Obama defends Iraq War in Europe speech

[Enrique]

on a day when liberals everywhere, including me, are defending Obama against Rumsfeld, Obama defends Rummy's indefensible war.

http://news.firedoglake.com/2014/03/26/president-obama-denounces-russia-defends-iraq-war-as-legal/

President Barack Obama gave a speech today in Brussels where he denounced Russia and defended the 2003 Iraq War as legal and done while working within the international system. The speech comes after the Crimea was annexed by Russia under a controversial referendum and American neoconservatives have criticized the Obama Administration as naive and ineffective.

The remarks on Iraq came as Obama responded to complaints by the Russian government and others that America’s position on respecting sovereignty was hypocritical given the 2003 Iraq War.

Russia has pointed to America’s decision to go into Iraq as an example of Western hypocrisy. Now, it is true that the Iraq war was a subject of vigorous debate, not just around the world but in the United States, as well. I participated in that debate, and I opposed our military intervention there.

But even in Iraq, America sought to work within the international system. We did not claim or annex Iraq’s territory. We did not grab its resources for our own gain. Instead, we ended our war and left Iraq to its people in a fully sovereign Iraqi state that can make decisions about its own future.

Worked within the international system? So if Russia had gone to the UN to get a resolution, failed, then annexed Crimea it would have been OK?

[cthulu2016]

1. "Defends Iraq War" is too strong, but it was embarrassing and sad.

The idea that pretending to go to the UN then ignoring whatever the UN says is what international law is all about was just weird.

There is probably nothing he could have said about Iraq that would not have been a cringe-a-thon.

I might have just said that if anyone was upset about Iraq then they should also be upset about Crimea, and left it at that.

[Enrique]

4. you are bending over backwards to be fair

that's a good impulse, and I think most Obama critics here try hard to be fair, but "defend" is a perfectly fair term for:

But even in Iraq, America sought to work within the international system. We did not claim or annex Iraq’s territory. We did not grab its resources for our own gain. Instead, we ended our war and left Iraq to its people in a fully sovereign Iraqi state that can make decisions about its own future.

[cthulu2016]

19. Defending the diplomatic process and the exit, but not the decision to invade

I don't defend anything about Iraq so Obama was way out of my comfort zone.

But yes, I was put off by it when I saw it, but did not post about it because I do bend over backward to be fair to the man.

[Enrique]

20. a lot of Obama critics do that

hold back criticism of Obama because they are not sure there is a purpose for it. I know I do. The claim that Obama critics stretch to find things to "bash" him about is outrageously false.

[Supersedeas]

24. so much pretending...where is the leadership to call the Iraq War

what is really is/was.

[senseandsensibility]

2. Yuck.

How disillusioning.

[ProSense]

3. "I opposed our military intervention there."

"Obama defends Iraq War in Europe speech"

That's what cherry picking does.

Moreover, Russia has pointed to America’s decision to go into Iraq as an example of Western hypocrisy. Now, it is true that the Iraq War was a subject of vigorous debate not just around the world, but in the United States as well. I participated in that debate and I opposed our military intervention there. But even in Iraq, America sought to work within the international system. We did not claim or annex Iraq’s territory. We did not grab its resources for our own gain. Instead, we ended our war and left Iraq to its people and a fully sovereign Iraqi state that could make decisions about its own future.

Of course, neither the United States nor Europe are perfect in adherence to our ideals, nor do we claim to be the sole arbiter of what is right or wrong in the world. We are human, after all, and we face difficult choices about how to exercise our power. But part of what makes us different is that we welcome criticism, just as we welcome the responsibilities that come with global leadership.

http://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/2014/03/26/remarks-president-address-european-youth

There was in fact a process to work with the international community...right up until Bush violated all agreements. On that score, Bush's and Putin's invasions are illegal.

Obama did defend his own actions in Iraq: ending the war and leaving it a sovereign state.

[Enrique]

6. i posted that before you did

and FDL posted it before I did. Neither of us cherry picked shit.

[ProSense]

8. Opposing Iraq is not defending Iraq. n/t

[JackRiddler]

13. Making excuses for wars of aggression.

The worst of all international crimes - one that Obama attempted to extend past the deadline in the SOFA. What he did in office matters more that what he said back in Illinois.

[ProSense]

14. Nonsense. n/t

[JackRiddler]

16. He opposed it before he supported it.

There's precedence. No problem.

[polichick]

5. Yeah, too bad he brought it up at all.

[Enrique]

10. Putin has the easiest response imaginable

he can just ask, how many people died in Crimea vs. in Iraq?

[Rex]

23. +100000000000000000000000000

nt.

[BlueStater]

7. Oh, good lord.

[bigwillq]

9. Another issue he evolved on.

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=99591469

http://www.reuters.com/article/2007/02/12/us-usa-politics-obama-idUSN0923153320070212

[alsame]

11. Working within the

international system.

[IMG][/IMG]

[JackRiddler]

12. Even this leaves the reflexive supporters

impervious. Invincible.

Party line, sad substitute for brains.

We are talking about a planned, announced war of aggression, launched without provocation by the superpower under Bush on the basis of witting and gargantuan lies, against a country on the other side of the world that posed no threat and did not pretend to threaten the United States. Obama, elected in part because people believed he stood for peace, attempted to extend the U.S. military involvement beyond the term agreed by the Bush regime, only to be rebuffed by the Iraqi ally. The result is a country in ruins, hundreds of thousands dead, hundreds of thousands yet to die from the continuing environmental and the political consequences of a shattered society. The United States should be paying reparations, not making excuses for the atrocity. And what of the monsters who planned and executed the first worst of all international crimes against humanity -- the worst by far, and the most important of the last 20 years in terms of setting the tone for a new world order based on power alone (an invitation to Russia as well)? They went free, and they prosper, they have not been investigated let alone prosecuted, and they receive awards from their successors in the following administration.

[PowerToThePeople]

15. Who is selling Iraq's oil these days?

[renegade000]

17. ok let's be fair

to defend Obama: As odious as the Iraq War was, we weren't trying to make Iraq the 51st state. What Russia is doing is really "old school" imperialism, which makes it pretty darn egregious. That being said, the Iraq war was pretty darn egregious as well, and Obama appears to be glossing over the egregious aspects to get to his administration's withdrawal from said conflict, which is a more positive aspect (if we had a President McCain or Romney, we'd still be there...).

to criticize Obama: I really wish he wouldn't gloss over the huge issues with the Iraq war, and would just completely throw the previous administration under the bus. Why can't he just say, "Well if Putin wants to be like George W Bush and Dick Cheney then that's his prerogative. We made similar mistakes in the past, but this is a new administration." Then I'd pretty sure we'd all be happy here on DU. I know he can't say it in those exact terms, but something to convey that idea-- it would simultaneously neutralize Russia's criticism and criticize his domestic hawkish opponents (as frankly they aren't shy from attacking him).

[Liberal Veteran]

18. Myrtle Snow said expresses my feeling for me.

[rtracey]

21. Defended? really

Moreover, Russia has pointed to America’s decision to go into Iraq as an example of Western hypocrisy. Now, it is true that the Iraq War was a subject of vigorous debate not just around the world, but in the United States as well. I participated in that debate and I opposed our military intervention there. But even in Iraq, America sought to work within the international system.

(We did not claim or annex Iraq’s territory. We did not grab its resources for our own gain. Instead, we ended our war and left Iraq to its people and a fully sovereign Iraqi state that could make decisions about its own future.)

Hes not defending it, hes telling the truth about it.

[uponit7771]

22. *****BULLSHIT ASS'D MISLEADING ARTICLE***** Obama never "defended" Iraq even said he opposed it

[Enrique]

25. he said he opposed it

then he defended it against certain claims people have made about it, such as that it was done unilaterally.

[chillfactor]

26. no that is NOT what the President said at all....

get a grip.....

[Gothmog]

27. To use a legal term, what President Obama did was to distinguish the Iraq war from Crimea

Remember that President Obama is a lawyer and a law professor. What President Obama did in his speech was to distinguish the Iraq war from the situation in Crimea. Here is a simplified explanation of this concept. http://legal-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/distinguish

Distinguish
To set apart as being separate or different; to point out an essential disparity.

To distinguish one case from another case means to show the dissimilarities between the two. It means to prove a case that is cited as applicable to the case currently in dispute is really inapplicable because the two cases are different.

The Iraq war is a very different situation compared to the conduct of Russia in annexing Crimea. In his speech, President Obama did not defend the Iraq war but merely explained why the Iraq war was not relevant to the conduct of Russia in annexing Crimea.

As a lawyer, there is a huge difference here.