The United States of America did NOT torture "...some folks."

[xocet]

"We" tortured individual persons. To wit: each measure of liquid in waterboarding did not nebulously affect some abstract and ill-defined group - each drop affected a single person's ability to breathe.

Measure by measure, second by second, breath by desperate breath, these people then became "our" torture VICTIMS. Regardless of whatever else those people may or may have not done, they are now and always will be the VICTIMS of our government's torture program. That is "our" relationship to them.

This is not sanctimony - it is consistency. Torture is fundamentally wrong and is a war crime. George Bush and his thugs are war criminals and should be prosecuted.

[grasswire]

1. I don't know if you saw the post in the last two days..

....about the loophole in the order written by Obama to end the torture. We can't know if it has been ended, even yet.

[xocet]

2. No, I didn't see that post. I'll look for it. Thanks. n/t

[grasswire]

3. I found it.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025347198


Maddening.

[xocet]

4. Thank you for the link. It is maddening. n/t