General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsScott Walker does not have a college degree.
MSNBC was talking about this earlier, saying it could negatively impact his "biography" and appeal in the general election. Of course having a college degree is not a requirement for being president, but it is pretty universally expected.
DemocratSinceBirth
(99,711 posts)MoonRiver
(36,926 posts)and its anticipated consequences.
TampaAnimusVortex
(785 posts)And of course there's Jobs, Ford, Gates, Spielberg, Rockefeller Sr, and Zuckerberg
Degrees only mean you have some minimal amount of exposure to various subjects, not that you retained any of it or can use it any better than the average Joe. Pretty elitist...
MoonRiver
(36,926 posts)is needed in current politics to get elected president.
AgingAmerican
(12,958 posts)...with a GED
treestar
(82,383 posts)How is it elitist to value a degree or education?
the entire problem with this country is the lack of respect for education.
TampaAnimusVortex
(785 posts)Art_from_Ark
(27,247 posts)which showed Abraham Lincoln trying to apply for a job.
"'Lincoln', huh? What sort of college experience do you have?" asks the interviewer.
"Well, I studied law on my own..."
"Sorry, fella, you ain't going nowhere without that sheepskin," snaps the interviewer, as a dejected look comes over Lincoln's face.
Then the announcer says, "To get a good job, you need a good education".
Hekate
(90,793 posts)Once medical schools were set up, they set the requirements for an MD, not just passing exams but being male. Passing exams mattered; the degree mattered. That's how midwives got marginalized and got the reputation for being dirty and ignorant. They were excluded from formal medical education and outlawed.
As for lawyers, to this day the most important qualification is passing the Bar Exam. You can get your JD from Harvard or from a little regional law school, but if you have not passed the Bar you cannot call yourself a lawyer.
Iirc, Lincoln clerked for a lawyer and studied intensively on his own. I really don't recall the details of his biography, whether he was able to afford to attend a school of law for a time or not, but he passed the Bar.
treestar
(82,383 posts)All you had to do was "read" the law and clerk for another lawyer back in those days. Then you could take the bar exam. Now they make you have a law degree and law schools won't take you without a college degree. Maybe there are some states left that let you take the bar based on "reading" the law. Would be interesting if anyone has tried that recently!
Joe Turner
(930 posts)is not the point. A good college education teaches one to reason at a higher level and better appreciate the complexities of life. These days there should be an expectation that the person running for high office have a college degree. But this is just another black mark on this corrupt Koch-head dope.
Kalidurga
(14,177 posts)Maybe it does look that way to some people who have not been to college. I have four years of college behind me, I am a few credits short of a degree and having that experience in college is very important.
It is very difficult IMO to go through college without developing a deeper perspective of the world, some critical thinking skills, and communication skills.
Scott Walkers lack of education shows. I wouldn't automatically think no degree, but it is clear that he skipped the kinds of courses that develope critical thinking, so I would think business major. No offense to business majors many do a whole lot of other kinds of things that help them be well rounded, Scott Walker isn't one of those types though.
FBaggins
(26,757 posts)There was an article a little over a year ago that reported him as triple-majoring in poli-sci, philosophy, and econ.
Two of the three require decent thinking skills, but his GPA was a middlin-fair ~2.6 - so that's not much evidence either way.
Kalidurga
(14,177 posts)How did is it that nothing from those disiplines seem to have sunk in?
Scuba
(53,475 posts)Kalidurga
(14,177 posts)I have only been to college in Minnesota. I rarely run into conservatives here and when I do they really make an impression. I actually over heard a girl saying "guns don't kill people, people kill people" granted that isn't proof that she is a conservative, but comments like that are rare. The few people I have run into that are devout Christians also tend to be liberal. So, I am truly baffled when someone that close to a degree seems so very lost when it comes to having a philosophical idea that promotes the well being of people. He comes off as a bully and someone who is willing to do sceevy things for finacial gain.
Scuba
(53,475 posts)randys1
(16,286 posts)I mean my god people, how STUPID can you GET?
mrs_p
(3,014 posts)Jesuit schools often require extra courses in liberal arts that emphasize critical thought. Maybe I missed your meaning?
Scuba
(53,475 posts)mrs_p
(3,014 posts)He seems to have missed a lot of many things.
Scuba
(53,475 posts)Drahthaardogs
(6,843 posts)scholars of the Church and value science and knowledge very much.
mrs_p
(3,014 posts)Nearly all my liberal ways were cultivated by their teachings.
yeoman6987
(14,449 posts)I heard he is taking night classes to finish up before the election.
CreekDog
(46,192 posts)snacker
(3,619 posts)tenderfoot
(8,438 posts)Hope he gets good grades in his classes.
yeoman6987
(14,449 posts)But I won't knock someone for a life decision and trying to fix the decision. He has almost 100 percent of the issues wrong in my opinion.
upaloopa
(11,417 posts)philosophy. Most of us learned critical thinking long before college. Many of us had parents who taught us to be critical thinkers. Some of us had great high school teachers who taught us the importance of being open minded and to not agree with bull shit stereotypes like those that plague much of DU.
pnwmom
(108,994 posts)Would it be elitist to require that someone had a high school degree?
Drahthaardogs
(6,843 posts)The average Joe has an IQ of 100. That is too dumb to be in charge of the world 's largest nuclear arsenal. I don't want an average quarterback for my football team either.
Half-Century Man
(5,279 posts)He went to a very expensive upper level university for 3.5 years and left under currently unexplained circumstances. There was a very public scandal when he cheated in a student election (including the attempted suppression of the press, manually collecting and disposing of the college newspaper)and still lost badly.
2naSalit
(86,775 posts)That's a pretty big thing. Maybe it wasn't his idea to leave school when he did and has been lying about it - I think he said he got his mate pregnant or something - to cover his true colors.
In my travels I have found that a college douchbag grows up to be a major douchbag in most cases. I would like to see all the warts, hairs and ugly-demon-nightmares from his past ooze up and haunt him indefinitely.
Half-Century Man
(5,279 posts)2naSalit
(86,775 posts)Thanks to you and Malaise!
edhopper
(33,615 posts)a lot of anti-intellectuals in this country. It hasn't hurt him with the morons in WI.
The question is are there enough idiots in the rest of the country to not make it matter.
CanonRay
(14,113 posts)Just a name change to "Tea".
bullwinkle428
(20,630 posts)edhopper
(33,615 posts)among many Republicans, hating science is a plus, and other blind voters don't think it's important.
el_bryanto
(11,804 posts)I got Walker confused with Rand Paul. As there is a story about him in the news today.
Bryant
MoonRiver
(36,926 posts)MoonRiver
(36,926 posts)Jackpine Radical
(45,274 posts)Don't need no elitist collitch iddikated fool trine ta run things. We need someone with the common sense God gave an earthworm (and not much more).
egduj
(805 posts)No college degree... Disgusting!
yeoman6987
(14,449 posts)I guess Mark Zuckerburg and Bill Gatez are disgusting to you. They don't seem very successful I guess.
prayin4rain
(2,065 posts)yeoman6987
(14,449 posts)Erich Bloodaxe BSN
(14,733 posts)But not because of their lack of college degrees. They're both perfect examples of 'savvy businessmen' who used the work of others while cutting those other people out of the loop when it came to sucking up the resulting profits. Perfect vulture capitalists.
yeoman6987
(14,449 posts)Erich Bloodaxe BSN
(14,733 posts)I'm a fan of Elon Musk, though.
yeoman6987
(14,449 posts)However he has degrees. We need to find someone successful who doesn't have a degree........Steve Jobs perhaps?
Erich Bloodaxe BSN
(14,733 posts)wasn't Edison himself just a self-taught kind of fellow?
Jackpine Radical
(45,274 posts)MoonRiver
(36,926 posts)olddots
(10,237 posts)or a brain and heart so the anti itellectuals can go drool over Jenny McCarthy's ta-tas somewhere else .
DonViejo
(60,536 posts)He quit Marquette University one semester before his graduation. There's a lot of speculation about why he dropped out but, nothing proven as of yet.
GusBob
(7,286 posts)Neither he nor the University are real forthcoming on the specifics.....some are claiming he is 34 credits short of a degree.
it makes no never mind to me, but if he is gonna lie about it, or was "asked to leave" it makes a difference
forthemiddle
(1,382 posts)Has stated, on the record, that he "left in good standing", but won't say anything more than that. Wisconsin Dems have been digging for years, and nothing more has come out. If the University refuses to change their statement, I don think anything scandalous will appear at this time.
Part of the problem with Walker is that he has been thoroughly vetted, so I would be surprised if this turns into anything more than a guy who left college early to take a job, and never returned. Not unlike the majority of American voters.
oldandhappy
(6,719 posts)I am sure they can arrange for him to get an honorary doctorate and give a speech at a graduation this Spring. gag
Gothmog
(145,554 posts)The GOP is the party of anti-science and ignorance. Not having a college degree may help Walker with these idiots
MoonRiver
(36,926 posts)Teahadists do not dominate in general elections. If they did Sarah Palin would have been VP fore 6+ years and actively running for president.
Gothmog
(145,554 posts)There are a ton of other issues to attack Walker on in a general election campaign and attacking Walker on this issue would appear to be elitist
MoonRiver
(36,926 posts)Everybody else in the clown car have post secondary degrees. Scott's lack of education will be a major tool for eliminating him from the primary pack.
Gothmog
(145,554 posts)The tea party types hate people with educations and so Walker's lack of education may help him
MoonRiver
(36,926 posts)There's all kind of ways one can politely parse this to get the "not prepared/competent/informed enough to lead the country" message out.
aint_no_life_nowhere
(21,925 posts)If he's lived in the woods so he knows every tree, that might be enough knowledge for them. These people are living 200 years in the past.
Lil Missy
(17,865 posts)MoonRiver
(36,926 posts)Paladin
(28,272 posts)Scold me for elitism, and Lord knows I'd never vote for a dip like Walker, but I don't think it's too much to expect that presidential candidates have a successfully-completed college education. Further evidence (as if any was needed) of how this country is regressing.....
TheNutcracker
(2,104 posts)My point is Walker would still be an idiot with a college degree.
MoonRiver
(36,926 posts)CK_John
(10,005 posts)MoonRiver
(36,926 posts)CK_John
(10,005 posts)onecaliberal
(32,894 posts)enough stupid to go around. There are many benefits to education. I NEVER EVER want a POTUS without education.
cherokeeprogressive
(24,853 posts)Elitist AND ignorant.
Go Vols
(5,902 posts)Yo_Mama
(8,303 posts)A lot of very successful persons don't have degrees. That doesn't mean they aren't learned.
I can't see why Walker would be any better for having finished a few more credits. What will matter in the election will be the agenda, not the diploma. Dwelling on that would weaken the message - it would make it look like one were grasping at straws!
Also I think trying to make an issue of it will be a turn-off to a lot of young people. They've grown up with very successful role models who didn't have degrees - a lot of them in the tech world. Their standard is to be so damned good that you don't have to finish college to get a job.
Response to cherokeeprogressive (Reply #66)
aint_no_life_nowhere This message was self-deleted by its author.
GeorgeGist
(25,323 posts)that's disturbing.
He was not a wunderkind like Bill Gates.
BlueCaliDem
(15,438 posts)dilby
(2,273 posts)Hell, it will only be time before the Republicans put forth a candidate that has a GED or Christian Faith Home School of Science diploma and people will not think it's unusual at all. People are picking candidates based on likability and not if they can run a fucking country.
CK_John
(10,005 posts)Egnever
(21,506 posts)Neither does Bill Gates.
YoungDemCA
(5,714 posts)Would they have gotten nearly as far as they did? Would the vast majority of Americans even know who they are? Somehow, I doubt it.
Women and persons of color have had to invest considerably more in educational attainment to even begin to achieve parity with the earnings of white men. Pardon me if I find it a sign of unearned privilege that someone like Walker not only didn't have to do that to achieve success in his career; but, in light of his vicious assaults on teachers and other public employees in Wisconsin, it is fair to say that Walker is making a political career out of right-wing anti-intellectual populism.
DesMoinesDem
(1,569 posts)Walker is an idiot, but so is this attack on him. Do you even know what classes that he missed? Why do you think that last semester of classes are so important? College degrees are more often than not useful for getting a job, but not necessary for that job. Exponentially so for a politician. I couldn't care less if anyone, especially a politician, graduated from college. A college degree doesn't mean you are smart, nor does a lack of college degree make you stupid. Bill Gates didn't graduate from college. Bush graduated from Yale...and Harvard!
YoungDemCA
(5,714 posts)and the fact that unlike the majority of Americans who don't graduate from college (or even have the opportunity to go), Walker chose not to finish his undergraduate studies-and still became very successful in politics. How many women or people of color could get away with that? How many people have had that choice?
It has nothing to do with smarts (or lack thereof), and everything to do with social privilege and an overall respect for education. Now, Walker has made a political career out of demagoguery against educated professionals (including teachers) in the public sector, and it's all paid for by the Koch Brothers and other wealthy right-wingers. Pardon me if I find all of this (in context) gross.
MoonRiver
(36,926 posts)Image matters in elections. Bill Gates never ran for president. Dumbo probably bought his degrees, but he had them for his presidential resume.
CTyankee
(63,912 posts)tenderfoot
(8,438 posts)He has literally done nothing else but run or serve in office.
kwassa
(23,340 posts)It ruined their lives.
tenderfoot
(8,438 posts)eom
philosslayer
(3,076 posts)Would some be saying they weren't qualified because they didn't have college degrees?
tenderfoot
(8,438 posts)Erich Bloodaxe BSN
(14,733 posts)They certainly made it sound like he started college and then left. Which makes me wonder if he had an 'Aqua Buddha' type of incident of his own, or if he just didn't have the intellect or the commitment.
840high
(17,196 posts)YoungDemCA
(5,714 posts)And the relevant time period for Truman's young adulthood was over 100 years ago.
840high
(17,196 posts)Book knowledge does not always translate to intelligence or common sense.
YoungDemCA
(5,714 posts)Whatever that means.
And besides, Truman grew up in a time when very few Americans even went to college, let alone graduated. Doesn't seem very relevant today.
pnwmom
(108,994 posts)NCTraveler
(30,481 posts)yuiyoshida
(41,861 posts)Intelligence.. and think of smart people as SNOBS and selfish people. Its not true, of course, its normally educated people who make the best leaders, because they have in some form studied history and knows what direction the country should be lead.
For some reason, Republicans and Tea party members want someone who will react in a knee jerk way. Rush us off to war, for example, even if they have to make crap up, to do it.
YarnAddict
(1,850 posts)you misspelled "sneer?"
Kind of ironic, donchathink?
yuiyoshida
(41,861 posts)don't agree with what I said, or is it that you gotta be anal enough to be my spell check?
YarnAddict
(1,850 posts)that when people are looking down on others as less intelligent, or less educated, they ought to at least be able to spell their insults.
This is the kind of thing that pops up on the Sites That Will Not Be Named.
yuiyoshida
(41,861 posts)right?
YarnAddict
(1,850 posts)yuiyoshida
(41,861 posts)Last edited Fri Feb 20, 2015, 06:57 PM - Edit history (2)
I typed it out in Japanese, what ya think??
Imma just a Japanese girl!!
KamaAina
(78,249 posts)He got booted out of Marquette for cheating. The opposing campaign ads pretty much write themselves.
YarnAddict
(1,850 posts)he was in good standing. If you can prove otherwise, please post your proof.
The trouble is, if there was any "there" there, it would have come up in one of the last three elections that he won, in which every effort was made to find anything at all to pin on him. Nothing stuck.
This guy could be a problem.
spin
(17,493 posts)But he does now have an honorary degree in law from Harvard.
I'm not saying college is overrated but many if not all of our elected politicians in Congress have one and that doesn't seem to have helped them solve our nation's problems.
aint_no_life_nowhere
(21,925 posts)at least not without seeing how broad a self-education they have. If they're really, really good at one thing and became millionaires, they may be idiot savants and know little else than their particular tech area.
spin
(17,493 posts)Although it was a long time ago in a different place and time, Abe Lincoln did not have a college education but was self educated. He taught himself the law and became a lawyer.
Harry Truman was the last elected President without a college degree.
TheKentuckian
(25,029 posts)To be honest even if he had a doctorate it wouldn't make me one iota more tolerant nor could being a first grade drop out really lower my acceptance.
It doesn't have importance to me because it isn't relevant as education level really doesn't change my view at all.
Educating a TeaPubliKlan is just smearing lipstick onto a pig anyway. The only hope is education will cure the stupid and I'm all but certain that another semester or two or 20 is going to flip any switches on this asshole.
HereSince1628
(36,063 posts)bigwillq
(72,790 posts)I don't care if he has a degree or not. Not an issue for me.
There's far better reasons why he should not hold public office.
HereSince1628
(36,063 posts)We don't get to choose those advisors. Walker's taste in advice runs toward A.L.E.C.
He relies on bullies to get things done in the Legislature AND the courts.
bigwillq
(72,790 posts)And we never get to choose them either.
arcane1
(38,613 posts)Throd
(7,208 posts)I have known some incredibly intelligent and wise people with zero college experience.
I have known some complete numbskulls with impressive sounding degrees that couldn't find their ass with both hands.
HereSince1628
(36,063 posts)He's got some college experience, he's not incredibly intelligent, actually borders on numbskull and he regularly uses his hands to spread the cheeks on the asses he's kissing.
Yo_Mama
(8,303 posts)jmowreader
(50,562 posts)The college degree he does not have is not nearly as worrisome as the dangerous ideas he does.
pnwmom
(108,994 posts)Most people who manage to graduate from college have accepted, for example, the reality of climate change.
Yes, there are college-educated Rethugs who are deniers; but IMO they are liars. They just take the position for political reasons.
HereSince1628
(36,063 posts)and setting up taxpayers to pay interest on interest...
No, a college degree isn't everything, but what you DO with the education you HAVE really should give people some read on just how Mr Walker is guided by what he has learned.
Scott Walker isn't just lacking a degree he's proud of it, and jealous and angry that other people are getting them. Walker's plan is to starve the UW system so that in the future fewer people will do that and the state will be better positioned to compete with the Marshall Islands for sweat shops
Bonx
(2,075 posts)aint_no_life_nowhere
(21,925 posts)but a college degree should involve broad coursework that ensures that you been exposed to new thoughts and information that make up the complexity of modern society. To me it's important to vote for someone with a broad education whether it's formal or self-taught. That's why I'd be reluctant to vote for someone without a degree. We're talking about the President of the United States here, not an auto mechanic. People in foreign countries I think would be shocked to find out the U.S. would elect someone who had not gone through the experience of college. I'm not elitist for that because there's nothing elite about going to college in this day and age. Maybe back before WWII.
suston96
(4,175 posts)valerief
(53,235 posts)cherokeeprogressive
(24,853 posts)People with college degrees. It's been fucked to the point where I'm afraid there's no coming back. By people with college degrees.
I possess a Bachelors in Vocational Education. I earned it at Long Beach State when I was well into my thirties. Funny thing, I stopped teaching shortly after that, and had been teaching Adult VocEd for almost 8 years at the time. I know possessors of BAs that are some of the smartest, quickest thinking problem-solvers I've ever met. I also know doctorates who I'm sure couldn't think their way out of a wet paper bag while holding an Exacto knife.
Get the fuck out of my face with your degree. It's almost like Wilson's belief that only "institutional men" should be trusted with governance. Institutional being those educated at Ivy League schools.
I worked for a Master Chief Petty Officer in the Navy whose edumacation only went to grade 8. That man (Man) was a master of resource management, motivation, discipline, and getting things fucking done, and yes... politics. His name was Max Melvin and I'd have followed him to the bottom of the ocean if he told me it was going to help in my country's defense.
Having been on both sides of the fence well into my thirties; the more I read this elitist, ignorant shit, the more disgusted I become. Anyone who believes themselves to be better for having a degree than those who don't can roll their degree into a tight little cylinder and... well... satisfy themselves with it.
DeSwiss
(27,137 posts)[CENTER]
Next time you're found, with your chin on the ground
There a lot to be learned, so look around
Just what makes that little old ant
Think he'll move that rubber tree plant
Anyone knows an ant, can't
Move a rubber tree plant
But he's got high KOCHS, he's got high KOCHS
He's got high apple pie, in the sky KOCHS
So any time you're gettin' low
'stead of lettin' go
Just remember that ant
Oops there goes another rubber tree plant
When troubles call, and your back's to the wall
There a lot to be learned, that wall could fall
Once there was a silly old ram
Thought he'd punch a hole in a dam
No one could make that ram, scram
He kept buttin' that dam
But he's got high KOCHS, he's got high KOCHS
He's got high apple pie, in the sky KOCHS
So any time you're feelin' bad
'stead of feelin' sad
Just remember that ram
Oops there goes a billion kilowatt dam
All problems just a toy balloon
They'll be bursted soon
They're just bound to go pop
Oops there goes another problem kerplop
Oops, there goes another problem kerplop
Oops, there goes another problem kerplop
Kerplop!
[/CENTER]
tularetom
(23,664 posts)The focksnooze crowd is pretty resentful of pointy headed intellectuals. And it'd be real easy for a douchebag like Walker to use their resentment to portray himself as a regular guy with common sense, not book learnin like them sissified eggheads.