General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsSmoking is a terrible addiction.
I never let anyone smoke around me, or my kids.
Nobody in my family smokes.
My kids are adults now and they don't tolerate smoking either.
I think all tobacco advertising, including branding, ought to be banned. All types of tobacco would, in effect, become generic. Maybe even outlaw cigars and cigarettes. Roll your own, or put it in your pipe and smoke it.
Non-biodegradable cigarette butts are gross.
I'll add a Blazing Saddles clip here just to keep this discussion friendly...
(Notice the cigarette machine at 0:48. Those are long gone from California.)
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rug
(82,333 posts)Logical
(22,457 posts)quinnox
(20,600 posts)I immediately think they must not be the brightest bulb around. Yep, its probably wrong to look down on them, but I honestly feel this when I see someone who is young that is smoking these days. I think, "How could they be that stupid, to take up smoking in this day and age when everyone knows its really bad for your health?"
Logical
(22,457 posts)Lost_Count
(555 posts)It's because people like you are still out there.
Logical
(22,457 posts)Someone cracked a psychology 101 book.
Subtle but important difference...
Logical
(22,457 posts)functioning_cog
(294 posts)than use their brains and realize society looks down on smoking for a very good reason? The person judging them as "not a very bright bulb" may be correct.
Lost_Count
(555 posts)This just in...
A young person made a decision that will probably result in negative long term consequences! Unnamed sources in the administration have labelled them as "not the brightest bulb."
For more on this ground breaking story we now go to a woman in her 40s...
"I jut don't see why they have to rebel. Don't they know how bad it is for them? Don't they realize there is a reason society looks down on it nowadays?!"
Hard hitting stuff... We'll bring you more on this once in a lifetime story after the break!
LadyHawkAZ
(6,199 posts)Depression is associated with an increased frequency of smoking. Addicted smokers are characterized by preoccupation with smoking, abnormal attachment to cigarettes and anticipation of brain reward from the drugs in cigarette smoke. Attempts to quit smoking often lead to a decreased level of pleasure and undesirable mood swings. Thus, once the brain has adapted to the daily dose of the drug, it seems abnormal to the brain if the user attempts to abstain.
Individuals with underlying or current depressive symptoms are more likely to experience mood disturbances when they attempt to quit. Furthermore, it appears that smoking may mask an underlying depression in some smokers.
New research has suggested that there may be something in cigarette smoke that has antidepressant properties, which explains why cigarette smoking is much more common among depressed patients. A survey of 3,000 individuals in the St. Louis area confirmed that lifetime frequency of major depression was more common among smokers than nonsmokers (6.6 vs. 2.9 percent) This study also demonstrated that smokers who reported at least one episode of major depression were less likely to succeed in smoking cessation programs than smokers without depression (14 vs. 28 percent). These findings have been confirmed many times over.
There are thousands of chemicals other than nicotine constituents in cigarette smoke, of which one, or several, may affect mood in much the same way as a group of antidepressant medications called monoamine oxidase inhibitors or (MAOIs). These MAOIs effectively increase levels of specific neurotransmitters involved in the regulation of mood. Smoking, therefore, may be a way for depressed individuals to self-medicate depressive symptoms. Consequently, healthcare professionals who offer smoking cessation programs should offer depression screening and be prepared to address underlying mood disorders as part of a comprehensive smoking cessation program.
It's not really about the cool.
Midwestern Democrat
(806 posts)cigarettes a day and rationalizes that that's probably not that harmful - unfortunately, the usage doesn't stay at 2 or 3 a day for very long.
mike_c
(36,281 posts)My partner smokes. She wants to quit, but cites the "benefits" she receives from smoking, primarily stress relief, less weight gain, etc. But from a medical perspective, the only benefit of nicotine use is cessation of nicotine craving itself. The perceived stress relief is relief from the stress of nicotine withdrawal, which begins again as soon as each butt is extinguished. The perceived weight stability is because smokers in nicotine withdrawal seek other pleasurable stimuli, and hunger cessation is a biggie, even when we're not really hungry. All of the perceived benefits are simply projections of the nicotine addiction itself. It's one of the purest addictions, in the sense that there are no benefits of using other than cessation of withdrawal symptoms. All of the perceived benefits can be had simply by stopping nicotine use.
unblock
(52,247 posts)i'm pretty sure nicotine has stimulation and/or relaxation effects even on first-time users.
but the neurotransmitters involved very quickly become desensitized and the cessation of withdrawal effects certainly plays a big role in the cycle. the benefit of "stress relief" is needed because withdrawal is stressful....
mike_c
(36,281 posts)It is a stimulant, but not in the sense that most people think of stimulants, e.g. caffeine or methamphetamine. Nicotine binds to nicotinic cholinergic receptors on neuron membrane surfaces so it "stimulates" nerve activity by blocking cholinesterase activity, which results in a build up of the neurotransmitter acetylcholine in the central nervous system and peripheral nerves. This is similar to the mode of action of nerve gasses and many pesticides, like DDT. In the latter case the stimulation is severe and leads to paralysis, for nicotine users the stimulation is minor and the nervous system adjusts by adapting the synaptic environment to anticipate the presence of nicotine-- which then causes constant withdrawal symptoms whose severity begins ramping up as soon as nicotine levels in the blood decline, i.e. as soon as one puts out the last butt. Nicotine extract from tobacco makes a decent insecticide because of its effects on acetylcholine metabolism in the central nervous system and its inhibitory effects on motor nerves (causing paralysis).
Nicotine is also biphasic, so it starts out as a nervous system stimulant but then becomes a depressant. It's the latter effect that usually causes death by nicotine poisoning in humans.
It is SO addictive that users very quickly adapt to it, and begin withdrawal cravings that then define every aspect of their experience with nicotine.
CTyankee
(63,912 posts)I didn't want to be a smoker any more. I hated the smell of cigarette smoke in all my clothes, even my panti-hose and in my hair! I had no withdrawal symtoms at all...no cold sweats or shakes or anything...I just quit
because I had a stronger desire to be a NON SMOKER. At the time Ralph Nader was still a liberal icon and he had said he wouldn't hire a nonsmoker. That made a big impression on me...
RebelOne
(30,947 posts)I did cocaine for about a year. In the late '70s and early '80s, I worked for a magazine in Miami and had to do some all nighters once a month for deadlines, and the coke kept me going. I kicked that habit, but I could not kick the nicotine habit. I am 75 and have been smoking since I was 16. I had a pre-op X-ray last month, and believe it or not, my lungs are clean.
Throd
(7,208 posts)I don't use tobacco in any form.
hunter
(38,317 posts)But making smoking highly commercial and convenient only increases the problem.
Throd
(7,208 posts)Smoking rates will continue to diminish. There will always be a few who choose to do so. I'm fine with that provided I don't have to pay for the consequences of their addiction.
Journeyman
(15,036 posts)I struggle at times, especially when I walk into range of people smoking. The smell can either repulse me or entice. It's never neutral.
Arugula Latte
(50,566 posts)but what I don't get are these young hipster dumbasses who I see puffing away. Seriously, how willfully stupid do you have to be to voluntarily take on a habit that is expensive and disgusting and harmful & offensive to others and will probably eventually cost you your health, if not your life? It's not like these kids haven't grown up hearing about the dangers of smoking.
Stupid stupid stupid
mokawanis
(4,441 posts)a great many people advocate that the addict get help and treatment, unless the addiction is to tobacco. If the addiction is tobacco people heap scorn upon the addict.
Why is that?
hunter
(38,317 posts)I don't like second-hand smoke. It's gross.
Discarded cigarette butts on the sidewalk are gross too.
When I was a kid people smoked in the supermarkets and smashed the butts out on the floor. In nicer markets they employed a kid to continuously sweep the floors. In markets that were not-so-nice the floors were littered with cigarette butts by the end of the day.
mokawanis
(4,441 posts)and a lot of people do fling the butts anywhere and everywhere with disregard for what others think, and they have the same attitude about exposing people to second-hand smoke. It's legitimate to criticize people for these things.
There are also smokers who are considerate of others. They make an effort to avoid exposing others to their second-hand smoke, and they pocket the butts.
But my question remains. Why do people advocate for treatment for addicts, unless the addiction is tobacco? Addicted to coke, or oxycontin, or alcohol? You need help! Addicted to tobacco? Fuck you!
Personally I think publicly funded health clinics that either help people quit their addiction, or provide safer alternative drugs in a safe environment (for the tougher cases) ought to be easily accessible for anyone. Nicotine, alcohol, opiates, whatever. These clinics would compete directly with the drug pushers (legal or illegal) collapsing their markets.
Yes, I am a little hostile about smoking. I have severe asthma and cigarette smoke is one of the things that can set it off. I have to take meds every day or I end up in the E.R..
Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)In this month's discover, i believe, that says nicotine holds promise for helping people with certain degenerative neurological syndromes, like Parkinson's. Surprising, to say the least.
It also states that apparently lab animals almost never get addicted to nicotine alone- speculating being that it is the particular chemical cocktail in cigarette smoke- acetylaldehyde, etc. which act in conjunction with the nicotine to be so addictive.
http://discovermagazine.com/2014/march/13-nicotine-fix
Edim
(300 posts)
Zorra
(27,670 posts)There's nothing that is good about them whatsoever. Nothing. Nada.
Sarah Ibarruri
(21,043 posts)Jenoch
(7,720 posts)whose members are people who represent a political party that embraces tolerance have a number of people posting on this thread who are showing incredible intolerance.
Both of my parents were smokers. They grew up during The Depression when cigarettes were cheap and not socially unacceptable.
My mother never smoked more than 10 a day. My father burned up three packs a day. He ran his own business and seemed to have several cigarettes going simultaneously in ashtrays all over the building. When my dad was 42 he had some chest pain. He did the usual tests, including lung tests. The nurse, who was a family friend, told him he couldn't blow out an effin' birthday candle. My dad quit smoking cold turkey while my mother continued to smoke for about 16 more years. She quit smoking at age 60 the day her favorite cousin was diagnosed with lung cancer.
My mother died at 78 but it had nothing to do with smoking.
My father is 82 and for years he said he would start smoking again at 80. We talked him out of it when he was 74. Now my dad says he will lice to be 96. He will then be shot by the irate husband of a 38 year old woman as he is climbing out of her bedroom window.
Bonobo
(29,257 posts)I don't think it is about smoking alone anymore. For some? Maybe. But for many it is a proxy war, a fundamentalist position that they can take while maintaining their self-conviction that they are doing it for good reasons.
People like to judge and condemn so they feel better about themselves. Smoking allows some to do that now.
This is particularly apparent when one looks at some people's responses on the e-cig issue.
Jenoch
(7,720 posts)While I am not a fan of cigarette smoking, I am also not a fan.
Throd
(7,208 posts)And the alliances shift contingent upon the issue. But the schtank of judgement and authoritarianism is always a constant component.
Especially when you think about the fact that there are so many pollutants in our environment that we can't control. If perhaps tobacco was THE only pollutant that was killing off millions of people, then I believe this kind of rhetoric and vitriol would be necessary. But we are experiencing larger storms than ever, polar vortexes and unbelievable drought in other areas. It has become plain and simple that global warming/global environmental destruction is almost a given and cigarettes are the one thing that people have control over in their immediate area.
They have no control over the amount of toxins released from the use of coal, petroleum products and nuclear energy. Necessities to survival, but people feel powerless over being able change it. Tobacco is really the only thing people can literally say, "Can you get that toxin away from me?" They can't do the same with the others. The Inuits are some of the most polluted people on Earth and they live very far from the sources of the pollutants found in their bodies. Pollutants other than tobacco are so much more pervasive and travel much farther distances than tobacco smoke ever could.
They are saying now that tobacco smoke is so dangerous that even "3rd hand" smoke is dangerous. Perhaps, but tobacco doesn't poison the next 500 or so generations like nuclear waste does. Priorities people...
nadinbrzezinski
(154,021 posts)I almost went to the hospital with a severe asthma attack at the Doctors office from the smoking.
I am not tolerant of things that could kill me.
I love living a tad too much.
To each it's own.
And if you want to smoke, by all means. Just not in my house (see that asthma attack) or an enclosed building.
kwassa
(23,340 posts)My grandfather died at 74 after spending 15 years in bed with emphysema. It was 15 years of misery. All from smoking.
You will find, if you look at the actual statistics, not just the anecdote of your family, which, with all due respect, is not largely significant, that smoking is murderous.
To believe otherwise is to deny science and medicine. This is not about tolerance. It is about an addictive drug that kills
Approximately 443,000 people die prematurely from smoking or exposure to secondhand smoke each year
http://www.lung.org/associations/states/colorado/tobacco/
Bonobo
(29,257 posts)kwassa
(23,340 posts)If they want to smoke outdoors someplace, where no one else has to smell it, I don't really have much problem with that.
Jenoch
(7,720 posts)cigarette smoking.
I have zero idea how it is that you arrived at that conclusion.
My brother today underwent successesful surgery today to remove a malignant tumour from his kidney. Does that make me a fan of cancer?
kwassa
(23,340 posts)Just to make it crystal clear, as I said above, your family is lucky in someway to be resistant to lung cancer or other smoking- related diseases. Most will not be so lucky. Many die from it.
Jenoch
(7,720 posts)about my family's experience with cigarettes indicated that I did not believe that smoking is bad for the smikers health. Of course that was not my intention. Three out of my four grandparents died from cancer.
kwassa
(23,340 posts)I also grew up in a family where my parents smoked when I was very young. My dad quit after the surgeon general's report in the '60s. My mom continued in a low-grade smoking habit for another 20 year or so. She is still alive at 87.
I became a heavy smoker when I went to college, and smoked for 14 years before finally quitting. That was 30 years ago.
Jenoch
(7,720 posts)I remember both of my parents smoking in the car with three boys (me, two brothers) in the backseat. This was post 1964 but nobody had heard of second hand smoke.
I was a 'closet' smoker in my college years and for a few years after that. I don't really have a yearning for a cigarette anymore, especially since they cost $7 or $8 per pack in Minnesota. I quit at around $2 a pack.
Interestingly, one of my mother's best friends still smokes, some kind of ultra-lites, at age 76. She must have good genes as well. She is so skinny, I actually worry about her.
Cha
(297,284 posts)from me.
nadinbrzezinski
(154,021 posts)stop making crack tobacco, people will have an easier time quitting
Earth_First
(14,910 posts)I recently fell off the wagon six months ago.
It *is* an addiction.
I successfully quit for two years, and just as an alcoholic would say "just one won't hurt me..." it was over.
I contacted my primary today. I'm going back in for a ceccasion program next week.
I'm over it.
It's just extremely difficult.
JoeyT
(6,785 posts)Grow my own tobacco, too.
I never smoke around non-smokers, but sometimes when I go out in the yard to smoke (Which I do at my own house) one will come outside to talk to me and ask me what I'm smoking. When I respond with something along the lines of "Cigarette. Why?" the response is always that it doesn't stink.
Since I started growing/curing/rolling my own, I cannot smoke store-bought cigarettes, and they stink as much to me as they do a non-smoker. I dunno if they're any healthier. They're certainly not healthy. They just don't taste like a paper mill fire.
And yeah, it's an addiction. For most of us it's a ridiculously hard one to shake.
In_The_Wind
(72,300 posts)
Tsiyu
(18,186 posts)Personally, I am appalled at obesity rates in this country.
When I see parents hand their kids more chicken nuggets and HFCS-loaded drinks, I cringe.
Obesity will soon surpass - if it hasn't already - smoking as a leading cause of death.
http://www.usnews.com/news/articles/2013/08/15/obesity-causes-more-deaths-than-previously-thought
http://www.americashealthrankings.org/all/obesity
Obesity is one of the greatest health threats currently facing the United States. It contributes significantly to a variety of serious diseases including heart disease, diabetes, stroke, certain cancers, as well as poor general health Obesity is a leading cause of preventable death in the United States, causing an estimated 200,000 deaths per year. The direct medical costs for treating obesity and obesity-related health problems are overwhelming. In 2008 it was estimated that $147 billion was spent on obesity or obesity-related health issues. Compared to smoking, obesity is more prevalent; similar to smoking and excessive alcohol consumption, obesity is highly associated with chronic conditions and overall poor physical health. http://www.americashealthrankings.org/all/obesity#sthash.FixYrcrD.dpuf
emphasis mine
Still, I don't want to outlaw McDonalds or crap food. You want to shove that stuff into your pie-hole, go for it. But be aware, you cost everyone in society when you overeat to the point of obesity, both in health related expenditures and by the fact that you are more likely to stroke out or have a heart attack while driving or operating heavy machinery, putting other drivers at risk. Many on disability are on public assistance due to their obesity - a choice to eat oneself sick.
I could say I am SOOOOOO much better, smarter, cooler than they are because I eat healthy and almost NEVER touch any kind of fast food. But I don't think I'm smarter or better or cooler. I make better choices here, poorer choices there. It's my feckin' body.
There are all sorts of bad addictions. We can run around judging one another all day long for one thing or another. I prefer to live and let live.
Others want to ride their tall Horses of Anti-Smoking Self-Righteousness while they cram another BigMacDaddyFatBurger into their cake holes.
Whatevs.....
lonestarnot
(77,097 posts)worse to kick. Not an excuse, just a more than likely fact. And so far DU has not banned smoking. 
So in here you will find smoke filled rooms. 
:cough:
Populist_Prole
(5,364 posts)The heavy smokers anyway. No no, I don't mean the second hand smoke or the burnt-toast reekage, I mean their addiction to nicotine.
There are a few that while I rate them high personally and professionally, can become an infernal pains in the ass:
- Constant stepping outside or interrupting work just to "go burn one" at disruptive times
- Crankiness/moodiness, sometimes downright irrationality that rivals a nap-starved 2 year old if they have to go more than 10 minutes, hell, make it 7 or 8 minutes without a cigarette
- Being unintentional slackers avoiding some tasks that would put them in a position where they can't smoke for hours on end; the rest of us have to pick up the slack
I'm sick and tired of it.
Prophet 451
(9,796 posts)If you don't want people to smoke around you, that's fine. But I smoke and enjoy smoking and I'd rather you not take away my right to do so.
Heidi
(58,237 posts)