Staggering Statistic

[bigtree]

Mother Jones ‏@MotherJones 2h

Every square mile of ocean contains 46,000 pieces of floating plastic, according to the UN http://mojo.ly/GCNYHX

[wercal]

1. I'm not sure the photo is accurate

I've seen stories on this before, and the pieces of plastic in the ocean break down into tiny pieces, which are small enough to be ingested by sea life.

[bigtree]

2. but, they don't begin their life cycle in the ocean as 'tiny pieces' of plastic

. . . do they?

[wercal]

3. No...but the story is about 46,000 pieces of plastic per square mile

You won't find 46,000 bottles per square mile...you'll find 46,000 ingestible bits of plastic.

A bottle is ugly, but it won't particularly hurt an animal.

Pieces of plastic small enough to swallow hurt animals (and people btw).

[bigtree]

4. where did those 46,000 ingestible bits of plastic come from, then?

... if these bottles "won't particularly hurt an animal".

Good point that the plastic is broken down and dispersed, but disconnected from the actual source of that plastic in trying to make this distinction of yours.

[wercal]

5. That's like taking a photo of a tree and calling it paper waste

"where did those 46,000 ingestible bits of plastic come from, then?"

I'm merely pointing out that the trash in the ocean (the subject of the story) does not look like a few bottles washed up onshore in some bay.

The photo accompanying the story should be, I dunno, of the actual trash it describes...lest somebody get the wrong impression that there are 46k bottles floating per square mile.

[bigtree]

6. now you're mixing apples and oranges

. . . but, maybe all the fuss you've made on this thread will be sufficient to warn folks off of any concern of theirs that the plastic in the photo represents the actual problem.

[wercal]

9. Psst

I have a secret.

Come closer....a little bit closer...

Bottles are not the major source of plastic pollution in the ocean.

Plastic bags, pellets used in manufacturing, wrappers, packing material, etc.

[bigtree]

10. yet

These larger items are the visible signs of a much larger problem. These big items do not degrade like natural materials. At sea and on shore under the influence of sunlight, wave action and mechanical abrasion they simply break down slowly into ever smaller particles.

A single one litre bottle could break down into enough small fragments to put one on every mile of beach in the entire world.


http://www.greenpeace.org/international/en/campaigns/oceans/pollution/trash-vortex/

[KoKo]

7. Maybe if we could find a way to get the bottles off surface before

they break down into the bits of plastic that can't be recovered...would be a start.

I've read back and forth about how we clean this up and there doesn't seem to be a way. Yet some feel that at least some kind of surface dredging in the currents where the waste flows might be worth a worldwide effort. Some kind of "skimming nets" for the large items would at least be a start. But, ideas never seem to go anywhere.

[wercal]

11. Before cleaning it up, we need strategies to stop the pollution in the first place

The bottles really aren't the problem. Now the OP seems really bent out of shape that I'm trying to explain this, but its true.

The real problem is

1) Pellets
2) Crap that flies off of trash barges

The pellets are the raw plastic beads that are shipped across the ocean to get molded into crap in China. The factories that make the pellets, the transfer points where pellets go from factory to truck or truck to rail, or rail to ship...these are all opportunities for the pellets to hit the ground. And eventually the rivers run to the oceans of the world. So, the pellets that spill on the parking lot in Texas and don't get a second thought will eventually end up in the oceans.

And the crap that flies off of trash barges - bags, wrappers, light stuff that gets blown off, even through the trash nets.

The bottles will stay as 'bottles' for many years, and are easily skimmed off the top. The real problem is the suspension like array of the 'pieces' of bags and these pellets that are at varying depths.

The US puts 1/3 of this in the ocean. So we can do our part. Banning plastic bags, mandatory (or incentivized) recycling are up for discussion. Handing these pellets as a hazardous material, with reporting requirements on spills would go a long way to keep these under control.

The other 2/3...international cooperation is needed. Good luck.

Cleaning it up? At this point it would take forever. All I can think of is large ships that intake ocean water and filter it, before pumping it back out...operating 24/7 for decades. But fish, plankton, etc. would be a problem for this approach. The pellets are eventually consumed by microbes, once they get microscopically small, so the trash would eventually go away...if we would just quit putting it out there.

Fun fact - I have a glass ball, which acts like a float for a fishing net. The Japanese made these balls for centuries, blowing them into sand molds. They quit using glass floats in the late 1930's I think, but the balls are still out there. Every once in a while, an unusual storm will blow some balls up on the beach. Mine came from Alaska...after spending a minimum of 70 years floating at sea. Stuff can stay out there for a long, long time.

[KoKo]

12. Thanks for your view on this..BUT...what if we could not only stop this

AT THE SOURCE...but for those in countries without our efforts to stop use of Platics that we could "SKIM SURFACE!" Drag Nets in the Ocean Currents where it ALL FLOWS!

Would you go with that?

If you can't train people to Recycle (or in Countries where there is NO RECYCLING...could you see that "SKIMMING THIS" might be a HUMANITARIAN PROJECT?

WHY NOT? If you can't get "Platic Bottles/Jugs and the Rest of this waste out of DEVELOPING COUNTRIES....then why not do an INTERNATIONAL EFFORT FOR CLEAN UP?

SHIPS who do FISHING...to do the CLEAN UP! WHY NOT?

Have them SKIM...because there will SOON BE NO FISH who are SAFE to EAT...LEFT!

[wercal]

13. Skimming won't get most of it.

This stuff is floating around in subsurface 'clouds' of nearly microscopic particles.

[CrispyQ]

8. Chris Jordan's Midway: Message from the Gyre (2009 - Current)

http://www.chrisjordan.com/gallery/midway/#CF000313%2018x24







This image is not from Jordan's collection, but a precursor to it.




I read an article that said anytime you see a photo of a gorgeous beach, almost certainly a crew went through & picked up the debris beforehand.

We don't deserve this fine planet.