Terrorist kills 3 Muslims in Chapel Hill, North Carolina

[Ichingcarpenter]

CHAPEL HILL, N.C. - Chapel Hill Police have released the names of three people who were shot and killed on Tuesday evening in the Finley Forest Condominium on Summerwalk Circle, near the Friday Center off Highway 54. Police also said the shooter was in custody.

Those victims were identified as Deah Shaddy Barakat, 23, of Chapel Hill, Yusor Mohammad, 21, of Chapel Hill, and Razan Mohammad Abu-Salha, 19, of Raleigh.
Police said Craig Stephen Hicks, 46, of Chapel Hill has been charged with three counts of first degree murder. He's being held in the Durham County Jail.



Barakat was responsible for Syrian Dental Relief program for Syrian refugee students in Turkey and had raised over $20,000 towards the program.

In January, he wrote on his Twitter account: "It's so freaking sad to hear people saying we should 'kill Jews' or 'kill Palestinians'. As if that's going to solve anything."


- See more at: http://www.middleeasteye.net/news/killings-three-muslims-us-elicited-cries-double-standards-over-media-blackout-595448996#sthash.Phjw1ldy.dpuf



hicks




http://www.wncn.com/story/28075915/shooting-reported-in-chapel-hill

[Ichingcarpenter]

1. has this story been picked up on your tv?

thanks tv news watchers



IMAGINE if a Muslim killed three Christians in their home.

[OneGrassRoot]

23. Yes.

I'm in Raleigh. Local news covered immediately, and it was also just mentioned on Good Morning America. (I usually have a TV on in the background, muted; a habit since 9/11.)

[Ichingcarpenter]

24. I would expect local

thanks for the imput

[chillfactor]

2. sick...

sounds like a hate crime..............

[RandiFan1290]

3. So much hate and bigotry towards Muslims

We even see a lot of it here on DU day after day and the admins do NOTHING

Shame! So sick of it!


Are you guys proud?

[MoonRiver]

4. I see very little of it here.

[Douglas Carpenter]

8. that's called intentionally keeping your eyes wide shut

[carolinayellowdog]

14. hate and bigotry feeding upon itself

not just voluminous amounts of it spontaneously from individuals, but days of self-congratulating trollery with bigots and haters egging one another on. Now this has hit so close to home for me that the results of such hatred will never again seem like a hypothetical future consequence of the "open season on Muslims" attitude we've seen. It's real and present and dangerous.

[Douglas Carpenter]

22. I want to know why EarlG and Skinner never even once tried to put any breaks on it!

DU was reading like Pamella Gellar's forum for a few weeks. It was damned scary.

[marym625]

38. I agree

Some thread, recently, made me physically ill. I couldn't believe I was reading it on DU. I even commented on it and was ignored. It was hateful and hate-filled.

[Turborama]

175. I miss DU2 when any hints of bigotry (whoever it was aimed at) were firmly stamped on.

Since the jury system was put in place it's been "open season on Muslims", as carolinayellowdog so succinctly put it earlier. This is the main reason why I have to take up to 6 month long breaks from here.

[MoonRiver]

26. People are outraged about the terrorists, but

I haven't seen blatant generalizations to Muslims as a whole.

[Douglas Carpenter]

34. you are not being serious

[Violet_Crumble]

35. Yeah, there's been some, including a few hidden posts...

I can give you links if you want to see them

[carolinayellowdog]

44. the blatant generalizations were broader than that

all religion was responsible for the C. Hebdo attacks; somehow I doubt that all anti-religion will be held responsible for this

[leftynyc]

30. You saw people HERE

trying to blame all Muslims for the jihadists? I too seem to have missed that.

[Douglas Carpenter]

32. you are being disingenuous to the extreme

[leftynyc]

41. No I'm not

Perhaps you can provide a link or two to back up that charge rather than trying to claim I'M the problem.

[Douglas Carpenter]

43. you know very well that for at least a few weeks the General Forum was flooded with anti-Muslim

posts and threads - you do know that. If that was not an avalanche of hate and bigotry - then hate and bigotry do not exist

[leftynyc]

47. If it's anti-Muslim

to point out that the majority (some would say vast majority) of terrorism in the recent past has been done by Muslims, then you're just asking people to put their heads in the sand. That's a far cry from tagging all Muslims as jihadists.

[Douglas Carpenter]

48. the stuff that was flooding the forum went a lot farther than that

[leftynyc]

50. Seems a few of us missed it

Perhaps you can provide a link or two. If it was "flooding" the forum, that shouldn't be asking too much.

[Douglas Carpenter]

55. I think you're being intentionally obtuse - but just go back a review post from January 7 to 14

and you will find plenty - but you already know that. There certainly wasn't anybody who missed it

but here is just one of many:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=6080821

[leftynyc]

60. Uh - no

Just went through that ENTIRE thread and comments and didn't see what you claim is FLOODING this site. There was anti-jihadist and holy shit, who isn't anti isis?) but not one post that laid isis at the feet of all Muslims (which was your original claim). So you can call me disengaged, obtuse or whatever other thing but you still have not proved your point. At all.

[Violet_Crumble]

118. Here's two links to posts containing anti-Muslim bigotry...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=6153996

and

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10026211752#post13

If you or anyone else still thinks there hasn't been any anti-Muslim bigotry, I can go back and dig up the posts from early January where someone insisted that European Muslims had brought hatred from anti-Muslim groups like PERGIDA on themselves, and another who posted a crime article from a RW British rag trumpeting away that it was a MUSLIM!!!.

If you or the others in this thread who claim they don't see anti-Muslim bigotry at DU disagree that any of those are anti-Muslim bigotry then I'd like to see what you think constitutes bigotry against Muslims.

[leftynyc]

124. Are you seriously

pointing me to to two posts that our community took care of? Anybody with an account can post whatever crap they like. I could make up an account and say I revere hitler - it will get hidden which means the community will not stand for it. Find me posts that were left standing and then you'll have a point.

[Violet_Crumble]

130. Yeah, coz clearly there's only been two anti-Muslim posts at DU recently...

Actually, no, but that's how you seem to be seeing it. Go read my post again. I referred to other incidents. If you want the links to non-hidden examples, you can politely ask me to PM them to you, as I'm not interested in being alerted on because I linked to posts that aren't hidden.

[Violet_Crumble]

119. Uh - yes. There was a post hidden in that thread that linked to a hate site...

That one was obvious.

[randome]

84. I think that's more in the line of a discussion thread.

[hr][font color="blue"][center]Don't ever underestimate the long-term effects of a good night's sleep.[/center][/font][hr]

[Pooka Fey]

121. Oh By all means, let's start the Pooka Fey Witch Trial

What the fuck is wrong with this post? It is a direct Sam Harris citation, a thinker for whom I hold enormous respect and who is a "New Atheist"

How is it anti-Muslim, since Sam Harris states in it, that Muslims are the primary victims of Islamism?

Please state your case showing the Anti-Muslim bigotry clearly so we can deal with arguments and not innuendo.

Maybe you're mortally offended that I claim that liberals have too much cognitive dissonance when it comes to ISIL terrorism.

[Dyedinthewoolliberal]

59. I'm with you lefty

though my post count is low, I have been here a long time and check in daily. I didn't see any anti- Muslim threads as described by others on this one.

[leftynyc]

61. Just watch

The very fact I don't see anti-Muslim sentiment like the charge being made will be reason enough for some to call me anti-Muslim. I've been saying for years that Islam gets a special pass around here and the evidence for that is plentiful but now we're being treated to being called anti-Muslim It's a bullshit charge and I'll fight against it all day long.

[Pooka Fey]

64. +1 (nt)

[Violet_Crumble]

123. You forgot the 'some of my best friends are Muslim' line n/t

[leftynyc]

125. Exhibit A

Thanks for playing.

[Violet_Crumble]

128. It's the twin of the pre-emptive 'Someone will call me a <insert form of bigotry here>!!!' n/t

[leftynyc]

129. You continuing to make my point

for me is garnering you nothing but my thanks.

[Violet_Crumble]

131. I've got a question for you...

I saw you involved in a thread where things like pre-emptive calls of 'someone will call me an anti-semite', and 'some of my best friends are...' were identified as hints that someone may be anti-Semitic. So how come that same thinking doesn't apply to anti-Muslim bigotry?

[leftynyc]

134. Do you really need

me to link you to where I've been called an Islamophobe for pointing out the more unsavory treatment of women in Islamic countries? If you want to pretend DU doesn't give Islam special treatment, I'd be glad to link you to posts about Christianity that would get hidden in a heartbeat if about Islam. Not now though, I'm leaving work and going to the theatre.

[Violet_Crumble]

136. No, what I need for you to do is to answer the question I asked you...

Y'know, the one I just asked about why those two phrases are seen as indicators of bigotry if said about Jews, but not so if they're said about Muslims.

[leftynyc]

173. They're two phrases

that would give me pause but I've also heard them used by those who have no nefarious feelings at all. I simply can't make a blanket statement and say it definitely means they're haters. But I would watch carefully. What that has to do with this thread is beyond my comprehension. If you want to think I'm a hater, knock yourself out - ignore my posts and roll your eyes. I'm sorry but I simply don't care.

[Violet_Crumble]

174. That's how I feel about both phrases used about any minority group...

Which is why I didn't post in Bonobo's thread on signs of anti-Semitism and tell him I agreed with everything he said. Because with most minority groups, it's a lot more than just one or two comments like that. It's patterns that start to emerge, except if we're talking about RW fuckwits who don't dance around it and come out with really coarse stuff.

Besides, I don't believe yr a 'hater'. There are some folk at DU who are bigoted against Muslims, but I've seen you speak out against attacks on Muslims before. I get that you simply don't care but what I don't get is this. I agree with you 110% that governments like Saudi Arabia are brutal and should be condemned. Same goes for ISIS. There's no justification and no excuses for the horrific things they do. When it comes to citizens of my country who've gone to Syria and Iraq to join up with ISIS, fuck 'em. They shouldn't be allowed back in the country, or if I'm in a slightly more generous mood, they should be allowed back in, arrested when they get off the plane and charged with terrorism offenses or whatever is on the books. I think option 1 is safer though. I'm an Atheist so I get the Religion Is Crap arguments. But this is what I don't get, and it's not aimed so much at you as generally into the air:

Two things gave me the irrits when I was reading threads on the murder of the Jordanian pilot. One was watching a few people skate dangerously close to the 'We have no right to criticise because we used to do just as bad back in the early 20th century!' line. The other was watching a few appear and try to connect that horror with the 'Islamic world' or to think it's more important to speak from their, uh, vast knowledge of Islam and inform everyone that Islam is a very bad religion rather than talk about the stuff that matters, like what a bunch of fuckers ISIS are, and in doing what they did are they trying to drag Jordan into the Syrian conflict to try to destabilise Jordan? Or what I was thinking, which was ISIS isn't something that can be left to burn out on their own and I'm doubtful the countries in the Middle East, including Israel, can deal with it on their own, so where does it go now? I just don't get why there's people who only talk about those two things that piss me off and don't seem to have much point.

But back to what was being discussed. Of course there's been some bigotry against Muslims posted at DU (some hidden, some not, and no-one nuked). It's like other forms of bigotry at DU. It's present and it's fine if folk disagree on the level present, but when people insist there's none present, that does sometimes set off a little warning tingle and it doesn't matter what form of bigotry they're talking about. So the way I see it is there's this line that shouldn't be crossed, and that line's when someone tries to paint most or all Muslims as being violent extremist types who aren't like other humans, here's a link to religionofpeace.com It tells the TRUTH! blah blah blah. If others want to draw that line in a different place, that's their right, but my line sits in the same place for pretty much all forms of bigotry...

[leftynyc]

176. I'm not even going to look

at religionofpeace.com. I suspect it's a pam geller site (or one of her fans). I may not be close friends with any Muslims but I do know several from work so I could never tag all Muslims with the jihadi label. When I hear "why don't moderates speak out", I want to scream - the moderates speak out all the time - they just never get the press. My biggest beef with this site is that every single time there is a thread about ANYTHING having to do with Islam or Muslims, the topic, usually within the first 10 comments, reverts to how awful Christianity is/was or how the US has no right to ever say anything because of our own history. It's a bullshit argument and it's never the other way around. When a Christian does anything, the topic NEVER moves to Muslims. That's why I maintain that Islam gets a pass here.

What none of the haters seem to realize - because they're imbeciles - is that nobody is suffering more under isis than other Muslims. Today what's galling me is what happened in NC - as soon as some people see those two poor women who were killed are wearing headscarves, they will stop feeling any sympathy (also imbeciles). Those three victims appear to be wonderful people - the world is a darker place with their senseless murder. I can't help but feel their murderer turned himself in because he lives in a place he figures the jury will go easy on him because his victims were Muslims. I have an awful pit in my stomach that he's right about that.

[Nuclear Unicorn]

132. So, anyone saying they're innocent is automatically guilty?

[Violet_Crumble]

133. Huh? I've got no idea what yr talking about...

Maybe if you read what I said again and ask a question about what I said?

[BainsBane]

141. I also don't know if the statement that the majority of terrorism in the past has been by Muslims

is actually true. Has anyone counted? Then the question arises as what do we consider terrorist vs. non-terrorist? Jihadi terrorism is a fairly new phenomenon, so I suspect if we examine the question historically we would find a larger pool of events to consider.

And yes, of course GD was flooded with anti-Muslim rhetoric. The claim otherwise is absurd. For more than a few, Islam and terrorism are synonymous.

[Violet_Crumble]

172. It's not true. Here's some information on terrorism...

It's responding to the RW claim that most or all terrorists are Muslim, and also deals with the selective blindness of the US media about terrorism that isn't committed by Muslims. It's an interesting read:

So here are some statistics for those interested. Let’s start with Europe. Want to guess what percent of the terrorist attacks there were committed by Muslims over the past five years? Wrong. That is, unless you said less than 2 percent.

As Europol, the European Union’s law-enforcement agency, noted in its report released last year, the vast majority of terror attacks in Europe were perpetrated by separatist groups. For example, in 2013, there were 152 terror attacks in Europe. Only two of them were “religiously motivated,” while 84 were predicated upon ethno-nationalist or separatist beliefs.

We are talking about groups like France’s FLNC, which advocates an independent nation for the island of Corsica. In December 2013, FLNC terrorists carried out simultaneous rocket attacks against police stations in two French cities. And in Greece in late 2013, the left-wing Militant Popular Revolutionary Forces shot and killed two members of the right-wing political party Golden Dawn. While over in Italy, the anarchist group FAI engaged in numerous terror attacks including sending a bomb to a journalist. And the list goes on and on.

Have you heard of these incidents? Probably not. But if Muslims had committed them do you think you our media would’ve covered it? No need to answer, that’s a rhetorical question.

Even after one of the worst terror attacks ever in Europe in 2011, when Anders Breivik slaughtered 77 people in Norway to further his anti-Muslim, anti-immigrant, and pro-“Christian Europe” agenda as he stated in his manifesto, how much press did we see in the United States? Yes, it was covered, but not the way we see when a Muslim terrorist is involved. Plus we didn’t see terrorism experts fill the cable news sphere asking how we can stop future Christian terrorists. In fact, even the suggestion that Breivik was a “Christian terrorist” was met with outrage by many, including Fox News’s Bill O’Reilly.

Have you heard about the Buddhist terrorists? Well, extremist Buddhists have killed many Muslim civilians in Burma, and just a few months ago in Sri Lanka, some went on a violent rampage burning down Muslim homes and businesses and slaughtering four Muslims.

Or what about the (dare I mention them) Jewish terrorists? Per the 2013 State Department’s report on terrorism, there were 399 acts of terror committed by Israeli settlers in what are known as “price tag” attacks. These Jewish terrorists attacked Palestinian civilians causing physical injuries to 93 of them and also vandalized scores of mosques and Christian churches.

Back in the United States, the percentage of terror attacks committed by Muslims is almost as miniscule as in Europe. An FBI study looking at terrorism committed on U.S. soil between 1980 and 2005 found that 94 percent of the terror attacks were committed by non-Muslims. In actuality, 42 percent of terror attacks were carried out by Latino-related groups, followed by 24 percent perpetrated by extreme left-wing actors.

And as a 2014 study by University of North Carolina found, since the 9/11 attacks, Muslim-linked terrorism has claimed the lives of 37 Americans. In that same time period, more than 190,000 Americans were murdered (PDF).

In fact in 2013, it was actually more likely Americans would be killed by a toddler than a terrorist. In that year, three Americans were killed in the Boston Marathon bombing. How many people did toddlers kill in 2013? Five, all by accidentally shooting a gun.

But our media simply do not cover the non-Muslim terror attacks with same gusto. Why? It’s a business decision. Stories about scary “others” play better. It’s a story that can simply be framed as good versus evil with Americans being the good guy and the brown Muslim as the bad.

Honestly, when is the last time we heard the media refer to those who attack abortion clinics as “Christian terrorists,” even though these attacks occur at one of every five reproductive health-care facilities? That doesn’t sell as well. After all we are a so-called Christian nation, so that would require us to look at the enemy within our country, and that makes many uncomfortable. Or worse, it makes them change the channel.

That’s the same reason we don’t see many stories about how to reduce the 30 Americans killed each day by gun violence or the three women per day killed by domestic violence. But the media will have on expert after expert discussing how can we stop these scary brown Muslims from killing any more Americans despite the fact you actually have a better chance of being killed by a refrigerator falling on you.

Look, this article is not going to change the media’s business model. But what I hope it does is cause some to realize that not all terrorists are Muslims. In fact, they are actually a very small percent of those that are. Now, I’m not saying to ignore the dangers posed by Islamic radicals. I’m just saying look out for those refrigerators.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2015/01/14/are-all-terrorists-muslims-it-s-not-even-close.html

[uponit7771]

104. What's "recent past"?!?!? Who decides that?! you!?!?!

[leftynyc]

114. What are you babbling about?

Since it's my post, I get to decide what I mean about the recent past. I'm thinking past 20 years. If you want to go back to the Crusades, be my guest but that argument is laughable.

[Bluenorthwest]

45. Here's the sort of thing LGBT people put up with. I can show you dozens of links with ease...

""The openness and brazenness of the LBGT agenda and the media flaunting of gay marriages all across the country cost Dems dearly and threatens to do so in the future."
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025764803#post45

That poster is still on DU. So is the 'gay marriage is unthinkable to me because of the Bible' poster, the 'You gays have plenty of rights already' poster......

[liberalhistorian]

126. You know, I'm gonna try a little experiment.

Without looking at the thread first, I bet I know exactly who the poster on that first disgusting comment is and he/she and his/her minions have made no secret of their feelings in that regard, always blaming Dem losses on "teh gayzzzz".

Unfortunately, such delusion and hate is not unknown even here. And that anti-Muslim hate was in full force and swing here in the weeks after the Paris attacks.

[Violet_Crumble]

33. Of course there's been bigotry against Muslims at DU...

Many other forms of bigotry make an appearance at DU. Anti-Muslim bigotry's no different...

[Fred Sanders]

111. Maybe you have not been watching TV for the last few months or any of the mass media, 'here'?

[liberalhistorian]

122. Then you must

not be paying too particular attention because I assure you it's openly here, and often from people who claim to be so open and progressive. Yah, right.

[Chathamization]

63. Many here are as blind to their bigotry as Freepers are to their racism.

And arguing with them about it is going to be about as useful as arguing with a Freeper. Seriously, there are people in this thread saying that there's nothing wrong with claiming that the vast majority of recent terrorism comes from Muslims. Freepers say similar garbage about how there's nothing wrong with claiming that the majority of recent crime has been committed by minorities. "I'm just reporting the facts" is the common defense of the bigot; never mind that the facts are often twisted and skewed to fit their distorted world view.

We have posters here creating topic after topic about scary Muslim criminals in Europe (complete with scary pictures of the individuals involved), and again, that kind of garbage gets defended as "just reporting the facts." Hey, the Willie Horton ad was just reporting the facts, so it wasn't racist, right?

Hell, we've even seen the right-wing trope that liberals are too PC to condemn the inherent violence in [minority group] group thrown around here when it comes to Muslims.

[Douglas Carpenter]

66. that's right and they are about as sincere as David Duke claiming not to be anti-Semitic

[carolinayellowdog]

72. if Muslims are murdered by a non-Muslim, religion is an irrelevant distraction

but if non-Muslims are murdered by Muslims, religion is the only issue. That's what the "blind" bigotry has come to-- a very selective kind of blindness.

[Matrosov]

67. Why should Islam be exempt?

Religion in general is poison.

I'm not sure I'll ever understand why many progressives who have no issue with the rightful bashing of Christians and Jews for the crimes they commit in the name of their religion then suddenly find it hateful and bigoted when Muslims are bashed for the same reason.

Pointing out how Christians have killed in the name of God from the Crusades all the way to lynching African-American 'barbarians'? No problem.

Pointing out how Jews are engaging in genocide against the Palestinian people because they feel God wants them to have the land? No problem.

Pointing out how Muslims how treating women like property (Saudi Arabia), killing homosexuals (Iran), and killing those who aren't 'Muslim enough' (ISIS)? That's just hateful...

[hardcover]

106. + 1000

[Violet_Crumble]

120. That's news to me...

People were getting nuked back during the attack on Gaza for saying things like 'Jews are engaging in genocide'.

And condemning the disgusting actions of Islamic extremists is fine. When it becomes hateful is when that sort of thing is used to stereotype most or all Muslims.

[malaise]

5. First I'm seeing this

No surprise here

[Ichingcarpenter]

7. nothing on tv yet...????

you always seem to have all the channels on to give us the lowdown ...........no tv here as you know......

[trusty elf]

6. Christian terrorist?

[blogslut]

9. Terrorist primarily. Also atheist.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/chapel-hill-shooting-craig-stephen-hicks-condemned-all-religions-on-facebook-prior-to-muslim-massmurder-arrest-10038126.html

[JI7]

11. What a piece of shit.

[Ichingcarpenter]

16. thanks for the link

and update on the killer

[trusty elf]

19. Ah, that figures!

One of them godless heathens!

[MisterP]

117. why the eyeroll?

[uponit7771]

97. HATE CRIME ... PERIOD

[benz380]

10. This happened in my area. Nothing reported about being a Christian or terrorist.

Family stated one of the victims had problems in the past with the shooter.

[7962]

27. Because he WASNT a Christian, he was an atheist. If they knew each other, another story

That puts all the "terrorist" talk out the window. Have you got a link to an unbiased source? The OP link has an obvious bias

[hrmjustin]

70. Anti-theist terrorist!

[Iggo]

81. Finally!

[hrmjustin]

85. Shocking really.

Rarely happens. I saw one incident only last year.

[linuxman]

12. Lemme bust out my jump to conclusions mat.

Ya'll gonna need it.

So far it's been reported that he was an atheist with prior dealings with at least one of the victims.

Terrorism? Well, we can't just throw that word around because it breeds Islamaphobia and hate.

God rest the victims. So fucked up.

[uponit7771]

98. this might help

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/chapel-hill-shooting-craig-stephen-hicks-condemned-all-religions-on-facebook-prior-to-muslim-massmurder-arrest-10038126.html

[Dorian Gray]

13. Those poor

people. No reason for this.

[TexasProgresive]

15. This is so, so, so sad

That picture of showing the happy couple and sister make it so real. I don't have a clue as to why Hicks did such a thing. I don't think it has anything to do with his anti-theism or their Muslim faith but rather he is just let himself be consumed by hate. May these young people rest in peace and may this man wake up to what he did.

[Ford_Prefect]

17. Local Raleigh, NC news source from 6 pm news yesterday (Tuesday)

http://www.wral.com/three-killed-in-chapel-hill-shooting-46-year-old-man-charged/14438074/

As far as I can tell the shooting happened around 5:15 PM yesterday evening. ATM it is 6 AM EST, roughly 12 hours later. How the national media could have digested this as a hate crime or anything else remains unclear to me. They might notice it today, Wednesday, the day after the evening it happened.

Please understand that this is also still a local murder in a college town. The motivations of the killer are not clear although the cultural background of his victims is. Why a self-professed atheist
would murder 3 people associated with fundraising for a peaceful cause is hard to fathom. The shooter doesn't fit the profile of the usual uber-christian one would expect to see either here in North Carolina or generic anti-Muslim types in the US.

[mountain grammy]

18. Well, there ya go, Fox... are ya happy?

[ProdigalJunkMail]

20. terrorist is quite the leap

as the murderer knew at least one of his victims prior to the killings. his motive decides whether or not he's a terrorist and not some headline.

sP

[7962]

28. Seems as though there is a lot more to this story.

[Are_grits_groceries]

21. When Eve Carson was shot in 2011 at UNC,

the coverage was wall to wall. The MSM couldn't get there fast enough with everything they had. The African American killers' lives were dissected minutely.
This happened yesterday and it barely registers? WTF is going on?

[OneGrassRoot]

25. That's true. It was wall-to-wall coverage.

It was covered on local news, and just mentioned on Good Morning America.

We'll see if it rises to the level of the murder of Eve Carson. There is no reason for it not to, other than the skin color of the killer in this most recent case and the ethnicity of the three victims.

That's a great point. Thanks. I'm going to stay tuned to how this murder is covered.

[zazen]

42. she was the campus president and was shot multiple times and left dead in street

after being kidnapped from her home right off Franklin Street and driven around (terrified no doubt) to ATMs to help those monsters steal money from her bank account. I think the shocking circumstances of her murder were part of the immediate sensationalism.

These triple murders are atrocious. My kids have close friends who knew them well. I'm just not sure I see racism in the coverage, but the commentariat blogosphere will no doubt say horrible things.

[Are_grits_groceries]

54. A triple muder at a high profile school gets little or no

coverage until the next day???
The MSM barely mentioned it early this am. I don't buy it.

The cheating scandal involving athletes got more daily coverage of every aspect and still does.

[carolinayellowdog]

75. sounds like media abetting a police coverup

Last edited Wed Feb 11, 2015, 02:23 PM - Edit history (1)

When I logged in to Facebook this morning, I saw a Dutch friend had posted a link to a story accusing the US media of a coverup. I ALMOST replied that the story is less than a day old and asking her not to judge yet.

But this morning, just now, I heard NPR dismiss all talk of a hate crime, on the basis that the Chapel Hill PD was assuring the media that the problem was merely a parking dispute. Nothing to see here, move along folks, the victims just happened to be highly visible Muslims and the killer just happened to be virulently anti-religious.

So now I reluctantly agree with your assessment.

On edit-- but the media seem more avid than the police to say "move along here" at least in the case of AP-- the headline of this AP story, and some of the framing of the narrative, implies that the three murders could only have a single cause and that if a parking dispute "sparked" the killings then nothing else could have contributed. But the actual text of the quotes from the Police Chief, DA, and ATF state very clearly that the investigation of motives is ongoing.

In an email, Chapel Hill police Chief Chris Blue said, "We understand the concerns about the possibility that this was hate-motivated, and we will exhaust every lead to determine if that is the case."

Durham district attorney Roger Echols said he couldn't discuss a motive. Asked whether Hicks could be charged with a hate crime, he said the case was still under investigation...

Gerod King of the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives said agents were in touch with the U.S. attorney's office and that investigators hadn't ruled out a hate crime.

[muriel_volestrangler]

93. Which would imply it was their being Muslims that got the coverage

The initial reports were '3 people shot'. Their name were released some time later, and it went national after that.

[wolfie001]

29. Fox viewer no doubt.

Worthless piece of dog-shit. I hope someone kills him in prison. That'd be true justice.

[leftynyc]

31. I very much doubt

that atheists have the fox news habit. There appears to be a history between the shooter and his victims.

[wolfie001]

74. This pig sitting in a chair watching teevee....

.....being a hater and racist, yes I stand by my "Fox viewer" statement. Whether he "believes" or not is irrelevant.

[leftynyc]

78. Where do you get

hater and racist from? Any evidence available that would explain why you claim that? Meanwhile, here are two sources who say it's a parking dispute.


http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/man-arrested-shot-death-north-carolina-28881115

http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/2015/02/11/385417978/an-arrest-but-no-motive-announced-in-killing-of-3-muslims-in-n-c

[wolfie001]

127. This:

From HuffPost-

Still, the father of two victims, Dr. Mohammad Abu-Salha, believes hate led to the killings.

"It was execution style, a bullet in every head," he told the News Observer. "This was not a dispute over a parking space; this was a hate crime. This man had picked on my daughter and her husband a couple of times before, and he talked with them with his gun in his belt. And they were uncomfortable with him, but they did not know he would go this far."

*This is my last response to you, so you don't need to send any sanctimonious follow-up.

[Ford_Prefect]

36. More local print news coverage

http://www.newsobserver.com/2015/02/10/4545775/three-people-shot-dead-in-chapel.html

Apparently they were neighbors.

[totodeinhere]

37. I think it's irresponsible to call this shooter a "terrorist" until we get more

information. If you had used the the "potential terrorist" then I would have no problem with that.

[Vinca]

39. Can we rule out "patriot exercising his freedoms?" Sheesh. He's a terrorist.

[pipoman]

65. "terrorist" has a very specific meaning

If it turns out this was motivated by some previous encounter/disagreement with the victim(s), it wouldn't be terrorism. Terrorism is an act which is used to terrorize a group of people not directly effected by the act...if this act was retaliation for some personal dispute, the intent was to remedy that dispute, not terrorize others...even if others are terrorized by the act.

[totodeinhere]

94. Not according to this.

Our preliminary investigation indicates that the crime was motivated by an ongoing neighbor dispute over parking,” said police spokesman Lt. Joshua Mecimore. “Hicks is cooperating with investigators.”

http://www.newsobserver.com/2015/02/11/4547742/chapel-hill-police-arrest-man.html#storylink=cpy

It was a dispute over parking, not a terrorist attack.

[uponit7771]

96. No... he hated Muslims and let them know about it

[totodeinhere]

99. Link please to substantiate your claim? n/t

[uponit7771]

100. here

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/chapel-hill-shooting-craig-stephen-hicks-condemned-all-religions-on-facebook-prior-to-muslim-massmurder-arrest-10038126.html

[totodeinhere]

105. So since he hates religion would it also have been a terrorist attack if he had shot

Christians? The fact that he hates religion does not prove that this was a terrorist attack or a hate crime in this case. Let the investigation go forward before jumping to any conclusions. Can't you at least consider that the investigators might be correct when they allege it was over a parking dispute?

[uponit7771]

103. and here

http://www.democracynow.org/blog/2015/2/11/muslim_lives_matter_outrage_grows_over

Dr. Abu-Salha said his daughter had described Hicks as “a hateful neighbor" just last week. “Honest to God, she said, ‘He hates us for what we are and how we look,’” he said

[totodeinhere]

107. In his grief the father is liable to say a lot of things. And of course we all grieve

with him. But let the investigation run its course.

[uponit7771]

108. I'm not willing to call the father a liar or wrong in this account. The shooter has no benefit

... of the doubt with me.

The innocent and their loved ones have more credibility

[uponit7771]

109. Also these small details that the US media leaves out

“It was execution style, a bullet in every head,” Abu-Salha said Wednesday morning. “This was not a dispute over a parking space; this was a hate crime. This man had picked on my daughter and her husband a couple of times before, and he talked with them with his gun in his belt. (Note: The shooter posted a picture of his gun on his facebook page only a month ago) And they were uncomfortable with him, but they did not know he would go this far.”

Abu-Salha said his daughter who lived next door to Hicks wore a Muslim head scarf and told her family a week ago that she had “a hateful neighbor.”

“Honest to God, she said, ‘He hates us for what we are and how we look,’” he said.

[Douglas Carpenter]

40. yeah, if it had been the other way around - I can't imagine anyone here jumping to conclusions

[totodeinhere]

95. You better believe that if it had been the other way around there would plenty of people

asking that we do not jump to premature conclusions. And that's all I'm asking in this case.

[Pooka Fey]

46. Why do we never refer to people wearing headscarves as "Americans" or International Students

even though they reside in Chapel Hill and Raleigh? Because we only care about what religion they belong to? Are we to blindly follow Fox News on framing this point? Do we identify everyone in America by their religion? Am I to assume every person wearing a headscarf is a foreigner when I know this is false?

If they are American, why are they identified as Muslims as if this is more important than their rightful inclusion in American society as American students? If they are International students, why is their nationality irrelevant? I read two articles and nowhere does anyone identify these young people by their nationality, but only by their religion.

In the Charlie Hebdo stories, the victims were identified as French first, and then afterwards by their religious denomination - Jewish or Muslim or Atheist or Christian. Can we too stop making religion the most important thing about an American citizen shot in the USA, a supposed secular society?

This might be a hate crime, or it might be another multiple victim shooting incident such as happens daily in the USA. Apparently the victims knew their assailant.

[mmonk]

49. I don't know. I did volunteer work at the library where they went to high school (Athens Drive).

They were just Raleigh kids to me.

[Pooka Fey]

51. Exactly. Raleigh kids.

Part of the Raleigh community as American citizens, legal residents, or International students.

But I hope you can agree with my point that identifying Americans or any other nationality as Muslims is problematic and allowing a RW Fox News style framing to how we view this particular religion as opposed to the many other religions practiced on US soil.

[mmonk]

69. Yes.

Dehumanization is a wrong turn for a decent society.

[ScreamingMeemie]

52. I am so sorry for your community's loss.

No words for how horrible this is.

[johnnyreb]

62. +1 very important point. "Americans" = inclusive.

We need to bring that identifier back into vogue.

[pampango]

53. Wonder how FOXNews will play this. It's the lead story at ABC and second at CNN websites.

Don't have cable so I don't know how it is playing on TV at the moment. FOX will have to do some verbal gymnastics if they cover this at all.

[In_The_Wind]

56. Very sad.

[HappyMe]

57. Yay! Hate crime!

Bigoted asshole.

[mnhtnbb]

58. This is totally shocking. I live in Chapel Hill. Eve Carson was murdered in my neighborhood

where I walk the dog.

Last night when this was being reported on local 11 pm news it was only 3 people shot, not
identified, no motive.

We do have crime here: assaults, robberies, drug deals, etc. There is an ongoing investigation
in to another young woman who was murdered in her apartment a little over a year ago and
no one has ever been arrested. That's probably someone she knew.

This is just totally shocking.

[Ichingcarpenter]

68. toon

remember this story happened yesterday not today

[hrmjustin]

71. #Muslimlivesmatter!

[FourScore]

73. NO!!! NO ! No! No! So sad...

MY heart goes out to their families. Such a tragic loss.

[Mosby]

76. the link you used has an article defending hezbollah

And is filled with lies against Israel.

It even translates Hebrew words wrong in order to slander Israel and Jews.

http://www.middleeasteye.net/columns/hasbara-happenings-us-media-again-propagandises-israel-37749351

[Ichingcarpenter]

92. thank you for your concern for the victims

and not making this about israel

[uppityperson]

116. well put

[randome]

77. We have to be willing to kill 10-year-olds so why not 3 completely random people, too?

[hr][font color="blue"][center]You should never stop having childhood dreams.[/center][/font][hr]

[Nye Bevan]

79. Guy was a self-described militant, anti-religious atheist.

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/chapel-hill-shooting-gunman-craig-hicks-militant-atheist-who-fantasised-that-religion-would-1487502

I hope that this turns out not be motivated by his hated of religion.

[hrmjustin]

80. I don't buy the whole thing was over a parking space.

[cleanhippie]

82. Of course you don't.

Such a simple explanation doesn't fit what you'd prefer it to be.

[hrmjustin]

87. What would I prefer it be?

[cleanhippie]

138. You tell me. You say you don't buy it, so what do you think it was?

[hrmjustin]

139. You tell me. your the one who made the statement.

I made the statement I don't believe it was just about a parking space and neither do the family.

[cleanhippie]

140. Why is that so difficult for you to believe? The police do.

Chapel Hill police say they are still investigating and have no evidence of a hate crime. Instead, they believe Tuesday’s killings were sparked by a long-standing dispute over parking spaces at the condominium complex

http://news.yahoo.com/self-proclaimed-atheist-charged-in-slayings-of-north-carolina-muslim-students-204302578.html

I mean, this is a completely believable situation, an entirely plausible explanation (that may turn out to be wrong), that is firmly within the realm of possibility.

It's not a totally absurd idea, such as a human coming back to life or something, wouldn't you agree?

[hrmjustin]

142. I never said it was impossible but considering his views and actions I think it is very possible

a hate crime.

[cleanhippie]

145. Possible, but not very, or even likely.

As the article states, this was a long-standing dispute, that he had with many other neighbors.


The point being, it's not difficult to believe the current hypothesis because it's not only possible, but probable.

Yet you find it difficult, for no apparent reason.

[hrmjustin]

146. Time will tell.

[cleanhippie]

149. And if proven to be a dispute over a parking spot, will you reflect on your inherent bias

that causes you to believe the police have it wrong, even though you know nothing more than what they have said?

[hrmjustin]

150. Bias? i think not.

[cleanhippie]

152. Then on what do you base your opinion, if not bias?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=6211124

[hrmjustin]

155. He did terrorise these people and the family made clear it was not only about parking.

Maybe it was too early to say that but you know as well as I do if he were christian he would be called a Christian terroridt by many trying to say it was only about a parking spot.

Maybe I jumped the gun and I do have a bias but you a re no one to judge.

[cleanhippie]

157. Most murders in this country are committed by Christians, yet very few have anything to do

with their beliefs.


And you called him an "anti-theist terrorist" before you know a damn thing about him or what actually happened here.


And I'll judge blatant bias whenever it rears it's ugly head.

[hrmjustin]

159. Actually I did know enough and nothing you presented has changed my mind.

It seems you have a vested interest in saying it had nothing to do sith his hatred of religion. Why?

It is does not reflect on anyone else but him.

[cleanhippie]

161. You can continue to defend your inherent bias, but it's making you look silly.

[hrmjustin]

163. Making it personal as usual.

[cleanhippie]

165. No more personal than you've already made it.

But keep deflecting. It's funny.

[hrmjustin]

167. Well as usual it is a pleasure.

[cleanhippie]

168. More for you, I'm sure.

[hrmjustin]

169. You always have the option of not bothering with me.

I don't go looking for you anymore.

[cleanhippie]

170. You always have the option of not responding.

Try that now. I'll bet you can't.

[rug]

171. "Anti-theism had nothing to do with it."

"It was a parking space, I tell you!"

[ScreamingMeemie]

101. I don't buy it either. One bullet through each one's head in THEIR home?

Nope. If they were in the parking lot/near the spaces, sure. It can happen. But this was sustained rage.

[Nye Bevan]

83. Anyone who has spent time in places like NYC would give this theory some credibility (nt)

[hrmjustin]

86. I live in NYC and I don't see stories like this often.

[Nye Bevan]

90. Here's one from NYC last year.

http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/nyc-crime/son-died-shot-parking-space-mom-article-1.1781377

[hrmjustin]

91. In a city of over 8 million we have a story or 2 on it but it does not happen often.

Most of us don't own cars.

[ScreamingMeemie]

102. It sounds like that happened at the actual parking spot.

These people were shot through the head in their own home (one bullet each). I am having difficulties with the parking spot theory as well.

[hrmjustin]

89. Well time will tell what this guy was about and why but I have a hard time believing it was just

over a parking space.

[cleanhippie]

143. why is that so hard to believe? It's not unbelieveably absurd like people rising from the dead.

[hrmjustin]

144. His views and actions suggest it was a hate crime.

[cleanhippie]

147. No, they don't. Even the police don't think that's what it was, yet you feel strongly about it

And that's kinda strange.

[hrmjustin]

148. And the police are never wrong?

[cleanhippie]

151. Irrelevant, and a distraction from your obvious bias. You called him an anti-theist terrorist.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=6211124

You made a claim based on nothing but your gut instinct, your inherent bias, even though the police have stated they do not think it was a hate crime at all.

And that's sad.

[hrmjustin]

153. I made the claim I don't buy the story. i admit I might be wrong but I agree with the family

that there is more to this.

as to your opinion of me, you are well aware how I feel acout that so lets not make this personal.

[cleanhippie]

154. You claimed he was an anti-theist terrorist.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=6211124

[hrmjustin]

156. i just answered.

[cleanhippie]

158. No, you deflected.

[hrmjustin]

160. Whatever!

[cleanhippie]

162. So we agree then, you deflected.

[hrmjustin]

164. lol. no buddy.

[cleanhippie]

166. lol. yeah buddy.

[Fred Sanders]

110. Beautiful American students and the pride of each of their grieving parents, all of them. CAIR says it best:

“Based on the brutal nature of this crime, the past anti-religion statements of the alleged perpetrator, the religious attire of two of the victims, and the rising anti-Muslim rhetoric in American society, we urge state and federal law enforcement authorities to quickly address speculation of a possible bias motive in this case,” said CAIR National Executive Director Nihad Awad.

"Chapel Hill Police Chief Chris Blue said in a statement: "We understand the concerns about the possibility that this was hate-motivated and we will exhaust every lead to determine if that is the case."

[7962]

112. So the real story is a parking dispute ends in murder. Not random killing of Muslims

Much to the chagrin of many so it seems. But then look where the OP story came from.

And the guy should get the needle for it too.

[Fred Sanders]

113. 3 Muslims...Deah 'Dean' Barakat, Yusor Mohammad, Razan Abu-Salha, rest in peace. You are not '3 Muslims" to me.

Those victims were identified as Deah Shaddy Barakat, 23, Yusor Mohammad, 21, of Chapel Hill, and Razan Mohammad Abu-Salha, 19, of Raleigh.

There will be Justice, delivered by the Justice system, not the useless and complicit media.

This is America.

[carolinayellowdog]

115. Victim: "he hates us for what we are and how we look"

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10026211921

Of course, the testimony of all three murder victims would not shake the "parking dispute only, move along, nothing to see here" narrative that some here and elsewhere are determined to promote as the final answer. Determined to promote a final answer despite the fact that three sources all say the investigation of motive is ongoing: the PD, the DA, and the ATF.

[Judi Lynn]

135. Thanks for the photo of the murdered people. Hard to believe ANYONE would try to harm them.

They look like exceptional people, all three.

[Cha]

137. So sad.. ignorant hate.. :(

RIP Deah Shaddy Barakat, Yusor Mohammad, Razan Mohammad Abu-Salha

[Erich Bloodaxe BSN]

177. Two comments, maybe three.

First, glad to see you willing to label it an act of terrorism towards the Muslim-American community, since I doubt anyone in the MSM will bother.

Second, my condolences toward the families of those slain, they sound like lovely people.

Third, the pic of the murderer looks eerily like my brother in law, although the eyes look different.