"How much do we make here?" asked the temp six hours into his shift

[Nikia]

Another production employee told him that as a temp he makes $9/hour. I said that I never took a job without finding out how much it paid ahead of time. The employee, who had recently been hired as a permanent employee with a $1/hour raise, said well sometimes something is better than nothing and how lucky she felt that she was making more than minimum wage. The temp who asked the question nodded.
I then realized that it is a privilege to choose a job, in part, based on what it pays.
I wish that I could have found something to say to make up for my insensitivity, but anything that I could think of didn't seem appropriate and would just make the situation worse.
I feel bad that some people expect no more than minimum wage and that a dollar or two more is a happy surprise.

[Rod Beauvex]

1. Something is better than nothing.

I swear to God I hate that phrase. That kind of thinking is why the country is in the shape it is in.

Asking what a job pays before you take it does not make you insensitive, and don't let anyone shame you into thinking it is.

[Nikia]

2. While asking an employer does not make me insensitive, saying that to the temp

maybe was insensitive. I didn't intend it to be insensitive. I don't know if he is going to stay with our company long or not, but it seemed like good advice to know what you are going to make before you agree to take a job.
When the newly permanent employee made her comment though, I realized that I was speaking from a position of privilege. I do think that it is bad to have the mentality that you aren't worth more than minimum wage, but it is easy for me to say. You see, I'm not a low level production employee. I'm a salaried employee in another department with a degree and several years of experience in my career field.

[Gormy Cuss]

32. Now you know.

You're a good person and won't forget this newly identified privilege.

[closeupready]

3. When I was in the job market, salary was almost always my first question.

Better to find out ASAP rather than waste everyone's time.

If I were looking now, I'm not sure how I would approach that issue, since many agencies don't want to discuss it - they'd rather you take a job they have and they can make a fee, regardless of compensation. And in an economic climate such as we've had over the last 7 years or so, I probably wouldn't feel so assertive, if I were unemployed.

[wickerwoman]

4. I don't think you were responsible

for the awkwardness of the conversation.

It's not your job, as a fellow employee, to be informing temps how much money they are being paid unless they are working for you. Anyway, you don't necessarily know the actual amount.

It's your employers responsibility to tell the temp, or the agency's or the temps responsibility to ask one of those two organisations.

It's just bad manners anyway to discuss how much money you make or to ask other people you work with how much they make. I've worked for companies where it's part of the company policy/contract you sign when you are employed that you don't disclose your salary to other employees. While that's obviously self-serving of the company, it also helps to avoid extremely awkward conversations like this and to spare feelings and reduce resentment and infighting.

[Lordquinton]

16. It's entirely self serving

If employees get to talk about how much they make, they might start to talk about how much they are actually worth and that might lead to unions.

Don't buy into the false politeness, if that's all it were then there wouldn't be corporate rules about it.

And always ask what your compensation is, never agree to work for someone not knowing what you will get in return.

Never sign a contract without reading it.

[jtuck004]

18. This sounds like it was taken directly from the Plantation Owner's Handbook...

It's just bad manners anyway to discuss how much money you make or to ask other people you work with how much they make. I've worked for companies where it's part of the company policy/contract you sign when you are employed that you don't disclose your salary to other employees. While that's obviously self-serving of the company, it also helps to avoid extremely awkward conversations like this and to spare feelings and reduce resentment and infighting.

I still remember overhearing a conversation from many years ago..

"Your job is to pick that cotton, not worry about how much I am making off of you. Boy."

[wickerwoman]

29. Wow.

Even for DU, that's a gobsmackingly ridiculous and insulting lack of perspective.

Thinking it's rude to ask strangers what their salary is makes me a plantation owner? I don't want strangers at work asking me how much I make. It's none of their damn business. And how much they make is none of my business unless they want to tell me.

[Gormy Cuss]

33. You may feel differently if you found that the slacker with the same job title makes more than you.

Closed salaries benefit only management. Salary differences in an open roster environment need to have a valid basis such as job performance or experience. In a closed environment, Person A may make more than Person B solely because Person A is more aggressive at asking for compensation.

I've worked as a professional in both open and closed payroll companies and I'd take the former any day.

[Orrex]

36. Now that you mention it...

I don't believe that I've ever worked for an open payroll company, and in fact they had explicit and sacrosanct polices that thou shalt not discuss salary. I know of quite a few coworkers who were disciplined for revealing their pay.

I agree with your assessment entirely: it's a scheme to benefit management and to increase the company's leverage.

[jtuck004]

35. And plays into the hands of the plantation owner as if it were gift-wrapped. Americans are taught

this, just like racism and hatred, and it is used against them all the time.

I didn't say you were a plantation owner, though you may be. I said it is the language of the plantation owner. But nice dodge.

How much the owner is making by exploiting you and everyone else is very much your damn business, btw.

[KG]

5. the great american economy in the 21th century - 'something is better than nothing'

expect no help from the dems on this issue.

[Blus4u]

12. Check List...

Check List for the great American economy in the 21st century

No benefits - check
No security - check
No working wage - check
No self esteem - check

"Please be honest on our annual employee satisfaction survey because we really want to improve things for our employees.
They are our most valuable assets."

Peace

[Half-Century Man]

6. Do not confuse

Biting the hand that feeds with biting the hand that holds you by the neck.
BON APPETIT

[Brigid]

11. And we have our thread winner.

[dmr]

7. Something is better than nothing is belittling to any employee,

whether they realize it or not.

It shouldn't be this way. It's shameful.


Edit to correct my title

[Doctor_J]

8. Wait! yesterday we heard that the job market is completely healed, owing

entirely to the president! How can this be?

[Ace Acme]

9. It's healed if you're an employer. Or a prison guard. nt

[blur256]

10. I have a master's degree

And I am currently working two jobs. One pays $12 an hour, and the other pays $9 an hour. I too was at one point concerned about how much a job paid, until I couldn't find a decent job anymore. I don't have a single day off in the week, but I am thankful that I am only paying my rent a few days late this month instead of not at all. If you have been in a great job, but lose it, you too would be thankful for making $9 an hour just so you can live. Thankfully for Thanksgiving this year, my mom bought us a dinner because we would not have had anything. My partner and I are not buying gifts for each other this year because we are behind on pretty much every bill we have. In my opinion, this is what America is turning into. There are definitely plenty of jobs out there, but a lot of them anymore pay horrible wages. If you have a good job, be thankful and hope that you do not lose it. Because it's hard to get back into a good one after. It can happen to anyone.

[Nikia]

21. Would you have agreed to work at your jobs if you had no idea if it paid $12/hour or minimum?

This was the situation of the temp. You may be willing to accept $9/hour or $12/hour for a job. If you have no idea and accept it, you are accepting that you are worth no more than minimum wage for whatever work they give you.

[blur256]

23. Honestly,

I was so desperate for a job, I would have accepted minimum wage. In fact, I took the $9 an hour job without knowing how much it paid because it was a job offer. Luckily for me, it was above minimum wage. Really, that's how bad off financially I was. I just really needed to be doing something at that point because I thought I might be evicted.

[hfojvt]

24. as a temp though

the agency just tells you "go work for Factory X" or "we will place you in Office Y". I would always ask some basic questions, like What do they do there? and How much do I make? but to some degree they are not relevant since I am going to take the job no matter how much they pay. But I still would want to know that going in.

Still, I can see how it sorta doesn't matter.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

42. And you can be sure that the employer pays a lot more to the agency than you get

Back in the 1980s, I usually got $5 an hour for clerical work.

Then one of the office managers let it slip that the temp agency charged them $9 an hour for each temp.

[mstinamotorcity2]

27. Welcome to the

party
this is what we are supposed to be about. Economic fairness. There are so many reasons you must work like a dog for median wages. Just about everyone here could provide you with a link and you would be up reading for about two years. So I am going to try and give it to you very simply. The 1% want to stay the 1%. They will Lie, Cheat, Steal, Buy, Lobby, Divide, and target anyone or any thing that gets in their way. They use Radio, Television, Supreme Court justices, Senators, and Congressmen to get their way. The Center for tax policy says that if minimum wage was 12.25 per hour it would lift one third of the country out of dire poverty. So making a couple dollars over that means you just poor. They don't want union because it mean employee fainess and things like profit sharing. How dare a mere worker think they are entitled to any money they help make besides their wages. That is why your jobs were out sourced to China. Forced Labor camps work 12 to sixteen hour days at sixty nine cents to ninety-nine cents per hour. And Shit Romney of Bain Capital was the man who exemplified this process. And when its all over and you think okay I will die and then I will be at peace. There's that little mater of The Dead Peasant policy that most companies have on their employees. more on those they see as liabilities. Sometimes its millions and your family may or may not get anything.

[blur256]

34. So sad

but so true. I think you summed it up very nicely. Hello serfdom!

[mstinamotorcity2]

38. Yes us Serfs and Waifs must

stick together. Know I am feeling just like a frigging serf under Emergency Financial Management. Watching this bullshit now on local show Flashpoint. I feel sorry for American cities in Repug states. You are next. The Repugs have attorneys waiting and watching. They are going to model this plan around the Country. They are going to use us as the test city and work out the kinks. You can thank the 1%.

[oberliner]

37. What is your degree in?

Just curious.

[blur256]

39. My undergrad

is in advertising and public relations. My master's is in management. My biggest problem is that I worked in higher education for the first ten years of my career, and now the market is just dried up at the moment (schools do great when the economy is failing, and start doing worse as things pick up). But I did have an interview the other day for an entry level marketing position. If I get it, I would get paid less than my first "real" job, but at this point I would take it. It has fully paid benefits!

[oberliner]

40. Very interesting

Best of luck to you!

[blur256]

41. Thank you so much!

[Brigid]

13. We 99-percenters . . .

Are living with severely diminished expectations nowadays. And that is exactly how the 1% likes it.

[Spitfire of ATJ]

15. Ever notice Republican NEVER claim the rich are doing well?

They always claim the rich are overburdened by taxes and regulations and that's why they can't afford to give the workers a raise.

Then they claim the government takes all of that money they take from the rich and fritter it away on nonsense like turtle crossings.

[Brigid]

17. You got that right.

They claim federal tax money is frittered away. They're right -- but not in the way they think. The money is not used for anything useful, like education or infrastructure or health care. It's frittered away on useless wars, bank bailouts, and NSA snooping.

[Spitfire of ATJ]

14. There are a LOT of workers making $12 an hour that feel like they're doing great.

[Demo_Chris]

19. I have been told that it is a bad idea in an interview to even ASK what a job pays...

Apparently this question might lead some hiring managers to question a candidate's motivation. If you aren't willing to put the company first then they don't want you.

[Nikia]

20. But it should be your question before you agree to take the job

Once they offer it to you, not go to the job and wonder whether it pays minimum wage, a couple of dollars an hour more, or a lot more.

[Skittles]

22. Nikia, apologize to that gal

just tell her you're sorry and you learned a lesson - everyone makes mistakes

[Laelth]

26. k&r for the truth, however depressing it may be. n/t

-Laelth

[unblock]

28. don't feel bad. they should have asked the employer, period.

perhaps it wouldn't have entered into the decision regarding taking the job, if they would have been content with minimum wage, fine.

but they still asked, so they were clearly curious for an answer and weren't certain that they were getting only minimum wage.

and of course, the best source for the answer is the employer. what if they're making a different amount than other workers for some reason (fair or otherwise)?

[Zo Zig]

30. Why ask the question?

So Mr. Employer how much will I be paid?
That depends on how badly you need or want this position, so you get whatever we are paying.
That how it works, don't like it you can go elsewhere.
Ok, I really need the job.

[DesertFlower]

31. i worked as a temp from '79 to '88 at NY Telephone.

i started at $6.00 an hour -- within a few months i was up to $9.00 an hour. when i left i was making $18 an hour. the agency made $4.00 an hour for every hour i worked. i worked all the overtime i could get and made between $45 and $55,000 a year. i didn't need benefits -- had my husband's. the temp agency also gave 1 week vacation pay for every 1,000 hours worked.

WTF happened since then? my friend in NYC said you're lucky to get $25 an hour as a legal secretary, but most times they try to get away with $20-22 an hour. he has a steady job now as a legal secretary/paralegal and makes $63,000 a year with benefits. he works his ass off.