General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsQuackers
(2,256 posts)Personally, we need it.
MosheFeingold
(3,051 posts)By the Saudis against Iran, Russia, and Texas, in that order.
It's being produced at less than the cost to explore/produce. The problem with that is it is a downward bubble that will pop violently.
We do need to end the export ban, which will help domestic production and lower the price the Saudis get for their oil.
safeinOhio
(32,714 posts)Aerows
(39,961 posts)No wonder the Bush cabal wants a war with Iran.
davidn3600
(6,342 posts)Global demand has been dropping over the last year or two. Now with new worries about China's growth slowing down, it is spooking investors that demand will further drop leading to an increasing glut of oil on the market.
It's also combined with a strategy by the Saudis. They are not cutting production because they are trying to knock out competitors that would survive only at higher prices.
Response to davidn3600 (Reply #9)
Aerows This message was self-deleted by its author.
uponit7771
(90,359 posts)bottomofthehill
(8,346 posts)Best tax break going. Leaves lots more to spend on back to school shopping
yeoman6987
(14,449 posts)PasadenaTrudy
(3,998 posts)$3.49 the other day, lol. Crazy.
bottomofthehill
(8,346 posts)KentuckyWoman
(6,692 posts)Still hovering at $3 and trucking companies are still adding "fuel surcharges" to their billing.
Greed is as greed does.....
FLPanhandle
(7,107 posts)We have some pretty good taxes on gasoline here in Florida and California has even higher ones.
Binkie The Clown
(7,911 posts)They are running on borrowed funds. This will kill them. Thousands of jobs lost, and, ironically, shortages are in the offing.
Plus, and this is the big one, low oil prices remove the incentive to develop alternatives like wind and solar. We need high oil prices if solar or wind are ever to be competitive. Without high oil prices, alternative energy companies go bust and we won't have any kind of energy future at all.
Right now, low oil prices are about the worst thing that can possibly happen to this country. And as bad as it is for us, it's even worse for Russia and Venezuela. They face extreme financial crisis if the prices do not recover. This is a very bad thing. To think it's good is to be short-sighted and concerned only with ones own pocketbook.
joshcryer
(62,276 posts)Hurt the fracking industry, maintain the monopoly.
Unfortunately that doesn't mean fracking is going away. They can ramp production back up as soon as oil goes back up. It's very fluid.
Sucks for US oil jobs though. That boom is over for the time being.
Binkie The Clown
(7,911 posts)They are already rated "junk" by the bond rating outfits. There is nobody left who will lend them the capital so their only choice right now is to try to fleece the general public by convincing ordinary people that they can get rich quick investing in oil wells. There is not one single fracking operation in the U.S. that has ever turned a profit. Ever.
Google "fracking debt" to read plenty of articles from many different sources on how the fracking industry is drowning in debt and falling apart at the seams. The only people telling us how promising it is is the very people trying to sell the public on investing in a lost cause.
Amishman
(5,559 posts)The smaller operators will be the first to go under and their assets will be bought up by bigger players. The bigger players rehire the workers at lower wages and restart the wells they just bought. The new owners are able to sell it at lower prices because labor costs went down and they bought the equipment and infrastructure for pennies on the dollar.
Binkie The Clown
(7,911 posts)The big operators can't get loans, and can't seel their junk bonds. Nobody in the know wants to touch that disaster in the making.
The infrastructure requires constant maintenance or it rusts and crumbles.
The knowledge disappears as unemployed people go into different lines and the really experience engineers retire. You'd be amazed how fast a technology can be lost.
Ramping up is a pipe dream.
But just suppose you could convince me. Would that change the outcome?
Or just suppose I could convince you. Would that change the outcome?
What I think doesn't matter. What you think doesn't matter.
Time will tell, but I'm betting on fracking going the way of the dinosaur, and pretty quickly too.
joshcryer
(62,276 posts)Your argument applies to fracked oil, but debts impact smaller companies more than larger ones, they can handle the debt easily because they're producing. Put oil back to $100 a barrel and new companies will pop back up. The technology exists. It would require an entire generation of living with sub $60-80 oil for the technology to be "lost." (And require significant R&D to bring it back.) It is highly unlikely the Saudi's can keep pumping oil at these rates for a damn generation.
Binkie The Clown
(7,911 posts)what I believe about the future of fracking doesn't matter, and what you believe about the future of fracking doesn't matter. Unless you happen to be the CEO of a fracking company, what we think will have exactly zero impact on the future of fracking. Only time will tell, and trying to see the future is just so much mental masturbation. Things never turn out the way we expect them to.
Blue_In_AK
(46,436 posts)but it may be a good thing in the long run if it forces the state to stop being a vassal to Big Oil.
We personally won't have any problem riding out the oil slump since we're retired, but I have friends in the biz who are very, very worried.
And did I mention our gasoline is still $3.29 a gallon here in Anchorage and much higher in the outlying areas. It really makes no sense.
joshcryer
(62,276 posts)Keystone XL isn't going to be viable at these prices. I guess it'll be shelved though and not completely taken off the table. Oil prices are bound to go back up. Who knows how long.
hobbit709
(41,694 posts)Juicy_Bellows
(2,427 posts)It's a finite resource obviously. However, it's clear that the heavy hitters are flooding the market with cheap oil. We were supposed to be getting lean around now - can a smart person explain what the hell reality is with regard to actual reserves?
Thanks in advance, I'm genuinely curious.
Agschmid
(28,749 posts)Juicy_Bellows
(2,427 posts)I did find this article that is a good summation but doesn't answer our question.
http://fcnp.com/2015/08/19/the-peak-oil-crisis-a-4-trillion-hole/
DanTex
(20,709 posts)Bad in the sense that cheap oil means more consumption, and cheap energy means it's more difficult for clean technologies to compete.
Good in the sense that it makes dirty oil extraction (e.g. tar sands) less financially viable, if viable at all.
MosheFeingold
(3,051 posts)Kills solar, wind, nuclear.
joshcryer
(62,276 posts)It kills coal.
It sucks though because new natural gas is unconventional (ie, fracked).
delrem
(9,688 posts)Fuck the planet! I want mine!
bigwillq
(72,790 posts)Hope the price of gasoline drops soon. Would be nice.
A HERETIC I AM
(24,376 posts)Saw that last night.
Not trying to gloat, BTW.
Agschmid
(28,749 posts)wildbilln864
(13,382 posts)Tommy_Carcetti
(43,197 posts)Figures.
Yavin4
(35,445 posts)Amishman
(5,559 posts)with the added risk of the supplier going under between now and delivery.
That being said, if you use oil for heat and your tank is not full, this is a great time to top it off.
Yavin4
(35,445 posts)More money in people's pockets.
PasadenaTrudy
(3,998 posts)But, I have no where to charge one and I have a 2011 car that's paid off. Some day!
mike_c
(36,281 posts)hunter
(38,326 posts)It wouldn't be so bad if the wealthy and politically powerful felt the pain of their mismanagement first, not those already living in poverty whose lives will turn from hungry to starvation, to risking their lives on boats or walking across deserts seeking refuge.
One of the comforts of my current lifestyle is that I don't have to care about the price of gasoline, not because I'm wealthy, but because my wife and I by some planning and much greater good fortune managed to escape automobile commuter hell in the later 'eighties. When we met we were both Los Angeles commuters, a lifestyle where having a reliable car and affordable gasoline was essential. Driving to work was not a choice. You drove, or you were unemployed, or you lived in rough neighborhoods. Every hour I spent in stop-and-go traffic in Los Angeles is an hour of my life that was wasted, and all the toxic crap I breathed in driving certainly did not improve my health. I remember days I averaged fifteen miles per hour on the freeway, very high stress driving.
We've done the living in very rough neighborhoods gig, and some wealthier white people would consider the neighborhood we live in now a little rough, but it's still better than commuting. Most of the kids in the public school here (less than a hundred yards from our home) are first, second, third generation Mexican American, original Mexican California, and otherwise entirely cosmopolitan, from all over the planet.
I fled Ivory Soap 99 44/100 white majority U.S.A. with extreme prejudice. In middle school until I quit high school the bullies called me "queerbait." Some bullies made it to college too, but any adult who beats up a minor often goes to jail. College is not like high school. We squeaky minors in college had a mandatory "coping with college" class. We knew our rights, we also recognized the difficulties. I had professors who were obviously uncomfortable that my parents had to sign off on field trips, especially the field work sort where they did not want to be chaperons.
But in the larger picture, people who don't have jobs or money, no food, no safe housing, let alone medicine, are abandoning places like Syria.
And here in the U.S.A. wouldn't it be a bummer to be a "moth-balled" fracking field worker? Most of them will be forced to return to whatever low wage hell they escaped from, maybe even back to mom and dad's house.
maveric
(16,445 posts)Waiting for it to drop to the national average.
Andy823
(11,495 posts)Gas where I live in Washington state is $3.21 as of today. It was $3.29 for two months before dropping 8 cents about two weeks ago. It will stay the same till after labor day even though oil has dropped over 20% in the last few months. It's pure GREED!
Hekate
(90,784 posts)Answer same as always: Because they can.