Four toll lanes down the middle of a free-to-drive interstate highway ? wtf is this....

[steve2470]

Later this year, or possibly early 2015, a massive $2 billion overhaul of Interstate 4 through downtown Orlando is set to start. It will add four toll lanes down the middle of the region's most heavily traveled highway, with the likely construction-caused delays expected to send frustrated motorists scurrying to SunRail.

Both developments are unprecedented in the region, though tolls long have played a role because motorists have to pay to ride Florida's Turnpike and the 109-mile road network operated by the Orlando Orange County Expressway Authority.

What's different this time is placing tolls lanes on a so-called free road such as I-4. That's never been done before in Central Florida and, in fact, was prohibited by federal law for years. The prohibition was dropped in 2012, allowing the state Department of Transportation to move ahead with a pay-to-drive plan.

State officials are counting on a private company – four are in the running – to cover nearly half the cost of the project, with tolls being used to repay the investment over 30 or more years. The state is willing to put up close to $1 billion as its contribution.

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/business/os-cfb-transportation-tolls-trains-20140119,0,957947.story

I'm just speechless. Watch out fellow DU'ers, coming soon to a taxpayer-funded interstate highway near you.

[giftedgirl77]

1. Wow, this is some bullshit. The main artery through

the middle of Florida. Speechless is right...

[yeoman6987]

35. Florida

I love Florida and own a home in Florida but spend most times in Maryland in a home in Annapolis. Well I had to get a sun pass as my EZ Pass does not work in Florida. I never could understand why they have to have their own pass but I went and bought one because stopping for every toll was getting ridiculous. It is much easier to have a pass going through these roads. I guess Route 4 will just take more money. The state is great but makes things difficult sometimes. No state tax though which is nice.

[giftedgirl77]

41. I was raised there in South Florida & there is no place

else like it. If it wasn't for the heat & the ridiculous cost of living I would live there in a heartbeat. My kids are on me constantly to move back which is funny since they haven't lived there since they were little.

Everything is turning into a pay to play, it sucks.

[yeoman6987]

43. Cost of Living

I am not sure where you live now, but after Maryland, Florida is like practically free to live. Maryland is ridiculous state to live in. My property taxes here are 7,500 and in Florida they are 2,300. I have both places still but will sell Maryland house in a few years. Florida is much cheaper. I personally hope you give Florida a second chance…we NEED people like you down here!!!!!

[giftedgirl77]

47. Ha ha, my dad keeps trying to convince me to move back

as well. My mom is always telling me about the houses for sale in her neighborhood, but we bought a house in SC last year (was dual military, I'm fully disabled now). We have close to 3000 sq ft on .5 acre & my property taxes were less than $1200 a yr. My in laws live in NJ, their property taxes are insane as well, I am not thrilled with the people that live around me but I love my house & little zoo.

[El_Johns]

2. KR. We paid for the highways when they were built, we paid for maintenance, & now we will pay

to drive on them, plus the rest.

[bluestate10]

5. Welcome to the republican vision for America. nt

[elleng]

3. We pay tolls on portions of I-95.

[steve2470]

4. but on those portions, isn't everyone forced to pay tolls ? nt

[elleng]

6. Yes.

[steve2470]

7. If everyone is forced to pay tolls, I can live with that

The way this is set up is a slap in the face to lower income drivers. Yes, one can argue that toll roads are also a slap in the face, but this is really blatant. At least toll roads are out of sight once you pass that exit or area. Some roads need to stay completely taxpayer funded/non-toll roads.

[woo me with science]

16. No, roads should be tax funded.

Toll roads are a way for greedy corporations to keep extracting payment long after roads are paid for.

[steve2470]

17. I'm assuming the tolls elleng refers to go to the state and/or federal governments ?

If not, my mistake. Yes, I agree with your point that privately-funded toll roads should not be allowed on public routes.

[elleng]

18. Correct, steve, I-95 tolls go to states and feds

for maintenance etc.

[yeoman6987]

36. What are you talking about?

Everyone pays on toll roads period. They do not discriminate at all. Everyone going to Disney will pay for those tolls.

[DirkGently]

46. No. Toll lanes in the middle. Free on the edges.

It will add four toll lanes down the middle of the region's most heavily traveled highway, with the likely construction-caused delays expected to send frustrated motorists scurrying to SunRail.

It's the Big New Thing. People who can pay get to ride in the fancy lane.

This is insane. Orlando / Orange County also has the Expressway Authority, which was supposed to build one "East-West" expressway back in the 1970s. The $0.15 toll was supposed to go away in a few years once the road was paid for.

Instead, the Expressway Authority, a corrupt organization which is a daily subject of reports as to how its latest expansions are tailored to favor insider land developers, and which most recently hired an utterly unqualified Republican state legislator to run things, is the most expensive toll system in the country.

[DirkGently]

48. The Expresway / Greenway is the most expensive

toll system in the country, or so I've read. And it's run by the Expressway Authority, whose work you're probably familiar with?

State Attorney Jeff Ashton asked Orlando's expressway board Friday to hold off hiring former state Rep. Steve Precourt as its next director because of an investigation his office is conducting of the toll-road agency.

...

Precourt, R-Orlando, has spent the past several days at the authority, meeting staff and acting as the de-facto director. He was not paid but expected his $185,000 a year salary to kick in after the five-member board approved his contract Wednesday.

http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/2014-01-17/news/os-state-attorney-precourt-20140117_1_state-attorney-jeff-ashton-precourt-board-chairman-walter-ketcham

Our family probably spends $2,000 / year traveling the Expressway / Greenway. May as well have an income tax.

[elfin]

8. No tolls in Wisconsin for the FREEways, BUT

Weasel walker is floating the trial balloon.

[yeoman6987]

37. The worst

The worst is Chicago! Chicago!!!!

[ProdigalJunkMail]

9. just look at the fucked up shit that happened on I-85

in northeast ATL... now the HOT lane runs close to $8 for 16 miles in the mornings... and that lane when it was added was paid for by taxpayer dollars.

sP

[elehhhhna]

10. we have this going on all around Houston

[ccinamon]

11. It's a Republican governor thing....

DFW metro area has one section finished, but not yet open @ 114 thru Grapevine, with a big section of 121/183 thru the mid-cities area to be finished in 2015.

To use the new toll roads the price will be variable depending on time of day and amount of traffic... estimates run as high as $12/mile during rush hour....so the rumor goes. And since this was done by pRick Perry and his gang, I believe it.

[yeoman6987]

38. Maryland

You should see how much it costs going from Maryland to New York….between gas and tolls about 100 dollars and they are Democratic States. I think all states are horrible with regards to tolls.

[distantearlywarning]

12. I live in Orlando

Just moved here a few months ago.

All the major highways seem to be tolled here. It's impossible to go anywhere on a highway without paying tolls. It does suck, but on the other hand, I have to say that the freeways here seem to be in much better shape and less congested than those where I moved from (PA; not a city where the major freeways were toll roads).

Edited to say: On the other hand, Florida has no state income tax. At our current income level, this is a *substantial* income boost for us compared to PA. My guess is that the money has to come from somewhere. If citizens aren't taxed at the state level, then they are tolled when they drive on highways (and from other things too, I imagine, that I don't know about yet). Of the two, I actually prefer the tolls. They cost me a LOT less than the income tax would, and I can avoid them if I want to by taking other routes.

[TheBlackAdder]

29. Less movement also means a more stagnated populous and economy. nt

[groundloop]

34. You're paying much more for a lot of things, all in the name of no income tax

You may think it's cool not having to pay state income tax, but you're being 'nickel and dimed' for EVERYTHING. The top 1% are benefiting far more than you from not having to pay income tax. (I used to live in Florida).

[DefenseLawyer]

13. At least they didn't sell the road

That's what Mitch Daniels did in indiana.

[B Calm]

39. No kidding and to a foreign business to boot. Privatization republicans love!

[Ikonoklast]

49. And that money is now all gone.

The consortium that leased the toll road is bankrupt, some of the debt the consortium used to finance the original deal is due in 2015, with a pretty dim prospect of being re-financed at a respectable rate as the debt is now junk.

[solarhydrocan]

14. Perhaps China will be granted the contract

State officials are counting on a private company – four are in the running – to cover nearly half the cost of the project, with tolls being used to repay the investment over 30 or more years. The state is willing to put up close to $1 billion as its contribution.

They now build our bridges, subways, schools and shoes.

New San Francisco bridge built in China to be shipped to US-- 28 Jun 2011



Next month, four enormous steel skeletons, the last of the 12 segments of the bridge, will be shipped 6,500 miles from Shanghai to San Francisco before being assembled on site....with likes of China State Construction Engineering Group (CSCEC) overtaking established American giants like Bechtel.

CSCEC has already built seven schools in the US, apartment blocks in Washington DC and New York and is in the middle of building a 4,000-room casino in Atlantic City. In New York, it has won contracts to renovate the subway system, build a new metro platform near Yankee stadium, and refurbish the Alexander Hamilton Bridge over the Harlem river. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/china/8602786/New-San-Francisco-bridge-built-in-China-to-be-shipped-to-US.html

Thanks to the current crop of wall street suckups the US cannot build its own bridges, schools or even shoes.

Hopefully one day the average citizen will wake up and realize the depth of the sellout. Then they can beg for more rations.

[WinkyDink]

23. I MIGHT want to cross a China-built bridge---NOT!

[TransitJohn]

15. They're going to do it here in Colorado on I-25

from Longmont up to Fort Collins. It needs done, badly (the widening, not so much the privatization). There's a hold up with the plan, though. Taxpayers paid for a third lane from Denver up to Longmont a few years ago, and the corporate sponsor won't do this deal without that part of it, too. So now they're trying to figure out the constitutional legalities of taking already paid-for public roads and privatizing them. Fuck this corporate shit.

[rhett o rick]

19. So when the poor peoples lanes are jammed with traffic, you will be able to watch the rich

speed by in their limos.

[ProdigalJunkMail]

20. that's pretty much exactly what happens here in ATL on I-85

up to $8 one way (for only 16 miles) so all us peons can watch the people that can afford an extra $300+ per month jet off to work while our commute just got that much longer with the loss of that tax-payer funded lane...

sP

[Ed Suspicious]

28. It's much like the Verizon model against net neutrality. If you aren't prepared to pay to play you

can't even get in the game.

[fizzgig]

45. i saw something about that not long ago

25 needs widening something awful but not like that

[hobbit709]

21. They want to do that here too.

[workinclasszero]

22. No more socialist roads people

Its gonna be pay to play in everything everywhere in this godforsaken third world hellhole called the USA!

The corps now own the internet where they will nickle and dime you to death, freeways(LOLfree) are next on the teabag agenda!

[WinkyDink]

24. Pay to enter banks, stores, malls, etc.

[CrispyQ]

25. I have my mother's ration booklets from WWII.

She was just a little girl, so my grandmother had to sign for them, but everyone got ration stamps. Twenty first century rationing will not be like that. Instead, rationing will be done by who can afford it. That's what this reminds me of. If you are well off, you can pay to drive in the less congested lanes, if not, too bad for you sucker.


America is a mean place.

[liberal N proud]

26. I 4 serves as the only route through Orlando

Nothing to go around the damn place.

Screw the public.

And I see they expect it to be run by a private company? hmm?

[L0oniX]

33. Disney?

[mn9driver]

27. In Minneapolis you can drive in the HOV lane alone

...if you're willing to pay. On a public road this seems like a reasonable option: carpool, or pay $ to drive solo in the less congested lanes.

[TheBlackAdder]

30. I used to spend $7K a year vacationing in FL. Not anymore. It's going to safe states.

I don't need to take my family to states where you can get blasted just for looking at a person the wrong way.


I'll mention the time I got a rental Cadillac SRX and was flipped off by locals, time and again.

The car had Georgia tags on it. The other times, with other standard rentals, or the family minivan, no flip offs at all.


===


There is an intense hostility in that state that isn't felt in others, especially ones above the Mason-Dixon line.

[B Calm]

44. Hell if it's going to cost me just to drive down the hwy, I think we'll go to

Minnesota for our fishing trips!

[seveneyes]

31. prohibition was dropped in 2012, allowing a pay-to-drive plan

Who approved this POS idea? It sounds like a federal screw up. WTF were they thinking, other than screwing the taxpayers?

[L0oniX]

32. Toll booths owned by Disney?

[Liberal In Texas]

40. Kansas Turnpike

Interstate Highways, and pay to drive.
And always has been.

I really think any highway with an Interstate designation should not have tolls.

[cthulu2016]

42. Same with the capital beltway (DC)