Footnote 857

[Octafish]

[font size="1"]President Kill III by Carl Oxley[/font size]



What "Both Sides" are Ignoring

Torture Did Work — to Produce War (See Footnote 857)

by SAM HUSSEINI
CounterPunch, WEEKEND EDITION DECEMBER 12-14, 2014

EXCERPT...

So, contrary to the claim that torture helped save lives, torture helped build the case of lies for war that took thousands of U.S. lives and hundreds of thousands of Iraqi lives, helping to plunge the region into astounding violence, bringing al-Qaeda into Iraq, leading to the rise of ISIS and further bloody wars. As Arianna Huffington noted: “A perfect circle: Torture helps start Iraq War, which in turn gives us more people to torture. #happyhumanrightsday”

This oversight perhaps shouldn’t come as too big a shock given who’s calling the shots in Washington: Feinstein and McCain both voted for the Iraq war authorization in 2002, as did virtually everyone running foreign policy atop the Obama administration: VP Joe Biden, Pentagon heads Bill Gates and Chuck Hagel and Secs. of State Hillary Clinton and John Kerry.

[font color="green"]Some have made an issue of videos of torture being destroyed — but it’s been widely assumed that they were destroyed simply because of the potentially graphic nature of the abuse. But there’s another distinct possibility: They were destroyed because of the questions they document being asked. Do the torturers ask: “Is there another terrorist attack?” Or do they compel: “Tell us that Iraq and Al-Qaeda are working together.”? The video evidence to answer that question has apparently been destroyed — with barely anyone raising the possibility of that being the reason.[/font color]

Exploiting false information has been well understood within the government. Here’s a 2002 memo from the military’s Joint Personnel Recovery Agency to the Pentagon’s top lawyer — it debunks the “ticking time bomb” scenario and acknowledged how false information derived from torture can be useful:

“The requirement to obtain information from an uncooperative source as quickly as possible — in time to prevent, for example, an impending terrorist attack that could result in loss of life — has been forwarded as a compelling argument for the use of torture. … The error inherent in this line of thinking is the assumption that, through torture, the interrogator can extract reliable and accurate intelligence. History and a consideration of human behavior would appear to refute this assumption.” The document concludes: “The application of extreme physical and/or psychological duress (torture) has some serious operational deficits, most notably, the potential to result in unreliable information. This is not to say that the manipulation of the subject’s environment in an effort to dislocate their expectations and induce emotional responses is not effective. On the contrary, systematic manipulation of the subject’s environment is likely to result in a subject that can be exploited for intelligence information and other national strategic concerns.” (PDF)

So torture can result in the subject being “exploited” for various propaganda and strategic concerns. This memo should be well known but isn’t, largely because the two reporters for the Washington Post, Peter Finn and Joby Warrick, who wrote about in 2009 it managed to avoid the most crucial part of it in their story, as Jeff Kaye, a psychologist active in the anti-torture movement, has noted.

CONTINUED w links...

http://www.counterpunch.org/2014/12/12/torture-did-work-to-produce-war-see-footnote-857/

[CJCRANE]

1. Self-inflicted and self-feeding wars.

The perfect way to drain our blood and treasure into the bottomless coffers of the MIC and the surveillance state.

[Octafish]

2. Absolutely, CJCRANE.

"Money Trumps Peace" = "Mission Accomplished"

[bananas]

3. kr nt

[Octafish]

4. Truth doesn't matter: Controlling the narrative is all.

For instance: Lies about Torture Continue

The sad truth is that today there are more people around the world who follow the ideology Osama bin Laden espoused than there were before 9/11. America’s turn to the dark side damaged our reputation and played into our enemy’s narrative.

[GeorgeGist]

5. They hate US for it's sociopaths ...

just as US hates theirs.

[Octafish]

7. Torture for a Higher Purpose...

The higher purpose being wars without end for profits without cease.

[grasswire]

6. interesting article, thanks nt

[woo me with science]

8. "another...possibility:(Torture videos) were destroyed because of the questions...being asked"

But there’s another distinct possibility: They were destroyed because of the questions they document being asked. Do the torturers ask: “Is there another terrorist attack?” Or do they compel: “Tell us that Iraq and Al-Qaeda are working together.”? The video evidence to answer that question has apparently been destroyed — with barely anyone raising the possibility of that being the reason.

Exploiting false information has been well understood within the government.

K&R