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BainsBane

(53,074 posts)
Wed Sep 18, 2013, 09:39 AM Sep 2013

There Will Be Another Mass Shooting. This Is What the Data Tells Us About It

See the full article for how they generated their conclusions regarding the probability of the next mass shooting.

The next mass shooting will take place on February 12, 2014, in Spokane, Washington. It will be committed by an emotionally disturbed, 38 year-old white man who will kill seven people and wound six more at a place he used to work using a semi-automatic handgun he purchased legally in the state.

That, at least, is what a look at the data on past such shootings might indicate. We'll say at the outset: Every assertion in the first paragraph is a function of probability, not fact. The next mass shooting — which will happen somewhere, sometime — will almost certainly not be in that place at that time. But a look at the historic data on such killings, compiled and shared by Mother Jones magazine, makes each of those predictions defensible.

If President Obama's second term has been beset by "unpredictable calamities" like the Navy Yard shooting, in the words of the Washington Post's David Nakamura, we thought we'd try and offer a little prediction. Especially since, if such incidents occur at the same pace for the rest of Obama's term as they have since 2009, there could be 14 more before he leaves office.

Here's how we came up with our predictions. . .

The vast majority of guns used in mass killings were obtained legally — 81.8 percent. Advocates of gun control will note that this bolsters the case for tighter restrictions, particularly given the overlap between those with mental health issues and those able to buy guns. Opponents of gun control will note that nearly a fifth of shootings used illegally obtained guns, suggesting that new controls won't prevent such shootings. . . .

As for the type of weapon, the database did most of the work on this, too. Not every shooter used a semi-automatic handgun, but at each of the workplace or "other" events, such a weapon was the most common one present.


http://www.theatlanticwire.com/politics/2013/09/there-will-be-another-mass-shooting/69508/

One thing is for sure, these shootings happen continually. As long as too many Americans remain complacent and don't prioritize gun control, the gun lobby will continue to undermine public safety in the interests of increased profits for manufacturers and dealers. An average of 87 Americans die every day from gun violence, through either suicide, homicide, or accidental discharge of weapons. Gun violence represent a far greater threat to public safety than terrorism, yet our society does little to prevent it.
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There Will Be Another Mass Shooting. This Is What the Data Tells Us About It (Original Post) BainsBane Sep 2013 OP
FWIW, every second amendment supporter I know also wants tighter restrictions. NYC_SKP Sep 2013 #1
I guess you don't know the gungeon crowd BainsBane Sep 2013 #2
I don't doubt that, but I have never read a thread specifically saying that. NYC_SKP Sep 2013 #5
There were distinct amedments BainsBane Sep 2013 #10
Useless, pablum restrictions should be torn down and opposed. krispos42 Sep 2013 #8
bullshit BainsBane Sep 2013 #11
*snort* krispos42 Sep 2013 #28
I supported then and suppoet now a national UBC law, Jenoch Sep 2013 #30
Many but not all gun rights advocates who post in the gungeon oppose all proposed ... spin Sep 2013 #34
The NRA, tparty, Libertarian gun wing, etc., disagree adamantly. Hoyt Sep 2013 #3
And, accordingly, I don't know a single one from any of these groups. NYC_SKP Sep 2013 #13
not here at DU, they don't. bettyellen Sep 2013 #4
I don't know. But I know this guy supports the Second Amendment AND tighter restrictions. NYC_SKP Sep 2013 #14
Before Heller he did not believe the 2A extended to personal ownership of guns BainsBane Sep 2013 #17
Let me try this. NYC_SKP Sep 2013 #18
Firstly, saying anyone should give up support for the 2a is pointless BainsBane Sep 2013 #22
Well you see, I've never said that, ever, never. NYC_SKP Sep 2013 #27
I don't claim to know what you've said BainsBane Sep 2013 #31
If productive discussion is a goal, then it would be helpful not to lump people together. NYC_SKP Sep 2013 #33
fair enough, but I see no point in worrying about repeal of the 2nd Amendment BainsBane Sep 2013 #45
It's time for everyone, not just owners and proponents. NYC_SKP Sep 2013 #46
Yes, it is time for everyone BainsBane Sep 2013 #47
It is also in the Democratic party platform. nt hack89 Sep 2013 #20
Yet the GOP is the party that promotes BainsBane Sep 2013 #23
The Democratic party reflects my core belief that the 2A protects an individual right. hack89 Sep 2013 #24
Did you contact your representatives to support the rest of the gun control measures BainsBane Sep 2013 #25
Yes I did. hack89 Sep 2013 #29
You just enter every thread to talk about why it's not necessary BainsBane Sep 2013 #32
Why what is not necessary? hack89 Sep 2013 #35
As will non-mass shooting, and non-gun killing, and a variety of other things. krispos42 Sep 2013 #6
If you had bothered to read the article BainsBane Sep 2013 #7
I addressed that in my post krispos42 Sep 2013 #9
Oh right, because suicides don't count BainsBane Sep 2013 #12
As if anyone is saying, implying or hinting at that. beevul Sep 2013 #43
No legislation will pass because the block is not in Gun supporters, it is in the money. . . Agnosticsherbet Sep 2013 #15
Absolutely BainsBane Sep 2013 #16
That's a common excuse for the fact the gun control advocates have failed to pass ... spin Sep 2013 #36
It was the NRA that decided in 1996 that legislation must be passed to deny the Center for Disease C LanternWaste Sep 2013 #38
In 1996 the Republicans had the majority in both the Senate and the House. ... spin Sep 2013 #40
It is the money the NRA uses to Bribe Democrats and Republicans. Agnosticsherbet Sep 2013 #41
I have several recommendations Orrex Sep 2013 #19
Signed, the gungeon BainsBane Sep 2013 #21
My prediction...he will have attempted to get help for voices in his head several times prior. dkf Sep 2013 #26
I'm afraid that mass-shootings will be consistently rationalized as they occur LanternWaste Sep 2013 #37
As I have been so eloquently told in another thread ... Aerows Sep 2013 #39
"Your public safety is trumped by a violent offender's need to own a gun and shoot you with it." BainsBane Sep 2013 #44
87 American lives a day are but small prices our government willingly and gladly pays to appease indepat Sep 2013 #42
 

NYC_SKP

(68,644 posts)
1. FWIW, every second amendment supporter I know also wants tighter restrictions.
Wed Sep 18, 2013, 09:46 AM
Sep 2013

If both sides work together, it can be done.

BainsBane

(53,074 posts)
2. I guess you don't know the gungeon crowd
Wed Sep 18, 2013, 09:48 AM
Sep 2013

because many of them fight tooth and nail to tear down the limited restrictions that exist. They opposed even the background check amendment that failed last winter.

 

NYC_SKP

(68,644 posts)
5. I don't doubt that, but I have never read a thread specifically saying that.
Wed Sep 18, 2013, 09:55 AM
Sep 2013

Also, I don't count any of them among the people I know.

I'm unfamiliar with the details of the Toomey Manchin amendment but wonder if it failed because of add-on amendments and details. I just scanned an article:

Found this part interesting:

The only significant steps that all sides agreed on were stemming illegal trafficking of weapons and improving mental health efforts, but even an amendment written with NRA input to crack down on trafficking failed 58 to 42.

A vote on improving mental health services was delayed until Thursday.

The background check measure would have expanded the current check system to cover sales of weapons on the Internet and at gun shows.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/04/17/background-checks-bill_n_3103341.html


It seems to support my admonition about both sides needing to work together.

.

BainsBane

(53,074 posts)
10. There were distinct amedments
Wed Sep 18, 2013, 10:09 AM
Sep 2013

and separate votes on each and every one. That argument is NRA bullshit. They spew it constantly in the Gungeon, but it is categorically false. The background check vote was entirely separate, and EVERYONE knew Feinstein's separate assault weapons admendment would fail weeks if not months before the actual vote, which is why the Dems split the bill up into separate amendments with separate votes.

The gungeon crowd grave danced over the failure of the background check amendment the night it passed. They blamed it's failure on the fact DUers hadn't been nice enough to them and that we had the nerve to TALK about restrictions other than background checks.

Your excerpt is vague and provides no details. I followed the details fairly closely and I know what happened. Frankly I'm amazed anyone didn't since it was widely covered in the news.

krispos42

(49,445 posts)
8. Useless, pablum restrictions should be torn down and opposed.
Wed Sep 18, 2013, 10:04 AM
Sep 2013

The default response to a mass shooting by your side is to push forward the same old useless shit... bans on semi-automatic guns with certain secondary features like pistol grips and quick-adjusting buttstocks (because making your rifle fit your body well is obviously unacceptable unless it requires a wrench) and arbitrary magazine limits and registration.

I've expressed my idea for universal background checks, but damn few on your side seemed inclined to comment on it, much less support it.

krispos42

(49,445 posts)
28. *snort*
Wed Sep 18, 2013, 02:18 PM
Sep 2013

A shooter goes on a rampage in Newtown, kills a bunch of kids and adults. The weapon used was not an assault weapon; such weapons had been banned in Connecticut by federal law since 1994, and state law since 2004.

Yet, the popular belief, promoted by gun-control advocates on TV and the internet was that it was an assault weapon, and that the federal government needed to ban them again.

Shortly thereafter, Senator Feinstein proposes a new assault weapons ban, one that expands the definition of "assault weapon" to the kind of rifle used at Newtown, making them "assault weapons" ex post facto.

And a national registry of assault weapons currently in existence. And a limit on magazine capacities.


Rewind the time to Aurora, Colorado. A shooter kills bunch of people in a movie theater. Solutions proposed?

Assault weapons ban, magazine limits.


Fast-forward to the Navy Yard in DC. A shooter kills a bunch of people in a movie theater with a gun that has not ever been classified as an "assault weapon", nor would be under Feinstein's proposed 2013 ban. Solutions proposed?

Assault weapons ban, magazine limits.



The fact that you have the stones to deny this is breathtakingly hilarious.

 

Jenoch

(7,720 posts)
30. I supported then and suppoet now a national UBC law,
Wed Sep 18, 2013, 02:49 PM
Sep 2013

as long as it does not include transfers among family members.

The reason the UBC did not pass was precisely because of Feinstein and her AWB. The slippery slope argument doomed the UBC law.

spin

(17,493 posts)
34. Many but not all gun rights advocates who post in the gungeon oppose all proposed ...
Wed Sep 18, 2013, 03:17 PM
Sep 2013

gun control legislation. I often post there and have often been accused of being a "gun nut." However:

1) I support Universal Background Checks for the sale of all firearms.

2) I want to see major improvements to our NICS background check system. States should be required to turn in the names of violent felons and those legally adjudged of having a serious mental problem to the NICS data base on a timely basis.

3) I would like to see better financing for the BATF in order to allow the agency to hire enough agents to more effectively combat the straw purchase and smuggling of firearms to our inner streets and to foreign nations such as Mexico.

4) I feel that anyone who wishes to purchase a firearm or to buy ammunition should have to show a card that would prove that they had received firearm safety training. This would be similar to the card that a scuba driver has to show to obtain air for his tanks.

5) Since we lost our War on Drugs decades ago, I feel that the sale of some drugs should be legalized which would take some of the profit motive our of smuggling and dealing in illegal drugs. This should help reduce much of the gun violence in cities like Chicago which results from drug gangs fighting over turf.

6) It's becoming more and more obvious that our mental health care system needs significant improvement. Hopefully this situation will improve with the implementation of the ACA.

 

NYC_SKP

(68,644 posts)
13. And, accordingly, I don't know a single one from any of these groups.
Wed Sep 18, 2013, 10:31 AM
Sep 2013

Save for one hippie friend in Santa Cruz, CA, who once became an NRA member.

I'm not sure if he still is. At the time he was a self-taught scholar of Nostradamus and was watching too much Alex Jones for my taste.

There are a hell of a lot more 2A supporters than the groups you mention.

 

NYC_SKP

(68,644 posts)
14. I don't know. But I know this guy supports the Second Amendment AND tighter restrictions.
Wed Sep 18, 2013, 10:32 AM
Sep 2013

Not someone I know and not a DU member, AFAIK.

BainsBane

(53,074 posts)
17. Before Heller he did not believe the 2A extended to personal ownership of guns
Wed Sep 18, 2013, 10:56 AM
Sep 2013

I doubt he does now, but as President he has to uphold the law, no matter how fucked it is.

 

NYC_SKP

(68,644 posts)
18. Let me try this.
Wed Sep 18, 2013, 11:17 AM
Sep 2013

I've said it before and been met with scorn and derision and accusations that I'm like a teabagger looking for armed insurrection.

I do not trust the police in the country, I'll bet you don't either.

I do not trust the CIA, NSA, TSA, ICE, and the rest as much as I think we should be able to.

I don't see trends getting any better with respect to the levels of security and privacy that our government is affording us.

And I don't particularly think that the police in most cases can respond to home invasion robberies and the like.

That doesn't mean that I keep a gun to use because of any of these things, I don't. The few guns I have, limited to basic .22 cal and shot, are in a safe and wouldn't help much with a home invasion.

No. I support the Second Amendment on behalf of those who DO have a legitimate use for them and for future generations.


I'll never give up my support, not as long as there are still untried options to reduce violence, including tighter gun laws, harsher penalties, and all the rest.

BainsBane

(53,074 posts)
22. Firstly, saying anyone should give up support for the 2a is pointless
Wed Sep 18, 2013, 12:06 PM
Sep 2013

and meaningless. It's the law. The point is moot. Does that, however, mean that you won't consider gun control unless every other option to reduce violence is exhausted? So then what?

Let me guess. You say there should be money spent on public programs to reduce crime and mental illness. Yes there should, but it won't happen and you know it won't happen. It's just like the gunners expression of support for a hypothetical background check bill while opposing the actual ones. If the perfect legislation that they agree with 100% descended from the heavens, they would support it. That's their cover for opposing actual legislation. It's all meaningless rhetoric unless they are actually willing to support measures that save lives. They instead prefer to insult people who do care about gun violence, while insisting that the deaths aren't really that significant. There aren't enough people dying to be worried about. Plus people commit suicide, and they don't count. I've heard all the bullshit a million times. I don't give a fuck about some theoretical idea you might support. I want to know what you are supporting right now.

 

NYC_SKP

(68,644 posts)
27. Well you see, I've never said that, ever, never.
Wed Sep 18, 2013, 01:23 PM
Sep 2013

I've never said that we shouldn't do stricter gun control unless we do the other things, too.

I've only said that doing only gun control won't be nearly as effective as a compound approach.

The ascription of these false characteristics to me and to others, usually blended with some anger, is always a discussion stopper.

BainsBane

(53,074 posts)
31. I don't claim to know what you've said
Wed Sep 18, 2013, 02:56 PM
Sep 2013

but I have seen enough propaganda from the gungeon for thirty lifetimes. I do know that many of them claimed to support all of the presidents reforms except for background checks, yet they worked to defeat them and celebrated their defeat in GD. I remember your saying you supported them too, but I haven't seen you discuss it since. I don't recall you among the grave dancers. The fact is there are simply people who care more owning guns and making sure others have unfettered access to them than anything else on this planet, and too many of them are on this site. Discussion with them is pointless. I'm only interested in talking to people who support gun control. I don't care to hear excuses why it's not important or necessary. If I wanted to hear that crap, I'd go to a far right wing site.

 

NYC_SKP

(68,644 posts)
33. If productive discussion is a goal, then it would be helpful not to lump people together.
Wed Sep 18, 2013, 03:13 PM
Sep 2013

I'm pretty outspoken about finding blended solutions and have consistently called for expansion of California's strict laws nationwide.

But when I so much as challenge the wisdom of a particular gun control idea that I think may not work, I'm instantly labeled a gun nut and any possibility of rational discourse is over.

You're probably right, discussion with anyone boneheaded enough to insist on keeping guns as accessible as they are and who fights the president's ideas is probably pointless.

But there are a few of us who straddle the vast grey area and reject the extremes at both ends of the topic.

On the one side, folks who want to repeal the second amendment and collect every single gun.

On the other side, those who think that current laws, even in Texas, are too restrictive.

I'm pretty sure that neither of us is either of these types,

BainsBane

(53,074 posts)
45. fair enough, but I see no point in worrying about repeal of the 2nd Amendment
Wed Sep 18, 2013, 06:26 PM
Sep 2013

It's never going to happen. There is no equivalency between someone random person spouting off about that online and those who resist reform because the latter is the status quo and the former absurd. Most people on this site never give a thought to gun issues except after mass shootings, yet more people are killed on a daily basis who never make the news. The same people making those off the cuff remarks about the Second Amendment probably have similarly absurd responses to every news event. The key issue at this point, as far as I see it, is universal background checks. I see no point in going on about endless other things when we can't get something that simple passed. It's time for gun owners and pro-gun proponents to contact their representatives and tell them they want background checks to extend to all gun sales.

 

NYC_SKP

(68,644 posts)
46. It's time for everyone, not just owners and proponents.
Wed Sep 18, 2013, 06:34 PM
Sep 2013

Why single out one side of the equation? You know there are people on all sides of the issue just hammering out posts on the Internet and not much more.

BainsBane

(53,074 posts)
47. Yes, it is time for everyone
Wed Sep 18, 2013, 06:42 PM
Sep 2013

but it is the most active gun proponents on this site who actively resist such measures.

BainsBane

(53,074 posts)
23. Yet the GOP is the party that promotes
Wed Sep 18, 2013, 12:09 PM
Sep 2013

your gun agenda. And several gunners post exclusively about guns, echoing the far right of the GOP, don't show concern or support for a single Democratic policy or program, and we're supposed to take their word that they are Democrats. Of course most are in red stats with no Democratic representation at all. Yet they support the recall of Democratic politicians in Colorado and defend the NRA and the Koch brothers.

The Democratic Party supports a whole range of gun control measures that gunners have devoted themselves full time to defeating.

hack89

(39,171 posts)
24. The Democratic party reflects my core belief that the 2A protects an individual right.
Wed Sep 18, 2013, 12:44 PM
Sep 2013

that is good enough for me.

The GOP does not support UBCs and firearms ID cards so no, they do not support my "agenda".

Lets remember that I live in a state with strict gun control laws - I choose to live here because I wanted to live in a blue state. I would love for the rest of the country to have the same laws we do.

The only gun control measures backed by the Democratic party that I emphatically reject are an AWB and registration.

BainsBane

(53,074 posts)
25. Did you contact your representatives to support the rest of the gun control measures
Wed Sep 18, 2013, 01:04 PM
Sep 2013

That were proposed last winter?

hack89

(39,171 posts)
35. Why what is not necessary?
Wed Sep 18, 2013, 03:25 PM
Sep 2013

I have posted several times over the past two days exactly what new gun control laws we need. Here, let me do it again:

UBCs, Firearm ID cards, mandatory safety training are all needed.

Couple that with a robust ATF cracking down on illegal gun trafficking and we could make a serious dent in criminal gun violence.

Since two thirds of gun deaths are suicides, we also need single payer health care with full mental health coverage.

krispos42

(49,445 posts)
6. As will non-mass shooting, and non-gun killing, and a variety of other things.
Wed Sep 18, 2013, 09:57 AM
Sep 2013

Since virtually any gun made in the last 150 years can be used in a mass shooting, we have to ask ourselves "why, despite this potential being in existence for so long, is it being realized now more than before?"


Of course, the overall homicide rate it as low as it's been since the 50's. That saves tens of thousands of lives a year, at least.




Interesting data on the frequency of mass shootings. Data from the BJS, graph from yours truly.





Obviously, the chart ends in 2005, the end of the study period. But it is population-adjusted.

We're at about 0.05 incidents per million people in 2005; or one incident per 20 million people, for the "5 or more victims" catagory.

Hmmm... maybe I should have made the Y-axis in terms of "incidents per 100 million people", so we get nice round numbers.

BainsBane

(53,074 posts)
7. If you had bothered to read the article
Wed Sep 18, 2013, 10:00 AM
Sep 2013

You would see mass shootings are up greatly from 2009. If you had bothered to read my OP to the end, you would have seen I give figures for the far more common deaths that result from guns. But yeah, I understand that 32,000 deaths are year are far too trivial for you gun fundies to concern themselves with. They make that clear several times a day.

krispos42

(49,445 posts)
9. I addressed that in my post
Wed Sep 18, 2013, 10:08 AM
Sep 2013

It does seem there is an uptick in them the last few years. Of course, despite the hysteria, the homicide rate continues to hold steady, at 60-year lows.


Nice of you to roll suicides and homicides into one number, too. To inflate things.

Also nice of you to routinely ignore non-gun murders and non-gun suicides.

And, finally, it's really nice of you to bemoan the number of guns in this country, yet shy away from stating any concrete proposals to lower them.

BainsBane

(53,074 posts)
12. Oh right, because suicides don't count
Wed Sep 18, 2013, 10:21 AM
Sep 2013

Those people who use guns to die from mental illness deserve what they get. I keep forgetting that none of the people who die from guns are actually worth living. But you'll keep reminding me, apparently hopeful that I will one day I will decide that human life is meaningless, and that your property is far more important than dead children. Your rights trump our dead, remember? http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1172&pid=126744

I have stated concrete proposals many times, and the President has proposed them. My side is the Democratic party, so that is what you so despise when you talk about how much you hate the people who propose increased restrictions on access to guns, the Democratic Party President, VP, and Senate. The ones you stand with: The GOP.

 

beevul

(12,194 posts)
43. As if anyone is saying, implying or hinting at that.
Wed Sep 18, 2013, 05:56 PM
Sep 2013

"Oh right, because suicides don't count. Those people who use guns to die from mental illness deserve what they get."

As if anyone is saying, implying or hinting at that. This is a position you have invented and apply regularly to those that disagree with you in just about any way on the gun issue. But you knew that, and now anyone that hasn't been paying attention does as well.

One size doesn't fit all. That has been pointed out to you numerous times. You and many like you, based on what you can be seen saying hereabouts, are uninterested in any size that DOESN'T fit all. If we bring up the fact that mental health improvements are a better way of reducing suicide numbers than prohibitionist gun policies, we get accused of "nra talking points". Elegant proof that you're more interested in going after guns, than reducing gun deaths.

And since taking things others have said and holding pro-gun posters feet to the fire for it has been deemed acceptable by you, You wont complain at all when the words of those who want to in part or in whole ban civilian owned firearms (contrary to the Democratic Party Platform) are applied to you, right?






Agnosticsherbet

(11,619 posts)
15. No legislation will pass because the block is not in Gun supporters, it is in the money. . .
Wed Sep 18, 2013, 10:39 AM
Sep 2013

supplied by large gun manufacturers fed via the NRA to people in Congress and the Senate.

This may be hard to believe but money talks louder than the fearful wail of 2nd amendment folk that Obama is going to take their guns, or the mournful screams of the gun control folk that at the pointless murder of another one or seven or ten or ten thousand people.

BainsBane

(53,074 posts)
16. Absolutely
Wed Sep 18, 2013, 10:40 AM
Sep 2013

No question about it.

However, enough popular pressure can override the influence of money. What is most important to politicians is to be reelected.

spin

(17,493 posts)
36. That's a common excuse for the fact the gun control advocates have failed to pass ...
Wed Sep 18, 2013, 03:40 PM
Sep 2013

strong gun control legislation at a national level like another assault weapons ban.

The fact is that only 5 million of the 80 million gun owners in our nation belong to the NRA. I will grant that the NRA is powerful but I feel that the real reason strong gun control legislation doesn't pass is that more gun owners show up to at the polls and vote for politicians who support gun rights than gun control advocates show up and vote for politicians who support strong gun control.

One reason this may be true is that gun owners often have a significant investment of time and money in their hobby while gun control advocates often have no money in the game.

But while it is extremely difficult for the gun control advocates to pass legislation at the national level, they have been successful at the state level. If the NRA was as powerful as you suggest, it should be able to stop all gun control legislation even in states like New York and California.

 

LanternWaste

(37,748 posts)
38. It was the NRA that decided in 1996 that legislation must be passed to deny the Center for Disease C
Wed Sep 18, 2013, 04:01 PM
Sep 2013

"I will grant that the NRA is powerful but I feel that the real reason..."

It was the NRA that decided in 1996 that legislation must be passed to deny the Center for Disease Controls the ability or the money to research gun violence.

You didn't have the opportunity to cast a popular vote on that, and neither did I.

spin

(17,493 posts)
40. In 1996 the Republicans had the majority in both the Senate and the House. ...
Wed Sep 18, 2013, 04:23 PM
Sep 2013

That was the first time the Republicans had such control since 1954. The reason that this may have happened was that the first Federal Assault Weapons Ban had became law in 1994.

Gun control policy of the Clinton Administration

***snip***

Assault weapons ban

One year after signing the Brady Law, White House lobbying also played a role in the passage of the 1994 Crime Bill, which included the assault weapons ban. The law banned certain semi-automatic firearms with two or more specific design features, and also prohibited the manufacture of ammunition magazines that held over ten rounds.[9]

Although initially heralded as a victory for Clinton and Democrats in congress, it proved costly.[2] The bill energized the NRA and Republican base, and contributed to the Republican takeover of both houses in the 1994 mid-term elections. Many Democrats who had supported Clinton's gun control measures were ousted, including Speaker Tom Foley. Clinton acknowledged that he had hurt Democrats with his victories.[6]...emphasis added

Clinton continued to push further regulations of firearms in his second term, especially after the Columbine High School massacre. Little success came out of his efforts though. Republicans controlled congress during this time, and a majority opposed any further gun control.[10] The House voted to overturn the assault weapons ban in 1996. The Senate failed to take up the issue.[11]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_control_policy_of_the_Clinton_Administration


Agnosticsherbet

(11,619 posts)
41. It is the money the NRA uses to Bribe Democrats and Republicans.
Wed Sep 18, 2013, 04:28 PM
Sep 2013

Money from corporations that make guns.

I didn't blam Republicans or Democrats. I blamed Corporations and their tools, the vile, foul, malicious, murderers that hand out the money from the NRA.

As long as someone shows them the money, it will not change.

Orrex

(63,228 posts)
19. I have several recommendations
Wed Sep 18, 2013, 11:21 AM
Sep 2013

Last edited Wed Sep 18, 2013, 12:07 PM - Edit history (1)

1. We need more guns, obviously!
2. We need to oppose any efforts to enact meaningful legislation, no matter how sensible or popular
3. We need to complain more about how the existing laws are stupid and don't actually restrict dangerous gun ownership
4. We need to declare that nothing can be done about the preposterous number of guns in the US
5. We need to make some sort of half-assed observations about how the mental health system is somehow to blame
6. We need to complain about dangerous swiming pools, because dangerous swimming pools are dangerous!!!!1!
7. We need more guns, obviously!

 

dkf

(37,305 posts)
26. My prediction...he will have attempted to get help for voices in his head several times prior.
Wed Sep 18, 2013, 01:08 PM
Sep 2013

But they sent him home to play call of duty for hours on end.

 

LanternWaste

(37,748 posts)
37. I'm afraid that mass-shootings will be consistently rationalized as they occur
Wed Sep 18, 2013, 03:58 PM
Sep 2013

I'm afraid that mass-shootings will be consistently rationalized as they continue to occur as simply part and parcel of the price we pay to keep and bear arms. And the NRA will keep pulling stunts like trying to deny the CDC from researching gun-violence by purchasing the congressmen appropriate to their needs, keeping them in office, and telling them to righteously proclaim to all "nothing can be done..."

Lots of gun violence in my neighborhood last weekend... no terrorism though. But when we compare the money invested into preventing the two, the disparities are enormous enough to tell me that the invested special interests have decided what's popular and what's not...

 

Aerows

(39,961 posts)
39. As I have been so eloquently told in another thread ...
Wed Sep 18, 2013, 04:04 PM
Sep 2013

What can we do about it, you can't change anything and STFU.

That's the mindset anyone faces when discussing even stepping a toe over the line toward effective gun control.

You and your children's brains splattered on the pavement after the next massacre are meaningless - it isn't about public safety. Your public safety is trumped by a violent offender's need to own a gun and shoot you with it.

BainsBane

(53,074 posts)
44. "Your public safety is trumped by a violent offender's need to own a gun and shoot you with it."
Wed Sep 18, 2013, 06:07 PM
Sep 2013

Sadly true.

indepat

(20,899 posts)
42. 87 American lives a day are but small prices our government willingly and gladly pays to appease
Wed Sep 18, 2013, 05:25 PM
Sep 2013

the NRA and gun nuts as it spends $75 billion a year in part to unconstitutionally spy on its own citizens, eviscerating their constitutional rights in the process without concern or apology, to best assure not one American life is lost at the hand of a foreign terraist on American soil.

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