Father forces son to hold pink ‘I am a bully’ sign on Texas highway

[Playinghardball]

Texas father is refusing to apologize for forcing his child to hold a pink “I am a bully” sign because he says that “we don’t need another Columbine.”

When Jose Lagares found out that his son got in trouble for bullying in his fourth grade class, he sent the boy out to the intersection of Ft. Hood Street and W. Veterans Memorial Boulevard in Ft. Hood on Tuesday.

KCEN captured video of the fourth grader holding a pink sign that read: “I am a bully. Honk if you hate bullies.”

“Bullying is also a form of public humiliation,” Lagares told the station. “Maybe he understands that when he humiliates someone publicly that doesn’t feel good.”

“Hopefully he’ll take that with him so the next time he tries to bully someone he’ll think about it twice.”

In an interview with KCEN on Thursday, Lagares said that he had received negative criticism, but he did not regret punishing his son.

“I refuse to allow my child to be somebody else’s pain,” he explained. “Ya know, we don’t need another Columbine, and we don’t need another Solomon Harris. Ya know, we don’t need that to happen, and I refuse for my child to be the cause of that.”

Watch the video below from KCEN, broadcast Oct. 3, 2013.

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2013/10/04/father-forces-son-to-hold-pink-i-am-a-bully-sign-on-texas-highway/

[Pretzel_Warrior]

1. rather bullying behavior from the father, I would say. No wonder the boy

acts the way he does. Maybe the father is too stupid to be introspective and help his son figure out how to deal with others in a more socially acceptable way.

Tactics like this are bullshit.

[leftyohiolib]

7. armchair parenting, a game absolutley anyone can play, you dont even have to have all the facts

"Maybe the father is too stupid to be introspective and help his son figure out how to deal with others in a more socially acceptable way."

what makes you think he hasnt -

[Pretzel_Warrior]

14. I have raised a daughter, and i am now raising a son. I know ass hole parents when I see them

this guy is a classic case.

[LanternWaste]

26. Many of us place great faith in our powers of prophecy...

" I know ass hole parents when I see them..."

Many of us place great faith in our powers of prophecy...

[cui bono]

52. I'm really not trying to pick a fight with you but...

many people could jump to conclusions about someone who can't control themselves enough in discourse to not have too many posts hidden by a jury of their peers.

You don't know this guy. You don't know how he behaves with his family apart from this one incident. He obviously is thinking about proper behavior with the lesson he is trying to teach his son, even if he may be going about it the wrong way.

[roguevalley]

123. lots of us have raised kids too, lots of them

I even taught over a 1000 kids in my career before I retired. You have your opinion and some of us have ours. That's all we get.

I've had kids without consequences and have taught without turning my back an entire year. I don't think that dad is out of line. IMO.

[Logical]

10. Not bullying at all. Maybe show him how it feels to be embarrassed. n-t

[fitman]

53. As someone who was bullied unmercifully

hope this kid knows what's it's like..the bullies that did it to me for 3+ years could not be reasoned with by my teachers or anyone else..they were out of control

Bullies are bastards and what this kid's dad did is doing the right thing..

Don't feel sorry for this kid in the least.

[frogmarch]

18. +1

[Scootaloo]

37. Yup. And that's the point

"This is how it feels. Do you like it? Do you think the kids you mistreat like it? Don't do it again, or we'll do this again, and you'll be wearing a leotard"

[frazzled]

56. That's like smacking a kid in order to teach them not to hit

Please folks, this has been proven time and again to be an ineffective and actually counterproductive form of "lesson teaching."

[Scootaloo]

88. No, it's not

It's more like having the kid pick up roadside trash after he throws a drink bottle out of the car window or something. Which I suppose might also be something you're against, clasping your pearls about child labor or something.

Though I agree with KurtNYC a few posts down that it could have been improved on, publicly shaming someone for antisocial and destructive behavior is not something that worries me. Children killing themselves because twits like this kid make their life hell, that worries me.

[frazzled]

105. Clutching my pearls, eh

Isn't your response a bit ... bullying?

I believe that a child who is a bully usually learns that bullying from somewhere. They've often been bullied themselves, just as sex offenders have almost always been the victims of some kind of abuse themselves.

I don't believe bullying them back teaches anything. It models more bullying behavior. That is my opinion, but I can see you want to bully me into retracting my response by shaming me, stereotyping who you think I am, and dismissing my viewpoint. Fine. I've got quite quick skin.

I raised two kids who were not bullies. We did it through modeling our behavior to show them how responsible, kind people act, and by discussing the importance of not hurting other people's feelings.

You are certainly entitled to your own opinion, and to your own methods. Just don't push other people around who don't agree.

[Pretzel_Warrior]

109. some ammo for your side of this argument

http://www.pbs.org/parents/education/going-to-school/social/what-to-do-when-your-child-is-a-bully/

Nowhere does it say that parents should humiliate their kids to teach them a lesson about bullying.

[Scootaloo]

111. Yes, clutching your pearls

You seem simply aghast that this child who makes a pastime of brutalizing other children day in and day out, might have faced a few moments of shame as punishment for his behavior.

I'm happy that you are a perfect parent who raised two flawless children. Since you never had to put up with this sort of behavior - and as I point out to pwnmom, there are a LOT of influences on children beyond their parents - I have to wonder if you actually have relevant perspective here.

[elehhhhna]

118. Actually, most of the bullies I've known were not bullied at home but treated like

precious little princes and princesses. They mophed ~ age 11 from diva to asshole.


There are 2 kinds of kids in the world (broad generalization alert

Those who act up when away from their parents and behave in their parents presence

Those who act fine in public and school, etc, and save the crazy stuff for their parents

The former can be triggered by abusive parenting, or indulgent parenting. Weird but true.

[Pretzel_Warrior]

57. gee. I thought I was the authoritarian

all it shows is to bully...I have to seem to have more power than the other. That's what allows my dad to bully me, and that's what allows me to bully the weaklings at school.

This merely reinforces bullying mentality with the added caveat of trying very hard not to get caught.

[Scootaloo]

89. Well, you are, but that's a different topic

[Pretzel_Warrior]

90. I'm not. And I DEMAND you retract that or there will be consequences

for the doofuses who don't understand.

[Scootaloo]

100. That's cute

I'm not sure if you noticed, but parents do have authority over children. It's not an equal partnership. There are of course parents who abuse that fact, and thus thieir children, as in the example you tried to give. But this story is not such a case.

Reasoning with the child is a reward for this sort of behavior. I'm not saying it shouldn't be tried, but more often than not a child who gets off bullying others is just going to see being treated like a reasoning adult as a reward for that behavior.

Grounding him will simply make him stew over how unfair his parents are being, denying him access to his game console or whatever - never has a child responded to being grounded in any other way.

Making him deliver an apology or something to the children he has mistreated will be the resolution that actually builds resentment, as you describe - he will see it as someone stronger than him forcing him to grovel before those he regards as weaker, and will certainly not be sincere or corrective.

A bully wants things to be about them. So, play on that, make the bully the center of attention. Just... not in the way he wants. Do it without involving people he will try to "get back at" or that he can hold resentment against. it places him in the position of being the target, but does so without allowing him a focus for his own resentment.

No, it's not fair. And frankly it's not nice. It's a punishment, and a pat on the head and a pizza party would just not suffice.

[pnwmom]

96. The point is that the son obviously learned the bullying from his dad

who no doubt was very embarrassed and angry to get the note from the teacher. Publicly humiliating your child is not the way to teach him to be a nicer person.

[Scootaloo]

102. No, it's not obvious in the least

Our society tends to reward and encourage bullying behavior. It's everywhere, a pervasive miasma of might makes right, strong triumph over the weak, and dominance vs. submission. Watch TV. Go to a school. Read politics. It's entirely likely that this kid picked it up in the same environment that he displayed it - at school. it may stun you, but once a child emerges into public via schooling, the parents are no longer the singular influence on their lives and behavior.

Teaching someone to be a nicer person, and discouraging the behavior of a bully are two different concepts. Many bullies are perfectly nice people... except to the people they target.

[pnwmom]

104. Yes it is. Because what the father did IS the act of a bully.

He is the more powerful person, the adult, and he forced his son to do this humiliating thing. There were many other ways he could have taught this lesson, but he chose to bully his own son. What a creep.

[Pretzel_Warrior]

110. Here ya go, buddy

This is but one of MANY links on the subject. Funny, none of them mention the parent should shame the child and "give him a taste of his own medicine.

http://www.pbs.org/parents/education/going-to-school/social/what-to-do-when-your-child-is-a-bully/

Here are six steps to follow.

1.Find out what happened. Your initial instinct might be to get angry, but bullying expert Joel Haber, Ph.D., says parents need to keep their cool. Instead, Haber recommends asking your child to tell you, in his own words, what happened and what his role in the incident was. “Kids have to take accountability for their behavior,” says Haber. If your child tries to push the blame onto another participant, be firm and reiterate that you aren’t interested in hearing about other kids—just your child’s role in the bullying.

-----SNIP------
3.Have your child make restitution. Once your child owns what she did and acknowledges the hurt she’s caused, it’s time for her to try to make amends for the situation. This may mean apologizing to the other child in the presence of a school guidance counselor, or, in the case of cyberbullying, contacting all the recipients of a hurtful e-mail to issue a correction.
Barbara Coloroso, the author of “The Bully, the Bullied and the Bystander,”notes the nature of the Web means that “rumors on the Internet can be hard to fix.” In extreme cases, she recommends that cyberbullies be forced to pay for a Web scrubber, which help bury nasty Web pages in Google search results.

-----SNIP------

6.Be a role model. Remember the antidrug television commercial from the 1980s in which the parent asks his son where he learned to do drugs, and the son replies, “I learned it from watching you!”? The same commercial could probably be made about bullying. “If your kid is truly the bully, you have to examine what’s going on in your own home,” says Coloroso. So be honest with yourself: What behaviors do you model that send your child the message that it’s okay to make another person feel small? Are you curt with salespeople? Do you gossip and spread rumors? Roll your eyes when you hear something you disagree with? If so, it’s time to change—for your kid’s sake, as well as your own. “Kids observe what we do and follow what we do more than they listen to us,” says Haber. If we as parents want to stop the bullying, we all have to get on board.

[Scootaloo]

112. Sure, these are the ideal

And thank heavens, every child is a mass-market robot, where you can push buttons in the right order and get the same output every time. Modern technology, what a marvel.

But seriously, yes, all this is ideal. So what do you do if you're say, on #2 there, and your kid's response to "how would you feel if it was you" was "I don't care," or "I'd hit them!" or something other than the meek "I wouldn't like it" response the advice guide seems to take as default? Children can be stubborn little things, and as we (probably) all know, empathy really isn't their strongest point in most cases (barring of course, every single DU'er chiming in here about their angelic flawless offspring!) I suppose you could beg them to understand, but at that point your child is basically bullying you into doing all the heavy lifting.

Sometimes to understand what it's like to be in the shoes of another person, you actually have to put them on.

You also seem to assume there's no follow-up past this point. I really doubt that'll be the case, just that it won't be on the news.

[KurtNYC]

59. If he expects change in his son's behavior perhaps the sign should read "I bullied someone"

Give the kid a chance to disown the behavior rather than have it imprinted it on him.

Management 101: "Criticize the behavior, not the person."

Management 102: "Never critic an employee in front of others (if it can be avoided)."

[joeunderdog]

108. Not bullying...

Shaming.

You're right. Not good parenting and probably explains a lot.

[roguevalley]

121. natural consequences of his actions. IMO

[frazzled]

2. It's clear where this boy learned his bullying from

What a useless tactic. No, what a totally COUNTERPRODUCTIVE tactic.

[Pretzel_Warrior]

15. AGREEEED! thank you!!

[Union Scribe]

95. Agreed.

This says a lot about the father, not so much about his son.

[nadinbrzezinski]

3. Honk, honk, I hate bullies.

[narnian60]

4. As a former teacher, I despised bullying behavior, also, but

geez, the look on that boy's face is heartbreaking.

[riderinthestorm]

28. Agreed.

I will say though that I refuse to judge this. We don't know the circumstances or the backstory.



One thing I've learned the hard way is that its easy for others to tell you how wrong they think you are parenting without understanding the situation in the least.

[RobinA]

65. I Can't Imagine

a situation in which this would be acceptable behavior for the father.

[pnwmom]

99. The father was the bigger bully, IMO.

He's a much more powerful adult, and he should know better.

[seabeyond]

5. Nothing like a little sexism to mix in with a life lesson... You girl. Wtf? Nt

[joeybee12]

9. I see it as pretty homophobic, too...nt

[seabeyond]

12. Ahh, so true that. Nt

[Brickbat]

16. The "pink" in the headline got my attention, but I don't see anywhere where the father was using

the color as part of the punishment. Sometime a neon color is just a neon color.

[seabeyond]

19. Mmmm. You could be right and I doubt it.Texas men take their pink gender identifying color seriously

[TexasProgresive]

32. And you know that is true, how?

[seabeyond]

54. What? That Texas men take pink seriously? Lol. Really? Whatever.

[TexasProgresive]

119. Texans are eclectic

We come in all sizes and shapes-male and female, straight, gay, asexual, transexual, intersexual (my cousin), religious to a fault, agnostic, atheist, all kinds of ethnic back and foregrounds. We are musicians, artists, roughnecks, cow people, engineers, whatever. We are apolitical, right wing, left wing, moderate.

The biggest toughest welders will wear flowery welders caps (they can wear them under the hood)

So, I'm an old white heterosexual male Texan who has worn pink shirts in the past and wore a paisley tie with a pink background last week. And I am a yellow dog Democrat from birth.

Judge me how you will. Just know that pre-judging is usually do to faulty thinking.

[seabeyond]

122. i have lived in the panhandle of texas for two and a half decades. married a texan.

gave birth to two texas boys.

howdy. lol lol

[TexasProgresive]

120. While it's not pink it does have flowers.

I think Don Bankston (Susan's Bubba- Juanitajean.com) would have no trouble wearing pink. Here he is with the next governor of the grrreaaat State of Texas- Wendy Davis.

[Cha]

124. Thanks TexasP!

[Hayabusa]

42. Could be it. Could also be that a neon pink sign would grab more eyes than a simple white poster

board

[cui bono]

55. So would a neon green, yellow or orange sign.

His goal is to embarrass his son, I'm pretty sure the pink is intentional and used in a sexist way.

[Nay]

66. Yup. The father's intent is to shame the boy in every way possible, and PINK

is a great misogynistic way to do it. I'm sure his father never even missed a beat when he went to buy the posterboard.

Whether this helps the kid or not, I don't know. It depends on the kid.

[seabeyond]

75. and that being said, the man would only think the most humiliating, like what his son did to another

hence getting the pink. and i have never needed to use something like this to discipline boys. or maybe it is to make a kid think. i know i have shot out misbehavior to family that will reinforce a lesson. not as grand of a scale as this and not meant to humiliate but teach, but same principle. what i do like is the father standing close by the son. now this could be made up in my imagination, but it is a show of support for the boy and the concentration on the kids face i think might mean effectiveness.

i do not think the father would see it as sexism and the harm in it though that is the result. intent matters.

interesting all around.

[Nay]

81. I do think that the father might think of women as lesser beings, thus

anything pink=girly would be shameful to a boy.

I have certainly shamed my son for some crap he's done, but not in this manner, so I truly don't have experience in knowing if this works for some kids or whether it really backfires.

[seabeyond]

82. well, whenever truly insulting male, you take it to female. so that is a given. nt

[appleannie1]

6. Gee, I wonder where he learned to bully.

[Avalux]

8. Humiliating his son should teach him to.....not humiliate others?

I understand what he's saying and that he wants to teach his son a lesson, but that is the wrong way to do it.

[LordGlenconner]

11. I'd love to know what some of his victims think of his punishment

I guess now he knows how they feel, rightly or wrongly.

[Demo_Chris]

13. Despite the comments above, I like it...

Yes, the father is "bullying" his son. That's the POINT. He isn't telling his son how it feels, he is showing him. Say what you like, but I bet THIS boy doesn't do it again.

[Pretzel_Warrior]

17. kids don't just come out of the womb as bullies. it is learned behavior

I wonder where he learned it!!

[Demo_Chris]

21. Probably his Mom, right?

You posted this as if you believe you know the answer. In truth, you do not. You know nothing about this child, his family, friends, and probably no more than I do about the science and psychology of bullying.

This dad is being proactive. Like any decision by any parent, it is subject to questioning and debate and someone will always be quick to judge, but the guy is trying to do the RIGHT thing. And like I said, I bet this particular child never does it again.

[cynatnite]

22. Humiliating a child does not cure bullying...

He is powerless in this situation. Do you not think this child will want to feel strong after something like this? Do you not think that this will fuel this child's anger that lead him to bullying in the first place?

I'm sorry, humiliating children is never a right thing to do. NEVER.

[Demo_Chris]

33. Shame is a POWERFUL deterent.

Are you actually suggesting that a child should be protected from it?

If a child is caught shoplifting by his parent, and the parent makes him return the item to the shopkeeper and confess his crime, are you suggesting that this is wrong? If a child breaks a neighbor's window and the parent makes them return to the homeowner and confess, are you suggesting that this is bad parenting?

Are you suggesting that it is bad for a child to be forced to apologize?

Compared to the soul wrecking HELL that bullies put their victims through, this punishment is a fun day at Disney.

[Oilwellian]

51. I totally agree with you

This is nothing compared to the pain he inflicted on other kids.

[Pretzel_Warrior]

60. shame-based parenting is not good parenting. sorry to inform you of that.

If the father had built up a relationship with his son focused on love and respect, the son would be 99% be willing to listen to reason and be struck in the heart with his father's disappointment in his behavior.

This macho "I'll bully you, little fucker" is the wrong approach. Even if it stops the kid from bullying for a time.

[laundry_queen]

63. Yep. 100% agree. nt

[Nevernose]

98. If the father had focused on love and respect

The kid probably wouldn't have been a bully in the first place.

[laundry_queen]

62. Shame may be a deterrent in the moment

but long term it does more harm than good.

Shame was my parents' favorite punishment. I won't go into all the ways it has harmed me, but let's just say it was a big part of my therapy - to stop feeling like I was a big fat failure and having my parents' taunting voices playing in my head whenever I wasn't perfect.

The other instances you cite aren't parents shaming the child, but the child him or herself internally feeling the shame of having done wrong and being shown how to make it right. There is a HUGE difference in the forms of shame. One is extrinsic, one is intrinsic.

For example: instead of the parent making the child apologize to the shopkeeper, what if the parent made the child stand in front of the store with a sign that said, "I'm a thief! If you see me in this store, please tell the shopkeeper to kick me out in case I steal something!" The child is being punished for his wrongdoing and is humiliated at the same time, which makes him angry in the long run. He doesn't internalize that stealing is wrong - only that it is worse to get caught.

Now imagine a parent marches his child down to the shopkeeper and makes him return the stolen goods, and makes his apologize. Not only that, but they sit down with the shopkeeper and the child hears about how hard the shopkeeper works to support his family. The parent invites the shopkeeper and his family over for dinner, and the child is made to help serve the shopkeeper. Or perhaps the parent arranges some volunteer work for the child at the shopkeeper's store. The child intrinsically feels shame as he gets to know the shopkeeper and his family, and realizes how hard the shopkeeper works everyday. Shame is not forced upon him, but develops out of a sense of empathy, empathy that he has learned by what is shown to him.

In this instance, imagine if the parents instead sat the child down and made him think about how the other child feels. Go through everything the child did, "How would you feel if Billy did that to you?" and let the child think about and answer. If the child has problems making the link, make up something like, "If I, your dad, decided one day to take some of your toys and break them, how would you feel? What if I took your favorite toy and hid it where you couldn't find it, and then made fun of you? How would you feel?"

Then invite the bullied child and his parents over for dinner. Just like it's easier to bully people online, it's easier to bully them in school if you don't know them very well. Get to know the child. Get to know the parents. Make your child come up with a way to apologize. Explain that apologizing doesn't just mean saying you're sorry, it also means showing you are sorry and making amends. Make the child decide how he wants to make amends. Also, since your child has shown a lack of empathy by bullying, come up with ways in which your child will develop empathy. Bring him to volunteer at a soup kitchen, or in a children's ward in a hospital. Point out how lucky he is to have the life he does, and that other people don't have it easy and that it's important to have compassion. I'm not against punishing either - by all means take away your child's most important toy or game and explain to them that they will have to earn it back by helping others and being nice to the child he bullied.

I could go on - there are really SO many other ways to steer your children in the right direction that I get incensed when I see parents like this who mean well but choose exactly the wrong thing. I have never been a fan of "You want to see what it feels like? I'll show you what it feels like." type of parenting. It's lazy. I've had friends who bit their toddlers to teach them not to bite. I think it's horrible to do that. There are SO many other ways to TEACH your child the right way, instead of simply stopping the behavior in the moment.

I have 4 kids. All are honor students, I get compliments on their behavior all the time, their teachers talk about how sweet and compassionate my kids are and I often get, "wow, more parents should be like you". Not saying I'm perfect, but so far so good (my oldest is 16). And when I see people talk about how 'good for this parent!' for these types of punishments, I am saddened because there is a better way. Hopefully the father in the article isn't actually causing the behavior he thinks he's preventing.

[Pretzel_Warrior]

68. very methodically stated and well reasoned

hopefully some can see where you're coming from and possibly adjust their thought process in applauding what I deem to be a bully father who uses bullying/shaming tactics to "punish his kid for bullying".

Many kids who bully don't do it as a way to get another kid's lunch or the answers to a test. They do it to exert power. They feel powerless in the home, and they enjoy finding a place/people where they can exert the power they see constantly being wielded against them.

Of course, one must also admit that parents who completely cater to their kids' wishes and create self-centered kids who have no sense of sharing and cooperation will also send some pretty mean and unruly kids out into the world as well.

Ahhh...once again. It comes down to balance in approach and that there are no easy answers/quick fixes to doing a great job of parenting.

Kudos to you on your kids. They sound terrific.

[laundry_queen]

101. "They feel powerless in the home"

Yup - that was how my brother was. He was a bully, because our dad was a bully. I bullied a bit too (I was one of those 'mean girls' where I was always mean in a passive aggressive way). Our dad was a mean, controlling authoritarian who enjoyed shaming us and didn't feel like a punishment was complete without us completely humiliated and crying and broken. Then he was satisfied. I see a lot of my dad in this dad, which is why I commented.

I agree parents who cater are a problem as well. My ex-h was a spoiled-rotten only child. He's also a sociopath. I'm convinced he could've been different given a different upbringing. (he was spoiled, but also shamed a lot).

Thanks about my kids - it's an ongoing project, lol. so far they *are* terrific. And a lot of work! But it's worth it.

[polly7]

78. Well said.

In this instance, imagine if the parents instead sat the child down and made him think about how the other child feels. Go through everything the child did, "How would you feel if Billy did that to you?" and let the child think about and answer. If the child has problems making the link, make up something like, "If I, your dad, decided one day to take some of your toys and break them, how would you feel? What if I took your favorite toy and hid it where you couldn't find it, and then made fun of you? How would you feel?"

Children are naturally empathetic and compassionate and imo, bullying only begins when they've been pressured somehow - or by someone, to ignore those feelings. It's a whole lot easier to show them in the ways you've suggested above: experiencing the loss of their own favourite toy, visiting the soup kitchen, etc. that it's really alright to feel the hurt of others and to care, and something they should do. Such a simple thing, and you really can tell the kids who were raised with parents who believe it's important.

[laundry_queen]

103. I'm a huge fan of teaching kids empathy

well, showing them too, obviously, but teaching empathy can do SO MUCH. At my kids' last school they had a program called 'roots of empathy' where they bring in a young baby and use the baby to teach empathy. They learn about how helpless a tiny infant is and how they need help to survive. The kids follow the baby all year, once or twice a month visits, and learn how the baby develops and how to figure out what the baby is feeling by his/her body language. This was in BC, Canada. It's a VERY cool program. It should be in every school all around North America, IMO.

[riderinthestorm]

79. How do you know this boy's parents haven't had those conversations?

Or invited the bullied child and the parents over for dinner? Maybe they know the other parents even.

Do you know this family? They don't volunteer? Or point out how lucky he is? How do you know this kid isn't in therapy? etc etc etc.

The thing is you don't know any of that.

I have a 26 year old who I get "rave" reviews on my parenting. She's a magnificent human being on every level. I'm so proud of her.

My 17 year old (raised in the exact same way, same parents, same environment, same socio-economic status etc) is a 180 degree different kid. She has challenged every notion I ever had about myself as a parent, and more importantly about OTHER PARENTS. After 3 years of awful stuff, she's finally come through it knock-on-wood. I'm so proud of her.

But the stuff she, and us as her parents, had to do to get to this point would blow. your. mind. All of it under professional counseling and guidance.

I would never DARE presume to know what's going on internally for this family. Its really easy to point fingers and assume they don't volunteer or model empathy etc etc. Or that this episode is the sum total of their parenting.

Because sometimes when kids do shitty things, stepping up as the parent requires you to do some pretty shitty stuff in response and its the only way forward. I know first hand.

[polly7]

85. Those are good points also.

Every child reacts differently to external pressures, ie. peers, school environment, etc. and sometimes even the best parenting plays no part in how a child behaves outside of the home. I was specifically thinking of bullying ... I don't think that a child who's been taught from the start how important feeling empathy and compassion is, is nearly even as capable of being a bully. But you're right, none of us knows what any other parent has tried or gone through.

[laundry_queen]

94. I have an idea

because I grew up in a family that would have done something like this boy's parents did and I am pretty good and picking out the dynamic of a family.

And if this kid was in therapy, the therapist would be telling the father that what he did was a bad idea. I know this because I had to put one of my kids in therapy. See, I also have a child that challenges me every single day, and she had issues dealing with her dad leaving us. She had a period where she wasn't a great kid with me (still was with everyone else, she saved her violent tantrums for me only). Putting her in therapy meant that the therapist involved me in any major issues and gave me a shit ton of 'homework' to do in order to facilitate my child's healing. Had my daughter been a bully, and told the therapist what I did (had I made her hold a sign by the road) I know the therapist would've had a few words for me. Do I know for sure this didn't happen? No, but I'd be willing to put some money on it not happening. Odds are I'm right with this. As I said, I know this particular family dynamic. Once you've been in therapy and understand your family's issues and have done your research, it's super easy to pick them out based on typical behavior. You don't have to agree with me. I'm basing this on the father's behavior, not the child's behavior.

[Jefferson23]

106. Excellent, teaching is what is needed and the formulation of it should not be exploitation.

Thank you for your post.

[joeybee12]

114. No it is not...show me the studies that prove that...

Or even come close to backing you up...you can't.

[Worried senior]

35. I agree with you.

Too many parents out there are saying my little boy wouldn't do this, yes, your kid will do it.

[Demo_Chris]

39. Not their angel. No way. nt

[cynatnite]

20. How does humiliating a child stop them from bullying? n/t

[Demo_Chris]

24. In the same way that shame stops many behaviors. nt

[cynatnite]

27. There is a difference between shame and humilating...

You don't have to cart a kid out to the public to shame them.

This is humiliating a child. You don't think this will fuel the anger this child felt in the first place? That anger which lead him to bully in the first place came from somewhere. Why not work with the child to solve it?

Instead, the parent hopes this "quick fix" will cure him from bullying. The parent is as much at fault if not more for how that child behaves.

[riderinthestorm]

31. You don't know if this is the end product of a long discussion and attempts

to "work with the child to solve it".

You don't know if this is a "quick fix" or if the father has other plans that go along with this.

We don't even know what the bullying episode(s) entailed.

We don't know if it the bullying was done in anger or with malicious intent or is homophobic or what.

[cynatnite]

38. If there had been a history of long discussions and attempts to work with the child...

what makes you think public humiliation solves it?

Usually what is behind bullying are a multitude of other issues which includes the home life. This kid is not acting out for no reason.

Humiliating a child publicly in such a way is not the answer. Bullying is a sign of a deeper issue with the kid.

On the surface, I think the kid learned it from his father since it was he who thinks that bullying his kid and humiliating him is the thing to do.

[Demo_Chris]

43. It's amazing how many conclusions you have drawn from one image and a short article...

You've damn near got the entire family dynamic figured out, and in a surprise twist worthy of M. Night Shyamalan, the guy in the story trying to STOP his child from being a bully is really the bad guy who taught him to be a bully in the first place. Well done.

[cynatnite]

45. Just like everyone else, you included, I'm guessing...

Humiliating a child does not solve bullying. It should not be treated as a quick fix. I think it has the potential to be abusive to the child.

[RobinA]

67. That's How

bullying works. Behind every bully is a...bully.

[riderinthestorm]

47. I'm sorry but "humiliating" and "shaming" appear to be synonyms

And as a parent I HAVE used "shaming" behavior to teach my kids lessons.

For example, when my older girl stole candy from the Walgreens, we had a long conversation about the ramifications of stealing - moral, personal and as a part of the community. Then she was marched back into the store with the stash and made to apologize to the store manager in front of staff and customers (gasp! shaming her in front of others). She has NEVER stolen again (she's 26 now).

I just don't think you have enough of the story to know this family's dynamics. I don't dare to presume. I simply don't know them or what happened here.

Neither do you.

[cynatnite]

49. I've used shaming with my children...

but I would never humiliate them.

There is a distinctive difference.

One is about self and the other is not.

[Demo_Chris]

36. No, any difference is subjective, and you are playing at semantics. nt

[cynatnite]

44. There is a difference...

It's not semantics.

Humiliation is an abasement of pride. One is lowered in the eyes of others.

Shame is an emotion caused by sense of guilt or embarrassment. It's how one perceives self.

[Demo_Chris]

46. Thanks, this has been a fun debate. I will leave you with the final word. nt

[TBF]

50. Long-term consequences of shaming -

This is the seminal book on how shaming works and the resulting consequences:

In this classic volume, Kaufman synthesizes object relations theory, interpersonal theory, and, in particular, Silvan Tompkins's affect theory, to provide a powerful and multidimensional view of shame. Using his own clinical experience, he illustrates the application of affect theory to general classes of shame-based syndromes including compulsive; schizoid, depressive, and paranoid; sexual dysfunction; splitting; and sociopathic. This second edition includes two new chapters in which Dr. Kaufman presents shame as a societal dynamic and shows its impact on culture. He examines the role of shame in shaping the evolving identity of racial, ethnic, and religious minorities, and expands his theory of governing scenes. This new edition will continue to be of keen interest to clinical psychiatrists as well as graduate students.

http://www.amazon.com/The-Psychology-Shame-Gershen-Kaufman-ebook/dp/B005A4R6HQ/ref=tmm_kin_title_0

This is a less academic version:

http://www.amazon.com/Shame-Power-Caring-Gershen-Kaufman/dp/0870470531/ref=pd_bxgy_b_img_y

[Pretzel_Warrior]

61. Shaming a child is 19th century parenting and stupid/lazy way to go about it

[Jim Warren]

23. It's soooo easy

raising other people's kids.

[LittleBlue]

25. Good. It's time we stopped pampering bullies

How many suicides do we have to see before bullying is treated with the severity it deserves?

Well done, dad.

[cynatnite]

29. A quick fix of humiliating a child won't cure bullying. n/t

[LittleBlue]

34. I'll bet you that kid won't bully anymore

If every bully was treated this severely, I'd also bet you the number of bullying incidents drops like a rock.

It continues because of the dismissive attitude "it's only bullying".

[cynatnite]

48. I'm not convinced it would...

One has to know why a child is bullying to begin with. Maybe the child can only find empowerment because of an abusive home life? Maybe the child witnesses his father being a bully?

I agree that too many people dismiss it, but this tactic certainly won't cure it.

[Pab Sungenis]

40. Bravo.

If we stopped canonizing the bullies killed when one of their victims snaps and sees no alternative to shooting their oppressor, maybe we'd have fewer Columbines.

[Union Scribe]

92. So the only people you think get shot

in those school shootings are the bullies eh? You're edging pretty close to a 'they had it coming' argument.

[JonLP24]

117. Not only that

The idea that they were bullied and the motivation was revenge for that is a myth
http://www.cnn.com/2009/CRIME/04/20/columbine.myths/

[mnhtnbb]

30. Well, in a few years when this kid shoots the old man while he's asleep

no one should be surprised.

[DinahMoeHum]

41. Honk! Honk! Bullies Suck.

[Hoyt]

58. Not sure this is the way, but I applaud dad for doing something. Lots of Texans would pat their kid

on the head and give him an AR15 and thousands of rounds of ammo.

[ScreamingMeemie]

73. Bull crap.

Signed, a Texas mom who knows tons of other Texans...

[Hoyt]

76. You honestly don't think your governor or right wing baggers would've condoned

the kid's actions?

[ScreamingMeemie]

77. Is that what I said? No.

I said there are not many other parents who would "pat their kids on the head" and hand them thousands of rounds of ammunition. In fact, the bullying policy at my son's Texas school is far more advanced than his Michigan school ever was...

I absolutely DETEST stereotypes of average people...especially when a story like this comes out where, whether we agree with the parent's reaction or not, a parent is attempting to do something.

[bigwillq]

64. Good for Dad!

Bullying is a huge problem and, no, I don't think the Dad is a bully for making his child do this. It's called tough love. We need more of that in our country.

[Liberal_in_LA]

69. “I refuse to allow my child to be somebody else’s pain,” he explained.

That says it all

[Posteritatis]

86. Yep. (nt)

[RedCappedBandit]

70. Honestly, I'm not a fan of public humiliation as a parenting tool.

I can't help but smirk when reading this, though.

[xchrom]

71. my dad wouldn't have thought of a sign and a road way -- but he sure would have spanked my ass.

and then there would have been a grounding.

my folks just din't put up with insensitive, anti-social bull shit.

[ScreamingMeemie]

72. The thing I tell my son is,"I don't expect you to be friends with everyone, but I will not stand for

you to be part of the problem."

That said, I cannot judge this parent because I have seen children not give up bad behaviors despite everything a parent does.

And sometimes no, children don't learn bullying from their parents. I've seen wonderful parents raise some rather shitty children.

[riderinthestorm]

80. [phone]. nt

[Mariana]

83. People always tend to discount peer influence.

Kids spend an awful lot of time away from their parents, what with day care and school and activities and ordinary play time. During that time they can and do learn rotten behavior from their peers. A lot of them are smart enough not to act as badly at home as they do when they're among other kids, so unless someone tells the parents what's going on, they honestly have no idea.

[enki23]

74. Lacks both proportion and propriety.

.

[Nine]

84. Awful parenting.

And for those saying that others have no business judging this father's parenting - when you make a public display of your child's punishment and give interviews about it, you lose your right to parent privately without public comment.

[hamsterjill]

87. I don't like that video of the son having to hold the sign was put on the news.

That's a little harsh to me. Instead of this being a learning experience, it will be seared in his mind forever as the ultimate humiliation, and he'll always have the video to relive it.

And as a parent, I always have to ask how the child got to this level of behavior without the parent realizing it and handling it before it got so out of hand.

That said - the father has a right to rear his child the way he sees fit.

[Pretzel_Warrior]

91. actually, there are even limits on that. (as there should be)

maybe not in this type of case, but there are plenty of parents who were charged with crimes for the way they "chose to raise their kids".

[B Calm]

93. The new TV show "The Millers" last night

had a young boy carrying a sign back and forth on the sidewalk that read that he had a potty mouth. Miller the TV news reporter asked him if he had learned his lesson. The little boy cussed at him like a drunken sailor. It was freaking hilarious!!

[budkin]

97. Kinda harsh but I think it'll teach him a lesson without violence

Oh, and fuck bullies

[47of74]

107. Whatever else you may think....

...we finally have a parent who doesn't whine and make excuses for his child and instead punishes the little jerk. I despise bullies as I was the victim of them and I make no fucking apologies in regards to my attitudes towards them.

[JonLP24]

113. I'm usually against things like this

but for some reason the analogy of the humiliation makes sense. I do think the idea that the sign has to be pink is stupid.

I'm not convinced one way or the other if this is appropriate. I do think there are other actions handled in-house that could be just as/or more effective.

[SoCalDem]

115. Probably should take taken the kid personally to the school

and supported him while he (the son) apologized to the kids he bullied..and as a father, he should have apologized to the parents of the bullied kids.

and then gotten some family counseling to see why this kid has so much anger..

The dad's overt and shaming punishment says more about the Dad than it does the kid..

Looks like dad wants kudos for HIS reaction to the kid's bad behavior, more than he wants the kid to learn something constructive.

[William769]

116. I am probably in the minority here but I salute the father for his actions.

The article I read said the father had tried everything & was left to do this.