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One of the scariest pictures I've seen in a long time. (Original Post) trumad Aug 2014 OP
Incomprehensible. If I didn't know otherwise I'd say he's part of a combat unit in Afghanistan. Avalux Aug 2014 #1
Not possible Kelvin Mace Aug 2014 #6
What you do abroad... JackRiddler Aug 2014 #16
First they came for the Afghans... tblue Aug 2014 #23
Didn't that Reverend once talk about Chickens Coming Home to Roost? johnlucas Aug 2014 #89
ward churchill got in trouble for that "chickens coming home to roost" comment as well. niyad Aug 2014 #131
so shall ye reap......... tavalon Aug 2014 #135
"I'd say he's part of a combat unit in Afghanistan" Plucketeer Aug 2014 #94
Definitely. If you didn't know the setting of this photo, you'd very easily assume this was taken calimary Aug 2014 #105
Speaking strictly for myself, the "St. Louis County Police" arm patch would have been a clue... WuzYoungOnceToo Aug 2014 #146
Welcome to DU, WuzYoungOnceToo. I'm guessing you served in the military? calimary Aug 2014 #150
Here's the problem WuzYoungOnceToo Aug 2014 #159
Fair enough. calimary Aug 2014 #168
Well, I tried. WuzYoungOnceToo Aug 2014 #170
Well, I tried, too. calimary Aug 2014 #174
Found this item, and I thought of your comments. calimary Aug 2014 #169
What did you find "illuminating" about it? WuzYoungOnceToo Aug 2014 #171
Well, evidently, that poster had military experience. calimary Aug 2014 #175
No reason for good people to fear, citizen! The PD sniper is there to protect the protesters... Octafish Aug 2014 #2
This needs to be it's own OP Octofish! Extremely important information! 2banon Aug 2014 #22
I agree 100% !!!! H2O Man Aug 2014 #33
Amen to that! You too! :) 2banon Aug 2014 #118
+1 woo me with science Aug 2014 #53
Reccing this post. woo me with science Aug 2014 #50
Here's a new name for us... ReRe Aug 2014 #69
Add COINTELPRO L0oniX Aug 2014 #72
Need more eyes on this. TheKentuckian Aug 2014 #93
Nothing we didn't know. That's why we were out in the streets, to make people Zorra Aug 2014 #96
Which points again to the wisdom of Occupy dixiegrrrrl Aug 2014 #122
That is why they still exist. tavalon Aug 2014 #136
+1 daleanime Aug 2014 #141
+1 a whole bunch. Enthusiast Aug 2014 #123
It infuriates me. nt alsame Aug 2014 #3
Since laughter truly is the best medicine, please see this hilarious VanGoghRocks Aug 2014 #4
Kick! Heidi Aug 2014 #5
There is a photo of a protester exboyfil Aug 2014 #7
I haven't seen the photo pintobean Aug 2014 #9
Given the fact that there are pictures that show snipers decked out in military gear, JTFrog Aug 2014 #15
I haven't convinced myself of anything pintobean Aug 2014 #18
Indeed. JTFrog Aug 2014 #35
I don't know that they actually pintobean Aug 2014 #43
I hope the situation gets better soon. JTFrog Aug 2014 #52
On the picture in the OP OnlinePoker Aug 2014 #70
No Flyboy_451 Aug 2014 #84
Did the facts that you have no idea who actually pointed a laser at the protester... WuzYoungOnceToo Aug 2014 #147
I am not talking about the picture of the sniper exboyfil Aug 2014 #149
First off, my personal relation (or lack thereof)... WuzYoungOnceToo Aug 2014 #160
Bloomberg a better source? exboyfil Aug 2014 #161
Not really, no. WuzYoungOnceToo Aug 2014 #162
His casual posture is one of the most disturbing things. alphafemale Aug 2014 #8
Right. H2O Man Aug 2014 #34
+2 nomorenomore08 Aug 2014 #137
This type of person is drawn to law enforcement RedCappedBandit Aug 2014 #144
Considering the fact that he's not even looking through the scope... WuzYoungOnceToo Aug 2014 #163
I would prefer he not be there at all. /nt pintobean Aug 2014 #165
The more of this CRAP Island Deac Aug 2014 #10
New World Order jalan48 Aug 2014 #11
EXACTLY!!!! heaven05 Aug 2014 #12
Thank you. Cassandras of the world, unite! WinkyDink Aug 2014 #91
The police have had snipers for a long,..... long time. NM_Birder Aug 2014 #13
Isn't that the problem? Nuh Uh Aug 2014 #21
camo clothing and desert boots ? NM_Birder Aug 2014 #27
Add to that H2O Man Aug 2014 #37
? nobody got "picked off" NM_Birder Aug 2014 #41
Once again, H2O Man Aug 2014 #46
? but I enjoyed it, thanks. NM_Birder Aug 2014 #49
ROTF trumad Aug 2014 #64
Guy's on a roll today! panader0 Aug 2014 #76
With all those wrinkles... hootinholler Aug 2014 #79
Priceless! HangOnKids Aug 2014 #108
Yep. H2O Man Aug 2014 #140
Military dress and military attitude. A Simple Game Aug 2014 #42
I say, "Let's not H2O Man Aug 2014 #54
We need to destroy the village in order to save it. nt tblue37 Aug 2014 #78
How long you been waiting to say that ? NM_Birder Aug 2014 #57
awww...you're starting to show your colors.. trumad Aug 2014 #66
Favorite mis-direction meme of the right wing. Ikonoklast Aug 2014 #75
Not a dodge, it's fact, wanted to see if anybody cared. the answer is no, nobody cares. NM_Birder Aug 2014 #82
Uh-huh, sure. Ikonoklast Aug 2014 #86
It's true, I don't think you care. NM_Birder Aug 2014 #100
Three words you got right. Guess which ones. Ikonoklast Aug 2014 #103
I think there are a few of them ThoughtCriminal Aug 2014 #129
it's true, not a "meme" and I'd say you could care less. NM_Birder Aug 2014 #81
what is it that you're doing to bring awareness about gun violence in Chicago? frylock Aug 2014 #134
Any time that H2O Man Aug 2014 #139
If Chicago is in such dire need of policing, then why aren't the riot police in Chicago? A Simple Game Aug 2014 #113
Well, for starters... WuzYoungOnceToo Aug 2014 #164
No jurisdiction? Then why would anyone bring up Chicago as a comparison? A Simple Game Aug 2014 #166
Uh, no. WuzYoungOnceToo Aug 2014 #172
My apologies, I usually don't pay attention to a posters name, I should start. A Simple Game Aug 2014 #173
But they WERE raising their hands in the air, the lot of them, tblue37 Aug 2014 #77
What a load. fleabiscuit Aug 2014 #25
Yeah...here we go...nothing to see here folks..move along elias49 Aug 2014 #30
Post removed Post removed Aug 2014 #32
No, the threat of a riot was caused by, NM_Birder Aug 2014 #45
The rioting started AFTER the SWAT teams were there. freebrew Aug 2014 #110
ok... trumad Aug 2014 #65
First you show me all the people he gunned down....... NM_Birder Aug 2014 #83
Didn't say he gunned down anyone trumad Aug 2014 #95
Didn't even look for another picture. NM_Birder Aug 2014 #102
Look... trumad Aug 2014 #115
Thats not what I said, but your spin was pretty smooth, NM_Birder Aug 2014 #120
Yeah---for swat teams who use them in hostage situations. trumad Aug 2014 #124
let me know where the goal posts are going from here. NM_Birder Aug 2014 #128
No goal posts trumad Aug 2014 #130
The speculation thing has gotten out of hand. NM_Birder Aug 2014 #133
Who are the people in your neighborhood? RadiationTherapy Aug 2014 #14
Nothing but fear and intimidation. blackspade Aug 2014 #17
That dickbag thinks he's a soldier Boreal Aug 2014 #111
Apparently, the police are at war Bettie Aug 2014 #19
JEEEZIS! MarianJack Aug 2014 #20
Seems so willing and ready to shoot fellow Americans Oilwellian Aug 2014 #24
What's wrong with having a C student high school bully dressed and armed like that?... lame54 Aug 2014 #26
Your "C student high school bully" seals it: It's SHRUB!!!!!!!!!1 n/t UTUSN Aug 2014 #68
Curious about the gun -- packman Aug 2014 #28
I think, janlyn Aug 2014 #40
In order: Recursion Aug 2014 #56
actually #3 is most likely 2 things SQUEE Aug 2014 #58
All it lacks is a cupholder Recursion Aug 2014 #61
I am a KISS kinda guy myself SQUEE Aug 2014 #62
"looks like he he dragged that thing through a tactical catalog. " Spitfire of ATJ Aug 2014 #85
I don't mind then having rifles, just not military assault rifles. Rex Aug 2014 #153
You'd rather they have a more powerful hunting rifle? Recursion Aug 2014 #154
I won't deny there might be a need for a sniper or two. Rex Aug 2014 #156
Answers about the gun OldRedneck Aug 2014 #99
3 is not a laser designator, it is a reflex sight NickB79 Aug 2014 #109
Actually 3 is two things. Glassunion Aug 2014 #152
You've come a long way baby. Kablooie Aug 2014 #29
The man in blue pintobean Aug 2014 #47
At least his pants are camo, so no one will notice him. meti57b Aug 2014 #31
Even the flag patch is camo, but his white skin shines out bright and clear. JEB Aug 2014 #36
Face paint is too expensive? L0oniX Aug 2014 #74
Proof the cops need more money. JEB Aug 2014 #106
Camouflage while patrolling the streets of suburban St. Louis . . . markpkessinger Aug 2014 #142
Yeah, pretty intimidating! janlyn Aug 2014 #38
He must have skin irritation from the constant hard-on he gets when he puts that stuff on. Hoppy Aug 2014 #39
I was thinking the same thing... SoapBox Aug 2014 #48
Men literally get *aroused* by guns? Thought it was a joke. Imminent death should be a turn off. freshwest Aug 2014 #80
Didn't the hippies tell us to Make Love Not War? johnlucas Aug 2014 #92
The voice of sanity. Thanks, johnlucas. We need more of it, and freshwest Aug 2014 #97
I've tried to sell my concept for the "open carry" uniform for cops rock Aug 2014 #44
K&R woo me with science Aug 2014 #51
escalation of weapons as the public acquires more of them samsingh Aug 2014 #55
The parallels with pre war Germany are terrifying mountain grammy Aug 2014 #59
The SA before the SS took them over. L0oniX Aug 2014 #73
Actually modern German police can be pretty scary looking.. EX500rider Aug 2014 #112
Keep our police local. talkguy365 Aug 2014 #60
"Dress for the job you want... alterfurz Aug 2014 #63
Excellent! n/t dixiegrrrrl Aug 2014 #125
You should be scared. Cleita Aug 2014 #67
Well ...at least it isn't a 50 cal. L0oniX Aug 2014 #71
I want to hear what Sergeant Shamar Thomas has to say (video heavy): freshwest Aug 2014 #87
Whoever ordered that idiot to threaten citizens from on top of a tank needs to be fired. nt SunSeeker Aug 2014 #88
A pre-requisite to getting this equipment ought to be Basic Training. WinkyDink Aug 2014 #90
Thought this was a thread for selfies The Straight Story Aug 2014 #98
Dude is better armed and armored than I EVER was, and people were actually shooting at me! 11 Bravo Aug 2014 #101
The more guns we have as citizens Politicalboi Aug 2014 #104
Bullshit. ForgoTheConsequence Aug 2014 #107
+1 freshwest Aug 2014 #114
Wait til you see this flying over your house (actually, you won't see it, but it'll see you, 24/7): blkmusclmachine Aug 2014 #116
You're right, we won't see it... Glassunion Aug 2014 #151
Their bosses, the people who offer us life on their plantation, and kill more people...are scarier. jtuck004 Aug 2014 #117
This is a chilling depiction of the militarization of our police force in general. Liberal_from_va34 Aug 2014 #119
It is scary Unknown Beatle Aug 2014 #121
Hoping, PRAYING the Black folk act up so he can open fire on them... randys1 Aug 2014 #126
That photo also appears..... LloydS of New London Aug 2014 #127
Dressing up Halloween or play soldier KauaiK Aug 2014 #132
When your citizens are treated like your enemy.... Generic Brad Aug 2014 #138
Hey, but don't worry... Javaman Aug 2014 #143
K & R ctsnowman Aug 2014 #145
Pointing it at American citizens gldstwmn Aug 2014 #148
Why? Glassunion Aug 2014 #155
Well to Morans it's perfectly OK. trumad Aug 2014 #157
Forgot the sarcasm thingy... Glassunion Aug 2014 #158
So apparently we are now sending American Po-licemen over to Iraq and Afghanistan to kill madinmaryland Aug 2014 #167

Avalux

(35,015 posts)
1. Incomprehensible. If I didn't know otherwise I'd say he's part of a combat unit in Afghanistan.
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 10:07 AM
Aug 2014

It may be that intimidation is the desired effect from this obscene display....nothing more than a terrorist tactic, IMHO.

 

johnlucas

(1,250 posts)
89. Didn't that Reverend once talk about Chickens Coming Home to Roost?
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 02:33 PM
Aug 2014

What was his name?
Reverend Jeremiah Wright?
He said something else too I think.
"What you sew, you shall reap," I think it went.

I know of another famous saying not said by him.
You point out at somebody else, you got 4 fingers pointing back at you.
We keep looking out THERE for THEM, not recognizing that they keep looking back HERE at US.

What happens when Shock & Awe comes to a neighborhood near you?
John Lucas

niyad

(113,552 posts)
131. ward churchill got in trouble for that "chickens coming home to roost" comment as well.
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 10:01 PM
Aug 2014

"as ye SOW, . . . "

 

Plucketeer

(12,882 posts)
94. "I'd say he's part of a combat unit in Afghanistan"
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 02:51 PM
Aug 2014

He probably was - prior to this gig. Our military is a convenient training school for future police departments.

calimary

(81,459 posts)
105. Definitely. If you didn't know the setting of this photo, you'd very easily assume this was taken
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 03:19 PM
Aug 2014

somewhere in outer Afghanistan. RIDICULOUS that it's here in America. UNBELIEVABLY RIDICULOUS!!!!!

WuzYoungOnceToo

(17 posts)
146. Speaking strictly for myself, the "St. Louis County Police" arm patch would have been a clue...
Tue Aug 19, 2014, 05:29 PM
Aug 2014

...along with the non-camo shirt, non-mil helmet and the fact that the rifle configuration is completely different from anything fielded by the U.S. military. But maybe that's just me.

calimary

(81,459 posts)
150. Welcome to DU, WuzYoungOnceToo. I'm guessing you served in the military?
Tue Aug 19, 2014, 06:21 PM
Aug 2014

I have not done so, myself. And I would stop for a moment and thank you for your service.

But all I'd need to see is the camouflage pants (when did local police start wearing camouflage clothing? Only the local National Guard folks do, around my neighborhood. The police look and dress like regular police, not paramilitary individuals). Granted the shirt does not match, but the pants cover a lot more real estate on that fellow's body than a shirt does, particularly when the shirt would probably be at least partially obscured from someone's view on the ground - because of the rather ferocious-looking mounted death weapon he's sitting behind - and aiming outward (maybe in MY direction?). All else that I'd need to see is the heavy artillery, Army-like helmets (doesn't look like the well-marked/labeled helmets the motorcycle cops around here wear), and none of the officers I see around here, either police or fire, wear desert-colored Army boots. At a distance it might be difficult to spot the arm patch that says "Police" on it. Especially since, presented with that vision in front of me, I would not want to stare OR make eye contact. 'Fraid it'd be taken wrong by the guy sitting up there on that big-ass paramilitary vehicle behind that big-ass paramilitary mounted assault weapon. 'Fraid he'd think I was trying to incite something.

It's off-putting, threatening, menacing, and terrorizing, at least to me. I'd get myself ONE glance at that and just want to run like hell!!! And I'm a little ol' white lady in her early 60s.

But maybe that's just me.

WuzYoungOnceToo

(17 posts)
159. Here's the problem
Wed Aug 20, 2014, 04:31 PM
Aug 2014

- "All else that I'd need to see is the heavy artillery"

The only weapon in the photo is a rifle that appears to be chambered for the standard (and quite small/under-powered by rifle standards) .223/5.56 mm round. Admittedly, it's possible that the perspective of the photo is visually misleading and the rifle is actually based on the AR-10 platform and chambered for something like .308, but even so...calling something like that "heavy artillery" is an exercise in ill-informed hyperbole. Please don't take this as a personal insult, as it is not meant that way. But what your post illustrates is more your own lack of knowledge than any inherent problem with the hardware being used by the LEO in the photo. Just because you don't know what any of it is does not mean that your fears are justified, or that it is inherently inappropriate. Don't get me wrong, I'm as much an outspoken critic of police force militarization as anyone, especially the trend toward knee-jerk use of SWAT teams in no-knock raids and the like. But when I criticize these things I like to do it from a perspective of knowledge about the subject, not fears based on my own topical ignorance (with "ignorance" not meant as a pejorative, but simply it's defined meaning: a lack of knowledge about something).

The short version is that those who don't really know much about the particulars of things like combat gear (and yes, that's what weapons and/or protective equipment used by law enforcement is...even the old six-shooter revolvers and ballistic vests) are not going to be able to draw informed conclusions about the propriety of the selection of that gear. How it makes you or I "feel" when we see it has to take a back seat to more practical considerations concerning their efficacy and practicality.

I do agree that the wearing of camoflage designed for desert, woodland, et al environments in an urban setting is exceedingly silly, and that armored vehicles are, for most departments, a waste of taxpayer money. But they are sometimes useful.

- "And I would stop for a moment and thank you for your service."

I appreciate the sentiment, but I in fact never served in a military capacity either. But that's neither here nor there, as military service is not a prerequisite for the knowledge that I've referred to.

calimary

(81,459 posts)
168. Fair enough.
Wed Aug 20, 2014, 09:39 PM
Aug 2014

But I stand by my opinion. I don't want war toys on our city streets. It's just flatly inappropriate. I have been around enough kids to know that if you give them an exotic new toy, they're going to want to play with it. And they'll find any excuse to do so. In addition to that, the overkill - he wasn't the only officer so outfitted or equipped. I can only imagine facing a whole wall of them! And yes, it would be intimidating as all-get-out. I wish all I thought they were - was "exceedingly silly."

The sad thing here is - ordinarily, I do not fear the police. Why should I? This is America. I have two things in my favor - well, three these days. 1) I'm white. 2) I'm female. And 3) I'm now - um - older. I doubt anybody would feel threatened by looking at me. But seeing the police arrayed as that officer was - fills me with terror and dread. How easy would it be, with all that added and outlandish and over-the-top, militarized or military-issued - excuse me but I AM repeating it: "Heavy Artillery" - to inflame a situation out of control? One single plastic water bottle flying through the air the other night and a totally peaceful assembly went straight to hell.

I think those extremes are totally unwarranted. PARTICULARLY when you stir them into a cocktail of general and widespread distrust, a climate of "stand your ground" that has produced VERY bad results involving other white-versus-black confrontations in other communities (it adds up. It's cumulative. And it tends to be taken as a very distressing trend), continuing and exacerbated racial tensions, a local majority-white constabulary with a poor track record for dealing with a majority-African American community, local and state government as well as law enforcement that does not look like the community it is honor-bound to serve, and the fatal shooting of an unarmed black teen. I think it's just asking for trouble. I think it's looking for, and even planning on, trouble. In effect, there's mutual distrust. Going to and coming from both directions.

And I won't take offense despite two attempts above to delicately flirt with same.


WuzYoungOnceToo

(17 posts)
170. Well, I tried.
Thu Aug 21, 2014, 06:36 PM
Aug 2014

- I don't want war toys on our city streets."

This sort of childishly emotional comment, along with your insistence on reiterating a mischaracterization that was already shown to be grossly hyperbolic...

"excuse me but I AM repeating it: "Heavy Artillery""

...is a clear indication that you have no real interest in honest, substantive commentary. Oh, and tossing in the passive aggressive...

"And I won't take offense despite two attempts above to delicately flirt with same."

...was a nice touch too.

calimary

(81,459 posts)
174. Well, I tried, too.
Thu Aug 21, 2014, 08:03 PM
Aug 2014

And I am sorry to see that you can't seem to refute me without adding in some subtle but real insults.

calimary

(81,459 posts)
169. Found this item, and I thought of your comments.
Thu Aug 21, 2014, 03:37 PM
Aug 2014

Especially since I admittedly and quite literally do not have expertise on such matters. I never served and the only "combat" I've ever known was in the back seat of some young dude's car when I was in high school.

But I found this illuminating:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025424439

WuzYoungOnceToo

(17 posts)
171. What did you find "illuminating" about it?
Thu Aug 21, 2014, 06:39 PM
Aug 2014

It's just an opinion screed by another DUer who clearly doesn't know anything about the hardware being commented on (griping about semiautomatic sidearms when that's been the standard LEO weapon for decades is especially silly), and claiming (with no substantiation) that a bunch of military people agree with him/her.

calimary

(81,459 posts)
175. Well, evidently, that poster had military experience.
Thu Aug 21, 2014, 08:16 PM
Aug 2014

I thanked you for your service since your writing and explaining contained enough clues for me that you might be or might have been in the military. You responded that you weren't. So I think I'll take as credible the descriptions of someone in the armed forces (a former Marine - I guess that might qualify) describing the inappropriate and over-kill display of war toys and other accoutrements that a local municipal police officer was allowed to put on, sit on, sit behind, and grip in his hands. I would think a former Marine would recognize war toys when he (or she) saw them. Meanwhile, you still have yet to identify what expertise you bring to the table, and what therefore allows and enables you to make pronouncements about what constitutes war-toy displays and what doesn't constitute war-toy displays - except only to let me know that you did not serve (in response to my thanking you for your service).


A Former Marine Explains All the Weapons of War Being Used by Police in Ferguson

There is a growing chorus of military veterans who have chimed in on the absurdity of photographs like this one. Let me join the parade. What we’re seeing here is a gaggle of cops wearing more elite killing gear than your average squad leader leading a foot patrol through the most hostile sands or hills of Afghanistan. They are equipped with Kevlar helmets, assault-friendly gas masks, combat gloves and knee pads (all four of them), woodland Marine Pattern utility trousers, tactical body armor vests, about 120 to 180 rounds for each shooter, semiautomatic pistols attached to their thighs, disposable handcuff restraints hanging from their vests, close-quarter-battle receivers for their M4 carbine rifles and Advanced Combat Optical Gunsights. In other words, they’re itching for a fight. A big one. It’s a well-known horror that the US military greets foreign peoples in this fashion as our politicians preach freedom, democracy and peace. It’s an abomination that the police greet black communities in the States with the same trigger-happy posture. Especially on the occasion of an unarmed teen’s death by cop

Octafish

(55,745 posts)
2. No reason for good people to fear, citizen! The PD sniper is there to protect the protesters...
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 10:09 AM
Aug 2014

...who are undercover Secret Police, Secret DIA, Secret Army Intel, Secret ONI, Secret Service, Secret NSA, Secret CIA...



FBI Document—“(DELETED)” Plots To Kill Occupy Leaders “If Deemed Necessary”

By Dave Lindorff
June 27, 2013 WhoWhatWhy.org

Would you be shocked to learn that the FBI apparently knew that some organization, perhaps even a law enforcement agency or private security outfit, had contingency plans to assassinate peaceful protestors in a major American city — and did nothing to intervene?

Would you be surprised to learn that this intelligence comes not from a shadowy whistle-blower but from the FBI itself – specifically, from a document obtained from Houston FBI office last December, as part of a Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) request filed by the Washington, DC-based Partnership for Civil Justice Fund?

To repeat: this comes from the FBI itself. The question, then, is: What did the FBI do about it?

The Plot

Remember the Occupy Movement? The peaceful crowds that camped out in the center of a number of cities in the fall of 2011, calling for some recognition by local, state and federal authorities that our democratic system was out of whack, controlled by corporate interests, and in need of immediate repair?

That movement swept the US beginning in mid-September 2011. When, in early October, the movement came to Houston, Texas, law enforcement officials and the city’s banking and oil industry executives freaked out perhaps even more so than they did in some other cities. The push-back took the form of violent assaults by police on Occupy activists, federal and local surveillance of people seen as organizers, infiltration by police provocateurs—and, as crazy as it sounds, some kind of plot to assassinate the “leaders” of this non-violent and leaderless movement.

CONTINUED...

http://whowhatwhy.com/2013/06/27/fbi-document-deleted-plots-to-kill-occupy-leaders-if-deemed-necessary/



Secret Police. Secret Spying. Secret Laws. Secret Detentions. Secret Executions...I'd say "Be On the Look-Out" but that's getting too dramatic.

H2O Man

(73,605 posts)
33. I agree 100% !!!!
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 11:32 AM
Aug 2014

Octofish provides the DU community with the most important of information. That post is a great example of why he is our most important contributor.

Zorra

(27,670 posts)
96. Nothing we didn't know. That's why we were out in the streets, to make people
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 02:55 PM
Aug 2014

aware of what was really going on, and join us and help us rid the world of the 1% fascists and their hired killers.

That's what Occupy is all about.



As we gather together in solidarity to express a feeling of mass injustice, we must not lose sight of what brought us together. We write so that all people who feel wronged by the corporate forces of the world can know that we are your allies.

As one people, united, we acknowledge the reality: that the future of the human race requires the cooperation of its members; that our system must protect our rights, and upon corruption of that system, it is up to the individuals to protect their own rights, and those of their neighbors; that a democratic government derives its just power from the people, but corporations do not seek consent to extract wealth from the people and the Earth; and that no true democracy is attainable when the process is determined by economic power. We come to you at a time when corporations, which place profit over people, self-interest over justice, and oppression over equality, run our governments. We have peaceably assembled here, as is our right, to let these facts be known.

They have taken our houses through an illegal foreclosure process, despite not having the original mortgage.
They have taken bailouts from taxpayers with impunity, and continue to give Executives exorbitant bonuses.
They have perpetuated inequality and discrimination in the workplace based on age, the color of one’s skin, sex, gender identity and sexual orientation.
They have poisoned the food supply through negligence, and undermined the farming system through monopolization.
They have profited off of the torture, confinement, and cruel treatment of countless animals, and actively hide these practices.
They have continuously sought to strip employees of the right to negotiate for better pay and safer working conditions.
They have held students hostage with tens of thousands of dollars of debt on education, which is itself a human right.
They have consistently outsourced labor and used that outsourcing as leverage to cut workers’ healthcare and pay.
They have influenced the courts to achieve the same rights as people, with none of the culpability or responsibility.
They have spent millions of dollars on legal teams that look for ways to get them out of contracts in regards to health insurance.
They have sold our privacy as a commodity.
They have used the military and police force to prevent freedom of the press.
They have deliberately declined to recall faulty products endangering lives in pursuit of profit.
They determine economic policy, despite the catastrophic failures their policies have produced and continue to produce.
They have donated large sums of money to politicians, who are responsible for regulating them.
They continue to block alternate forms of energy to keep us dependent on oil.
They continue to block generic forms of medicine that could save people’s lives or provide relief in order to protect investments that have already turned a substantial profit.
They have purposely covered up oil spills, accidents, faulty bookkeeping, and inactive ingredients in pursuit of profit.
They purposefully keep people misinformed and fearful through their control of the media.
They have accepted private contracts to murder prisoners even when presented with serious doubts about their guilt.
They have perpetuated colonialism at home and abroad.
They have participated in the torture and murder of innocent civilians overseas.
They continue to create weapons of mass destruction in order to receive government contracts.*

To the people of the world,

We, the New York City General Assembly occupying Wall Street in Liberty Square, urge you to assert your power.

Exercise your right to peaceably assemble; occupy public space; create a process to address the problems we face, and generate solutions accessible to everyone.

To all communities that take action and form groups in the spirit of direct democracy, we offer support, documentation, and all of the resources at our disposal.

Join us and make your voices heard!

http://www.nycga.net/resources/documents/declaration/

dixiegrrrrl

(60,010 posts)
122. Which points again to the wisdom of Occupy
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 06:23 PM
Aug 2014

when they refused to identify as having any leaders.

Something to remember for the future.

tavalon

(27,985 posts)
136. That is why they still exist.
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 10:45 PM
Aug 2014

You can't kill a thousand headed hydra. Some parts of it have morphed into service groups, some remain in the protesting mode, many are just quiet, waiting for the right moment.

Occupy Ferguson.

 

VanGoghRocks

(621 posts)
4. Since laughter truly is the best medicine, please see this hilarious
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 10:17 AM
Aug 2014

sendup by DUer LTX of that figure here (excerpts below):

He has those mean-ass looking black gloves (because you never know when desert sand-storms, rain-forest downpours, snakes or scorpions are going to interfere with your trigger finger)
. . . .
You have to figure it took this guy the better part of two hours to put on this dumb-ass costume (which, of course, included the half-hour in front of the mirror striking poses and muttering "yippee-kai-yay mother-fucker&quot .

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025397873

exboyfil

(17,865 posts)
7. There is a photo of a protester
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 10:24 AM
Aug 2014

painted with a laser sight. In my opinion that is sufficient justification to fire that LEO immediately. Same with pointing vs. holding your weapon at safe port position when not engaged.

Quote from an article
However, the primary method of carrying weapons in the control force formation is at the safe-port position,” FM 3–19.15 states. “It is used whenever troops are in contact with a crowd that is showing resistance or not withdrawing.”

The safe-port position keeps the barrel aimed at the sky, with the firearm at an angle across the chest and the finger off the trigger. In practice, soldiers tend to aim the barrel down instead of up, but the effect is the same.

https://medium.com/war-is-boring/even-the-armys-crowd-control-rulebook-says-ferguson-police-tactics-are-dumb-541156b710f2

 

pintobean

(18,101 posts)
9. I haven't seen the photo
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 10:31 AM
Aug 2014

but I'm wondering how anyone would know it was a laser sight, and not a laser pointer.

My wife and I were shocked and pissed when we saw that sniper.

 

JTFrog

(14,274 posts)
15. Given the fact that there are pictures that show snipers decked out in military gear,
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 11:05 AM
Aug 2014

I guess one could convince themselves that there were just random laser pointers being flashed into the crowds.

Whatever helps them sleep at night.



 

JTFrog

(14,274 posts)
35. Indeed.
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 11:38 AM
Aug 2014

I'm having a hard time sleeping knowing that snipers are setting their sights on the citizens of Ferguson and those who came to support them.


 

pintobean

(18,101 posts)
43. I don't know that they actually
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 11:58 AM
Aug 2014

have set their sights on anyone or they just wanted it to look that way. Either way, it's disturbing.

Look. Frog, the fact that I don't jump to conclusions doesn't mean I'm not concerned. I live in the St. Louis area. I'm about 20 minutes away from this. I have family, friends, and acquaintances up there. I was working in Ferguson the week before the shooting. I care about the people there and I want peace for them. I also want justice in the shooting case.

 

JTFrog

(14,274 posts)
52. I hope the situation gets better soon.
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 12:06 PM
Aug 2014

And I hope you and yours stay safe. Be careful out there.

WuzYoungOnceToo

(17 posts)
147. Did the facts that you have no idea who actually pointed a laser at the protester...
Tue Aug 19, 2014, 05:37 PM
Aug 2014

...and that the cop in the photo doesn't even have a laser mounted on his rifle matter at all when you formulated your opinion? Or is your own ignorance of the facts all you really need to go on when calling for someone to lose their job?

exboyfil

(17,865 posts)
149. I am not talking about the picture of the sniper
Tue Aug 19, 2014, 06:16 PM
Aug 2014

in the post. I am talking about another picture.

If that is a LEO holding a laser site on the back of a protester, then yes I think that person should lose their job. Tell me if you think differently if it was your own son.

http://www.infowars.com/photos-ferguson-police-train-weapons-laser-sights-on-peaceful-protesters/

Of course if it was just a laser pointer, then I would feel a little differently. Still not a good idea to point a laser at someone though. If it is a rioter in the crowd trying to deceive, then I apologize. Any disciplinary action should follow an investigation.

WuzYoungOnceToo

(17 posts)
160. First off, my personal relation (or lack thereof)...
Wed Aug 20, 2014, 04:46 PM
Aug 2014

...to the protester in that photo would only be relevant if I were prone to thinking that public policy should revolve around my own emotional bias. But I'm not, so it isn't. Whether he's my son or not is absolutely immaterial to the question of whether or not a cop should be fired for illuminating the young man's back with a laser. That said...

InfoWars? Seriously? And that's not a case of shooting the messenger. All that's presented in that piece is a photo of someone with what appears to be a dot from a LED laser on his lower back. We don't know if it's been Photoshopped (normally I wouldn't even suggest that, but hey...InfoWars), but even if we accept it as legit, there's absolutely no evidence - save for the caption at the bottom of the photo) of the dot being from a weapon-mounted sighting laser, let alone a police one. Red laser pointers are a dime a dozen (OK, not literally...but they're cheap) and are routinely used by kids to light stuff up at night. In fact they've become a real problem for aircraft pilots.

So you'll forgive me if I don't just take Alex "FEMA death camps" Jones' word for it.

exboyfil

(17,865 posts)
161. Bloomberg a better source?
Wed Aug 20, 2014, 05:02 PM
Aug 2014
http://www.bloomberg.com/video/police-faulted-over-using-military-tactics-in-protests-~wizNU7RQcKEGl74dxj3wQ.html

The Guardian

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/13/missouri-police-shoot-man-city-teenager-killed

Businessweek (also part of Bloomberg)

http://www.businessweek.com/news/2014-08-14/police-faulted-over-use-of-military-tactics-in-ferguson


Actually considering the implications of something to your own family is a rational approach. It is called empathy. Even 2nd Amendment Rights people complain about having laser sites pointed at them by others at gun shows. No rational person should want a gun pointed at them. The Army Field Manual is even specific about not pointing your weapon at a non-violent protester.

WuzYoungOnceToo

(17 posts)
162. Not really, no.
Wed Aug 20, 2014, 05:30 PM
Aug 2014

Even ignoring the gratuitous use of sensationalist hyperbole in those pieces, none of them contain any visual evidence of any police pointing laser sights at anyone. Just unsubstantiated claims. Were there armed cops there in numbers? No doubt. Was someone illuminated by an LED laser? Quite possibly. Did one or more journalists see/hear about that and just jump to the conclusion that it must have been one of the cops pointing his/her weapon at protesters? Also quite possibly. Considering the now infamous "I believe these are rubber bullets" tweet about some foam ear plugs found by a HuffPo reporter, and the way that news agencies tend to blindly accept and repeat claims made by other news outlets I'd say that sort of knee-jerk assumption is quite probable.

Do I know which is the case? Of course not. But neither do you, and there's no compelling reason to conclude that the claims are legit.

- "Actually considering the implications of something to your own family is a rational approach. It is called empathy."

Fortunately I'm capable of also feeling empathy for people that I'm not directly related to. Aren't you? In any event, your empathy for a particular individual is still not a "rational" basis for determining whether or not someone should lose their job based on their actions.

 

alphafemale

(18,497 posts)
8. His casual posture is one of the most disturbing things.
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 10:29 AM
Aug 2014

He does't seem disturbed at all to scoping for citizens as targets.

Like he is looking to shoot rats at a landfill.

WuzYoungOnceToo

(17 posts)
163. Considering the fact that he's not even looking through the scope...
Wed Aug 20, 2014, 05:55 PM
Aug 2014

...characterizing him as "scoping for citizens as targets" is dishonest hyperbole. As for his relaxed demeanor, it bespeaks training and the expectation on his part that he won't need to actually take any deadly action. Would you prefer that he be nervous and jittery?

Island Deac

(104 posts)
10. The more of this CRAP
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 10:47 AM
Aug 2014

you wear and carry, the LESS of a man (human-being) you are. What a brave soul he is.

jalan48

(13,883 posts)
11. New World Order
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 10:48 AM
Aug 2014

This is it. George Bush Sr.'s New World Order. It's taken us awhile to get here but with the help of 9-11 we have achieved our goal.

 

NM_Birder

(1,591 posts)
13. The police have had snipers for a long,..... long time.
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 10:58 AM
Aug 2014

is it the helmet or the tripod that scares you ? Because none of this equipment is out of the ordinary.

You might be surprised to know how often police snipers are deployed when there is a large crowd of potentially violent people.
Riot gear is standard, when there is threat of a riot.

Nuh Uh

(47 posts)
21. Isn't that the problem?
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 11:13 AM
Aug 2014

That none of that equipment is out of the ordinary? That military upgrades were to protect against the illusion of drug cartels coming to America that never materialized? Riot gear may be standard, but camo clothing and desert boots were never made for police officers to engage civilians in an American city. That fellow sitting atop that van is more soldier than police officer and I suggest that is a problem all by itself.

 

NM_Birder

(1,591 posts)
27. camo clothing and desert boots ?
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 11:23 AM
Aug 2014

BTW, everyone else is ignoring it too, but 7 people were shot and killed in Chicago over the week-end, and better than twenty wounded.

H2O Man

(73,605 posts)
37. Add to that
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 11:39 AM
Aug 2014

the fact that an estimated 200 people jay-walked. No one talks about that shit. Or that last October, a 7th grade student failed to hand in his assignment on time. The media ignores that, too. Or in 1967, someone -- and I'm not pointing fingers -- ripped a "do not remove" tag off a mattress they bought (on credit).

What the fuck is this world coming to? Obviously, we need armed SWAT teams to just start picking off those people who have the potential to disrupt society, by not raising their hands before they ask questions. And I say kill anyone and everyone who raises their hands, too. We can't be too careful, in this day and age.

Thank you for your thoughtful and important contributions to this discussion.

 

NM_Birder

(1,591 posts)
41. ? nobody got "picked off"
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 11:53 AM
Aug 2014

there is threat of a riot, the police come out in riot gear. It's just that simple. Would you describe what happened as " threat of a riot" ?

No, thank you. The mattress tag comparison is what clarified your thought process for me, you convinced me alright, but not about what you think, but ..."how" you think.

I am waiting for the actual facts of what happened to Brown to come out, so far the "facts" of the case are changing every time a "news" report "proves" a new theory.




H2O Man

(73,605 posts)
46. Once again,
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 12:02 PM
Aug 2014

I agree with you 100%. Even more. Way more, in fact. And, if possible, even more than that.

We need to keep the streets of this nation safe. As the grape Ronald Reagan said after Kent State, "maybe a little bloodshed in the streets is what is needed." I feel safe in speculating that you agree with that 100%. Maybe more, in fact. And, if possible, even more than that.

hootinholler

(26,449 posts)
79. With all those wrinkles...
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 01:16 PM
Aug 2014

*I* thought Ronnie Raygun was a raisin, not a grape. But then again back in the days of Kent, maybe he was still a grape.

Thanks for the "Heard it through the grapevine" earworm.

 

HangOnKids

(4,291 posts)
108. Priceless!
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 03:28 PM
Aug 2014

This poster asked me if I was on the right site a few days ago, your post just makes me so happy!!!

H2O Man

(73,605 posts)
140. Yep.
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 11:05 PM
Aug 2014

I make mental notes of such things, even though I usually don't bother to respond at that moment. But, if I see someone being rude to you, I surely do remember and keep track of that for future opportunities.

(And how the heck are you these days? We haven't had the opportunity to talk as often as we used to, or that I'd like.)

A Simple Game

(9,214 posts)
42. Military dress and military attitude.
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 11:54 AM
Aug 2014

"Shoot them all and let god sort them out."

It just makes the job that much easier.

H2O Man

(73,605 posts)
54. I say, "Let's not
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 12:06 PM
Aug 2014

waste God's time in sorting them out."

We need law and order in this nation. Indeed, it was founded on the principle that you better keep your nose clean, or risk being shot in the street. This is the ONLY thing that can make it safe here in America -- and we don't want to risk being some country where thugs rule. Bloody christ, the next thing you know, teenagers might be jay walking with abstract intent. We can't have that.

 

NM_Birder

(1,591 posts)
57. How long you been waiting to say that ?
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 12:10 PM
Aug 2014

There were 7 people shot and killed and better than twenty wounded this past week-end in Chicago. Bet you didn't know that.

Like I said, threat of a riot, the police come out in riot gear. People rioting in the streets, police come out in riot gear.
Scary looking police sniper in camo pants, gunned down how many people "

Ikonoklast

(23,973 posts)
75. Favorite mis-direction meme of the right wing.
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 01:02 PM
Aug 2014

Gungeoneers favorite dodge here, too...lots of overlap in that Venn diagram.

frylock

(34,825 posts)
134. what is it that you're doing to bring awareness about gun violence in Chicago?
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 10:15 PM
Aug 2014

what possible solutions have you presented to people in the region that may work to curtail gun violence?

H2O Man

(73,605 posts)
139. Any time that
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 11:01 PM
Aug 2014

one person attempts to tell another person what they think, that person is always wrong. It's a weak position to take, and obviously -- like here -- one that cannot be justified in any manner whatsoever. It is so weak, that a junior high school student would fail any course in which they attempted to use it as a foundation point -- and rightly so.

I note that you resort to that failing tactic over and over.

A Simple Game

(9,214 posts)
113. If Chicago is in such dire need of policing, then why aren't the riot police in Chicago?
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 04:16 PM
Aug 2014

The scary sniper didn't shoot anyone this time, but do you still remember why the people are protesting? Someone did in fact get shot. I won't call it a riot because there is little doubt in my mind that it was induced by the police, police chief, and the Governor.

WuzYoungOnceToo

(17 posts)
164. Well, for starters...
Wed Aug 20, 2014, 06:01 PM
Aug 2014

I'm pretty sure the Ferguson, MO PD (and any other MO LEA for that matter) has no jurisdiction in Chicago.

- "I won't call it a riot because there is little doubt in my mind that it was induced by the police, police chief, and the Governor."

Your refusal to call it a riot, and your claims as to what induced it doesn't make any less a riot. How about the looting? The PD and Governor induced that too?

A Simple Game

(9,214 posts)
166. No jurisdiction? Then why would anyone bring up Chicago as a comparison?
Wed Aug 20, 2014, 06:32 PM
Aug 2014

And the size difference alone makes it a foolish comparison. I know, let's ask the person that brought it up! Oh, that would be you.

WuzYoungOnceToo

(17 posts)
172. Uh, no.
Thu Aug 21, 2014, 06:59 PM
Aug 2014

- "I know, let's ask the person that brought it up! Oh, that would be you."

No...it wouldn't be me. But let's look at the pseudonym of the poster who DID bring it up (the author of the "How long you been waiting to say that ?" post that you were responding to):

"NM_Birder"

Oops! That appears to be...NOT ME. Now, let's see who responded to that with a question about why the Ferguson, MO riot police aren't in Chicago:

"A Simple Game"

Oops again! That's YOU (AKA, "not me&quot .

RIF

A Simple Game

(9,214 posts)
173. My apologies, I usually don't pay attention to a posters name, I should start.
Thu Aug 21, 2014, 07:31 PM
Aug 2014

But in my defense I was responding to your first sentence:

I'm pretty sure the Ferguson, MO PD (and any other MO LEA for that matter) has no jurisdiction in Chicago.
You didn't start the meme but you were more than willing to continue it's use.

But as for the Ferguson riot police being in Chicago, neither NM_Birder nor I said anything about the Ferguson police being in Chicago that was first mentioned by you in the previously mentioned sentence. Thinking I meant the Ferguson police should go to Chicago is a bit of a stretch, as is comparing Ferguson to Chicago in the first place.

As for the "riot" well if you dress up for a fight and trash talk your "opponent" you aren't going to go home without getting what you want. On that subject I think we will just have to disagree.

tblue37

(65,487 posts)
77. But they WERE raising their hands in the air, the lot of them,
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 01:08 PM
Aug 2014

and shouting, right out loud, "Don't shoot!". Is it any wonder that the cops were ready to start shooting? (Do I need the sarcasm tag?)

fleabiscuit

(4,542 posts)
25. What a load.
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 11:20 AM
Aug 2014

A sniper is a highly trained combat marksman skilled in concealment and evading detection. You’re looking at a paid thug out to intimidate civilians by pointing a lethal weapon at them. The dismissiveness stinks.

 

elias49

(4,259 posts)
30. Yeah...here we go...nothing to see here folks..move along
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 11:28 AM
Aug 2014

standard tactic of a supporter.
Happens here all the time...

Response to NM_Birder (Reply #13)

 

NM_Birder

(1,591 posts)
45. No, the threat of a riot was caused by,
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 12:02 PM
Aug 2014

the people rioting in the streets. Is that what you meant by "critical thinking" ? LOL

freebrew

(1,917 posts)
110. The rioting started AFTER the SWAT teams were there.
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 03:36 PM
Aug 2014

Riot gear, dogs and rubber bullets. Then came the riots.

The police instigated the riots. Funny, they were already out and about because of a 911 call earlier that day.

The destruction and fires were very possibly from outsiders, not Ferguson citizens.
Or, maybe they were. At this point, I can't blame the citizens for rioting. What else can they do?

"Work within the system?" That always works out so well.

 

trumad

(41,692 posts)
95. Didn't say he gunned down anyone
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 02:54 PM
Aug 2014

But he sure was in the position to do so.

Can't find similar pictures now can you?

 

trumad

(41,692 posts)
115. Look...
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 04:28 PM
Aug 2014

You keep saying that Snipers like this guy are around in every situation like this. I asked you to prove it.

You have not been able to.

 

NM_Birder

(1,591 posts)
120. Thats not what I said, but your spin was pretty smooth,
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 05:45 PM
Aug 2014

I did not say snipers like this guy are around in every situation like this. I said police snipers have been around for a long long time. This was based on the OP's fear of what the police sniper looked like. Turns out it was the camo pants and desert boots that frightened the OP.

Look ......... if your understanding of the police is so limited, that you are unaware that the police have had long range snipers on the payroll for a long long time, then I doubt my posting of a picture is going to help much.

inaccurately representing information is the cause of most misunderstandings, just like the initial reports by 5 eyewitnesses, that Brown was shot in the back.

So take care, and keep believing that the police recently added snipers to the force, because NM_Birder didn't post you a picture.




 

trumad

(41,692 posts)
124. Yeah---for swat teams who use them in hostage situations.
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 06:45 PM
Aug 2014

These people were peacefully protesting while this guy sat on his Mine proof vehicle.

Of course you already know that.

 

NM_Birder

(1,591 posts)
128. let me know where the goal posts are going from here.
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 08:09 PM
Aug 2014

maybe you're a cop, who knows, maybe you do know more than me about when and how sniper teams are deployed. I doubt you are a cop, but who knows.

At least you can admit you already knew sniper teams have been a part of the police for a long long .... long time.

I'm not sure you're qualified to call this guy a sniper though, he does have a scope, but is that all it takes ?

You are speculating about him and his "mine proof" vehicle. that's how the fact of Brown being shot in the back started. Speculation. CSI Furgeson,... has been spitting out theories as fast as twitter can be updated, none of this is going to be of any value for the prosecution. "eyewitnesses", giving bogus testimony on camera, won't help anymore than online speculation.




 

NM_Birder

(1,591 posts)
133. The speculation thing has gotten out of hand.
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 10:04 PM
Aug 2014

we agree it's a cop, ...... we might agree sniper teams are a part of the deployment process in certain situations.

we will never agree on the frequency that sniper teams mow down the citizenry
we will never agree on our opinions of the police.

Furgeson 2014: NM_Birders speculation for future events.
in a few days, the speculation will subside when some actual facts are presented. Then the outrage over events not following the speculated trajectory will begin. Followed by a massive misunderstanding of the law, and finally concluding that this incident was a conspiracy to allow a white cop to execute a black youth in broad daylight.

This cop, photographed in Furgeson or not, is not to blame for the shooting, the looting or the gross misinformation being splattered around.

Cop shot an 18yo kid, 18yo kid is dead, 18yo kid not shot in back. those are the only facts neither of us can speculate on. take care.





blackspade

(10,056 posts)
17. Nothing but fear and intimidation.
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 11:07 AM
Aug 2014

Otherwise there is no other reason to wear camo (not even urban), sit on top of a vehicle (out in the open), and pointing a weapon at protesters.

What a total dickbag.

 

Boreal

(725 posts)
111. That dickbag thinks he's a soldier
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 03:53 PM
Aug 2014

Because the Posse Comitatus Act prevented military from being used against US citizens, the federal government simply went around it and militarized local LE. With the creation of Homeland Security it even got worse and additional work-arounds were created (for instance the Coast Guard was put under DHS). The federal government is pouring grant money, training and military equipment into local LE depts and they are brainwashing the likes of officer Dickbag. Who was once just some loser bully who became a cop is now a Marine (so he imagines himself) and all of us (black, white, hispanic, doesn't matter, left, right, apathetic, doesn't matter) are the enemy. In Dickbag's head, he's in some virtual reality where he's in Iraq and we're insurgents. In a few days "training", DHS has these assholes all pumped up and feeling badass but with a siege mentality of us against them.

Something else I've been noticing for quite a while now, and that MO State Police dude used the term last night, is cops calling us "civilians", indicating that they aren't. Well, domestic LE ARE civilians. We have (or are supposed to have) civilian LE in this country. Military are not civil LE. So this is more proof of how these knuckle dragger cops have been brainwashed by the feds and it's a serious problem. Keep your ears open for them calling us civilians and you'll be shocked how often they speak like that. Oh, btw, such language also conditions the uneducated public into buying that we are civilians and the cops are not.

lame54

(35,321 posts)
26. What's wrong with having a C student high school bully dressed and armed like that?...
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 11:21 AM
Aug 2014

What could go wrong?

 

packman

(16,296 posts)
28. Curious about the gun --
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 11:23 AM
Aug 2014

[URL=.html][IMG][/IMG][/URL]


1. What is those two projections under the barrel for?
2. What is that split thing on the end of the barrel?
3. What is the blue lense/green lense thing clipped on top?
4. I know it's a scope, but anything "special" about it?

This guy should, out of sense of decency , refused to arm himself like that. If he was "following orders" (Nuremberg Defense) , his commander should be fired.

janlyn

(735 posts)
40. I think,
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 11:53 AM
Aug 2014

#1 is supports for when sniper is in a prone position
#2 not sure but, I would think it might hide the telltale muzzle flash that can make said sniper a target.
#3 looks like a laser guide.
#4 very expensive, and has all the bells and whistles.

My ex was a gun nut so some of that is pretty familiar. I myself do not own a firearm.

Recursion

(56,582 posts)
56. In order:
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 12:08 PM
Aug 2014

1. A fold-down bipod for if he lies prone
2. A flash suppressor so he doesn't blind himself
3. A flashlight
4. Looks "stock" to me

Plenty of police units issue M-16's for riot situations; the bells and whistles on this one don't make it particularly more deadly. But I don't like police having rifles, in general, personally.

SQUEE

(1,315 posts)
58. actually #3 is most likely 2 things
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 12:20 PM
Aug 2014

correct it is a flashlight, but it is also a back up holo sight monted on a 45 degree mount, on the other side of the handguard... in case he has to use the weapon in short order on a closer threat and has no time to transition to a back up weapon...

To be honest it is a stupid set up for an LEO, looks like he he dragged that thing through a tactical catalog.

Recursion

(56,582 posts)
61. All it lacks is a cupholder
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 12:23 PM
Aug 2014

I could never aim an AR with all the fancy crap bolted to it, but some people seem to like it.

 

Spitfire of ATJ

(32,723 posts)
85. "looks like he he dragged that thing through a tactical catalog. "
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 02:09 PM
Aug 2014

Best description ever.

I pictured this stuff arriving FREE repacked like new and a bunch of Guns and Ammo guys with badges acting like kids on Christmas morning.

 

Rex

(65,616 posts)
153. I don't mind then having rifles, just not military assault rifles.
Tue Aug 19, 2014, 07:00 PM
Aug 2014

I can't imagine a cop needing a Ma Deuce for crowd control.

Recursion

(56,582 posts)
154. You'd rather they have a more powerful hunting rifle?
Tue Aug 19, 2014, 07:32 PM
Aug 2014

If they have to have one a low caliber rifle seems best, no?

 

Rex

(65,616 posts)
156. I won't deny there might be a need for a sniper or two.
Tue Aug 19, 2014, 08:03 PM
Aug 2014

In some situation. Just don't think they need M-16A2s or an M-249.

 

OldRedneck

(1,397 posts)
99. Answers about the gun
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 02:57 PM
Aug 2014

1. The two things sticking forward under the barrel are the legs of a BIPOD, folded up. The rifle is on a tripod for stability. If the shooter is in a position where he doesn't have or can't use a tripod, he uses a bipod -- two legs -- flip the bipod down and you have two short legs on which to rest the rifle for stability.

2. The split thing on the end of the barrel is a FLASH SUPPRESSOR. When a firearm is fired, some of the burning powder shoots out of the barrel, making a flash. If you're in a gunfight, you don't want the people you are shooting at to see the muzzle flash because the muzzle flash gives away your position. The flash suppressor does what it's name says -- suppresses the flash so it's not so bright.

3. A LASER DESIGNATOR. This thing fires a laser beam that is sighted in to match the flight of the bullet. The shooter presses a button near the trigger that turns on the laser designator. The shooter then aims the rifle by putting the dot made by the laser on the target and pulling the trigger.

4. It appears to be a Leupold scope. Not certain of the model. Leupold makes a range of optical devices including binoculars, spotting scopes, and sights for rifles, pistols, and crossbows (yes, crossbows). http://www.leupold.com/ The Leupold scopes range in price from "affordable" at around $300 to well over $2,000 -- http://www.opticsplanet.com/leupold-rifle-scopes.html?gclid=CMKA9eu-ncACFSpo7AodYWcATg

NickB79

(19,258 posts)
109. 3 is not a laser designator, it is a reflex sight
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 03:35 PM
Aug 2014

It doesn't project a laser, it is simply a holographic sight. The idea is that, if you're too close to use your high-power scope (inside buildings), you rotate the rifle a bit to the side and aim using the red dot sight for close combat.

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/1548412795/burris-fastfire-iii-reflex-red-dot-sight-with-picatinny-mount-matte?cm_vc=PopCat

 

pintobean

(18,101 posts)
47. The man in blue
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 12:03 PM
Aug 2014

is a friend to you.

We always assumed that that's why St. Louis County wears brown - don't be confused.

 

JEB

(4,748 posts)
36. Even the flag patch is camo, but his white skin shines out bright and clear.
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 11:38 AM
Aug 2014

Last edited Mon Aug 18, 2014, 12:49 PM - Edit history (1)

 

JEB

(4,748 posts)
106. Proof the cops need more money.
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 03:20 PM
Aug 2014

Cut their budget by at least 50% and give the savings to the local Public Schools.

markpkessinger

(8,401 posts)
142. Camouflage while patrolling the streets of suburban St. Louis . . .
Tue Aug 19, 2014, 04:38 AM
Aug 2014

The sheer absurdity of it is just . . . I have no words for it.

janlyn

(735 posts)
38. Yeah, pretty intimidating!
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 11:45 AM
Aug 2014

But the one of an officer with his finger on the trigger and his eye to his scope, made the hair stand up on my body!!

 

Hoppy

(3,595 posts)
39. He must have skin irritation from the constant hard-on he gets when he puts that stuff on.
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 11:49 AM
Aug 2014

To me, nothin' worse for me than when "Old Faithful" rubs against the hard canvas of field gear.

SoapBox

(18,791 posts)
48. I was thinking the same thing...
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 12:05 PM
Aug 2014

We were told the same years ago, about the "thrill" of the uniform, the weapons and POWER that (wacky) cops have, was a real "stimulant".

And that was before all this Stormtrooper, goose-stepping bullshit even started.

freshwest

(53,661 posts)
80. Men literally get *aroused* by guns? Thought it was a joke. Imminent death should be a turn off.
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 01:34 PM
Aug 2014

IDK how why that could happen, no sex in sight. I've always thought it was a double entendre on phallic objects. It'd be a distraction in combat, impractical and not leading to sexual release in a tense situation.

Seeing your and Hoppy's response, I'm wondering it it's true, but don't think it's a useful response, more like embarrassing. I'm not the proud owner of a penis, so I'll never know all about them.

I'm asking an honest, if weird question because this seems to be a joke, and not a real thing. I've worked with a lot of men who have been in wars, and they never told me about that, even if they were very enthused to tell me about their service.

FFS, I know I shouldn't be asking this here, but I really want to know what drives hyper aggressive types as we're discussing. Sexual fulfillment would seem to be far down on the list of priorities.

Maybe the human race really is that crazy. If so, there's little hope for us.

 

johnlucas

(1,250 posts)
92. Didn't the hippies tell us to Make Love Not War?
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 02:44 PM
Aug 2014

If I want a hard-on, I look at women!
And I use my natural hard-on not a steel gun-powdered substitute!
The "bullets" that come out of the "natural gun" help to create life.
The bullets from these steel monstrosities only destroy it.

The King told Paul McCartney "I'm a lover not a fighter" in that song "The Girl Is Mine".
The King's sister caused an uproar when she accidentally showed a titty at the Super Bowl, you remember.
WOW! Lock up the kiddies! They'll be traumatized!
The beauty & splendor of the female breast terrifies people but the insanity & horror of the metal firearm is something to snuggle up to???

The hippies told us way back when to MAKE LOVE NOT WAR.
When you worship war these are your results.
Men getting hard-ons from steel pieces than female breastseses.

Something's very wrong with that if you ask me.
Time to turn things back to Right Side Up before this goes any further.
John Lucas

freshwest

(53,661 posts)
97. The voice of sanity. Thanks, johnlucas. We need more of it, and
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 02:56 PM
Aug 2014

Last edited Mon Aug 18, 2014, 03:32 PM - Edit history (1)

I want to hear what Sergeant Shamar Thomas has to say (video heavy):

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025404315#post87

This man is a leader with a lot of experience in life.

And what you said was poetry.

rock

(13,218 posts)
44. I've tried to sell my concept for the "open carry" uniform for cops
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 11:59 AM
Aug 2014

But it doesn't seem to be catching on.

"Open Carry" dress code for cops:
1) take away their uniform (they must go around in underwear);
2) take away their guns and ammo belt;
3) take away a shoe from one foot; the other foot must wear a swim flipper;
4) require that they carry a bucket of piss which is full and must be accounted for at the end of the shift (this is where the name "open carry" comes from);
5) wear a red, round rubber nose;
6) must have their billy club inserted into their ass when on duty (with no more than the handle showing);
7) Must shave their head and have a bathroom plunger struck to it;
8) No sunglasses allowed!

Note that they can still hand out tickets and give lawful orders. But this should make them a lot less intimidating and provide lots of entertainment for the kids!

samsingh

(17,601 posts)
55. escalation of weapons as the public acquires more of them
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 12:08 PM
Aug 2014

it's an arms race within one country

how long before the public, especially the minorities, decide to raise their arms capability?

 

talkguy365

(47 posts)
60. Keep our police local.
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 12:23 PM
Aug 2014

There is no justifiable reason the Pentagon is arming our local departments as if they're fighting in Afghanistan.

Cleita

(75,480 posts)
67. You should be scared.
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 12:32 PM
Aug 2014

We used to criticize totalitarian, dictatorship regimes for doing this, like China.

freshwest

(53,661 posts)
87. I want to hear what Sergeant Shamar Thomas has to say (video heavy):
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 02:12 PM
Aug 2014

Last edited Mon Aug 18, 2014, 03:03 PM - Edit history (1)



Media should ask his solutions, not trot out the troublemakers like a former convicted NYC commissioner. The sergeant has a higher calling than the shills.

Sorry for source, but Thomas understood the police and was able to make them think:



The sergeant describes how Iraqi activists were treated better, even if they pelted soldiers. It's likely the reason the guy was employed to do his sniper gig in the OP:



More from his interview with Keith Olbermann:



This man has integrity and credibility. His is one of the voices we need. Police need to hear him.

 

Politicalboi

(15,189 posts)
104. The more guns we have as citizens
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 03:12 PM
Aug 2014

The more cops will need these things. Who would be a cop if you didn't have better armory than citizens. Bad enough armor piercing bullets are legally sold. The more we're armed, the more they're armed. Thanks gun nuts.

ForgoTheConsequence

(4,869 posts)
107. Bullshit.
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 03:27 PM
Aug 2014

Most of these protestors are unarmed. During the Bundy Ranch fiasco nearly every right wing nut was armed and the police didn't have a response anywhere near this. He'll there were protestors pointing guns at police. But they were white.....

 

jtuck004

(15,882 posts)
117. Their bosses, the people who offer us life on their plantation, and kill more people...are scarier.
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 04:43 PM
Aug 2014
 
119. This is a chilling depiction of the militarization of our police force in general.
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 04:57 PM
Aug 2014

These are some scary times we are living in.

Unknown Beatle

(2,672 posts)
121. It is scary
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 05:47 PM
Aug 2014

but it sure as hell pisses me off big time that WE allowed this to happen. I was in my share of protests in the early 70's. I was kicked out of Albuquerque in June 71 riots for not living there because they said I was an outside agitator. Well, anyway, I'm not getting into it because this post is about the Clint Eastwood wannabe with rifle who's just following orders atop a military vehicle.

KauaiK

(544 posts)
132. Dressing up Halloween or play soldier
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 10:03 PM
Aug 2014

The gloves are dead give-away....look like they have never been worn.

Generic Brad

(14,275 posts)
138. When your citizens are treated like your enemy....
Mon Aug 18, 2014, 10:51 PM
Aug 2014

...then who exactly do you think you're protecting?

This shit has got to stop.

Javaman

(62,534 posts)
143. Hey, but don't worry...
Tue Aug 19, 2014, 08:44 AM
Aug 2014

it doesn't violate posse comitatus at all!!

so it's alllllllllllllllllll good.

Glassunion

(10,201 posts)
155. Why?
Tue Aug 19, 2014, 07:44 PM
Aug 2014

The safety is on...

And that makes it safe. He must be a safety officer, there for the well being of all.

madinmaryland

(64,933 posts)
167. So apparently we are now sending American Po-licemen over to Iraq and Afghanistan to kill
Wed Aug 20, 2014, 08:21 PM
Aug 2014

more people of non-"Northern European" background.

Wait, what????

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