Pope Francis recruits Naomi Klein, author of THIS CHANGES EVERYTHING, for climate change battle.

[pnwmom]

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/jun/28/pope-climate-change-naomi-klein

She is one of the world’s most high-profile social activists and a ferocious critic of 21st-century capitalism. He is one of the pope’s most senior aides and a professor of climate change economics. But this week the secular radical will join forces with the Catholic cardinal in the latest move by Pope Francis to shift the debate on global warming.

Naomi Klein and Cardinal Peter Turkson are to lead a high-level conference on the environment, bringing together churchmen, scientists and activists to debate climate change action. Klein, who campaigns for an overhaul of the global financial system to tackle climate change, told the Observer she was surprised but delighted to receive the invitation from Turkson’s office.

“The fact that they invited me indicates they’re not backing down from the fight. A lot of people have patted the pope on the head, but said he’s wrong on the economics. I think he’s right on the economics,” she said, referring to Pope Francis’s recent publication of an encyclical on the environment.

Release of the document earlier this month thrust the pontiff to the centre of the global debate on climate change, as he berated politicians for creating a system that serves wealthy countries at the expense of the poorest.

Activists and religious leaders will gather in Rome on Sunday, marching through the Eternal City before the Vatican welcomes campaigners to the conference, which will focus on the UN’s impending climate change summit.

SNIP

[ZakCarter]

1. Naomi

Rocks in my book.. the Pope? Not so much!:p ...still, this is crazy cool!

[pnwmom]

2. It shows he knows how to pick good allies. Yes, this is "crazy cool"!

And welcome to DU, ZakCarter!

[hifiguy]

3. No one better.

"This Changes Everything" is, with Thomas Piketty's "Capital in the 21st Century" one of the most important books of the last 25 years, at the very least. She is a very smart woman, and a writer of rare vigor and lucidity,

[pnwmom]

5. Yes. Everyone should read, "This Changes Everything." Thanks for the reminder, hifiguy. n/t

[hifiguy]

6. Just read it a couple of weeks ago,

and it does provide a "holy shit" kind of epiphany about the urgency of doing something about climate change.

[Admiral Loinpresser]

11. Reading that book

should be a requirement for citizenship for everyone. I mean that quite seriously. At least 95% of the people on DU do not understand the level of crisis we are facing.

[hifiguy]

12. Yep.

It's enough to scare the hair off of a gorilla.

[daleanime]

35. +1

[arcane1]

76. All three of her books are must-read, eye-opening masterpieces.

I'm speaking of "No Logo", "The Shock Doctrine", and "This Changes Everything"

Needless to say, I have a tremendous crush on Naomi Klein

[Koinos]

4. K & R

[RoccoR5955]

7. OMFG!!!!

And I don't even believe in god!
Naomi freakin' Klein teaming up with the pope!
Awesome!
It is almost unbelievable.
Are you sure that it's not being reported by the Onion?

[Admiral Loinpresser]

14. Could we have actual leadership

to save the planet at long last? Absolutely mind blowing.

[lostnfound]

8. Did I land in never-never land? Or Oz? Lilliput?

Reality has taken some surprising turns this week.
Naomi does rock.

[SidDithers]

9. If contraception and population control aren't part of their Climate Change discussion...

then the efforts of this Pope are nothing more than window dressing.

Sid

[Admiral Loinpresser]

13. When we are being sold out by almost the entire

Democratic Party leadership, I will take the Pope's leadership even with dogmatic limitations. Right now we are still in Paul Revere mode, when we need to be in Marshall Plan on steroids mode and if he can help us get there, I'll take it. I agree that population control is an important aspect, but we need to start restricting carbon output immediately.

[SidDithers]

16. No thanks...

I'll take Obama, or Hillary, or Bernie, over the leader of that homophobic, misogynistic, organized-crime Catholic Church "institution" any day of the week.

Sid

[whatchamacallit]

68. Sid, you just hate Naomi because she's a famous, influential Canadian

who contributes more to the world than "UNREC" and " "

[stevenleser]

71. Agreed and you were right and I was wrong about the Pope initially.

I believed some of his early rhetoric about improving on his predecessors (as well as his own previous) homophobic positions and statements. But then 6-8 months ago, he reverted to form. I am not going to be fooled by this guy again.

[BuddhaGirl]

18. Yes - this is a good step

I disagree with the 99% of the RCC church's policies - very lapsed Catholic here - but the Church won't change overnight...and Naomi Klein is quite the force.

I'll take it!

[Tobin S.]

20. Sid's being sardonic.

Last edited Sun Jun 28, 2015, 05:12 PM - Edit history (1)

I'm with you (and so is Sid, probably). The Pope is right on economics and climate change and wrong on some social issues. I'll take his enormous influence to effect change on the problems he's right about to help me out any day.

ETA: Apparently I read Sid wrong, but I'll let the original stand.

[pnwmom]

70. Right, the Pope is like all of us -- a flawed human being who is right on some things

and wrong on others.

But I support his actions on the global environment, climate change, and poverty and am so grateful he is using his voice -- and whatever power he has to influence -- for these causes.

[appalachiablue]

41. Mega Marshall Plan USA

K & R. Can we put Bernie, the Pope & Naomi Klein in the Executive Branch in 2016? Citizenship is mostly irrelevant now since everything's 'global' especially concerning capitalism and climate change.

[Admiral Loinpresser]

43. That is a troika I could get behind! n/t

[PeaceNikki]

44. You want a religious leader who is against women's and LGBT rights in the US government?

That's not even funny to joke about. It's fucking offensive.

[appalachiablue]

47. He's more vocal & serious than most of our pols about unregulated capitalism, income inequality

and climate change, issues where his influence could be helpful and limited to that role solely. Sister Simone Campbell and the Nuns on the Bus also have been working to tackle poverty and income inequality for a long while. Jesuit Priests the Berrigan brothers and other religious leaders actively demonstrated against the Vietnam War. All hands on deck at his point to combat massive global problems, including input by French economist Thomas Piketty. The return of Jacobites, Papists, patriarchy and bigotry isn't what I suggested. Get a grip.

[PeaceNikki]

51. You get a grip. He's vehemently opposed to the rights of women and LGBT.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/women/womens-life/11362224/Pope-Francis-he-aint-no-liberal.-Beware-of-his-two-faces.html
http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/7249020
http://www.spectator.co.uk/features/9112081/the-fantasy-francis/
http://www.newrepublic.com/article/116056/progressives-who-love-pope-francis-are-abandoning-women-and-gay-rights

It's disgusting to "dream" of having him in the executive branch of the US government, even in jest. This isn't a fucking theocracy.

[appalachiablue]

53. I'm aware of the positons of the Catholic Church, Protestants and also secular groups . You stop

accusing, attacking and putting words in my mouth like advocating a theocracy which is fabrication. I've explained my thoughts more than sufficiently and there are others on this thread who also think highly of the Pope's calls for addressing climate change and wealth inequality. Find another place for your views, good luck and good night.

[PeaceNikki]

54. I'll post my views supporting equality for all wherever I damn well please.

You're the one who cheered at the idea of an anti-woman and anti-lgbt religious leader in one of the most powerful positions in our government. That's what I was and am responding to. It's a disgusting and offensive idea.

Also, those links weren't just about the views of the Rcc, they are specifixlly about how Francis is not a damn liberal hero. You're buying into a fantasy that a good PR team is feeding you.

[pnwmom]

48. He is FOR women's rights in any situation except the priesthood.

I don't know why that would bother non-Catholics.

And compared to the rest of the hierarchy, he is showing some flexibility on LGBT issues. He has said "who am I to judge?" about gay people. And he is welcoming LGBT people to the upcoming conference on families.

I'm not saying he's a supporter. But he's taking some steps in the right direction.

[PeaceNikki]

50. Um. No.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/women/womens-life/11362224/Pope-Francis-he-aint-no-liberal.-Beware-of-his-two-faces.html
http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/7249020
http://www.spectator.co.uk/features/9112081/the-fantasy-francis/
http://www.newrepublic.com/article/116056/progressives-who-love-pope-francis-are-abandoning-women-and-gay-rights

[BrotherIvan]

56. The church thinks women should breed until they drop

Or die rather than have a life-saving abortion
Or be put in jail for terminating an unwanted pregnancy
Or get beaten to death by an abusive husband rather than a divorce.

So yeah, I don't think the church supports women. At all.

[PeaceNikki]

57. mmm hmm

Unreal how people keep perpetuating this Fantasy Pope.

[BrotherIvan]

59. He's got quite a lot of cleanup in his own house

Though I do think the conversation on climate change is important, I don't think the institution that can claim a substantial chunk of responsibility is a good leader of it.

[PeaceNikki]

60. Agreed, but Sid is right.

[LeftOfWest]

49. Well PeaceNikki, You are one in a trillion.

At least a trillion.

Agree, not funny and it is offensive.


edit for spelling.

[PeaceNikki]

52. Thanks. It's awful to watch people drool all over someone who fights against the rights of millions

and to the level that was done in this thread at the point I jumped in was just too much.

Nope. Nu uh.

[Admiral Loinpresser]

61. PeaceNikki, I agree that the RCC is terrible

when it comes to critical issues of inclusion. But we are all headed for civilizational collapse or quite possibly even extinction within 2-3 generations right now. That's what a growing number of scientists are saying. So I believe we have to get out of Paul Revere mode and get into a mega Marshall Plan mode. And it should have been done around 1988, when the real debate started. So I hope you can appreciate my point of view that our survival as a species probably depends on immediate action, if there is still any time left at all.

I respect your point of view and it is true and valid about the RCC and even this Pope who has been a mixed bag on progressive issues. But I believe there is a moral imperative to act now and if that means an unholy alliance that mobilizes Catholics and others, it is necessary to take that help. Otherwise humanity is probably doomed.

[PeaceNikki]

63. I get that. But Sid is right. Without birth control it's pretty meaningless.

Also, I jumped in only at the point that people took it to the offensive extreme of stating they want a religious leader who is vehemently opposed to equality IN THE EXECUTIVE BRANCH OF THE US GOVERNMENT. That's offensive, even in jest.

[Admiral Loinpresser]

64. I agree.

The joke wasn't right. I also agree about the need for aggressive birth control, not only for survival, but because of all the humanitarian benefits to girls and women because of greater chances for education, etc. But we have to get the ball rolling now on an international agreement on carbon regulation. The Pope giving Naomi Klein a huge megaphone is helpful in that regard. If the Pope doesn't want to go along on birth control (almost surely he won't), then at least we got a huge benefit on carbon regulation and wealth inequality and maybe on such issues as rainforest conservation and reforestation in general. Then we work with other international champions on those issues where he doesn't help. Klein will help on everything and this can only enhance her prestige. That's my view.

[pnwmom]

72. Catholics here are more likely to use birth control that the average citizen.

And the Church's efforts in countries with few Catholics have little effect. It is also true that lowered birth rates tend to be the result of economic success, which is why wealthy countries have lower birth rates than poor countries. People in poor countries have many children to ensure that some will live to support them one day. So addressing poverty around the world will lower the birth rate, just as it has in developed countries (whatever the position of the Church on artificial birth control.)

Having said all that, I agree with you that Pope Paul's Encyclical against artificial birth control was wrong, and I hope it is changed eventually. But the Pope must pick and choose his battles to have the most influence. And he's putting climate change front and center. It could very well be that the scientists he's working with inform a serious Church discussion about birth control. We'll find that out as time goes on.

[PeaceNikki]

73. Check the birth rates in heavily Catholic Latin countries.

There is a huge tie between environmental issues, population and consumption. You must address population or you're not doing it right.


In addition to that, the Catholic Church is the largest private provider of care to HIV/AIDS patients in the world, but the Church's position on AIDS prevention is inhumane and unconscionable. Francis won't be changing that. But he should and could.

[pnwmom]

74. Those heavily Catholic countries are POOR countries. That's why they don't have

the lowered birth rate of a heavily Catholic country like Ireland, or Catholic citizens of countries like the U.S.

And the Church changed its position with regard to condoms and HIV protection some time ago.

[PeaceNikki]

75. Also, are you arguing that not even Catholics really do as he says about BC,

but it's immensely powerful that he's addressing (sort of) climate change? And people will do as he says to on that?

Lol

[pnwmom]

77. Not even Catholics follow the teachings about birth control,

except in poor countries, where people have large families because they need children to help take care of them eventually. And this happens in all poor countries, not just the largely Catholic ones.

Just as there are high rates of birth control use in wealthy countries, no matter how many Catholics there are.

I don't know how much influence he'll have in the global climate change debate, but he's getting lots of smart people working together. I applaud him for that. I'd much rather have him focusing whatever power he has on this subject, wouldn't you?

[sabrina 1]

62. Me too. Good for the Pope for taking the lead when politicians refuse to do so on this

most important issue. He has so much influence over voters and is now using it so that politicians cannot anymore pretend they are for the people when they deny this enormous threat. Especially the Republican party which has consistently used their Catholicism to back up their nonsense. I love watching them splutter, see Santorum, over what they now view as the Pope's betrayal of those who pretended to be 'good Christians'. He has more or less told them wrt to all the 'wedge' issues they use in every election that they are no such thing.

And to bring Naomi Klein on board, who they view as a 'radical liberal' is like a slap in the face to them. It gives her status now with one billion people on this planet whereas before the right could simply dismiss her.

Times are changing rapidly for the 'ruling class'.

[BrotherIvan]

55. I agree with Sid!

Pope could do his part overnight by having a "revelation" that over 50% unplanned births in just the developed nations are fucking up the planet. "God says we have enough humans. Slow down."

Until then, he and his crew are major contributors to the problem.

[FlatBaroque]

10. A true hero, Naomi Klein

May she continue to have a major impact on this issue.

[Uncle Joe]

15. Outstanding!

Thanks for the thread, pnwmom.

[pnwmom]

17. You're welcome, Uncle Joe!

[nadinbrzezinski]

19. Good and thanks

[longship]

21. Naomi Klein, "The Shock Doctrine"

It is a book that will shake you to your bones.

I haven't read her latest, but it is going to go to the top of my reading list, especially since Pope Francis is allied with her on this issue. Note that neither are climate scientists, but that does not mean I do not respect them on this topic. Folks can educate themselves, and the Pope does have science in his educational background.

However... Pope... Please look up in the scientific literature: "medical uses of birth control pills" and "safe sex and condoms" and "animals which practice homosexual behaviors". (Hint: as to the latter, it is pretty much all of them.) If you do that, maybe you won't be as big a jerk as your predecessors. In the meantime, I will reserve judgement.

[pnwmom]

22. He's only been Pope for two years, and he has a giant ship of a church to swing around.

I won't be surprised if, assuming he lives long enough, the church changes position on birth control. But he's choosing his battles.

[hifiguy]

24. Changing the direction of an institution as old, big and bureaucratic

as the RCC is like raising the Titanic with a pair of tweezers. He's on the right road but still has a ways to go. But he IS on the right road.

[longship]

29. I am very cautiously optimistic.

But as a rather proud strident atheist, I will be very surprised if he doesn't end up being a douche bag on birth control, women's rights, LBGT rights, etc.

If he is serious, he will sit in his magic chair and, as Captain Picard, "Make it so." He has the power.

As a matter of fact, if he did even one substantive church change while wearing a Star Trek officer's uniform while perched in the chair with those words I would be forever in his camp. That would be very cool.

No. I would not start believing in gods, but the Pope would at least have more of my respect, which now is fairly minimal.

My best to you.

[pnwmom]

31. That's what non-Catholics don't realize. He doesn't have the power.

Not even a magic chair, much less a magic wand.

(But I wish he had a battalion of body guards.)

[longship]

34. You are probably correct about me.

Nevertheless, I suspect that I am correct about the Pope/Catholic Church. He is not going to make the changes necessary to bring it to the 21st century. The institution is just too conservative as a whole. Turning the Titanic is a good metaphor.

Still, the guy is somewhat refreshing, for a change.

[pnwmom]

37. I think he is making a valiant try. But I'm also skeptical about his chances of success,

given Church history and his age. Still, I'm glad he's trying. He's inspiring a lot of people.

[longship]

38. I'd go there with you. Many of my atheist compatriots would not. C'est la guerre! nt

[Bluenorthwest]

65. He should speak out against his Bishops then....

Supreme Court Decision on Marriage “A Tragic Error” Says President of Catholic Bishops’ Conference
"Regardless of what a narrow majority of the Supreme Court may declare at this moment in history, the nature of the human person and marriage remains unchanged and unchangeable. Just as Roe v. Wade did not settle the question of abortion over forty years ago, Obergefell v. Hodges does not settle the question of marriage today. Neither decision is rooted in the truth, and as a result, both will eventually fail. Today the Court is wrong again. It is profoundly immoral and unjust for the government to declare that two people of the same sex can constitute a marriage.

The unique meaning of marriage as the union of one man and one woman is inscribed in our bodies as male and female. The protection of this meaning is a critical dimension of the “integral ecology” that Pope Francis has called us to promote. Mandating marriage redefinition across the country is a tragic error that harms the common good and most vulnerable among us, especially children. The law has a duty to support every child’s basic right to be raised, where possible, by his or her married mother and father in a stable home."
http://www.usccb.org/news/2015/15-103.cfm

Notice how the Bishops are making use of this 'ecology' rhetoric to attack human rights. Those who make their alliances with this group need to use great caution and consideration lest they wind up being used as a device of dogmatic oppression. Good luck with that.

[cantbeserious]

23. Good News

eom

[kydo]

25. That is Most Awesome!

Thanks pnwoman for this amazing piece of information. Knowing she has the Pope's ear on this makes me eager to see what they do.

[pnwmom]

26. You're welcome, kydo. She and many other smart people have his ear now. If he lives long enough

he'll be a great Pope.

[bucolic_frolic]

27. The world is changing

Once the juggernaut of change is launched, there is no turning back.

The forces of anachronistic repression will fight hard, but they are
making more noise than progress.

People sense what is happening, and it is a big sigh of collective relief to them.

Forward is the new normal. Cruz, Rubio, Jindal, Wall Street in a suit and tie seem
so so so 20th century now.

This is happening not just here, or in the Vatican, or in Charleston, or on the Court,
it's occurring around the world.

Perhaps the internet has given people the tools to fight oppression, to reason
in their minds how they can be more free, to be responsible and helpful instead of
oppressive and exploitative.

Or maybe it's just a week in the life. I don't think so, but one never knows.

[SusanCalvin]

28. The Wonderpope still has issues (according to me)

But this is MAGNIFICENT, and very heartening.

[jwirr]

30. This is great. The two of them together should be able to get this message out to the world like

no one else has been able. Both have their own audience and both speak in a way that can be understood by anyone who wants to listen.

I wonder if there is a connection between her book "The Shock Doctrine" and the fact that the Pope is from Argentina? He also has some of the same attitudes about capitalism as she does.

[hifiguy]

32. Hadn't thought of that.

And IIRC Pope Frank has a M.Sc. in chemistry.

[jwirr]

36. Her book is my obsession. But somehow I lost it in my very tiny living space. Can't wait to read

this next one.

[hifiguy]

39. She's brilliant.

Nomi Prins is also very much worth reading on the Great Implosion of 2008 (It Takes A Pillage) and the influence of bankers on politics (All The Presidents' Bankers). They're two of the best investigative reporters I have ever read.

[jwirr]

40. Got them on my list also. At the age of 73 I am not real sure what I am going to do with all this

knowledge but I like to learn so who cares.

[Bluenorthwest]

66. No he does not, this explains his background from National Catholic Reporter.

"Numerous press reports are saying that Pope Francis has a master's degree in chemistry, including one that incorrectly cites me as a source. Sorry, it is not true.

What he did do was graduate with a título in chemistry from the Escuela Técnica Industrial No. 12*, which is a state-run technical secondary school.

In the Argentine system, "the título (same word used for a secondary diploma or a university degree) was earned at about age 19 after an extended secondary program," Liebscher said. "Not everyone who goes to secondary school gets one of those diplomas, and the título really represents something beyond our high-school diploma, something akin a certificate from a community college in the U.S."
http://ncronline.org/blogs/ncr-today/does-pope-francis-have-masters-degree-chemistry

It's nice what he has, and it shows he has a strong interest in science and that he was an excellent student.

[burrowowl]

33. YES!!!

Love Noami Klein! She nails it!

[sadoldgirl]

42. Certainly he will also call upon renown

scientists for this. Naomi has a broader view and
while he does not that much power he has a huge
pulpit, more than anyone else I know of.

Question remains for how long the conservative
powers in the Vatican let him get away with his
changes.
all in all very good news.

[pnwmom]

69. He has already called on renowned scientists and they helped him write the recent Encyclical

on climate change. He will continue to involve them.

You are right that there are conservative powers in the Vatican that are no doubt trying to thwart all this. I worry about his health and his safety.

[daleanime]

45. Sweet!

[Spitfire of ATJ]

46. This is very groovy.

[Enthusiast]

58. This is incredible!

[raouldukelives]

67. K&R "Action is my duty"

Over the last few decades the refrain from the corporatists, the ones who have unashamedly ignored and advanced us to the terminal stage of our planetary sickness, has been not to let the perfect be the enemy of the good.

If there was ever a time, in recorded human history, when that nugget had to be taken seriously. It is right now. And sadly, that is not hyperbole.

Lord knows, the Catholic Church has been pretty God damned far from perfect. In the end, the Pope just a person.

Just like Walmart, Aetna, DOW, Nike, Halliburton and Apple.
I hope the people that have no trouble donating to those people and by extension the Cato Institute, ALEC, RGA and the Heritage Foundation can cut the people who want to work with the Pope and the Church on this issue a little break.

At least until they start to take the problem seriously themselves.