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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region Forums'This is only the BEGINNING of the Euro crisis':
William Hague warns Greece debacle is only a 'minor rehearsal' for coming crash
Former foreign secretary breaks cover to warn Italy and Spain are next
Mr Hague said the 'folly' of the Euro would be studied in years to come
He urged Greece to abandon the single currency to give itself a chance
In May 1998 Mr Hague used a speech to warn that some countries in the Euro would find themselves 'trapped in a burning building with no exits'.
The then Tory leader predicted 'wage cuts, tax hikes, and the creation of vicious unemployment blackspots'.
'Greeks have experienced the loss of one quarter of their entire national income, following an unsustainable inflation of spending and debt which Eurozone membership facilitated.
'The responsibility for this crisis lies with their own former leaders and those around the EU who gave them euro membership when they were not remotely suited to it, a triumph of political desire over dispassionate economic analysis for which ordinary people are now paying the price.
'It is no good now expecting Greeks to sit quietly in a burnt out room of the burning building I described seventeen years ago.'
Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3151947/This-BEGINNING-Euro-crisis-William-Hague-warns-Greece-debacle-minor-rehearsal-coming-crash.html#ixzz3ffmC1KOe
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randome
(34,845 posts)A United Nations of Europe is a worthy goal. It could not be done politically so the introduction of the euro was the next best thing, which, ironically, was a very political move.
There will be many setbacks along the way but hopefully Europe won't lose sight of the ultimate goal.
[hr][font color="blue"][center]You have to play the game to find out why you're playing the game. -Existenz[/center][/font][hr]
Surya Gayatri
(15,445 posts)continent through internecine wars, after two cataclysmic conflagrations in the 20th century alone, Europeans have belatedly come to the realization that they must indeed hang together, else they hang separately.
I often get the feeling that Americans simply do NOT grasp just what a miraculous and remarkable achievement the creation of the European Union really is.
Depaysement
(1,835 posts)They have lived through 226 years of federation and then a Union torn asunder. To their great credit, they learned from it.
Surya Gayatri
(15,445 posts)have made 'integration' or 'reintegration' a much less daunting process than for Europe. No comparison really.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Languages_of_the_European_Union
The European Union has 24 official and working languages. They are:
Bulgarian
French
Maltese
Croatian
German
Polish
Czech
Greek
Portuguese
Danish
Hungarian
Romanian
Dutch
Irish
Slovak
English
Italian
Slovenian
Estonian
Latvian
Spanish
Finnish
Lithuanian
Swedish
http://ec.europa.eu/languages/policy/linguistic-diversity/official-languages-eu_en.htm
Depaysement
(1,835 posts)Vast religious, cultural, economic differences in the States that have ebbed over time. The real difference is that they learned to compromise, especially after the Civil War. And it is a real Union: Slovakia has a veto over a Greek deal, but Rhode Island doesn't have a veto over a Detroit bailout.
Aside from the French and its allies, the rest of the EU should be ashamed of itself.
Surya Gayatri
(15,445 posts)You seem not to grasp the fact that the American Federal System of goverance and the European system of relatively loose Political Confederation are very dissimilar.
Because a truly Federal system will take much longer than the 50~ years that the EU has been in existence, the Euro-zone was set up as an intermediary economic step.
I give you leave to suffer the pangs of shame in our place, since you would appear to need to cast 'blame on somebody for something'.
FWIW, I'm French.
Depaysement
(1,835 posts)They are not willing to solve the problem, to compromise. And why is that?
You don't seem to grasp that the Greek problem could be solved if every single EU country didn't have a veto over the deal.
Surya Gayatri
(15,445 posts)Go back to the Introduction section, and review how the EU is or is not similar to a state.
http://www.sieps.se/en/forskningsprojekt/the-political-system-of-the-european-union
The financial crisis and developments within the Eurozone have put a large number of issues of importance to the EUs political system on the agenda. One of the consequences of the financial crisis is that the EUs political system, the institutional balance of power and the relationship between the members of the Eurozone and those outside the Eurozone have been affected.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Politics_of_the_European_Union
Hope these sources help clear up your obvious confusion. Might I suggest that you read more than these brief extracts.
Depaysement
(1,835 posts)Your internet link education is interesting. I obtained a real one already. Reading real books.
Surya Gayatri
(15,445 posts)Surya Gayatri
(15,445 posts)ethnic, cultural, geographical and linguistic singularity to form a union for the greater good.
NO SMALL ACCOMPLISHMENT.
Depaysement
(1,835 posts)It is not impressive.
Surya Gayatri
(15,445 posts)Depaysement
(1,835 posts)Thanks for teaching me so much: the ignore button is really useful. Bye forever!
Surya Gayatri
(15,445 posts)merrily
(45,251 posts)http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1277&pid=9158
These two Acts played a huge part in bringing down the economies of several nations, including ours.
And, no, Dodd Frank did not fix everything.
magical thyme
(14,881 posts)and triggered the crisis in the Eurozone.
But the structure of the Eurozone is what has trapped the smaller, southern countries while Germany prospers in spite of 2008.
Of course, Germany also will ultimately succomb, just as the 1% ultimately will succomb. They just feed off the weakest until they turn on each other.
Iow, the Eurozone was doomed to fail from the start (just as everyone is, of course) but the '08 crisis caused it to start collapsing sooner than it otherwise might have.
merrily
(45,251 posts)Bliley, aka repeal of Glass Steagall and to one post about that and the 2000 Commodities Futures Modernization Act, which many view as having had the real effect on mortgage derivatives and credit default swaps.
magical thyme
(14,881 posts)sendero
(28,552 posts).. Glass-Stegall and the passage of the Commodity Futures Modernization Act ABSOLUTELY AND UNDENIABLY set the stage for the now somewhat-permanent economic malaise we are currently experiencing.
The housing bubble/crash COULD NOT HAVE HAPPENED without these two odious acts. And guess who was president and signed these? It wasn't a Republican.
merrily
(45,251 posts)He tried to get a so-called "veto proof majority" on both, as he did for a number of things he apparently thought might come back to haunt him in the future. And, when questioned on such things, he is quick to point to the alleged veto proof majority and to his advisors. But, he lobbied for them. Hard. My posts linked, among other things, the wiki articles on those two bills. However, the "Talk" portion of the articles is even more revealing on these issues.
appal_jack
(3,813 posts)Thanks magical thyme, merrily, & sendero for pointing out important history and truths, however inconvenient some may find them. K&R,
-app
Surya Gayatri
(15,445 posts)These pointed comments under the piece just about cover it, concerning the rabidly anti-European, doctrinaire Mr Hague. If Willy had HIS way, the UK would be OUT of the EU yesterday or sooner. He is the quintessential 1%er, spewing his RW poison all over the RW press--of which the Daily Mail is a premier example.
Fri, 07/10/2015 - 03:45 | 6294017 BitchezGonnaBitch
EDIT: I suppose what I wanted to say is that even a broken clock is right twice a day. Still very, very broken nonetheless. Hague is the poster boy for asshats like Evans-Pritchard. Probably because he worked so tirelessly for a chance to drop even more bombs in Libya and Syria.
Fri, 07/10/2015 - 06:46 | 6294230 HowdyDoody
Funnily enough, he may hate the Euro but he is more than happy to go along with the financial strategy behind it, austerity for the undeserving poor (99%).
Fri, 07/10/2015 - 07:17 | 6294289 BigJim
Hague is an odious, braying twat.
I keep hearing this fiction that less productive people cannot have the same currency as more productive people. A moment's thought should tell you that it's nonsense. Within every polity, millions of people of varying degrees of productivity share a currency without that being the cause of any problems. The less productive people just get paid less. It's true that there are government-imposed fiscal transfers between many of them, but that doesn't arise from them all sharing the same currency; that arises from them all sharing a government that bribes voters with other people's money.
Greece's (and the Euro's) problems didn't arise because they share the same currency (though this is making it harder for them to extricate themselves from their predicament). They arose from the Greek government (with the help of Goldman Sachs) obfuscating their true debt position; creditors lending to Greece (and the other PIIGS) at rates of interest that did not reflect the risk they were taking, encouraging even more borrowing; and government institutions bailing out private creditors when Greece failed, thus transferring the risk and liabilities onto Northern European taxpayers, and by the ECB's accelerated debasement of the euro itself.
Hague arrives at the right answer but for the wrong reasons, like a maths student who receives a single point after fluking a correct result via a series of erroneous calculations.
magical thyme
(14,881 posts)Sorry, I disagree with "BigJim." And you left out "Bitchez" admission that she hates Hague because of he turned Zionist once in office. Not bothering to read the rest of the commentary, which at zerohedge tends to be drivel.
http://web.mit.edu/krugman/www/euronote.html
1998 THE EURO: BEWARE OF WHAT YOU WISH FOR
But how do you run a common currency without a common government?
Europe has some experience with this sort of thing. For almost two decades - since the formation of the European Monetary System in 1979 - most European nations have committed themselves to maintaining fixed exchange rates between their currencies, which basically means adopting a common monetary policy. And while there have been occasional flareups in the arrangement - a last-gasp attempt by the French to follow their own path back in 1982, and a wave of speculative attacks that pushed Britain out of the system a decade later - the EMS has proved surprisingly durable. How did Europe manage to follow a common monetary policy? The was a bit of neatly calculated hypocrisy. Athough the EMS was in principle a symmetric system, with all countries treated equally, in practice it was tacitly run as a German hegemony: the Bundesbank set interest rates as it pleased, and other central banks then did whatever was necessary to keep their currencies pegged to the Deutsche mark. This arrangement allowed the system to meet two seemingly irreconcilable demands: the insistence of Germans, who still remember both the hyperinflation of 1923 and the economic miracle that followed the introduction of a new, stable currency in 1948, that their beloved Bundesbank keep its hand firmly on the monetary tiller; and the political imperative that any European institution must look like an association of equals, not a new, um, Reich. The Europeans, they are a subtle race.
But come actual monetary union, this subtlety will no longer work, because a truly unified currency must have someone - a European Central Bank - explicitly in charge. How could this institution be set up to give each country an equal voice, yet satisfy the German demand for assured monetary rectitude?
http://web.mit.edu/krugman/www/euro.html
~1999/2000 THE EURO, LIVING DANGEROUSLY
The biggest real concern about EMU before it got started was the issue of one-size-fits-all monetary policy. Given the lack of significant labor mobility within Europe, "asymmetric shocks" would create strains over the appropriate level of interest rates, and - if you believe that there is significant downward price stickiness - lead to a higher average unemployment rate than if countries could pursue monetary policy tailored to their individual interests. Euro advocates claimed that asymmetric shocks would rarely be an important issue, and that anyway European countries were too closely linked to achieve significant monetary autonomy even with floating exchange rates.
The other, more contingent worry about EMU was that the new ECB would have a deflationary bias - that it would be so dedicated to building stable-price credibility, to proving itself more German than the Germans, that it would ignore concerns about growth and employment (and perhaps even flirt dangerously with a liquidity trap). Indeed.
http://www.forbes.com/sites/timworstall/2015/07/04/paul-krugman-is-right-again-its-the-euro-itself-that-is-the-problem/
Paul Krugman Is Right Again: It's The Euro Itself That Is The Problem
actually...this one deserves its own thread.
Surya Gayatri
(15,445 posts)I believe the sceptics and doubters (i.e. Merkel's own party, other German Conservatives, the Finns, the Baltic States, the Netherlands, etc.) are insisting that the Greek Parliament show proof of their good faith (severely dented because of the expensive and futile referendum) before opening the cash tap.
They're asking Greece to start on Monday by passing some of the legislation required for implementation of the proposed measures.
http://www.france24.com/en/20150712-live-eurozone-leaders-meet-decide-greece-fate-bailout-debt-european-union
* The leaders of the eurozones 19 members have begun talks in attempt to find a solution to the Greek crisis, with Athens on the verge of bankruptcy and negotiations for a new bailout deal stalling.
* A meeting of the leaders of all 28 EU members states scheduled for this afternoon that would have dealt with the fallout of a Grexit was cancelled at the last moment by European Council President Donald Tusk to give eurozone leaders a last chance to strike a deal.
* Eurozone finance ministers resumed talks on Sunday morning over Greeces application for a new bailout deal which would be its third in five years after discussions broke down on Saturday night.
* A draft statement issued by the finance ministers called on Greece to make significant economic reforms including to pensions, the labour market and privatisation before a new bailout could be considered.
* Finnish Finance Minister Alex Stubb said the Greek government would have until Wednesday to pass the reforms.
* Greece's parliament had already backed painful austerity measures Saturday in an effort to secure a bailout but left Prime Minister Alexis Tsipras facing a rebellion by some in his own party.
roamer65
(36,745 posts)jtuck004
(15,882 posts)Which is exactly how the drug dealers - i.e. bank$ter/donors - that the parties kneel in front of, as if they were performing fellatio in a back alley, accomplished their dirty deeds here. Thieving, grasping people with no soul who, with the aid of their cheap politicians, sucked the American economy into a hole and profited from it.
I don't mean to disrespect fellatio, however. Even in a back alley, between consenting adults.
What the bank$ters and their lap dog politician friends did, and are doing, is more like criminal assault on a bent-over minor.