General Joseph Wheeler is buried at Arlington cemetary

[oneshooter]

Should he be dug up and moved?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_Wheeler

Discussion and Ideas please

[ibegurpard]

1. the guy in Memphis

Was dug up and moved from his original interment spot to create a "monument"as a message of defiance and intimidation. Your attempts at false equivalence are noted.

[Travis_0004]

2. Why? Because he fought for the confederate?

He also fought for the US after the civil war.

I say no. Also, there are confederates in Arlington Cemetery. There is a whole section for them.

[Starry Messenger]

3. Is he under a memorial park just for him?

[petronius]

4. Perhaps the bigger question is, do we merely rename Arlington House,

or should we bulldoze the place entirely? Maybe gut it down to the studs to remove any vestige of the Lee history?

(And, to actually answer your question: no.)

[tularetom]

5. They can bury him on my property if they want

I have 30 acre of pasture and no more cows.

Burying people here is probably counter to some health department regulation but the county has no interest in wtf goes on out here anyway.

Seriously, theres no reason the man should not be buried at Arlington. He had a distinguished military career for over half a century, most of it in service of the USA.

Removal of the confederate flag from government buildings is the right thing to do but IMO this discussion has moved into the realm of the silly.

[gladium et scutum]

6. No

He served the United States in Cuba and the Philippines. He retired as a Brigadier General in the United States Army.

[oneshooter]

7. He also served with the Confederate forces, under Lee, against the US Army.

So according to some here he is a traitor and a slaver. My question stands, "Should he, given that he was a traitor to the US, be allowed to stay in Arlington?"

And if so, why?

[NutmegYankee]

12. He was pardoned and then served in the US Army.

The pardon is the key.

[oneshooter]

18. Was there a blanket amnesty and pardon given to ALL Confederate solders?

[NutmegYankee]

19. For most, yes.

Some of the major leaders had to personally request it and some never did get back their civil liberties. Lee for instance requested it along with a new pledge to the United States, but the Secretary of State "disappeared it".

http://history.ncsu.edu/projects/cwnc/items/show/13

On edit: By 1868, ALL had been pardoned of Treason. A later law in 1872 granted all but 500 Military leaders their voting and office holding rights back.

http://www.presidency.ucsb.edu/ws/?pid=72360
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amnesty_Act

[gladium et scutum]

13. For starters, Wheeler

never served under Lee. His service in the Confederate Army was with the Army of Tennessee. There is no documentation that he ever owned a slave. He was raised in Connecticut from the age of 12 until he entered the Military Academy at West Point in 1854. After the Civil War ended, Wheeler applied for and was granted a pardon by President Johnson under the terms Johnson's Proclamation of Amnesty and Reconstruction of May 1965. Was he ever charged with or tried for treason, no he was not. In your mind he is a traitor. Not going to argue the point with you. I have no problem with Brigadier General Wheeler, United States Army reposing in Arlington National Cemetery. If you do, take it up with your local Congressman.

[Uncle Joe]

17. I agree in general with one minor quibble, just before the war ended Lee

was promoted to General in Chief of all Confederate Forces, thus technically speaking Wheeler served under Lee at the end.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_E._Lee

On January 31, 1865, Lee was promoted to general-in-chief of Confederate forces.

As the South ran out of manpower the issue of arming the slaves became paramount. By late 1864, the army so dominated the Confederacy that civilian leaders were unable to block the military's proposal, strongly endorsed by Lee, to arm and train slaves in Confederate uniform for combat. In return for this service, slave soldiers and their families would be emancipated. Lee explained, "We should employ them without delay ... [along with] gradual and general emancipation." The first units were in training as the war ended.[92][93] As the Confederate army was devastated by casualties, disease and desertion, the Union attack on Petersburg succeeded on April 2, 1865. Lee abandoned Richmond and retreated west. Lee then made an attempt to escape to the southwest and join up with Joseph E. Johnston's Army of Tennessee in North Carolina. However, his forces were soon surrounded and he surrendered them to Grant on April 9, 1865, at the Battle of Appomattox Court House.[94] Other Confederate armies followed suit and the war ended. The day after his surrender, Lee issued his Farewell Address to his army.

Lee resisted calls by some officers to reject surrender and allow small units to melt away into the mountains, setting up a lengthy guerrilla war. He insisted the war was over and energetically campaigned for inter-sectional reconciliation. "So far from engaging in a war to perpetuate slavery, I am rejoiced that slavery is abolished. I believe it will be greatly for the interests of the South."[95]

[kiva]

8. Personally I'd dig up this guy and move him:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacob_H._Smith

General Jacob Hurd Smith (January 29, 1840 – March 1, 1918) was a United States Army officer best known for ordering an indiscriminate retaliatory attack on a group of Filipinos during the Philippine–American War, in which American soldiers killed between 2,500 dead and 50,000 civilians. His orders included, "kill everyone over the age of ten" and make the island "a howling wilderness."Court-martialed for the incident,[1] he was dubbed "Hell Roaring Jake" Smith, "The Monster", and "Howling Jake" by the press as a result.

[Uncle Joe]

9. History is complex.

Thanks for the thread, oneshooter.

[Ex Lurker]

10. Let the dead lie where they are. Anything, no matter how well intentioned, can be taken to absurdity

And that line has long since been crossed in the flag/monument/grave controversy

[SteveG]

11. A lot of Confederate dead lie at Arlington - and there is a reason

During the early part of the Civil War, Arlington, which was R.E. Lee's estate, was commandeered by the Union, using the house as a hospital and the grounds as a cemetery for both Union and Confederate dead in the early fighting around DC. The idea was that no matter the outcome of the war, Lee would be forever deprived of the use of his lands for his treason against the Union.

[Red Mountain]

14. Here, here.

Poetic justice for the ages.

[cherokeeprogressive]

15. 1. To what end? 2. Pssssst. "He" isn't there; his decayed corpse is.

It's been a century and a half. What good does anyone see in digging up a decaying box that holds a human corpse?

To say this would be hateful symbolism without substance is an industrial-strength understatement.

[Rex]

16. No the Rebel flag now sits in total disgrace which, let us face facts, was a long time coming.

Because, pyramids.

[U4ikLefty]

20. That racist POS flag was flown in the 1960's to spit in the face of the Civil Rights movement.

It was rightfully taken down.

Get over it.

Oh wait, this is not about the flag!1!!1!

[former9thward]

21. Many Confederate dead at Arlington.

There would have to be a lot of digging. In fact there is a Confederate Memorial at Arlington.



Obama sends a wreath there every Memorial Day. It is a tradition started by Wilson and followed by every U.S. president except Bush I who refused to do it. Clinton picked it up again however and it was followed by Bush II and Obama.

[oneshooter]

22. Then, according to some posters it needs to go.

There seem to be some on this site that want to destroy history, to make it as if it never occurred.

More the shame of them, to destroy anyone's history, is to destroy a little bit of everybody's.