Why not Howard Dean in 2016?

[ram2008]

The thought hadn't even crossed my mind until all this Clinton stuff came up and I read up on some alternatives on Wikipedia. But just from reading up on him he seems like he could easily fill the void as a progressive alternative.

Dean was:

-- Governor of Vermont for over 10 years (executive experience)

-- Chairman of DNC - created the 50 state strategy helping Democrats get elected across the country

-- the opposite of a cold, calculating politician, he seems natural, unforced and honest

-- has sterling progressive credentials, opposed to Iraq war, against Patriot Act, said DOMA unconstitutional in 04 etc.

-- is a proven prolific fundraiser and has still retained his position as an outsider

I'm reading up on his page on the issue's and in 2004 he was well ahead of his time on almost every important liberal issue: http://www.ontheissues.org/howard_dean.htm

So what he had a 'Dean Scream' in 2004? Is that the only problem? I think that's what the American people are craving right now, someone who's a fighter and not afraid to speak up. Can someone explain why he wouldn't be a good candidate and someone we should get behind? I'm genuinely curious because Dean's first campaign was before I started following politics, so maybe there's something I'm missing? He seems to be a perfect fit for our party in 2016. I would love to see him chew up Walker and Bush.

[NYC_SKP]

1. Love it! ABC, baby. He was skewered by the media for that, it was ridiculous that we lost him.

I'll take a Howard Dean any day over what's being shoved down our throats right now.

[Scootaloo]

2. The #1 reason he wouldn't be a good candidate...

Is that he has thus far shown exactly no interest in running again.

[winstars]

3. yeah but other than that small fact... LOL

[ram2008]

4. He said he wouldn't run if Clinton didn't

But I'm assuming he just thought as everyone else did that she would be a shoo-in. This doesn't seem to be the case anymore. I've gone through all the alternatives and Dean seems to be the only one who fits the bill and with the ability to be a credible alternative, except maybe Gore.

Could you imagine a Dean/Gillibrand or a Dean/Warren ticket?

[blkmusclmachine]

5. Depends on who Diebold and SES want...

[SusanCalvin]

21. Yep

We still have corporate controlled voting, never forget.

[brooklynite]

43. Which is how President Obama won two elections?

And how the Democrats won Congressional seats in 2006, 2008 and 2012?

[SusanCalvin]

47. Didn't say everything was stolen.

I do say they steal where they think they can get away with it. In many different ways.

[brooklynite]

48. Funny how the stealing software is so inconsistent...

...I'd demand a refund if I was them.

[jaysunb]

6. I spent more than two years on his campaign team

and would be there again in a heartbeat. YES !

But I'd settle for a Jim Webb campaign if necessary.

[JonLP24]

33. A Webb candidacy was something dreaded

but after looking into him a little more, he now ranks ahead of all the potential moderates (Clinton, Maryland Governor, etc)

I think he'd at-the-very least have a much better foreign policy in Southwest Asia, especially Hillary Clinton who would have the worst.

questioned whether an overthrow of Saddam would "actually increase our ability to win the war against international terrorism" and pointed out that the measure of military success can be preventing wars and well as fighting them. He charged, "those who are pushing for a unilateral war in Iraq know full well that there is no exit strategy if we invade." He concluded, "the Iraqis are a multiethnic people filled with competing factions who in many cases would view a U.S. occupation as infidels invading the cradle of Islam. … In Japan, American occupation forces quickly became 50,000 friends. In Iraq, they would quickly become 50,000 terrorist targets."[26]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jim_Webb#Post-military_career

He was exactly right, it created the vacuum which put Al-Maliki in charge who created the vacuum which ISIS entered. While IS overloads on the propaganda, brutality, etc it is difficult to figure out their endgame in how it relates to US. They want to fight a ground war in Iraq & Syria. That is all I can figure out. Al-Qaeda or Al-Qaeda under Osama was very different. Osama was very straight forward, when he "declared war on the US" not long before the 1998 Embassy bombing, after he said the violence would stop if the US pulled all troops out of the middle east. He said was fighting "psychological warfare" later on.

He understood at-the-time very well, our foreign policy previously led to the anger that led to the terrorism combined with Wahabbi ideology which is the point I'm trying to make. I badly want American policy reformed and he strikes me as the "lesser of the evils" of the moderates, Elizabeth Warren don't know enough to know what her foreign policy would potential be like.

It was the Secretary of the Navy under the Reagan Administration that sent me running for the hills initially.

[JI7]

7. because he is third way and supporting Hillary already

[yeoman6987]

13. Rachel is having a one-hour show on all things Hillary

So liberals are lining up big time.

[ram2008]

17. Lining up for or against?

I don't watch television 'news' anymore. What seems to be the General consensus on MSNBC?

[yeoman6987]

24. It was basically for her

However, I misspoke it was 30 minutes and the discussed GOP letter.

[madokie]

8. I remember

being a deaniac I simply loved the guy, still do.
I'm not sure who I'll vote for in the primary but I will vote for the Democratic Candidate in the general.

[tblue37]

9. (1) He has already endorsed Hillary, and (2) I am pretty sure he has no desire to run again. nt

[ram2008]

12. When asked Dean said "Never say never" in politics

Although admittedly he did say he was supporting Hillary a year and a half ago; but things change. Me thinks if he had the progressive energy that is being channeled toward Warren toward him, he would hop in.

[JonLP24]

32. This is how he feels about Warren

Democracy For America founder Howard Dean, who has backed Clinton for president, said Warren is “right on policy, but the rhetoric needs to be toned down.”

“Our program cannot be soak the rich — that's a mistake and alienates middle class people. But on substance, the Warren wing is correct,” said Dean.

“The rhetoric about wealth creation needs to be scaled back because Americans like wealth creation,” he added. “The level playing field argument wins it for us. The reason you do not want to talk about ‘tax the rich’ is because when middle class people hear it, they hear ‘they're going to raise our taxes.’ Democrats can't do that.”

http://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/234224-centrist-dems-ready-strike-against-warren-wing

The rhetoric wins elections besides I strongly disagree that is the reason why middle class Republicans or middle class swayed to vote Republican think Democrats are going to raise their taxes. No, it is because Republicans constantly tell them Democrats are going to raise their taxes. Calming down or "scaling back" just makes it harder to hear the Democrats.

[SomethingFishy]

44. I agree, all Dean did with that statement was admit that he lives in the bubble and

has no idea what "Americans" like. Shut up and go away. If you are not part of the solution you are part of the problem.

I also love how he re-labeled "Income Equality" as "Soak the rich".

[Rex]

10. Why not! nt

nt

[dreamnightwind]

11. Pretty sure he is working for Hillary

I've seen him on the stump for Hillary Clinton,seemed pretty official to me, so I wouldn't look for him to go up against her. He's one of my favorite centrists, I would somewhat support him if he ran, but he's in the Clinton camp.

[Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin]

14. Does he want to run?

[ram2008]

15. We can make him change his mind

Hopefully.

[Warren DeMontague]

16. Or Al Gore, for that matter?

Short answer seems to be that neither has expressed anything resembling interest.

[Nye Bevan]

18. The Scream was not as bad as Rick Perry's gaffe in 2012.

And Perry is running again.

[Martin Eden]

19. Because ...

... he screamed.

That's a much bigger disqualifier than the actual voting record or qualifications of any other candidate.

[bigwillq]

20. I have always been a pretty big Dean fan. But I would pass.

Been there, done that. I don't like recycled candidates. I'm sure Dean will have an active role this election cycle. Seems like he's ready to support Hillary, which is fine by me. He can support the candidate of his choice. At the end of the day, he will be working for Democrats.

[elias49]

22. Could he be VP??

I liked him a lot in 04. He got screwed..

[ram2008]

23. My gut is O'Malley is gunning for VP

With his candidacy. Basically the Tim Pawlenty of the Democrats.

[mimi85]

27. Same here.

[elias49]

28. But he's kind of 'beltway' don't you think?

Dean, the northern liberal.

Hmmm. Think of it that way and you're both probably right.

[Mira]

25. No reason at my house

I Adore Howard Dean
He would get my time, energy and money

[blue neen]

26. Well, if he's interested...

I'd be interested.

[marlakay]

29. I was for Dean too before Kerry

But I've always had the impression his wife is not really into it, she is more interested in being a doctor.

She seemed like she was disgusted by the vileness of politics and I can't blame her. She got a lot of flack for not campaigning with him I remember, I read she said she wasn't giving up her practice unless he won the primary.

[JonLP24]

31. I remember the "issue" over that

That appealed to me more but this was addressed IIRC, she worked lived her life while Howard Dean lived his. It was so refreshing.

Also there was his 'odd religion' issue, "Congregationalist" which was also refreshing & appealing to me as well

Dean’s decision to join the Congregationalists in 1982 didn’t just coincide with his bike-path fight with the Episcopal Church. It also coincided with his first campaign for the state legislature. Like all American politicians, even in progressive Burlington, he needed a spiritual mailing address. As he shopped around for churches, it was natural that he turned to Congregationalism, a denomination famous for its informality and liberal stances. Last November, Dean told a reporter from the Forward that he liked that “there is no central authority” in the tradition. By the time Dean joined the church, Congregationalists had already authorized the ordination of gay ministers. Yoga is taught in the church. Sermons sometimes make the case for lefty causes, especially the plight of the Palestinians. (Last June, a sermon at Dean’s own Congregationalist church blared, “The real violence is the violence of the occupation of Israel to over three million Palestinians living in the Gaza Strip and the West Bank, including East Jerusalem.”)

Dean’s decision to switch churches is not the only way in which his religious journey progressed from more to less structured—or in which he mimicked his class as a whole. Soon after the Protestant elites had opened their institutions, they opened their families, with intermarriage becoming common in the 1970s and ’80s. “New England Protestants have assimilated Catholics and Jews. We are constantly searching for a combination of rituals and doctrines. We’re not afraid to cherry-pick,” says Peter Hall, a Harvard professor who studies religious politics. So, when Dean married a Jewish woman, Judith Steinberg, in 1981, nobody paid much notice. (His father, after all, had married a Catholic.) The new Dean family would celebrate Christmas and Passover. Religion in the household became not only nontraditional but extremely casual. As Dean put it at a candidate forum in November, “We go to temple once in a while, and, last time I went, we got a lecture about Jews that only go to temple on high holy days, just like I used to get a lecture at the Congregational church about Christians that only go to church on Christmas and Easter.” As James Dean told me, “[Religion] is just not something we really talk about.”

http://www.newrepublic.com/article/beyond-belief-religion-howard-dean

Whatever the case with Dean, he always struck me as more honest among the bunch.

[marlakay]

34. I didn't know that about his religion but respect him for it

I like his honesty to. I said that about his wife because I think she might be why he doesn't want to run.

So many people in this country would use his not going to church more as an excuse not to vote for him. Very sad.

I thought he did a great job as head of democrats and never understood why he got treated so bad at the end.

[ram2008]

35. I've read his relationship with DC insiders, even Obama isn't too good

It has never really been elaborated as to why in the press. I think Dean may have been a little PO'd that he wasn't offered a spot in the admin.

[marlakay]

36. I wondered why he wasn't

Either Obama or Rahm must not like him....I think Rahm did a lot of harm, I blame him for a bunch of stuff Obama didn't do his first years.

I thought Dean helped him get elected...

[JonLP24]

46. Rahm criticized his 50 state strategy

Said that they would have won "even more seats" if money & resources were concentrated to tight races.

[JonLP24]

30. Nah

He lost his "fighting centrist" label

I know, he's even less of a liberal than Bill Clinton was, but I don't think Dean is a moderate centrist. I think he's a fighting centrist. And folks, I think we have got ourselves a winner here.
http://www.creators.com/opinion/molly-ivins/molly-ivins-december-4.html

He's now a moderate centrist.

[samplegirl]

37. I have always admired Howard Dean

He was my first pick..........I was so upset because the repukes and help of the media ended him for his scream! Still pissed about it today!

[brooklynite]

38. I stand with Howard Dean.....in his endorsement of Hillary Clinton.

Hillary Clinton is by far the most qualified person in the United States to serve as President. If she runs, I will support her. I have known Hillary for almost twenty-five years. We first met when I was the governor of Vermont and she was the First Lady, giving us the opportunity to work together in various capacities, particularly on expanding health care access. During those years, I have learned that she is one of the most conscientious and competent people I have ever met. She has an enormous capacity to analyze and solve problems. She has a work ethic that drives her to persist until the job is done and done right. And she has a record in the Senate of successfully working with both sides of our very combative political spectrum in order to accomplish goals that improve the lives of ordinary Americans.

One of the most important reasons I am supporting her is because Secretary Clinton understands the institutional requirements of the Supreme Court. More than 73 percent of Americans think the Supreme Court is no longer a fair arbitrator and is influenced by political considerations. I am one of those 73 percent. This Court has repeatedly made decisions that have harmed our country for the sake of extending a political and ideological agenda that is far outside the mainstream of American traditions—on issues like campaign finance, voting rights, the rights of women, and religious freedom.

America needs a thoughtful President who will appoint judges and justices who will stand up for the Constitution and the law instead of catering to the dictates of those who fund the right-wing Federalist Society. I am confident that Hillary Clinton will provide that leadership.

http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2014/12/howard-dean-ready-for-hillary-113444.html#.VQCyYvnF9KI

FWIW - Why do people think Dean's campaigning skills have gotten any better since 2004?

[DFW]

39. I had breakfast with him 2 months ago, just the two of us

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10026052724

For now, he is backing Hillary, and he really Really REALLY doesn't want to run, but won't totally shut the door to it yet.

[geek tragedy]

40. Because he's already warned Elizabeth Warren to watch her tone and be less angry, nt

[Hutzpa]

41. Yeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrrgggggg!

nt.

[PassingFair]

42. I would get behind him 100%...

Donations and shoe leather.

People powered Howard!

[SomethingFishy]

45. Because the man lives in a bubble and has no idea what "Americans" want

His attack on Elizabeth Warren was so fucking stupid it's not even funny.

Apparently in Mr Deans world, getting paid a living wage for hard work is "Soaking the Rich".

Apparently Ms Warren should tone it down because "Americans love Wealth Creation".

I'd like a President who doesn't live on "Planet Wealth".

I want a President who realizes that I don't want fucking Yachts, and my wife doesn't want Diamonds, that I could give a flying fuck about "wealth". I want a President who realizes that when I work 70-80 hours a week, at the end of the month I should have a few bucks leftover, instead of coming up short and having to decide whether I should pay the power bill or buy my wife's medication.

Fuck Howard Dean and his total lack of understanding of what it's like to be working class in America in 2015.

[ram2008]

49. Pretty sure he was talking from a political point of view

As in politically - the messaging of what Warren was saying could hurt in reaching out to other groups. If you look at his record, he's pretty solidly for working people.

If not him, then who? Hillary? Yeah right. Bernie? A self admitted socialist will never be president,