ACA: I have little patience for idiots.

[Atman]

I have spent the better part of my day "talking" to old friends on Facebook who are convinced they're DOOMED because of the ACA. One old friend lamented that she only makes $5,500 a year, but that Obamacare would cost her $6,000 a year in premiums! *She lives in Florida* Another friend chimed in about the horrors of Obamacare.

I asked whether she's actually checked the "subsidy" box on the Healthcare.gov web site to see if she was eligible. Nope. But she was sure it wouldn't make a difference, because Obama sucks!

Is Florida just the home of stupid? It was a long thread, many people jumping in to say Obama sucks! Nothing more. Even after I pointed out that my friend hadn't actually inquired about subsidies since she was low income, everybody just kept jumping it like it was Fox "News" show. What is wrong with you people in Florida? I mean, besides your ridiculous governor?

[NCTraveler]

1. Many people in Florida are being completely fucked by the Govenor...

and the manner in which the ACA was written. Calling people who are getting fucked stupid isn't a really good way to go. The ACA doesn't help everyone like some think.

[ProSense]

5. That

"Many people in Florida are being completely fucked by the Govenor...and the manner in which the ACA was written."

...nothing to do with the way the "ACA was written."

Republican Governors are simply taking it upon themselves to destroy peoples' lives.

More than 7,100 deaths likely from states' rejection of Medicaid expansion: Health Affairs Blog

Harvard and CUNY researchers say death toll from 25-state ‘opt-out’ may be as high as 17,100 annually; hundreds of thousands more will be harmed by depression, untreated diabetes, and skipping mammograms and pap smears

The decision by 25 states to reject the expansion of Medicaid coverage under the Affordable Care Act will result in between 7,115 and 17,104 more deaths than had all states opted in, according to researchers at Harvard Medical School and the City University of New York.

The study, the first detailed estimate of the health impact of the states’ decision to reject the Medicaid expansion (with state-by-state data as well), is being published today at the Health Affairs Blog.

The researchers found that because of the states’ “opting out” of the Medicaid expansion, 7.78 million people who would have gained coverage will remain uninsured. In addition to the thousands of excess deaths associated with that lack of coverage, the rejection of the Medicaid expansion will have the following likely impacts:

* 712,037 more persons diagnosed with depression
* 240,700 more persons suffering catastrophic medical expenses
* 422,533 fewer diabetics receiving medication
* 195,492 fewer women receiving mammograms and
* 443,677 fewer women receiving pap smears

<...>

For example, in Texas, the largest state opting out of the Medicaid expansion, approximately 2 million people who would otherwise have been insured will remain uninsured as a result of the state’s action.

"Texas' refusal to accept federal money to expand Medicaid will result in 184,192 more people experiencing depression, 62,610 more people suffering catastrophic medical expenses, and as many as 3,035 avoidable deaths,” said Dr. Steffie Woolhandler, a professor of public health at the City University of New York who is also on the faculty at Harvard Medical School.

- more -

http://www.pnhp.org/news/2014/january/more-than-7100-deaths-likely-from-states-rejection-of-medicaid-expansion-%C2%A0health-a

[NCTraveler]

8. How do they have the power.

Loop hole?

[ProSense]

10. SCOTUS ruling made it optional. n/t

[NCTraveler]

11. Why? What did SCOTUS find?

You see, I blame the White House and our governor, SCOTUS was a known quantity.

[ProSense]

16. What

"Why? What did SCOTUS find?

You see, I blame the White House and our governor, SCOTUS was a known quantity."

...on earth does "known quantity" mean?

A law mandates a fully funded expansion of Medicaid, and the SCOTUS rules it can't be mandated. The Governors can expand Medicaid with federal funds at any time.

It's the asshole Republican Governors' decisions.

I mean, even corrrupt ass Christie expanded Medicaid.

[freebrew]

21. Not always the governor...

but it is always republicans.

We have a Democratic governor, a veto proof republican congress.

No medicaid expansion for us. Hartzler gets her farm aid though.

[jwirr]

24. My guess is that she is eligible for Medicaid with out the extension. She needs to go to the welfare

office (also known as Department of Human Services in some states) and apply. That is a very low income that would have qualified in most states before ACA. Of course this is Florida so who knows.

[djean111]

42. In Florida, she would need to be disabled to get medicaid, if she has no dependants.

[jwirr]

44. Florida has had way too many repugs running their state.

[djean111]

45. Well, the last one, Rick Scott, only won by 1.2%.

Hopefully this next election will see us Dems win by more than that!

[lumberjack_jeff]

2. Did florida opt in to expanded medicare? n/t

[VanillaRhapsody]

3. same thing as the other Red Staters....brainwash.

[NCTraveler]

6. Florida went for Obama. We also brought you Grayson.

While the state legislature is red, the overall state is purple with respect to national elections. DU also had many members fighting for a conservative for our governor. Publicly against the excellent democrat in the race. I never understood how that was allowed considering how great Meeks was.

[DrDan]

9. Meek was great?????? not hardly

[NCTraveler]

13. Yes, I do think Meek was great.

From the get go the money and democrats with money rallied behind one of the shadiest politicians in the country, Crist. Please go back and watch the debate. Meek was the one with the clear message and strong ideals. He could not get off the ground with the dems fighting against him.

[DrDan]

17. corrupt - read about Stackhouse

"strong ideals" - if they lined his pockets

[DrDan]

7. how many times did the brainwashed of Florida vote for Obama?

[DrDan]

4. "Is Florida just the home of stupid?" - you do know that Obama carried Florida twice . . .

I guess it just feels good to do a bit of region-bashing . . . need to feel a bit superior to someone, don't we

[Atman]

18. Did you intentionally miss the point?

This is a very long time friend of mine. Yes, it saddens me that that she is trying to live on a $5,500 a year income. I get that, I'm not stupid. But how is she coming up with a $6,000 premium on the health care exchange? It ain't happening! I asked if she was sure she had checked all the appropriate boxes on the application and she admitted that she hadn't...but it was all Obama's fault! Any premium is too much at her income level, but that changes nothing...she didn't actually check the box for a subsidy, and didn't want to because Obama sucks! How do you help stupid?

[Ms. Toad]

25. In Florida, there is no subsidy for people making $5,000 a year.

You should not be so hard on your friend.

Florida rejected medicaid expansion. That means that the poorest (including your friend) are not eligible for subsidies at all. Period. They were intended to have completely free access to health care - but the Supreme Court made that optional, and Florida (along with several other primarily red states) chose not to accept the money from the Feds which would have expanded Medicaid to your friend. She will be paying full price for her insurance.

[jwirr]

29. It would help if a good friend actually walked her through the application and sees that she push

the right buttons.

[MineralMan]

19. "Have you ever considered that maybe Obama does suck? "

Really? Is that what you think?

[Glitterati]

14. I know the feeling

A niece posted on Facebook yesterday that she thought she caught strep throat from her son, but couldn't afford to see the doctor because she lost her health insurance while on medical leave of absence from her employer.

Several of her friends posted blaming "Obamacare" for the loss of her insurance.

This was my reply to her:

Sara, I hope you feel better soon. But, seriously, you should go sign up for Obamacare. I have insurance for the first time in 30+ years and it cost me a whopping $28.55 per month! A visit to my doctor costs me $25.00 now thanks to that insurance.

Now, your friend in Florida, just may be screwed..........did the state accept the Medicaid expansion? If not, yes, her Governor and state representatives screwed her because she doesn't make enough to qualify for a subsidy. If they DID, then her ACA coverage will be FREE through Medicaid.

[egduj]

20. For someone that only makes $5500 a year, the fact that she's being forced to pay anything...

is disgusting. On top of the disgusting situation that she won't be able to use the thing she is being forced to pay for.

[Glitterati]

22. The facts are not established

Especially that she is being required to pay anything.

This woman, making $5,500/year, will definitely qualify for Medicaid. If her state legislators turned down expanded Medicaid, then it is her STATE which is denying her health insurance, not ACA.

[Agschmid]

23. Hi...

Did you read this part?

I asked whether she's actually checked the "subsidy" box on the Healthcare.gov web site to see if she was eligible. Nope. But she was sure it wouldn't make a difference, because Obama sucks!

It makes quite a difference in how the OP reads.

[Ms. Toad]

26. The reality - in Florida - is that it won't make a difference.

And checking the "subsidy" box won't change her impression about why it is being denied. So I don't see those sentences as changing anything.

[Glitterati]

28. Well, that's not entirely true

On healthcare.gov when she puts in her annual income, it WILL tell her she qualifies for Medicaid, give her the instructions on how to apply, and provide a link to her local Medicaid office.

I know, because, we in Georgia are in the same boat, and my daughter had to "wait" for the letter saying she didn't qualify for medicaid before I could get her insured under ACA.

[Ms. Toad]

31. But if her income is $5500, she is not eligible for subsidies - and most people .

are not eligible for Medicaid in states which chose not to expand Medicaid. So she would fill out the application (which is - in Ohio - a 20-30 page document requiring detailed, intrusive documentation), be told she is not eligible (unless she is under 18 and/or pregnant), and then will be right back to the marketplace with the $6000 (unsubsidized) premiume - and likely a whole heck of a lot madder than she was to start out with.

As I recall, your daughter is eligible to be part of your plan, based on age (or may independently have low premiums based on her age). That is an entirely different question than someone who has already verifiied that the premium for her age and location is $6000.

Unfortunately, for most low income adults in Florida, actually filling out the form is a futile exercise.

[Glitterati]

33. I understand ALL that

But, this is obviously FLORIDA, not Ohio.

I was simply saying that healthcare.gov WILL give her more information than "you don't qualify for subsidies."

[bunnies]

35. All it does is tell you to apply for medicare.

I know because I went through it.

[Glitterati]

36. MedicAID, and I went through it as well

It's MEDICAID. Medicare is a completely different system, for seniors on Social Security.

We went through the process with my daughter as well.

[bunnies]

37. Yeah. Doing 3 things at once. My error.

So if you've been through it, you know the website doesn't do anything more than that. Seemed like you were saying otherwise.

[Atman]

50. Seems to be the nightmare my friend is caught up in.

I live in Connecticut, and our healthcare site is one of the models for the nation. My wife signed us up with no problem. We're not eligible for any subsidies, but the ACA cut our deductible in half for the exact same policy we already had. My friend in Florida is in a different boat because of Governor Rick Scott. None of my Florida friends want to admit it, but this person went back to healthcare.gov and found the little "subsidy" check box, and now appears to be on her way to very cheap health insurance. The Obama hate down there is so severe that people do the hate first, tell everyone else to hate, then finally do the paperwork and say, hey, this isn't horrible after all!

[Ms. Toad]

38. Is it really helpful to make her think

there might be subsidies available - particularly when the price of confirming she is ineligible for Medicaid is a long intrusive form with lots of extra documentation?

Unless the person is really on the border between Medicaid and subsidies (and $5500 is not), there is really no point in encouraging someone already inclined to blame everything on Obama to go through the hassle, because you end up with someone who is angrier with no more benefits than she started with.

Go play here, with Florida. You'll see that there is really no point in going through the Medicaid process.

I randomly chose a city, and selected the age to match the premium the OP said she would have to pay. Based on that premium, it is pretty clear it is not a child or pregnant woman - and aside from those two categories, there is really no reason to go through the very painful Medicaid application.

[Glitterati]

41. It's the required process

that's the bottom line.

I couldn't insure my daughter under ACA until I got the letter saying she didn't qualify for the expanded Medicaid which didn't exist in my state.

We ALL knew she didn't qualify, but I spent 2 hours on the phone, being transferred to 8 different departments at Humana trying to get her on my insurance WITHOUT that letter. It's not possible.

[Ms. Toad]

43. But why go through the process

if insurance costs $6000 and you are only making $5500. It is a pointless exercise - particularly since this is not likely to be a situation where the person is eligible to be put on someone else's plan ($6000 in premiums corresponds roughly to a 60 year old non-smoker).

(It is only required if you expect to get insurance - my point is that this person, because of her circumstances, would not be expecting to buy $6000 a year insurance when her income is on ly $5500 - so why encourage her to do something pointless that will only make her angrier.)

[bunnies]

34. I had the hardest time getting people to understand what youre describing.

I went round and round with some here on this exact issue. Make too little to get subsidies, not "disabled" or pregnant so no medicare.

Thankfully I was able to go back to work so Im not in that situation anymore. But some people have the hardest time wrapping their head around that one. Eventually, I gave up. Hope you have better luck.

[Orangepeel]

30. She won't be forced to do anything

It is republicans in her state's fault that she won't be helped by Medicaid expansion. The ACA has a lot of faults, but one very good thing that it did do prior to SCOTUS giving states a pass and republican taking it, was expand healthcare via Medicaid to low income people.

The Department of Health and Human Services included being denied medicare due to a state refusing to expand it on the list of hardship exemptions to the mandate, so the person in the example will not be subject to a penalty.

[abelenkpe]

27. What is wrong?

FOX news

eom

[Hassin Bin Sober]

32. I honestly think it is starting to sink in with people that Obamacare is a good thing

They won't admit it but it is starting to have an impact on some people that I know who were big mouth Obamacare haters.

My brother-in-law was bitching and moaning about Obamacare but his 23 year-old daughter who he had just put back on his insurance had emergency appendectomy surgery all paid for by his insurance that she didn't have prior to Obamacare.

Another friend of mine, and old-school Chicago Daley Democrat, or in other words a Reagan Democrat, used to tell me how she doesn't want to pay for other people's health care. All while she was paying 400 dollar a month premiums for health care she could never use.

Now she's retired and on a very small pension and waiting for Social Security. She burned her savings paying premiums but never went to the doctor. Now she tells me she went on the exchange and found out she can get health care with no premium due to subsidies.

[Glitterati]

39. ROFL, I know exactly what you are talking about

I'm a member of a senior group on Facebook, mostly republicans. But the lies and misinformation about Obamacare were just astonishing. Mostly so because the people on the group qualify for Medicare and are on Social Security, so they were simply repeating Fox lies on Facebook and had zero first hand knowledge.

One person even posted that you had to claim the subsidies as income on your taxes next year!!!!!

Of course, I set out to correct the errors, posted tons of information and links. Not. one. response. Not even a like. ROFL!

[djean111]

40. Here in Florida, adults without dependants are not eligible for Medicaid unless they are disabled.

Home of the stupid? That's sort of a metaphysical thing - but I do think that people who make sweeping generalities using geographical parameters do most certainly live there. :-O

Rick Scott won Florida by a very thin margin, by the way - he beat Alex Sink by 1.2%. Hopefully Wasserman & Co. can do a good job of GOTV for Crist this year. And Kendrik Meek had a few little problems concerning accepting kickbacks from a shady developer.
Also, if Obama can evolve on gay marriage, then Crist can evolve on a few things. After all, today's Dem party would look like the GOP of years ago to many people.

[Atman]

47. I designed Kenrick Meek's NASCAR!

Apropos of nothing, other than I designed his logo and the graphics for his race car at Daytona. Crashed on the the 93rd lap. I did a lot of campaign material for Kendrick.

[Atman]

46. My friend just posted back. Oh, wait...

Yup. She admits she didn't fill out all the forms, didn't complete the process. Now she's actually excited. It seems as if she's eligible for a subsidy. Meanwhile, she's inflamed tons of friends on FB who all keep posting "OBAMA SUCKS!" and she'll probably wind up getting a deep discount on her insurance. All because she didn't fill out the forms right in the first place.

[Glitterati]

48. What's the saying..a lie gets...

“A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.” ― Winston Churchill

[djean111]

49. Well, it is an ill wind that blows nobody any good - you got to call an entire state stupid!

[Atman]

51. I grew up in Florida.

I can say that because it's my home.

[djean111]

53. My home, too.

Don't like to be generalized into any group. Funny thing, my next door neighbors are the same age as I am, but they are religious and Republican, I am an atheist and a liberal Democrat. Yet people here act as if we think the same because we both live in Florida. Makes no sense.

[Rider3]

52. They are too lazy to do any kind of research for themselves

I've given up trying to talk sense into these people. They don't know anything about the topic they're bashing.

[Sarah Ibarruri]

54. Yes. Florida, Georgia and all states where Repukes rejected its Medicaid expansion, are also...

where they seem to be congregated. They not only do NOT understand ACA, but they actually think that the refusal of fascist GOP governors and fascist GOP politicians to allow the ACA Medicaid expansion in their states, is the fault of the ACA.

And if you try to explain it to them, they will not understand it. GUARANTEED. I explained it to someone the other day, and it took me THREE tries. I even had to draw diagrams.

[Atman]

55. So I got a text from my Florida friend last night. I was right.

She never selected the box applying for a subsidy, so her rant was totally off-base. She received a reply from the Healthcare.gov web site saying that yes, indeed, she was eligible for FREE health care given her income level, but SORRY...."Your state (Florida)" chose not to accept the Medicare expansion, so you're shit out of luck. But it's all Obama's fault, not Governor Rick Scott's. Several other FB friends have chimed in to say that it's horrible what Obama did, they shouldn't be in this situation, completely ignoring the fact that is their governor (a Medicare Fraudster) who is denying them access, not the ACA.


Amazing.