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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsLeonardo da Vinci painting lost for centuries found in Swiss bank vault
The painting appears to be a completed, painted version of a pencil sketch drawn by Leonardo da Vinci in Mantua in the Lombardy region of northern Italy in 1499
But a 500-year-old mystery was apparently solved today after a painting attributed to Leonardo da Vinci was discovered in a Swiss bank vault.
The painting, which depicts Isabella dEste, a Renaissance noblewoman, was found in a private collection of 400 works kept in a Swiss bank by an Italian family who asked not to be identified.
It appears to be a completed, painted version of a pencil sketch drawn by Leonardo da Vinci in Mantua in the Lombardy region of northern Italy in 1499.
The sketch, the apparent inspiration for the newly found work, hangs in the Louvre Museum in Paris.
For centuries it had been debated whether Leonardo had actually had the time or inclination to develop the sketch into a painted portrait.
more
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/italy/10356401/Leonardo-da-Vinci-painting-lost-for-centuries-found-in-Swiss-bank-vault.html
onehandle
(51,122 posts)When da Vinci was alive, he was just another painter, more or less. It's just that to us, all this many years later, he's an icon and all of his work is revered.
If such works were legitimately bought in the first place, at what point should they just be taken away from the private owners? Really?
A HERETIC I AM
(24,368 posts)Demo_Chris
(6,234 posts)onehandle
(51,122 posts)Art should be protected from monsters and 1%ers looking for something to hang in one of their downstairs' powder rooms.
SheilaT
(23,156 posts)and a daVinci which has been owned by the same family for four hundred years?
Swiss bank account?
Fuck them.
msanthrope
(37,549 posts)onehandle
(51,122 posts)Anyway, I have repeatedly said in this thread that I was talking about art of note.
Everyone wants to change my meaning.
msanthrope
(37,549 posts)onehandle
(51,122 posts)There are a lot of masterpieces of note, owned by individuals, on permanent loan.
oldhippie
(3,249 posts)..... things that they like away from the people that have them. Usually it's called theft. When you get enough people to support you it's called something else.
Earth_First
(14,910 posts)I happen to collect concert prints, both vintage and newly printed that I have acquired both through private sale and directly from the artists.
If 50 years from now, Tyler Stout's work begins selling for $50K or more (highly doubtful...) but I should have my collection confiscated because it resides in a private collection?
Hardly.
onehandle
(51,122 posts)Art of notability should end up in museums.
Earth_First
(14,910 posts)Jenoch
(7,720 posts)think should be confiscated? Who is going to do the confiscation?
bvar22
(39,909 posts)I also support a yearly Wealth Tax.
Those who believes in a Meritocracy and a level, democratic, economic playing field over a Plutocracy/Aristocracy believe in these taxes too.
There is something creepy about someone who would keep great works of art hidden from the peasants. That ain't right.
GreenStormCloud
(12,072 posts)This is the first the world has seen of it, so the family must have bought it shortly after it was done. They may have commissioned da Vinci to do it.
By your standads no one should ever be allowed to privately own any work of art.
SheilaT
(23,156 posts)All art should be public art, is what this OP suggests.
*I* own art. I doubt any of it will be worth a lot someday, and a couple of my favorite things are ones my sons did when they were little. I have much of this art hanging on my walls, or on shelves or table tops. It gives me great pleasure. If, by chance, something I currently have becomes daVinci category valuable, it would be nice if my descendents loaned it out occasionally to museums, but unless they get to sell it at the fair-market value, they should be able to keep it.
Had the original owners of this piece not stored it away carefully, we wouldn't have it at all. I'm thrilled just to see the reproduction, although honestly for some reason I like the original sketch better. That's just my personal taste.
blogslut
(38,000 posts)Dr. Barnes felt that cloistering great works within the walls of "legitimate" museums and galleries was more about marketing those venues than about exposing beauty to the masses.
onehandle
(51,122 posts)Been there. I live minutes away from there.
None of that art is hanging above Donald Trump's toilet.
blogslut
(38,000 posts)Not all rich people are republicans.
BrotherIvan
(9,126 posts)Sounds a lot like the reasons why an estate tax of 0% is essential. IGMFU has taken over the discussion of a beautiful piece of art that could be enjoyed by millions. Really?
Just to play devil's advocate, this painting has been sitting in a vault for years: how much is it worth? A billion dollars? Will this family be paying a reasonable amount of taxes on it from now on as it has increased the estate's worth exponentially? And how do we feel about the fortunes that were based upon stealing art and treasures from Jews in WWII? How about the plunder from Africa and the New World? If I remember correctly, that's about 400 years old too.
I don't know good answers to these questions, but I'm surprised about all the grasping & fear.
treestar
(82,383 posts)In a bank? Not even enjoying it themselves.
Or did they even know they had this?
From the article, there looks like there is doubt Leonardo actually did paint it.
cthulu2016
(10,960 posts)There's no doubt somebody painted it from that sketch. Somebody might have even finished it from an abandoned Leonardo panel or canvas.
And I do not doubt that it is quite old. (Though after 1499, of course.)
But FFS... Leonardo did not paint THAT. It's awful in all the ways a Leonardo painting is not awful. Tenuous/hesitant line, lack of sense of underlying forms, flat-out incompetent drapery effects... not Leonardo. This painter doesn't even understand the shape of the woman's nose that leonardo's drawing indicates... he is not "reading" the drawing correctly.
And that hair... Leonardo, the great observer of organic form doing essentially a repeated fabric pattern... a symbolof hair, rather than hair. No sense the neck is cylindrical (and thus no understanding of the "why" of the shadow, only the "where."
There's a trick to these things. Does the painter know things the drawing doesn't tell? The real artist knows more than the drawing tells. The copyist knows less. Wherever the drawing doesn't give a clear guide to everything the painting falls apart.
The plant frond in her hand and her crown are not deliniated in the drawing. If the painitng is not by Leonardo we would expect those specific elements to be notably worse then other elements. And they are. Simple, un-nuanced and amatuerish. (The headband lighly implied in the drawing is, by the way, correct in its lack of roundness. The bottom line of the crown is more curved to make the crown look rounder... again, a symbol of a crown, not a crown.)
I mentioned the hair before. Leonardo didn't mess much with the hair because that was not his concern in the drawing, which is mostly about a profile. The hair is thus just a mass. (Maybe even in a net, which was common back then.) So the copyist has no instructions for the hair, and the painted hair is insubstansial and weak. But where the drawing says exactly what to do, the painting gets better.
Which is not to say it has never been sold as a Leonardo and bought as a Leonardo and stored away by somebody thinking it was a Leonardo.
I don't doubt that it has been.
Maybe a mediocre student of the master, or an art student from another decade
OldEurope
(1,273 posts)Look at the differences. The shadows at the cheek and the throat in the painting are anything but subtle. She Looks like she had a different skin colour at her throat. Maybe one of his scholars but never ever he himself.
xchrom
(108,903 posts)MNBrewer
(8,462 posts)Where's the background, for example?
Jefferson23
(30,099 posts)Scientific tests have shown that the type of pigment in the portrait was the same as that used by Leonardo, as was the primer used to treat the canvas. Carbon dating, conducted by a mass spectrometry laboratory at the University of Arizona, has shown that the portrait was painted between 1460 and 1650.
Professor Pedretti, a recognized expert in authenticating disputed works by Da Vinci, said more analysis was required to determine whether certain elements of the portrait notably a golden tiara on the noblewomans head and a palm leaf held in her hand like a scepter were the work of Leonardo or one of his pupils.
http://www.csmonitor.com/World/Global-News/2013/1004/Another-Da-Vinci-mystery-Is-a-newfound-500-year-old-painting-his
BlueJazz
(25,348 posts)If you measure her extended finger, in real life, it would reach from the bottom of her chin to her eye.
It's unusual ?? or not ?