the King can escape this time with the little cruise missile maneuver. But maybe Putin and his clients are planning to use that as an excuse to escalate this very quickly into a full-on attack of Israel. And then, of course, it is ion.

Buy stock in arms manufacturers. Here we go.

[blue14u]

113. When we hear the POTUS say the red-line

quote, I get the feeling that is because he was told to use those words. He was told by the powers..' it's time to say it out loud to the public so"" "we the people"
will stand behind him
..
From my memory, he has inched his way to this point over and over.. Timing is everything... "Put the ideal in the heads of the masses a little at a time... spoon feed us a little at a time...and he has.

Them Bam... we are stuck and they can follow the plan to get all the oil.
It is so simple to figure them out, but they think we will buy into their fake reports, and lie's.

I will not! I do not believe them...

It's about oil and money... Period.

[BlueStreak]

117. Seems to me he started diong that right after Netanyahu gave Iran his "red line"

No doubt Israel is stoking things behind the scenes.

[Harmony Blue]

49. The funny thing is the Chinese have thwarted the PNAC plan

of "energy resource procurement" in Iraq and along with Russia will be there to do the same all over the Mid East.

[leveymg]

54. Need I add, you usually get what you pay for? And, they finance 100%

Used War Salesmen

[n2doc]

4. Some real "winners" on that list

If Obama wants to be on the wrong side of history, he can do no better than to follow their advice.

Some others on that list worth highlighting


Max Boot

L. Paul Bremer

[LondonReign2]

127. And Pletka

Pletka is the vice president for foreign and defense policy studies at the AEI, a neoconservative think tank based in Washington, DC

Pletka was a strong supporter of Iraqi opposition leader, Ahmed Chalabi, even after it emerged he was being investigated by the US authorities as an Iranian spy. Pletka defended Chalabi saying that he had been "shoddily" treated and that CIA and US State Department personnel had been fighting "a rear guard" action against him.[2]

Pletka is married to Stephen Rademaker, who was in the George W. Bush presidential administration, was the Assistant Secretary of State for the Bureau of Arms Control.[3] The couple have three children.

[Puzzledtraveller]

5. ..........processing.......done!

no change in opinion.

[Arctic Dave]

7. Richard Perle.

There ya have it.

[bigtree]

8. Perle is on the Iraq list

. . . sorry it's a bit jumbled together.

[arcane1]

9. "to ensure that Assad’s chemical weapons no longer threaten America"

Funny, I don't recall hearing anything about Syria's ability to attack America with chemical weapons

[bigtree]

10. good point, arcane1

BO: The President does not have power under the Constitution to unilaterally authorize a military attack in a situation that does not involve stopping an actual or imminent threat to the nation.

[hughee99]

45. Perhaps it's Palin's concern since she can see Syria from her house. n/t

[durablend]

118. Apparently Kerry can see them from HIS house too! n/t

[SammyWinstonJack]

124. heh.

[LondonReign2]

128. Assad probably got Saddam's balsa wood "drones" that

Shrub and Faux told us were so scary

[bigtree]

11. kick

[blackspade]

12. A cavalcade of douchebags

A who's who of death.

[DeSwiss]

34. ''A cavalcade of douchebags''

- Whatever happened to that group?

[JEB]

13. Scumbag Lieberman hideous blot on humanity

signed the call for blood.

[JEB]

14. What, no Curveball?

[Enrique]

32. lol

[shireen]

15. yes, let's invade Syria!

Let's arm the people on that list and send them into battle. Or their kids and grandkids. Then watch how quickly they change their minds. Freakin' chickenhawks.

[northoftheborder]

16. I'm more skeptical by the day; I don't see any good outcomes for the United States, or necessarily

Syria, or it's surrounding countries.

[treestar]

17. Of course they are for it and wish they had these facts

back in 2003 re Iraq.

OTOH, each decision should be made on its own. Not as a knee jerk because the right wingers want it.

Another good reason Mittens is not President, as he wouldn't even be thinking twice about it.

[deutsey]

18. The Neo-cons have learned nothing from their disastrous wars in Iraq and Afghanistan

In fact, I heard an interview with one critic of the Neo-cons who said they actually believe those wars have been glorious victories.

[BobbyBoring]

28. They've learned one thing

It's easy to sell war to the right people~

[RC]

47. What's to learn? They got richer and that is what they wanted.

[HardTimes99]

60. Glorious Pyrrhic victories? - nt

[sabrina 1]

81. They learned how much more money they made than they originally thought. The more

the military failed to 'win', the longer the war, the more money they made. And while Congress was handing over Billions of Dollars for them, over and over and again, in the longest wars ever, the American people were losing their jobs, their homes, their Health Care, their education money, and the poor got poorer and the the Middle was disappearing.

And Wall St crashed the economy.

But ONE group continued to prosper, as the troops died, and Iraqis were slaughtered and tortured and maimed and driven from their country by the millions. ONE GROUP is swallowing all of our resources and all of the resources of every country where we are still killing people.

And why wouldn't they want another war?

Does ANYONE think this is about WMDs??

We, who have used them more than any other country in the world.

It is an obscene.

[HooptieWagon]

83. +1000

[Jokerman]

89. +1000

[KoKo]

19. Big K&R!

[closeupready]

20. Okay, yes. That DOES make me think twice.

Many of those signatories don't give a flying fuck about anyone but themselves, meaning if they are for this, then there must be a big government contract giveaway in it for them.

Thank you for posting this.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

21. This latest hit song has a familiar tune and a familiar chorus singing it. K&R

[joeybee12]

22. What gets me is how complict or stupid or both the media is...

They get lied to and lied to and lied to, and each time they fall for the same old shit.

[Art_from_Ark]

116. Because, as William Randolph Hearst found out back in the 1890s,

hyperbole about war and supposed atrocities committed by the other side can sell newspapers:

"Yellow journals like the New York Journal and the New York World relied on sensationalist headlines to sell newspapers. William Randolph Hearst understood that a war with Cuba would not only sell his papers, but also move him into a position of national prominence. From Cuba, Hearst's star reporters wrote stories designed to tug at the heartstrings of Americans. Horrific tales described the situation in Cuba--female prisoners, executions, valiant rebels fighting, and starving women and children figured in many of the stories that filled the newspapers. But it was the sinking of the battleship Maine in Havana Harbor that gave Hearst his big story--war. After the sinking of the Maine, the Hearst newspapers, with no evidence, unequivocally blamed the Spanish, and soon U.S. public opinion demanded intervention.

"Today, historians point to the Spanish-American War as the first press-driven war. Although it may be an exaggeration to claim that Hearst and the other yellow journalists started the war, it is fair to say that the press fueled the public's passion for war. Without sensational headlines and stories about Cuban affairs, the mood for Cuban intervention may have been very different. At the dawn of the twentieth century, the United States emerged as a world power, and the U.S. press proved its influence."

http://www.pbs.org/crucible/journalism.html

[backscatter712]

23. The military industrial complex is hungry...

The defense contractor industrialists clearly need more profits, and if a few more toddlers have to die so they can get it they're fine with that.

[WillyT]

25. Time For Another War To Get Everybody To Shut Up And Obey...

I'm so tired of this shit.

[HardTimes99]

61. Notice how no one is saying anything about how the NSA is violating Americans' right

to be free of searches without probable cause?

Hell, in my CT moments, I half suspect the NSA got together with some of its middle-eastern assets to put this whole thing together and pin it on Assad. Assad was winning and had absolutely no military need to use CBW agents. But the NSA was losing and had every need to.

They've been spying on (and blackmailing) Obama since about 2004, so no help from that quarter I'm afraid.

[blue14u]

115. Me to Willy... Me too!

[Ilsa]

26. We had to go draw that red line...

We'll end up fighting Syria, Iran, and Russia in war, and terrorists from most other ME countries before this is over. All because of the red line being crossed and the bravado that accompanies a response.

I hate that these people were murdered. But I'm not convinced we can improve their situation without thousands more dying.

[MotherPetrie]

27. K&R Of course Obama is going to do their bidding.

[Laelth]

29. Vomit. k&r n/t

-Laelth

[MADem]

31. A broken clock is right twice a day, though.

Francoise Hollande, who hasn't agreed with USA about much of anything, ever, supports punitive military strikes. His intelligence says that al-Assad was responsible for the massacre of all those people.

I don't think he's a right winger...hell, he's a socialist.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/europe/french-president-hollande-says-france-is-ready-to-punish-those-who-gassed-innocents-in-syria/2013/08/27/f9271b02-0f2d-11e3-a2b3-5e107edf9897_story.html

But on Monday Hollande said time is running out for the Syrian regime and airstrikes are a possibility. “Everything will come into play this week,” he told Le Parisien newspaper. “There are several options on the table, ranging from strengthening international sanctions to airstrikes to arming the rebels.

Hollande spoke with President Barack Obama on Sunday and told him France, like Britain, would support him in a targeted military intervention, according to the paper.

In a veiled allusion to difficulties in getting any strong action through the Security Council, Hollande said Tuesday that “international law must evolve with the times. It cannot be a pretext to allow mass massacres to be perpetrated.” He then went on to invoke France’s recognition of “the responsibility to protect civilian populations” that the U.N. General Assembly approved in 2005.

...Analyst Francois Heisbourg, of the Foundation for Strategic Research think tank, said Hollande’s speech ultimately meant a military strike is “going to happen, provided that the Americans confirm they are in it.” He said the message from Western powers to Assad in such an attack would be “this is punishment, and should convince him not to do it again” when it comes to use of chemical weapons.

[cali]

33. ....

Hollande largely agrees with the U.S. on foreign policy.


but go for it, cheer on another disastrous military adventure.

some people can't learn.

[MADem]

41. ....

They weren't in agreement about France's role in Afghanistan--that's kind of a big deal, wouldn't you say?
http://bigstory.ap.org/content/frances-hollande-sticking-early-afghan-pullout

And he certainly wasn't d'accord over intelligence collection, now, was he?
http://www.zerohedge.com/node/475884

They both like cheeseburgers, though, so there's that.

What will you do with your ire when this operation concludes without any of those "boots on the ground" scenarios being shopped by so many doom-and-gloomers?

You might want to gain some appreciation of the Yemen Scenario for Syria. That's what the government of the USA favors. Many other actors within and without the region support this solution as well. I favor that option, too.

However, it's apparent to me that most people here don't have a clue about that. They only understand binary constructs: If ya don't like al Assad, you MUST love the rebels!!!!! Just....because!!!!

[Volaris]

37. Then let HIM do it.

[MADem]

68. He's going to. Jeez, at least try to keep up...

http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/08/27/us-syria-crisis-france-idUSBRE97Q0QO20130827


This is a coalition effort, and there will be none of those "boots on the ground" that everyone is whining about.


The idea is to bomb property, not people--what a concept!

[Volaris]

72. K. Sorry for being behind the curve this week, been looking for another job=)

and thanks for the link.

[MADem]

73. Good luck in your job search--I hope you find something that you like, that pays well! nt

[Volaris]

75. lol neither of those things will be applicable until i get a job that lets me finish college

but I appreciate the thoughts of goodwill=).

[HardTimes99]

62. The NSA has got the goods on Hollande (and most of the EU governments) and is blackmailing

them to play along . . . or else.

[MADem]

63. That's just hilarious!

An asinine supposition, but hilarious....

It's the sort of thing one would read on that "other" website....

[MADem]

65. Go look up "Yemen Scenario for Syria." Learn a little something, and stop making a fool of yourself

by showing everyone how little you know about this matter. AQ doesn't benefit under that plan. Awww, doggone it--nothing for you to be outraged about!

Unless "women and children" are going to be sitting on runways and in weapons bunkers, they'll be quite safe--safer than they are when faced with the threat of al-Assad's sarin-tipped rockets.

[MADem]

69. Aren't you a charming fellow...hope you get some help for that temper of yours. nt

[freshwest]

70. Babies killed by bombs worse than Sarin? Do the dead argue? As far as anger goes, we'll try:

Feel so much better just looking at those skies...

[Cha]

71. JHC.. is that the best they can come up with?

Explain everything away with .. "the USA-NSA got the goods on them "

Poor France.. under the USA's mean ol thumb. rofl

[Enthusiast]

35. Neo-Cons!

Don't do it, Mr. President.

[MrMickeysMom]

36. Yes, we all know what meaningful decisive actions mean in code ...

And, Project for the New American Century members have yet one more chance for delivery. I can feel the ticker tape whiz away for the military industrial industries.

[DeSwiss]

38. K&R

[malaise]

39. All the neo-cons want war

I'm shocked I tell you. What did they have to do with chemical weapons?

Stay away from Syria Obama! You are being set up by the warmongers.

[Douglas Carpenter]

42. now that's a "whose who" list if there ever was one

[nadinbrzezinski]

43. Do look at the pnac founder list

The cross reference is there too

[avaistheone1]

50. Amazing. They are at it again!!

Soooo deeply disgusting.

[nadinbrzezinski]

53. They never ever stop

[Coyotl]

44. A bunch of fucking LIARs trying to sell a LIE.

"Syrian dictator Bashar al-Assad .... chemical weapons to kill as many as 1,400 people ..."

FIRST, establish this as FACT!

[Iggo]

48. I see PNAC's got their war-boner on again.

Of course, nobody here at DU is going to fall for that shit again.

Are they?

[go west young man]

51. They never went away and they received no punishment

for their misdeeds so they continued on doing their dirty work. I know because I waited tables who at Sea Island in Georgia where they hold their yearly meetings. They still have their grand plan and have been busy all over the Middle East trying to enrich themselves. Take the Azerbaijan Chamber Of Commerce for example. http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=US-Azerbaijan_Chamber_of_Commerce Many of the same names are there as well with James Baker from the Nixon Admin at the helm.
They are the NeoCons and they are the ones pushing for Syria intervention. Here is one of the main reasons why.

http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Middle_East/MID-02-130813.html Of course the Saudi's are involved as James Baker goes hand in hand with them. Here's an excerpt:

It's instructive to remember that in 2009, Damascus did not sign an agreement with Qatar for a pipeline via Syria; but they did sign the memorandum of understanding last year for the US$10 billion Iran-Iraq-Syria pipeline. So the point is for Damascus, the deal with Iran was much better; and if the pipeline is ever built Gazprom may even be part of it, in infrastructure and distribution. What Moscow has concluded is that Gazprom won't lose its energy grip over Europe to the benefit of Qatari natural gas. A case can be made that Gazprom holds more power over the distressed, decaying, virtually insolvent eurozone than the European Central Bank (ECB).




So essentially it's really just the same game again and has nothing to do with chemical weapons or liberation of people and everything to do with "The Great Game", US interests, oil, and keeping Russia and China in check.

[BlueMTexpat]

96. Many of them are also carryovers from

the debacles that were Iran-Contra and furnishing arms to the most radical jihadist groups in Afghanistan, many of whom were not even Afghanis.

Training Bin Laden worked out so well, didn't it?

[go west young man]

108. They go by AEI now.

[BlueMTexpat]

110. Same A-holes, different description.

Just as a rose by any other name would smell as sweet, PNAC'ers reek whatever they call themselves.

They have done more extensive damage to our country's interests (and thus of its people) than the leaks of Bradley Manning & Snowden combined ever could. But they know the "right people," are wealthy and well-connected.

Integrity, ethics and common decency don't matter in their world and the overwhelming majority either have "Rs" after their names or are Rs at heart, like (argh!) Lieberman. Unhappy as I am with Prez O, Kerry (who, of anyone, should know a LOT better) & any dizzy clueless Dems who are jumping on the war bandwagon generally, I know who those with truly evil agendas are. I for one will never forget.

[Zoeisright]

55. Wrong.

There was absolutely no proof that Saddam had chemical weapons. There IS proof that Assad is gassing his people.

You can't understand the difference? Pity.

[Cha]

57. thank you, Zoe. I trust the Obama Admin to do the right thing. They

do not want war. Big Difference.

I found this report from a French reporter ..

A special correspondent for Le Monde, Jean-Philippe Rémy, spent two months with FSA fighters in the Damascus suburbs.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=3544730

[bigtree]

74. White House says public version of intelligence community report on alleged chemical weapons use

. . . in Syria to come this week.

We've yet to see the 'proof.'

[David__77]

80. The UN inspectors have provided no proof. Let them speak.

And then let's deal with the issue of attribution. Then let's decide if intervening in favor of al Qaeda makes sense.

[sabrina 1]

84. Let's hope if the UN finds that it WAS the rebels, as originally reported from the ground,

that their findings will be accepted this time. But I wouldn't bet on it.

[David__77]

86. Well, the inspectors won't speak to who is to blame.

But everyone will try to connect the dots. We may well find that it was NOT something like sarin though. The fact that the medical workers were successfully treating patients and were wearing no protection seems to indicate that it was not sarin. Even concentrated CS gas (tear gas) can kill people. It too is banned under the CWC, but is a different ball game, in my opinion.

[BlueMTexpat]

111. No proof - just a lot of hysterical inferences ...

there are a lot of players in the very murky ME. I am very surprised that people haven't considered alternatives. It's not necessarily just a choice between the "Assad Regime" and "the rebels."

Syria has some nasty and interfering neighbors, among other possibilities. Provocateurs from the outside have a long history of aiming to influence events and outcomes in the ME. Our own ignorance of the various cultures lets them get away with it. Time and time again.

[Catherina]

56. The exact same gameplan all over again towards the same goal.

Thank you BigTree. +1000000000000000000000000000

[HardTimes99]

67. +Infinity! When Cheney said he favored the NSA surveillance, I knew it was rotten. Same here. When

these sociopaths, war criminals and torturers endorse something, you know in your heart that the right place morally is on the opposite side of the issue.

Half the signatories should be on trial at the Hague for their own war crimes.

Jeesh.

[Blanks]

92. It is probably all of the NSA chatter...

That has provoked this run up to war.

Although it took us years for us to get outraged when the CIA -I mean Saddam- gassed 'his own people.

They don't have years because everyone is up in arms about the spying. This is the readers digest condensed version of the Iraq war.

The bickering about the march up to war will definitely drown out the outrage about the spying.

[Scootaloo]

76. Here's some more on the fellows listed you didn't highlight...

Ammar Abdulhamid (Sourcewatch)
Dr. Fouad Ajamai (Sourcewatch) (Powerbase)
Michael Auslin (Sourcewatch)
Paul Berman (Sourcewatch) (Powerbase)
Ellen Bork (Sourcewatch) (RightWeb)
Matthew RJ Brodsky (Powerbase)
Ambassador William Courtney (Wikipedia)
Seth Cropsey (Sourcewatch) (Powerbase) (RightWeb)
James S. Denton (Sourcewatch) (Powerbase)
Paula A. DeSutter (Wikipedia)
Larry Diamond (Sourcewatch) (Powerbase)
Paula J. Dobriansky (Sourcewatch) (Powerbase) (RightWeb)
Thomas Donnelly (Sourcewatch) (RightWeb)
Michael Doran (Sourcewatch) (Powerbase) (RightWeb)
Mark Dubowitz (Powerbase) (Wikipedia)
Colin Dueck (Claremont Institute) (Can you even be called a professional if Wikipedia doesn't know you?)
Nicholas Eberstadt (Sourcewatch) (Powerbase) (RightWeb)
Ambassador Eric S. Edelman (Sourcewatch) (Powerbase) (RightWeb)
Reuel Marc Gerecht (Sourcewatch) (Powerbase) (RightWeb)
Abe Greenwald (Powerbase) (PJ media )
Christopher J. Griffin (RightWeb)
John P. Hannah (Sourcewatch) (Powerbase) (RightWeb)
Ash Jain (State Department)
Kenneth Jensen (Powerbase)
Allison Johnson (Sourcewatch)
Jamie Kirchick (RightWeb)
Irina Krasovskaya (Sourcewatch) (Powerbase)
Bernard-Henri Levy (Sourcewatch) (Powerbase)
Robert J. Lieber (Sourcewatch) (Powerbase) (RightWeb)
Tod Lindberg (RightWeb) (Powerbase)
Thomas G. Mahnken (Sourcewatch)
Michael Makovsky (Sourcewatch) (Powerbase) (RightWeb)
Ann Marlowe (Wikipedia)
Alan Mendoza (Sourcewatch) (Powerbase)
Joshua Muravchik (Sourcewatch) (Powerbase) (RightWeb)
Martin Peretz (Sourcewatch) (Powerbase)
Danielle Pletka (Sourcewatch) (Powerbase) (RightWeb)
David Pollock (Sourcewatch)
Arch Puddington (Sourcewatch) (Powerbase)
Ambassador John Shattuck (Sourcewatch)
Lee Smith (Powerbase) (RightWeb)
Henry D. Sokolski (Sourcewatch) (RightWeb)
James Traub (Wikipedia)
Ambassador Mark D. Wallace (Sourcewatch) (Powerbase)
Michael Weiss (Sourcewatch) (Powerbase)
Leon Wieseltier (Sourcewatch) (Powerbase) (RightWeb)
Khawla Yusuf (No info other than she's a human rights activist married to Ammar Abdulhamid)
Robert Zarate (Foreign Policy Initiative)
Dr. Radwan Ziadeh (Sourcewatch)

You will become less and less surprised as you thumb through the links.

[Catherina]

78. Thanks and wtf

Just as I clicked the reply link to thank you, the name Jamie Kirchick jumped out at me. I never heard of him until that video someone posted in the video section, when he went on Russia Today last week. Wow. These assholes aren't missing a trick to manipulate people.

Anyway, thanks and bookmarked. I'll try to read up on a few of them each day.

[Scootaloo]

79. Those sites are invaluable when you start talking about the middle east

It's amazing how many "nested" organizations there are all saying the same thing. It's a case of maybe 200 blowhards utilizing money and stationary to magnify their desires to a loud roar.

[bigtree]

87. thank you so much for taking the time with that list

. . . you just saved me hours of work. I clicked on to get to it and saw your post. What a wonderful place this can be!

Thanks again, Scootaloo . . .

[Scootaloo]

88. Not a problem

people need to know the names and follow the connections.

Out of that whole list, only four seem to not be either the American Enterprise Institute, PNAC, some right-wing Zionist group (*cough*) or just general islamophobic shitwhips; Allison Johnson, Anne Marlowe, Khawla Yusuf, and Dr. Radwan Ziadeh. I suspect that Johnson and Ziadeh are very lost.

[bigtree]

91. four

. . .that's amazing . . . and entirely predictable.

If I was at all inclined to support the President on some military strike, I'd check this list and see if their reasoning matched my own. I mean, you don't have to go any farther than Rove, imo.

[Puglover]

105. Your research is very impressive.

After going through a few of those it is like a bad case of deja vu.

Thank you.

[KoKo]

102. Good Info!

[BlueMTexpat]

112. Thanks so much for the groundwork! eom

[grasswire]

82. I notice Jeb Bush isn't on that list.

He signed the PNAC remember.

[HooptieWagon]

85. Yes he was a PNAC member.

I also noticed he wasn't on the list. Maybe he sees it as a no win situation, and signing on would be an impediment to his presidential aspirations.

[grasswire]

101. Rumsfeld was a PNAC member too. nt

[HooptieWagon]

106. Yes. And Condi. I think John Bolton, too.

W wasn't, although his admin was filled with them.

[AsahinaKimi]

90. Just what we need...

More walls in America

[nashville_brook]

93. thanks bigtree --

this is quite a heavy post.

[marble falls]

94. only when they put themselves and their kids on the front line.

[barbtries]

97. nothing changes.

including that war is not good for anything but death and destruction - oh and the enrichment of the MIC.

:peace:

[JDPriestly]

99. If we don't like these oil wars, then we need to detox from oil.

Walk. Don't drive. It is as simple as that.

If you possibly have the choice, walk; don't drive.

Don't burn more oil than you absolutely have to.

[Zorra]

100. Nice find! That about seals the deal for me. Now I'm sure something stinks. nt

[grasswire]

103. yesterday the polling at WaPo said 79% opposed to military interventions...

...and only 21 percent for it.

I thought that was pretty surprising, and am dismayed that we have so little ability to stop the neocons.

[ConcernedCanuk]

107. Does anyone remember the original name for the invasion?

.
.
.

It was "Operation Iraqi Liberation".

Then one of the alphabet soup agencies realized the acronym "OIL" would emerge.

So they changed it - because the invasion had nothing to do with oil,

right?

CC

[woo me with science]

109. Thank you. K&R

[avaistheone1]

114. So the Neocons want war with Syria.

Surprise. Surprise.

Figures they love MIC and eternal war.

k&r

[spanone]

119. the same fucking warmongering assholes who promoted iraq / afghanistan

[workinclasszero]

122. Neocon slimeball warmongers

Go sign up for duty chickenhawks and bring your kids with you!

[Blue_In_AK]

125. What a lovely bunch of neocons.

[AnotherMcIntosh]

126. So many neocons. So many chicken-hawks. So many profiting chicken-hawks.