"Thank you for your service."

[Stinky The Clown]

Today is Veteran's Day. In its current form, it is to honor those who served in the military. I am four square in support of the day and the intent.

One thing that occurs to me - as a veteran and as a citizen - is the now common refrain of "Thank you for your service." It has become, for me, like nails on a blackboard. To be sure, when said with sincerity, it is appreciated. "You're welcome" goes through my mind. But the phrase is fast becoming a cliche. I hear it said so often and with such insincerity that it is little more than a throwaway gesture, much like "Have a nice day" said by someone who couldn't give a shit less about your day.

The phrase started as an attempt to overcompensate for the way returning Viet Nam vets were treated. (The idea that they were spat upon is myth - look it up.) That's a good reason to use the term freely. But it seems to carry increasingly less meaning with its increasingly more common use.

All of that is a shame because, on this day, I really do want to say, to those who earned it, "Thank you for your service."

[hootinholler]

1. Always good to hear from you

Have a kick.

[GeorgeGist]

2. My service was compulsory, like Nazi Germany.

Fuck those whose war I fought.

[Whiskeytide]

3. My dad - WWII vet - taught me...

... that we must respect and honor our soldiers. But he made it plain that this sentiment does not necessarily mean we have to honor and respect the system and the leaders of that system. Love the soldier, challenge the politicians and the MIC.

He hated war. He was not happy we were in Nam. But he was proud to have served, and I was proud of him. I try to extend that respect to all vets to honor his memory.

[HereSince1628]

4. It's sort of like "Gesundheit", more a polite response

Last edited Tue Nov 11, 2014, 12:14 PM - Edit history (1)

which many people say, but few remember as a wish for health.

It's strange to be thanked for service by strangers ignorant of that service who perceive it as a fabled stereotype.

For me I encounter it most often through the V.A. because "and thank-you for your service" has become the standard telephonic sign-off for the VA hospital/clinics. It simply replaces "Good-bye"

[librarylu]

5. Not a myth

My late ex was spat upon at Sea-Tac. I'm not saying all returning vets were spat upon but that one was, assuming he wasn't lying. A group of protesters was "welcoming" the guys home. I was protesting at a time when he was being shot at but the marchers I saw were all well-behaved.

[BubbaFett]

6. did they call him a baby killer too?

or are you just remembering Rambo First Blood as real life?

The spitting on soldiers/baby killer myth is a reagan-era creation meant to discredit whatever was left of any left-wing liberation ideology movement and to besmirch the memory of 60s protestors.

[LP2K12]

7. It happened...

Just not as often or to the extent that the pro-war establishment says it did. My father was never spit on, but does recall being called a baby killer. He's also very open about that type of treatment not being the normal. I also have a very liberal teacher from high school that I am friends with who claims he was spit on. Again, only once and while in uniform arriving back to the states.

These are two men who have never embellished their service or war stories, so I tend to believe them.

[GGJohn]

8. It happened more often than you think,

I was home on leave at a party and was called all sorts of vile names and forced to leave under the threat of violence, so don't tell me that it was a Rambo First Blood fantasy.

[librarylu]

9. They probably did.

I can't ask him. I found out recently he's dead. I know he had late onset full-blown PTSD. He told me a lot that had nothing to do with Reagan era anything.

I'm surprised there wasn't a civil war over Viet Nam. Emotions ran high. I was once accused of burning my draft card. My accuser apparently didn't notice I'm female and didn't have a draft card.

I've never seen the movie and I don't think I like your attitude. I was a 60's protester (although a mild one). Were you?

[pinboy3niner]

10. I was called 'Baby-killer' on my first pass from the hospital treating me for my wounds

I was hospitalized for 18 months before being retired from the Army for disability.

Passions were high, and there were people in the antiwar movement who abused Vietnam vets at the same time that the movement was welcoming antiwar vets into their ranks and allying with VVAW (Vietnam Veterans Against the War, organized by disabled VN vet Bobby Muller).

People who weren't there get rabid about crying 'myth!' based on a book that labeled spitting reports as false. When I read the book many years ago, I was struck by how dishonest it was.

The context at that time was that the Right was trying to smear the Left and the antiwar movement as anti-VN veterans. So a Leftist VN vet college prof wrote a book to purify the movement and defend it against those attacks. The resulting work was highly disingenuous, but ended up being cited as gospel by many on lthe left and even here who accepted it unquestioningly.

It's been a long time, but I still remember the author's bogus claim that because troops returned from Vietnam to military base airports where protesters had no access, the claims of spitting at airports couldn't possibly be true.

But anyone who served at that time knew that after troops landed at places like Travis AFB in California, they were processed and then released. And they were bussed to San Francisco to catch flights home from civilian airports like San Francisco International. Those staying in the service had orders for their next duty assignment and were going home on post-deployment leave before reporting, and those whose term of service in the military had expired were just heading home as civilians. From CIVILIAN airports, not military. Civilian airports where there were many protests targeting returning troops.

I think the whole notion that the antiwar nmovement must be proved to be perfectly pure and always righteous is ridiculous. As with any movement--Occupy or Ferguson or anything else--it's not like yoiu submit an application and get vetted and get training and a membership card. The movement is those who show up, and not all will behave perfectly.

Shit, I was on the receiving end of the slurs and I get it. And those names really hurt. Not so much for me...I was thinking of the guys in my platoon back in Vietnam and the meatgrinder they were going through. I didn't know who or how many would make it back alive, and that's what made those names hurled at returning troops really hurt.

But I cannot for the life of me see how recognizing the reality of what actually happened to us, including bad treatment by the movement in some cases invalidates the antiwar movement in any way.

[BubbaFett]

11. When I think back

on my father, uncles, and their friends who fought in Vietnam - they were all tough, burly guys who wore hard hats, operated machinery, did construction, and were union tradesmen as civilians.

I sincerely doubt even the most macho hippie would have gotten away with saying anything negative to them, let alone spitting on them and not ending up in traction.

Of those men who had a hand in raising me, they were mostly all combat veterans from either WW2, Korea, or Vietnam, they took no shit.

YMMV, but in the industrial/trades milieu where I came up, men expressed themselves very often with their fists.

Especially 40+ years ago when cops didn't arrest you for every little thing.

2nd edit: the biggest Friday/Saturday night fights that busted out around the card table in the basement were when the WW2 guys started questioning the toughness of the Vietnam guys and their "generation" and the fact that some of the WW2 guys thought the Vietnam guys didn't have as much "heart" as the WW2 guys did.

Again, YMMV.

[GGJohn]

13. So what.

That doesn't mean it didn't happen, it just didn't happen to your relatives.

[BubbaFett]

14. Did it happen to you?

Or anyone you know?

Why did they let it happen and not DO anything about it?

[GGJohn]

15. Yeah, it happened to me,

I was home on leave from Vietnam and at a party, when the partygoers found out I was in the Army, I was called all kinds of vile names, including baby killer, and forced to leave under the threat of violence.

I didn't do anything about it because I was badly outnumbered and took the prudent course of leaving.

Like I said, just because it didn't happen to your relatives doesn't mean it didn't happen.

[BubbaFett]

16. So what part of your training

let you put yourself in harm's way as a civilian, but kept your tail alive on the battlefield?

Shit, I'm just a veteran of the internets, and I know better to ride alone to someplace where I don't know anyone.

[GGJohn]

17. Put myself in harm's way as a civilian?

I wasn't a civilian while on leave, I was a soldier on leave, still in the Army, so I have no idea what you're talking about.

What kept me alive in my 2 tours was my instincts, my fellow soldiers, and good Lt's.

[BubbaFett]

18. I guess those instincts weren't very effective

at a party.

Okey dokey.

[GGJohn]

19. I was home on leave, not on the battlefield,

I didn't expect the hostile reception I received from my fellow Americans.
But the spitting and name calling did happen and I don't give a good god damn what some idiot who wrote a book says, so it's not some Rambo fantasy as you seem to think it is.

[librarylu]

21. Do what?

There were MPs at Sea-Tac doing spot checks for drug smuggling. Were the spat-upon supposed to start a riot at the airport? IIRC, the soldiers just took it and kept moving.

Here's another spitting at an airport story (I looked it up):

"Dick Baker, a former Marine and Vietnam veteran, can sympathize. When he stepped off the plane at Los Angeles International Airport in 1968, a protester spat on him."

http://lubbockonline.com/local-news/2014-05-24/ignored-refused-service-and-spat-lubbock-vietnam-vets-talk-us-welcome-home#.VGInbfnF83U

Some of the SDS types got pretty extreme. So did the Hawks, of course.

[GGJohn]

12. Great post.

Welcome Home Brother.

[librarylu]

20. Thank you

WWll vets came home on troop ships where they could talk about their experiences with others. They were greeted with ticker-tape parades. Nam vets were rotated singly and, as you've said, were often greeted with protests as though they were responsible for the war they'd just left.

So many were kids. We all were.