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Purveyor

(29,876 posts)
Fri Dec 6, 2013, 06:12 PM Dec 2013

U.S. Eases Turbine Bird-Death Rule as Cats Kill Millions

By Justin Doom - Dec 6, 2013

The U.S. Interior Department loosened restrictions designed to reduce the threat from wind farms that annually kill dozens of federally protected eagles.

That’s a small figure compared to the hundreds of millions of birds killed every year by cats, cars and mobile-phone towers. Wind farms killed about 573,000 birds in the U.S. last year, according to the Wildlife Society.

“In 2002, the U.S. Fish & Wildlife Service estimated that communication towers kill 4 million to 5 million per year, cars kill roughly 60 million, cats kill hundreds of millions,” Amy Grace, a wind industry analyst for Bloomberg New Energy Finance, said today in by e-mail.

Almost 1 billion are killed annually from flying into windows, and “no one is protesting about bird deaths outside your new home,” she said.

David Ringer, a spokesman for the National Audubon Society, said 67 federally protected bald and golden eagles have been killed by turbines in the U.S. since 2008, a figure that excludes deaths in California’s Altamont Pass area, where as many as 60 to 75 eagles are killed every year.

more...

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-12-06/u-s-eases-turbine-bird-death-rule-as-cats-kill-millions.html

35 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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U.S. Eases Turbine Bird-Death Rule as Cats Kill Millions (Original Post) Purveyor Dec 2013 OP
This message was self-deleted by its author CurtEastPoint Dec 2013 #1
So you are a yes vote for tearing down all buildings that kill billions of birds a year. Luminous Animal Dec 2013 #9
DUer's hate hunting for fun...feral Kittehs hunt without interest in eating. HereSince1628 Dec 2013 #11
If a post is claiming that a feral cat can kill a bald eagle Aerows Dec 2013 #13
I'm not. Personally, I'm trying to protect Oven birds and Yellow Warblers. HereSince1628 Dec 2013 #16
windows are not natural and they kill far more birds than turbines Pretzel_Warrior Dec 2013 #12
Cats are not natural. They're domesticated. JVS Dec 2013 #14
Outdoor cats are an invasive species.. Upton Dec 2013 #15
Those kitties are a non-native species Major Nikon Dec 2013 #20
We already knew Bloomberg hated cats. KamaAina Dec 2013 #2
Tell you what Aerows Dec 2013 #3
Cats can kill smaller birds that predatory birds would eat. geek tragedy Dec 2013 #34
It's the flying turbine blades, and the turbine cancer voltage that's really dangerous...nt SidDithers Dec 2013 #4
i have heard tales of ProdigalJunkMail Dec 2013 #6
ha. n/t tammywammy Dec 2013 #10
if you duck into the 3 meters of hail Sid, you can avoid the flying turbine blades.... dionysus Dec 2013 #24
I have seen screaming coyotes climbing trees! zappaman Dec 2013 #31
Another difference cats and windmills Beringia Dec 2013 #5
That isn't really true. HereSince1628 Dec 2013 #19
That is funny that you mention cats in Wisconsin Beringia Dec 2013 #22
Well, the last bullshit article about this said cats kill BILLIONS... joeybee12 Dec 2013 #7
Funny, all these "bullshit" studies about cat kills NickB79 Dec 2013 #28
Cats kill birds, it's the hysteria, as evidenced by your bs post... joeybee12 Dec 2013 #30
100 million to a billion dead birds per year from a non-native predator NickB79 Dec 2013 #35
loss of habitat has destroyed populations of far more birds and butterflies. KittyWampus Dec 2013 #8
Yeah, that's why I find most of the pearl clutching about turbines ... LisaLynne Dec 2013 #17
These are two very different issues. surrealAmerican Dec 2013 #18
Message auto-removed Name removed Dec 2013 #21
This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Dec 2013 #23
LOL! - " they'd just camp out underneath the turbines and wait" ConcernedCanuk Dec 2013 #25
I don't think many house cats kill eagles. ... spin Dec 2013 #26
You want to rage about cats and turbines killing birds? Are_grits_groceries Dec 2013 #27
BALD EAGLE NUMBERS ON THE RISE B Calm Dec 2013 #29
Bald eagles and ospreys have both rebounded admirably. geek tragedy Dec 2013 #33
The article is misleading--the deal was that wind farm companies would spend the money geek tragedy Dec 2013 #32

Response to Purveyor (Original post)

HereSince1628

(36,063 posts)
11. DUer's hate hunting for fun...feral Kittehs hunt without interest in eating.
Fri Dec 6, 2013, 06:53 PM
Dec 2013

Feral domestic cats are not native to N. Am. and ground and near ground nesting birds aren't adapted to deal with the depredation that high densities of feral cats cause.

Bird lovers haven't much good to say about feral cat populations.

 

Aerows

(39,961 posts)
13. If a post is claiming that a feral cat can kill a bald eagle
Fri Dec 6, 2013, 06:57 PM
Dec 2013

that is about the most specious claim imaginable, unless they are attempting to conflate it with cats killing birds, which they do. Attaching it to our national symbol like cats are killing bald eagles? Stupidity that deserves to be mocked.

HereSince1628

(36,063 posts)
16. I'm not. Personally, I'm trying to protect Oven birds and Yellow Warblers.
Fri Dec 6, 2013, 07:07 PM
Dec 2013

I have no love for feral domestic cats that are, by and large recreational dicky-bird killers.

 

Pretzel_Warrior

(8,361 posts)
12. windows are not natural and they kill far more birds than turbines
Fri Dec 6, 2013, 06:55 PM
Dec 2013

so I guess we should get rid of all our windows. Break that news to folks in Minnesota this time of year.

 

KamaAina

(78,249 posts)
2. We already knew Bloomberg hated cats.
Fri Dec 6, 2013, 06:41 PM
Dec 2013

Or at least his would-be successor Joe Lhota does. Remember the subway kittens?



Lhota, head of the MTA, said he would have kept the trains running and squashed 'em?

 

Aerows

(39,961 posts)
3. Tell you what
Fri Dec 6, 2013, 06:44 PM
Dec 2013

if your cat can kill a bald eagle, this is probably a sign that your cat can take over the government and defy laws, anyway.

 

geek tragedy

(68,868 posts)
34. Cats can kill smaller birds that predatory birds would eat.
Mon Dec 9, 2013, 11:59 AM
Dec 2013

Of course, where eagles eat fish, cats aren't much of a problem for them.

But, warblers and buntings count just as much as eagles do.

ProdigalJunkMail

(12,017 posts)
6. i have heard tales of
Fri Dec 6, 2013, 06:48 PM
Dec 2013

turbine cancer voltage being effective as far as a mile from the windmill... crazy...

sP

Beringia

(4,316 posts)
5. Another difference cats and windmills
Fri Dec 6, 2013, 06:47 PM
Dec 2013

Windmills are in the wide open, wild areas, where animals can usually find their niche. Cats kill birds near human enclaves.

HereSince1628

(36,063 posts)
19. That isn't really true.
Fri Dec 6, 2013, 07:26 PM
Dec 2013

I have 17 acres set aside to protect non-game species 50 miles from Milwaukee, 37 miles from Madison. At 2.4 humans per square mile this is about as far from human enclaves as you can get in southern WI.

BUT!!! There is a US HWY and a County Rd which facilitate cat owners to drive by and let loose their no longer loved house cat.

Feral cats are a significant problem for me. They devastate ground and near-ground nesting bird populations. The mortality rate of 'pet cats' is very high. Illness and road kills lead the list, but falling to birds of prey for the starving and sick is pretty high. I take the best, maybe 6 per year, to the local shelter in hopes of saving them..

A small but significant number of cat owners are not responsible about ownership. The animals that they release into the environment are NOT an authentic part of the N. Am. fauna.


Beringia

(4,316 posts)
22. That is funny that you mention cats in Wisconsin
Fri Dec 6, 2013, 08:41 PM
Dec 2013

I actually lived in Madison for about 7 years and was there when the DNR had a meeting about making it legal to shoot feral cats. I went to the meeting where it was overflowing with people who did not want hunters shooting cats. Then this meeting got me started on issues of stopping cruelty to wild animals.

I did not know so many people abandoned their cats on county roads. Very sad for the cats.
 

joeybee12

(56,177 posts)
7. Well, the last bullshit article about this said cats kill BILLIONS...
Fri Dec 6, 2013, 06:48 PM
Dec 2013

So the cats apparently are making progress in stifling their instincts.

NickB79

(19,253 posts)
28. Funny, all these "bullshit" studies about cat kills
Sat Dec 7, 2013, 05:49 AM
Dec 2013

Some say hundreds of millions, others say billions.

Oddly enough, you never read any studies claiming cats kill almost no birds.

Why do you think that is? With so many studies, is it possible that cats kill anywhere from a few hundred million to a billion+ birds per year, and YOU'RE the one spouting BS when you dismiss the damage?

 

joeybee12

(56,177 posts)
30. Cats kill birds, it's the hysteria, as evidenced by your bs post...
Mon Dec 9, 2013, 11:51 AM
Dec 2013

That is the problem...some feather-philes who think nature should be curtailed to their particular whims.

NickB79

(19,253 posts)
35. 100 million to a billion dead birds per year from a non-native predator
Mon Dec 9, 2013, 02:32 PM
Dec 2013

Is hysteria to you, huh?

Thank god you're not responsible for ensuring the survival of native flora and fauna in this country.

Nature, curtailed? Domesticated cats are no more part of nature in the US than feral hogs or kudzu vines. WTF is being curtailed?

LisaLynne

(14,554 posts)
17. Yeah, that's why I find most of the pearl clutching about turbines ...
Fri Dec 6, 2013, 07:15 PM
Dec 2013

disingenuous. Loss of habitat, pollution from dirty energy sources, etc. kill birds, too, but no, let's go after the turbines.

surrealAmerican

(11,362 posts)
18. These are two very different issues.
Fri Dec 6, 2013, 07:22 PM
Dec 2013

The article seems to think there's some connection, but we are not even talking about the same kinds of birds.

Response to Purveyor (Original post)

Response to Purveyor (Original post)

spin

(17,493 posts)
26. I don't think many house cats kill eagles. ...
Sat Dec 7, 2013, 12:36 AM
Dec 2013

It is far more likely that the eagle will kill a house cat. If you do a web search you will find reports of hawks killing domestic cats as well as a few stories of house cats killing a hawk.

However I will agree that cats do a significant amount of damage to the native bird population in our nation.

Are_grits_groceries

(17,111 posts)
27. You want to rage about cats and turbines killing birds?
Sat Dec 7, 2013, 05:34 AM
Dec 2013

I suggest you take your outrage to the companies that maufacture pesticides and people who use them. That is where the biggest problem lies.

Rachel Carson predicted this in the 'Silent Spring.' At the time she got criticized for it. Now it's a classic.

Carson knew a lot about birds and bird populations. I never heard about her ranting about cats. There were plenty of feral cats around then too. She was very outspoken and if she thought that Garfield was heading an empire of feline marauders who were endangering birds, she would have said so.

 

B Calm

(28,762 posts)
29. BALD EAGLE NUMBERS ON THE RISE
Sat Dec 7, 2013, 06:47 AM
Dec 2013


Researchers Are Reporting A Soaring Number Of East Coast Bald Eagles In Fall Migration

The bald eagle probably represents the most successful recovery of an endangered species in North America, if not the entire world.

Down to just 417 breeding pairs in the Lower 48 states by 1963 due to the effects of a widely-used pesticide on their ability to reproduce, America’s national bird has now rebounded so throughly that it was removed from the federal list of endangered species in 2007. The U.S. Fish & Wildlife Service reports that there are now 10,000 breeding pairs of bald eagles in the Lower 48.

Further evidence of the eagle’s dramatic recovery was reported recently by researchers at Pennsylvania’s Hawk Mountain Sanctuary, which sits along a well-traveled East Coast flyway for migratory birds, and where a count of eagles and other raptors and migrating birds is conducted every autumn. The researchers announced that they had spotted 407 eagles by the close of the fall count, a number that shattered the previous record of 245 birds set just two years ago.

Although the researchers cautioned that this year’s impressive census may be owed at least partially to favorable weather conditions for migrating birds as well as for the people who count them rather than to a sudden population explosion among eagles, there is little doubt that, year after year, the once-endangered raptors continue to enjoy highly successful breeding seasons.

continued: http://www.allaboutwildlife.com/american-wildlife/bald-eagle-numbers-on-the-rise/5244
 

geek tragedy

(68,868 posts)
33. Bald eagles and ospreys have both rebounded admirably.
Mon Dec 9, 2013, 11:57 AM
Dec 2013

Proof that nature will rally, if we stop choking it.

 

geek tragedy

(68,868 posts)
32. The article is misleading--the deal was that wind farm companies would spend the money
Mon Dec 9, 2013, 11:56 AM
Dec 2013

to make them safer for eagles, and in return the USG would agree not to prosecute/fine them for the ones that did get killed.

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