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Gas Prices At The Pump: Europeans Pay Almost Twice As Much As US Residents
http://www.ibtimes.com/gas-prices-pump-europeans-pay-almost-twice-much-us-residents-1322727
LittleBlue
(10,362 posts)Which is a real alternative to driving, unlike America's woeful public transport systems.
Major Nikon
(36,827 posts)Which is what we should be doing here.
Mira
(22,380 posts)In Europe you can get anywhere without a car. Affordably. Any time.
(How can we not have a transit system? After all, aren't we number ONE?)
JVS
(61,935 posts)In Europe you can get a lot of places for fairly low prices, but there are a lot of situations where you either go a slow route or pay a high price. For example, I was at a university once and there was another university with a particularly good library about 60 miles away. My university ID allowed me to travel free on slow trains and I could go there for free but it would take 3 tp 3.5 hours of train rides. I could get a fast train there in 1 hour and 1:15 minutes but then I'd need to pay 29 euros each way. I had a similar situation in England where getting to Oxford (60 miles away) would 30 pounds for a morning train and 10 pounds for an off-peak return. In both situations I was overjoyed when a colleague from the area happened to be making the trip with their automobile. It was so much cheaper even with gas costing more.
You might not need a car for every day's activities in Europe, but having one at your disposal really opens up a lot of possibilities. Zipcar might be a really great thing to do over there.
Mira
(22,380 posts)You had options in Europe, albeit not always perfect, did you not? And chose one of them that made sense at the time. In America, with gas "cheap" people just drive without going to the trouble to find rides to save gas. Most cars I see have one person in them.
Here we have no real options, and not the mindset to conserve fuel and be good stewards of our resources.
Response to Mira (Reply #18)
JVS This message was self-deleted by its author.
Mira
(22,380 posts)have the opportunity to visit there. You know of course that we are discussing options for the whole country, right?
In either response to me you are making good and well researched points.
Major Nikon
(36,827 posts)But people who travel more frequently in Europe are generally going to take advantage of some type of rail pass. Another consideration is that in Europe, traffic jams are a lot more common, so that 60 mile car trip could very easily wind up taking you just about as long as your slow train option, and by the time you wind up paying fuel, tolls, and parking could easily rival the cost of a fast train ride. Sometimes traveling by car in Europe is quite nice, but it can also be quite the pain in the ass.
hfojvt
(37,573 posts)when I had to pay 5 marks to go about 5k on a bus. Tuttlingen to Seitingen.
Back in Utah in 1985 I used to pay 75 cents to go 30 miles, from Layton to SLC.
I couldn't believe the driver when he said 5 marks. Then I had to catch the next bus because I didn't have change.
myrna minx
(22,772 posts)Response to myrna minx (Reply #2)
Name removed Message auto-removed
Recursion
(56,582 posts)It really is just something America has proven itself averse to, sadly.
Blue_Tires
(55,445 posts)it helps that the majority of European cities were designed and laid out with the walker/horse rider in mind, while U.S. cities were designed to accommodate the automobile driver...
frazzled
(18,402 posts)It was true when I lived in Europe back in the late 1960s and it's been true ever since.
Recursion
(56,582 posts)If somebody can find a gas tax that can pass, I'll be all for it. Short of that, a road use fee is almost as good. In some ways better, because it won't hit farmers.
FarCenter
(19,429 posts)http://www.nytimes.com/1996/04/27/us/dole-urges-repeal-of-1993-gas-tax-increase.html
Recursion
(56,582 posts)I still wonder where the people who imagine there is a very left-wing silent majority were in the 1990s...
Lars39
(26,116 posts)Farmers use the interstate system, too.
Recursion
(56,582 posts)My grandfather's combine used about three times as much gas in a season as his truck. He would always file to get the gas taxes on it back, for that matter...
Lars39
(26,116 posts)Recursion
(56,582 posts)Just like tolls.
However, tolls charge for actual road use (the thing they're raising money for) as opposed to a gas tax. A farmer uses a lot more gas growing and harvesting his crop than getting it to market.
Lars39
(26,116 posts)JVS
(61,935 posts)So I can understand why people would be reluctant to have some of the few advantages we have here pissed away.
Zorra
(27,670 posts)Gemini Cat
(2,820 posts)hobbit709
(41,694 posts)NCTraveler
(30,481 posts)I can't think of any argument currently going on that this would back up.
frylock
(34,825 posts)entirely, I'm sure, because it's being proposed by the current administration.
randome
(34,845 posts)But that's not going to happen for quite a while, if ever.
[hr][font color="blue"][center]Birds are territorial creatures.
The lyrics to the songbird's melodious trill go something like this:
"Stay out of my territory or I'll PECK YOUR GODDAMNED EYES OUT!"[/center][/font][hr]
PumpkinAle
(1,210 posts)and in all reality it is not feasible to have public transport covering all areas.
Of course, we do need to shore up the public transport in areas it does cover and ensure that those that live there. America and other countries (i.e. GB) were stupid when they did away with tram systems. In Germany they have a wonderful tram system and people use it and enjoy using it to get about - it is cheap, efficient and clean.
Mira
(22,380 posts)speed up enormously and continue on the tracks, and then go to neighboring towns, slow down again, and become streetcars for the duration.
I rode that in Karlsruhe near the French Border.
Just AWESOME and cheap and ON TIME.
sir pball
(4,761 posts)'92, trip to France - gas was about the same price per unit, but the units were liters. I was utterly mindboggled that anybody could afford ~$3.50/gallon!
Glad to hear they're getting a fairer shake; my latest trip is beginning to coalesce, it'll be a nice bit of pocket money for the trip to Murren.
Nye Bevan
(25,406 posts)I'm thinking like people in VT who need to drive 10 or 15 miles to get to a store. Smart tolls are a much better solution. Someone who takes 2 hours driving from CT to NY at rush hour has a much greater environmental impact than someone in a rural state driving the same distance.
Xithras
(16,191 posts)The flipside of that argument, rural America once had small markets and other services scattered throughout rural areas, and those markets died off when the automobile shortened travel time and allowed for them to be consolidated. Historically, any place with more than a few dozen homes within a few minutes walk, ride, or drive would have a small central area providing services.
Smaller markets and stores still exist throughout Europe, and in America in densely populated areas where many people prefer to walk. By encouraging the reduction of cars, we would also encourage the resurgence of those types of businesses in rural America, which would help with unemployment.
gollygee
(22,336 posts)Most people in the US NEED cars to get to work. Working people can hardly afford gas prices as they are. If we had the kind of public transportation options that exist in Europe, it would be another thing, though I don't know how that would work with how big our country is.
dilby
(2,273 posts)Go figure, people who make twice as much can afford to pay twice as much.
FBaggins
(26,760 posts)There are only 2-3 European countries with median incomes higher than the US (none anywhere close to twice as high).
dilby
(2,273 posts)My counterparts in the UK make nearly twice as much as I do for doing the same job for my company. But their cost of living is greatly increased, as well as their taxes. But at the end of the day disposable income is nearly the same as mine, however they do get better perks as far as healthcare and vacation.
FBaggins
(26,760 posts)They may be in an expensive part of the UK while you're in a comparatively low cost-of-living part of the US -
It's good that you recognize the net living-standard difference. I can't tell you how many people that I've lost over the years who thought that they were leaving for better pay... only to see their standard of living decline because the new market was so expensive.
My younger brother probably earns a little more than I do, but I live in what most would consider an upper-middle-class home while he rents a small cinder-block 2BR home... because I'm in NC and he's in HI.
OTOH... the view from just about every corner of his home is spectacular.
Harmony Blue
(3,978 posts)or most of the United States
Myopic New Yorkers think that the rest of the United States have outstanding public transportation until they come for a visit down here in Florida and learn it is way different.
Your north east bias is showing.
tammywammy
(26,582 posts)I couldn't imagine driving in that all the time.
Speaking of Europe, at my work we travel to Germany and Italy often and where the people are going are not supported by rail. Their trips require a vehicle.
FBaggins
(26,760 posts)I just returned a couple weeks ago from an extended stay and prices were roughly $10/gal at then-current exchange rates.
The interesting thing though is that the 9-passenger diesel that I was driving got almost 30 mpg (significantly better than my much smaller Honda minivan).
liberal N proud
(60,346 posts)They also spend much more on infrastructure in general as do not have the oil reserves the US has.
truebrit71
(20,805 posts)....
Crunchy Frog
(26,647 posts)They also have excellent public transportation, and they tend to structure their communities in such a way that it is easy to get around by foot or by bicycle.
They also have a much stronger social safety net than we do, which makes some expenses less onerous to them then they would be to Americans who struggle to pay for things like healthcare and child care.
It's really comparing apples and oranges.
frylock
(34,825 posts)better public transportation, etc.
Estrella Fugaz
(14 posts)From the article.
Oh! What happens when one reads the whole thing.
rafeh1
(385 posts)Germany has no minimum wage but the average wage is around 18 euros ($23 hr?). On top of that the employee gets 2 years of unemployment and almost the month of august off.
Gasoline costs almost 7 euros ($8.5?)
Given extremely high primary inputs labor and transportation
How does Germany compete with China as the worlds top exporter?
According to Republican theory need $5 hr and $2 per gallon for US to be competitive?
Throd
(7,208 posts)1000words
(7,051 posts)shenmue
(38,506 posts)Worthwhile investments, all.
deathrind
(1,786 posts)If I had acces to the outstanding public transportation or healthcare they have.
Bluenorthwest
(45,319 posts)sure never seen you claim that we shouldn't because they don't. And they don't. So what you want is yet another contribution from people whom you refuse to treat equally except when it comes to your precious taxation. 'No rights, but endless fees' is not what Europe does.
Bluenorthwest
(45,319 posts)during the creation of the ACA? Did you make OP's saying 'In the UK they pay nothing at point of service!!!!!!' ?
If not, you seem a tad selective.