The Ebola patient and denial -

[hedgehog]

I have a chronic autoimmune disease and I can tell you, it's easier to beat yourself up for being lazy and unorganized than it is to sit back and acknowledge that you have limitations because you are ill. I have also seen people seriously ill with acute symptoms, denying to themselves that anything is wrong. I have seen people put off going to a doctor, waiting for the symptoms to go away on their own.

The Ebola patient did not tell the ER staff he thought he had Ebola because he was hoping that they would find something else wrong. The best news he ever had was that it was only the flu.

[Anansi1171]

1. Hes only human, and given he sought medical attention and...

...was not in a position at that point to make good decisions, ill as he was, it's only natural for the Texas establishment to blame this man and hold him accountable while defending the system that failed.

sure he has a measure of responsibility, even a great measure. But how Texas Health Presbyterian can be absolved and lie and rescinding that lie while the world sleeps is sadly predictable.

[seveneyes]

2. The road to ruin is paved with inattention

He lied to get here and endangered his family and more.

[treestar]

3. I agree

the mind is an amazing thing.

And in our culture we had years of "if you believe, you can make it so," sort of thinking.

[JayhawkSD]

4. It's not up to the patient to tell medical professionals what he thinks he has.

My father was a physician, and when a regular patient who he knew well would say "I think I have susc and such" my dad would ask him where he went to medical school.

It is the responsibility of medical professionals to determine the nature of the patient's problem from symptoms presented and from facts available to them, and he did tell them he had been in Liberia. I know it is always fun to blame the victim, but don't go there. The error at the hosital was not his, it was the hospital staff.

He did the wrong thing when leaving Liberia when he told the authorities he had not been in contact with any persons sick with Ebola.

[seabeyond]

6. it is not up to the patient to give relevant factual info in his care? really? all doctoring

must be thru hunting pecking and puzzle work?

that is crap.

bullshit

you give doctors ALL the relevant info.

telling doctors he was around a woman that died of ebola ten days prior is relevant and HIS responsibility to provide that info. derelict he did not

[JayhawkSD]

7. I did not say that, and you know it.

I said it is not up the the patient to say, "I think I have Ebola."

It is up to the patient to answer questions asked by doctors, but not to provide informatyion that is not asked. He does not know what is relevant. That he was in contact with a sick woman is certainly relevant, but it was the responsibility of the health care worker to ask if such contact had happened. He was asked if he had been in Liberia and he answered, "Yes."

Yes, absolutley, doctoring is done through "hunting, pecking and puzzle work." That is exactly how it is done. By asking questions, examining the patient, finding clues and putting those clues togetrher because the doctor knows what clues to look for and the patient does not.

The doctor does not, in fact, want the patient spouting a long list of information, most of which will be irrelevant. He does not want to know, for instance, that your bowel movement was oddly colored last Tuesday, or that it was "a little bit loose" on Thursday when he is examining you for trouble breathing. He knows what he needs to know and he will ask you for the information he needs.

[seabeyond]

8. "I said it is not up the the patient to say, "I think I have Ebola." and i call BULLSHIT again.

you did say it. you said... just this, twice. YES. it is a patients JOB responsibility obligation to say.... i was with a woman who died of ebola TEN fuckin days ago

[uppityperson]

14. He was told she had pregnancy related issues, not ebola.

[seabeyond]

17. that was one story from family. he drove with the family to the hospital with ebola ward.

they carried her body in to put her in an ebola ward. he watched her die later in the night cause the EBOLA WARD was too full.

[uppityperson]

18. I didn't know you were there with them, hope you stay healthy.

[seabeyond]

19. wow. i have watched this story shift, but wow. this is what we reduce it to.

[uppityperson]

20. You seem to have knowledge the rest of us don't. Excuse me for assuming you actually did.

I do hope you stay healthy, get a flu shot as it is starting to make the rounds.

[seabeyond]

22. the info is out there. it has been on plenty of thread. on phone now...

later i will ink it up. first story. and consistently told

[uppityperson]

23. The pg woman's family said they told everyone she was miscarrying

Until facts come out showing otherwise, that is all that is known.

My apologies for the snark, it's been a long few days and my patience wanes.

[seabeyond]

5. i am sure that is the case. tell the liberia. then off the hook. giving info. do NOT

tell them you were with a woman that died of ebola ten days prior, cause they might look too closely.

flu? antibiotics? cool. whoooosh.

yes. i am sure that is it. none the less. he had the info and did not provide it to the medical staff, at EVERY turn.

[gvstn]

9. Everyone days he had the info.

Whom in Liberia did an autopsy on the woman who died and gave the guy the results stating that she died of Ebola?

Remember people in that area are far more likely to get Malaria than Ebola. Someone with flu symptoms in Liberia is still more likely to be sick with Malaria than Ebola. Unless the guy was definitively told that the woman had died of Ebola he had no way of knowing. He would be stating a guess as a fact.

Remember the missionary woman who had Ebola and was given treatment in the U.S. thought she had Malaria even though she was working in a clinic treating Ebola patients. How is some layman supposed to know better than someone working in an Ebola clinic?

[seabeyond]

10. they knew it was ebola. they took her to a hospital that treats ebola, and ask to put her there.

they were denied because the ebola section was too full and could not take her.

they specifically went to the ebola ward and were turned down

they took her home, and hours later she died

he KNEW

[gvstn]

13. He did not KNOW.

He suspected. When filling out a legal form you are supposed to state what you know not what you think. Unless he saw a test result for that woman with a positive result for Ebola he did not know she had Ebola. It really is that simple.

[seabeyond]

16. i am talking, talking to a doctor when treated. and ya. you do not need a death certificate

to tell a doctor you were with a woman, ten days prior that died of ebola

[Barack_America]

11. The pregnant woman's family told the cab driver she was miscarrying.

Why assume they told Mr. Duncan anything different about the seizing pregnant woman?

Pregnancy is a very dangerous condition in many places of the world, particularly in a place like Liberia, where there is one maternity ward for 4 million people. One of the most dangerous conditions a pregnant woman can experience is eclampsia, which results in seizures and, if untreated, death.

[magical thyme]

21. maybe so the cab driver wouldn't drive off?

Witnesses say Duncan had been helping Ebola patients in Liberia. Liberian community leader Tugbeh Chieh Tugbeh said Duncan was caring for an Ebola-infected patient at a residence in Paynesville City, just outside Monrovia.

The New York Times reported Thursday that Duncan had direct contact with a pregnant woman stricken with Ebola on September 15, days before he left for the United States. Citing the woman's parents and Duncan's neighbors in Monrovia, Liberia, the newspaper said Duncan had helped carry the ailing woman home after a hospital turned her away because there wasn't enough space in its Ebola treatment ward.

http://www.cnn.com/2014/10/01/health/us-ebola-patient/index.html

[hedgehog]

12. I have no idea where he got the money to purchase his air tickets,

but I have to believe that money represented a lot of work and/or a heavy debt burden. He may have felt that he had to get on that plane or lose everything he'd ever worked for.

If he chose to run to the US for treatment, why didn't he sit down in Dulles Airport and announce that he had Ebola? no one would have put him back on a plane to Liberia. The same applies to his first visit to the ER. If he'd known for certain that he had the virus, he also know that his best chances lay in getting immediate treatment. By that time, there was no reason to conceal his illness or his exposure.

[louis-t]

15. I once had a bowling team partner that had a stroke while bowling.

He insisted on finishing 3 games at 100 pins below his average in each game. He attributed his weakness on his right side to 'hurting his back while shoveling snow.'